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I haven't sold Kirby, but I've sold watches on the street and I've sold worthless coupons door to door. I also sold Cutco knives. And I've cleaned toilets. I graduated HS in 94, and the job market for people with zero skills was dramatically better then. Are we saying it wasn't? Seriously? And it was easier to sell things door to door then as well, since people had a lot more disposable income than they currently do. Once again, the fact that someone succeeded at something many years ago proves nothing about the market today. I agree that no job is beneath anyone. But not pursuing a minumum wage job that would add enough living costs to put you underwater has nothing to do with whether a job is beneath you.

Toledo just lost in a crazy game to Akron, plus they were awful all year. But I'm a CSU partisan above all. I'm also actively working toward getting CSU a football team. Any alumni who would like to help with that, let me know.

I wasn't going to say so but yeeeeaaaah... I have to agree about the hair. It's not a seller's job market right now. You must conform, and you must do it preemptively. I didn't conform preemptively but that was late in Clinton's term. Different days. You'd have more leeway if you were only looking for jobs in video, which is inadvisable. Hypothetically if you were to do that you'd probably need to do it full time. On top of having the skills, it's almost entirely about carousing with enough people to get sponsored into the LA unions (so I'm told). For that you'd need savings. For that you need a haircut. But come on, how petty is combating the recession one haircut at a time? There's a difference between coping with the recession and combating it. That requires new ideas, ideas other than you need to try harder. Every policy at every level of government and business needs to be reviewed. It's time to reconsider the economy, in general. What's happening now is total madness.

Dan, what choices have we discussed? We haven't. So upon what facts are you judging these choices? Do you make every judgment this way, about people you're talking to? Goodness gracious me. What part of I can't pay for 1 more education, so I can forget having my own kids, don't you get? It's that serious for millions like me. You didn't have the same burden UP FRONT, so that it would restrain your entire adult life. I'd love to have a house at 14%. I don't think you realize how awesome that is, compared to realizing at 25 that you'll probably never own land. There's a front page story on MSNBC right now about this. Again, my whole point is that we shouldn't assume people chose to be screwed. To do so is to impugn their character. I'm sure some actually did choose to be screwed, but that has no bearing on the millions who didn't but are anyway. It is exceedingly disrespectful to insist that everything bad that happens to someone reflects upon them as a person.

If you keep hearing people complain about the cost of college, and you don't get it, consider for a moment that maybe you indeed do not get it. Google some graphs. Blame it on the unions... you'd have a point. But don't tell people the biggest problem they face in life is made up. It isn't. 40k is a great car. I've never had one worth more than 5k. And don't forget the rate on student loans is several times that of car loans. And that comes out before you can pay for any actual car, or home, or anything else. Also, consider what that does to your debt-service-to-income ratio with an entry level job. Welcome to derogatory credit even if you've never missed a bill. You're lucky if you can even get your own apartment in many cases.

Unintentional. I'll look out for that in the future. I even went out of my way to use the pronoun "one," which is cumbersome as heck. I'm still harping on those who jumped on C-Dawg. That's how I combat the recession-- I get people to admit there is an actual unique problem here, instead of a generation that deserves to be screwed.

I'd like to know who you surveyed to compile that data. Forbearances are limited, even if you're completely insolvent. And they do hurt you, quite a bit. The status of the loan shows up on your credit. My student loan payment, prior to law school, equaled out to one seriously badass new car if that's our yardstick-- and I went to a state school. The costs of college, incl living there, have skyrocketed since the era you describe. Skyrocketed. Please check your numbers and dial again.

Someone who's in the same boat and who probably does understand. But that's not who I'm speaking to, if that makes any sense. I'm speaking to those who would blame the victims.

Unless one went through a previous recession at the worst possible time in one's career, I'd reckon there isn't much familiarity. And this is no ordinary recession. This one is hitting at a time when education costs have never been higher and wages/CoL has never been lower... not since the 30s, anyway. Also, never in US history has the entry level market been so soft. Advances in transportation, communication and automation have made humans obsolete to an unprecedented extent. These are issues we must face, preferably as an entire nation, and step one is admitting they exist.

Me too. But I had to cut mine when I graduated college, because my job offer was contingent on doing so. Then I grew it out again, then I had to cut it off again for a series of government jobs. So get over it. You'll probably never like having short hair (I hate it) but you just about have no choice.

The problem with those Kirby and Cutco things is that there is often an up front fee (they sell a lot of product to their poor salesmen), followed by $12-$14 not per hour, but per person you know who is willing to sit through a demonstration. I get upset when I hear this line of attack ("you kids should do what I did, else you're lazy") because it's self-serving and hurtful. We'd love to do what you did. It doesn't work like that anymore, and we're not sure who to thank for it. But we definitely didn't do it to ourselves. It is counterproductive to act as if we could just "buck up" and things would go swimmingly. We're as diligent as you are, and were. But we're facing challenges you should be thankful you have no first hand knowledge of.

I may very well be stocking at Kmart in 6 months. But if I were in video and I were going to take a summer off, I would go to LA or NYC and network like the wind. If not, I would apply to every Kmart in Toledo and none of them in Dayton. Fire up the ol' resume machine gun.

I'm sorry, that is utterly false and ignores the biggest problem facing recent graduates. Depending on your debt structure, it is entirely possible that 3 menial jobs will not keep you afloat and your credit will quickly and semi-permanently be destroyed. Especially if you end up having to live alone. And that's if you can hold 3 jobs, the availability demands have also changed in ways you may not be accounting for. If you can't understand the current situation, or choose to disbelieve it, at least don't pile scorn on those to whom it's all too familiar. Things. Are. Different. Now. C-Dawg, now that I know your field I would emphasize my previous point about plans B and C. I minored in film/video production, and I do know people who got jobs in that field. In the 90s. Not now. My best friend graduated with a video major about 10 years ago, did some scantly paid production work at a Youngstown TV station, then for a while drove around a satellite uplink truck for live broadcasts. Long story short, he just finished his second undergrad degree in something completely different.

blah blah blah SCRANTON PENINSULA blah blah blah

Moving somewhere to work at Kmart, with today's college costs, can be a financially irresponsible decision that destroys a good portion of your life. Unfortunately, each of us faces a different predicament in this world. A great solution for some may not be appropriate for all. If certain numbers don't line up for someone, that's not an attitude problem.

C-Dawg, don't let people shame you into doing something that makes no sense. I don't know your field, and it may be wise to work on plans B and C, but becoming a drifter like Rambo shouldn't be one of them. If you're going to be poor anyway, you might as well retain some control over your situation. Having secure and realistic plans doesn't mean you're lazy or short-sighted.

Re what C-Dawg is doing to combat the recession, the entry level tide-you-over job market is completely different than it was for me 10-15 years ago. Very different... and it bears no relation to the era before that. Opportunities you/we took for granted just aren't there anymore, and it does no good to blame the victims. First, there are less jobs at that level period, due to automation and foreign competition. No this doesn't apply directly to food service or Kmart but it applies to the labor market as a whole. Second, there are more people working well into retirement age, and when they're willing to work cheap, they're preferred over graduates of any kind. Third, mid-career people who are wildly overqualified already hold a lot of these jobs. C-Dawg, having just graduated, is probably less wildly overqualified than many applicants they have. He isn't the only one screwed right now. Moving away for a job that doesn't pay enough, especially if you have any obligations at all, can be self-destructive. You're a stranger in a strange land with nothing, cut off from your networks and your safety nets, so if anything goes wrong your credit score is more likely to burn.

Yes! Let's all have a cigar.

That is possible. I would hold both parties accountable for bribery, though it's certainly a bigger deal for the official party. There have been some inexplicable problems with that development... people who live there say it's not well built, and there was a specific issue with the parking spaces being illegally small. I remember the city having no answer for how that got approved.

Well, everyone remember this when we're fighting over the viability of this or that consipiracy theory. All it takes is $1000 and some strippers to get someone official to say anything you want, about something as serious as structural integrity. It's that simple.

Nov-Dec-Jan-Feb-Mar-Apr... I can remember recent snow storms in each of these months. Round it down to 1/3 and the point remains. That's why we need quality transit options like the healthline!

In fact, I like these so well I wish there were more such installations throughout the line. They look way better than dead plants, it is winter here for half the year, and metal work is a strong local theme.

I went to several games this season, including the early loss to Butler, and this win was well deserved. CSU plays killer defense and will make some noise in the tournament.

Perhaps... that's not the first thing I thought of. I like it regardless of what it's meant to be. I'm basically 2 years old. I like lights and shiny things.

Art Deco is my favorite style by far. I always assumed it looked too opulent after the depression so people shied away and never went back. Everything since seems like some form of mockery. The same pattern is visible in culture at large-- nothing is valid anymore unless it's ironic and at least mildly disturbing. I'd love if we could go back to making things pretty for the sake of having pretty things.