Grumpy

I vote we wait till we've seen what kind of bridges are proposed. At that point we'll know enough about how cheap ODOT will try to be, that we can choose between "Mediocre vision for the Inner Belt/I-90" and "Grand pile of steaming horsedung that some moron at ODOT considers an acceptable way of screwing up the south side of downtown". Maybe at that point we should add a poll to decide the new name of the thread. :|

http://blog.cleveland.com/pdopinion/2009/02/dodging_a_bullet_getting_a_bri.html Dodging a bullet, getting a bridge Posted by The editors February 13, 2009 05:00AM

As far as the cold storage building, I don't think its a significant loss. I normally dislike seeing a building knocked down for "progress", but I'm OK with this. The Justice Center, Cleveland Public Power, and Aviation High School? I'm not stupid enough to think that the Justice Center is attractive or reaches the archetectural potential possible for that site, or that its even a good design for a Justice Center. With that said, I'd hate to lose that building. I've always been a fan of the way the Justice Center and the Federal building reflect each other (to some degree) across the mall. I veiw them as bookends, with roughly the same size and scale. Without the Justice Center, the Federal building looks like crap. With the Justice Center, the Federal building doesn't look like it was inspired by a brick wrapped in tin foil. http://maps.google.com/maps/sv?cbp=12,141.20716986330206,,0,-4.069767441860466&cbll=41.505787,-81.697064&panoid=&v=1&hl=en&gl=us Cleveland Public Power, Eh. I'd love to see the whales taken off of it, or replaced with something more Ohio-ish. But other than that, it could be worse. Someday if the building outlasts its usefullness I'd rather its replacement not be on the waterfront, but I don't think its a big deal. Aviation High School, What's wrong with Aviation High? I'd obviously prefer to see the building used, but its a solid building in a unique place. Why get rid of it? Do you have a better use for the site? OK, back to the Innerbelt before I get in trouble for being to far off topic, I'm sure its been discussed previously, but would it be cheaper to build a double decker bridge as a replacement?

^That would be nice, but I think we're far more likely to see the county offices move to the Higbee building. After all its got some empty space that FCE had saved in case the MM wanted it.

Absolutely this is the place to get information especially when the Plain Dealer describes the situation very differently from the reports above. http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/02/medical_marts_wouldbe_develope.html Medical mart's would-be developers breeze through session with no time left for critics Posted by Jim Nichols/Plain Dealer Reporter February 12, 2009 23:05PM Amen!

I was one of the two people that voted no. I know its going to happen whether its legal or not, but I don't think that society should condone it. I also don't think that law enforcement should go out of its way to search for though. Our law enforcement has (or should have) better ways to spend their time. In other words I'm ok with some of it happening behind closed doors, but I don't think we should allow it in the open. Feel free to criticise me and my opinion now.

I voted no on the survey because I don't consider it trouble since I didn't get caught. I realized a couple years ago that I never paid city taxes to the city I worked in while in college. By the time I realized it, my tax records from that far back had been long since lost, (I've moved 14 or 15 times since I dropped out of college), so I'm assuming I'm off the hook by now. I grew up in a township that didn't have local taxes, so when it came to filing local tax wasn't something I thought about

I understood what you meant by Dentil, but didn't get the joke. Or was that bad a joke that I can't even see it?

^Good point. The government does provide a large portion of our healthcare already, However as someone that has experienced both military healthcare and the VA, I'd rather them not be used as an example. I'd explain why, but it would take quite a while and has nothing to do with transportation.

^ I wish I had some good suggestions for Colic last summer for my son. Nothing worked. I'm reading Meditations on the First Philosophy by Rene Descartes. (Intro to Philosophy sounded like an easy A for the Semester)

^My ad says "Latina Romance". Maybe "THEY" are watching this thread! :roll:

This line especially angered me. I guess this moron hasn't taken the time to look at how many of us are taking the bus to downtown everyday. Hasn't RTA's ridership increased the last 6 years in spite of service cuts and fair increases? Its been quite a while since RTA had any empty seats on their busses. I heard recently that Laketran's ridership is up 14% this year over last (don't quote me on that percentage) inspite of fair increases. I've heard from a handful of coworkers that live in Akron that the Summit County Metro busses running up to downtown Cleveland are packing people in like sardines everyday. Last I heard we had a hundred thousand people still working in downtown, what is wrong with this guy?

Well I'd say the Plain Dealer has outdone themselves in their negativity toward Cleveland in the following editorial. http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/othercolumns/index.ssf?/base/opinion/1234258228249000.xml&coll=2 Build Cleveland's med mart where the medicine is Tuesday, February 10, 2009 Jim Strang

^Where did you hear that? That's great news! I think I'll go take a ride Thursday or Friday afternoon and see how fast it is now.

In high school I dated a girl from Mantua, and my brother's wife grew up there. Its a cute little town, but many of the farms that once surrounded it are being taken up by McMansions for people that drive way too far to get to work.

That's just way too depressing.

I would have to say this sounds like the dumbest suggestion yet regarding the OC. A toll road will do wonders for redeveloping the neighborhood. :roll:

Population is the biggest reason. The other is that the alternative route, CSX's Midland Subdivision and leased by the Indiana & Ohio RR, probably needs more upgrading and isn't that much shorter than the main route through Dayton. The Dayton route is a mainline railroad and in excellent condition. It's always been the main route between Columbus and Cincinnati (Pennsylvania RR's line through Xenia south to Cincinnati was the third option but most of it is gone). The Midland Sub is used by only a couple of freight trains per day and is only slightly shorter than the main route through Dayton (125 miles vs. 118 miles). From my awareness of it, this is not a bad route condition-wise. A passenger train might be able to safely operate at 40-60 mph on this corridor, depending on the length of circuits for flashers/gates at road crossings. It also lacks an automatic rail traffic control system, but that's not a big deal since either route option will need to have a Postitive Control System added to conform to a new federal law. However the Midland Sub will probably need to be resurfaced with some tie renewal and possibly the replacement any worn rail. There will also need to be some passing sidings added since it's all single track, but a siding or two may be necessary for the single-track portion of the Dayton route between Dayton and Columbus, as well. So the short version is, past studies (in 1984) showed the Midland Sub route would save a little bit on operating costs with a slightly shorter route, but that savings were wiped out by a greater drop in passenger revenues because the population via the Midland Sub was so much less. Thanks, I assumed this had been thought out already, but I hadn't seen it before. I do agree that it makes more sense to take the route with the highest density of potential passengers. For the same reason, I'd like to see the Akron route, though I understand the issues that will probably prevent that from happening.

I was looking at the maps KJP posted above and I'm a little curious. Other than the population density, what is the advantage of going through Springfield, Dayton, and Middletown? It seems to me that if we're considering all the options of getting between the 3-Cs, why do we assume that the route has to go through Dayton? Just looking quickly at a map, there's a couple of more direct rail routes between Columbus and Cincinatti. Have these already been looked at and ruled out already?

This article could probably go in several places. http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/02/gov_stricklands_transportation.html Gov. Strickland's transportation plan: more tolls, costlier car registration, cross-state train Posted by Karen Farkas

Personnally I like what Montreal has done with hiding a little bit of retail in the basements, then connecting those basements, so I think your idea has some merit. I think it wouldn't be a bad thing if done right, but I'm not one of "those with classical urban planning education".

^ I don't get it. The joke must be over my head. :roll:

:-( Boo Hoo we didn't get what we wanted. http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/01/forest_city_enterprises_calls.html#more Forest City Enterprises calls for public review of convention center site decision Posted by Jim Nichols

^ I wasn't actually riding, but I saw one about 15 minutes ago at 9th and Euclid and it didn't seem to be having more trouble than any other bus. A little slipping, but it didn't bottom out on 4 inches of snow or anything silly like that.

I guess my problem is I view a lack of sidewalk as meaning I'm in a neighborhood that can't afford them. Silly me. :roll: