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Well, alright then.

^^^ Baker Street is a really good song.

I'm with you. But even if they put a sprinkle of housing here, a sprinkle there... I think the dead zone aspect is a done deal at this point. I wish these tech center projects all the best. I really do. But I still view them as a mismatch.

No. But I often have to give secondary explanation when people say "wait, since when is there a trolley system?" This is mostly from visitors, who are forced to rely on general understandings of terms. But I was on the B-line today and I heard a girl call it the trolley, so that name does appear to be sticking among downtown regulars. I'm just not sure it's the best idea. When private-sector Lolly the Trolley does this it comes off pleasantly whimsical. I think it's different when a public transit agency starts switching concepts around. Ask our friends in Cincinnati about buses and trolleys. They're having quite the controversy over it down there.

I don't call them trolleys either, because it confuses people. Words have meanings and these are buses. It's a great service though.

Agreed. Cleveland needs more upscale chain presence, but not right here.

It's possible that Cleveland was already told no, and they're keeping it quiet to avoid embarassment. Otherwise I too would prefer to see some effort put forth on this. Even if Sears pays no taxes at all and leaves after 5 years, it's still a gain.

I think people along the existing line would use it to get to jobs in Solon, as would people along the other rail lines. By bus it takes an hour to get from downtown to 271. By train you could easily get from downtown to Solon in less than that. Presumably the extension wouldn't have a ton of stops like in Shaker. I don't consider Solon to be exurbia. Some if it is, but it's also within the county and parts of it could be mistaken for West Park. More importantly, it has enough open factories to make any city jealous. It's really not a bedroom community at all. One of the structural problems with Cleveland and other older cities is that the jobs, especially the industrial ones, have moved beyond the practical reach of the transit systems. Ideally RTA should connect all county residents with all county job centers, and Solon is a big one.

If neighborhood interests would back off, I think this area will get some height very soon. The success of Uptown will prove that UC still needs a lot more upscale apartments.

I agree with that theory, but such changes aren't likely to occur until the line is fully extended. All of them, really, plus better bus service. If the transit isn't there when the road capacity is taken away, all that does is make traffic worse. The net capacity to move people, regardless of mode, has been reduced. Above all else, TOD requires the T. This project is a necessary step in extending the line and fostering TOD, but it's not like this area didn't already have rail service, and the service isn't really being extended yet. Traffic is likely to get worse before it gets better. That said, we still need to do this, or we'll never get to the good part.

That's true, but it's really not a partnership when one side is paying the other for a service. The deal doesn't revolve around them owing money. Instead we give them money and they're obligated to do something... something they now say can't be done as promised. Like Darth Vader at dinner, they are altering the deal. But we can do more than pray they don't alter it any further. The county isn't powerless in this, and no medical mart has been built yet. The future is not set in stone. I agree that every point has pretty much been made on this story. Obviously I don't agree that it should be forgotten or ignored, but I doubt we've heard the last of it anyway.

Good point Tedolph but I think that ship has sailed, at least for this parcel. That still leaves us several peninsulas to work with though.

It is possible to have a solid urban environment that's also easy to navigate. Van Aken and Northfield do seem needlessly pinched off in that rendering. But I think extending the blue line is important enough to make some sacrifices. I'm less concerned with getting it to Randall Park, more concerned with getting it to the industrial base in Solon. At that point it becomes more than a downtown shuttle, which is important considering how many jobs are now located on the county's fringes.

Great to have you back, Musky.

Oooo what a cool thread. I'd most like to see the WHD built up, as the OP and others have described. EDIT: Htsguy is right. We only get one, the rest of mine I deleted. Music to my ears!

Neurosurgeons aren't widely unemployed, and rocket scientists are a pretty narrow sample. That's why I used the examples I did. Both are broad professional categories that involve a lot of specialization. Both are also cyclical in terms of employment. Lawyers have an additional mobility hindrance as their licenses don't transfer state to state. I'm trying to demonstrate that picking produce isn't a catch-all solution. Yes it may be a good solution for some, but then we're having different rules for different classes, or we're having an absurd result. I find the unemployment safety net to be a better approach. It can't fix things for every panhandler but it prevents cyclical effects from swelling their ranks.

There can't be full employment or there's no labor pool. Unemployment compensation is therefore necessary to capitalism. No, we do not need everyone picking onions in their downtime. Using engineers and lawyers as itinerant vegetable pickers is absurdly wasteful. If that's our system, our system is worthless. Even in the real estate market of years past, few people could just up and move to wherever an immediate opening might appear. That's like running around chasing herds of buffalo, a lifestyle involving houses you can roll up and carry. People who live in modern houses have to sell them. Even people living in apartments have to get out of the lease somehow, unless they're month to month, which most leases aren't. Unemployment compensation is a cost effective way to deal with the commitments inherent in our property system. When more people own their homes, it needs to go even longer, so it becomes less cost effective. But that's not unemployment's fault. The inefficiency, the bottleneck, is in the property arrangements. But mass migration buffalo hunts aren't efficient either. It makes no sense to have your population scrambling around the continent to stay afloat. We're better off stimulating employment where unemployed people already are.

"The discussion" was broad, but so what. The selling point wasn't. The selling point was a retail model similar to the furniture version. That retail model was going to drive convention traffic, as well as its own traffic. The presence of so many buyers would then help to build our local device and biomed industries. While the continuing ed theme is a nice one, and likely to generate traffic, the retail element was key to delivering more than just hospitality growth. Education doesn't move products. We didn't hire an education company to run this thing, or even a convention center company. We hired a retail company. The plan unmistakably revolved around selling merchandise. It's not clear why we need a new building (or a new CC) for this new plan. And I don't think the county ever intended to buy a medical school run by furniture salesmen. Hagan has already suggested as much. If the contract was worded broadly enough for MMPI's product to be whatever MMPI feels like delivering, that would be quite a screw up on our end. Hopefully not, and hopefully Fitzgerald has people poring over that contract to figure out what our options are.

At this point the convention center is all torn up, so we do have to finish that and roll with it. But no one is forcing us build the Med Mart itself and I don't think we should. All of its remaining goals can be met with existing office space. Instead, we should consider putting a new county admin building on that site, using the same money. It could even span the whole block. Those would be some big floors, just what the county seems to need. Alternatively, we could use the Med Mart Money to better integrate the new CC with Amtrak and the WFL, a concept MMPI has openly opposed. This project no longer revolves around the core reason for MMPI's involvement. We don't need a consulting firm to schedule a bunch of continuing ed seminars. Let's part ways with them and do something useful while we still can.

I'm doing doc review now and it pays better than any permanent position I've interviewed for. At this point I'm just saving up to go solo.

Agreed, this is very disappointing. Also agreed about how it should be handled.

I like it too. If you're going to have surface parking, this is the way to do it. Maximum street presence for the buildings with parking losses minimized. As much as I want it developed like Manhattan, Chester is still a major commuter route and a key exit from the innerbelt. They've done a really nice job with this arrangement, serving conflicting needs while leaving a clear path for growth.

Drove by last month, saw the beginning of something, but had no idea this was going on. Glad to see it. I always thought Dorr from Secor to Westwood could be cool central, especially on game days. This is a big step towards that.

We should embrace the river fire. And with it, we should claim Earth Day as our own. We just had citywide recycling bins delivered last month. The local food thing is already going. Greenspace? Do we ever have greenspace. Put that all together into a marketing hook. Better than "we're near Akron," which is what the current effort amounts to.

I'm not too worried about it, since the station is only moving a few blocks.