OldMojo

I have learned not to forget Youngstown!

Great recommendation - I found this book at the library - it's a quick read, but very powerful. I checked out the Springsteen album too - combine them and it's a real one-two punch *choke* It illustrates the human costs of the social Darwinism that has become so popluar among forums like this, especially with regards to the manufacturing sector. A lot of people seem to think that factory work involves no more than uneducated people turning wrenches. While there are some jobs like that, the fact is that there are many more jobs that require high levels of expertise and skill. There are metallurgists, electricians, fabricators, machinists, mechanics, chemists, and yes, computer programmers. There are a lot of jobs that require a certain amount of familiarity with any combination of these, although those people may not be considered "specialists" in any particular one. The attitude seems to be that those who were dislocated by the manufacturing downturn somehow deserved their fate because they were unable to see into the future. Of course the irony now is that we are starting to see some of those same "new economy" jobs shipped overseas as well, with the new chant being biotech or whatever. The notion of an "idea & information-driven" economy is great and must be pursued with appropriate vigor. But we have to remember that there will always be a need for people who can turn those ideas into the physical reality. Society will always need "stuff" so we will always need people to manufacture said "stuff" A good example is the current situation in Iraq and the issue over the lack of spare parts & armor. We are being told that this problem is because production capacity for such items has been maxed out - an absolutely ridiculous situation, if it is to be believed. Presumably this shortfall could be dealt with by converting some civilian pruduction, as was done in WWII. But then again, we are not fighting WWII. We are fighting a small group of "insurgents." If this conflict has taxed our production capacity for military equpiment to the point of crisis, then we have some serious problems. I personally suspect that the true reason is logistics and poor planning, but the fact that a US administration can cite limited production capacity and not be laughed off the podium is telling. I've drifted a bit off-topic here, but I won't start a new thread unless discussion carries on a bit further. :speech:

Yes, and the shadow it left was visible from quite a distance for some time as well. I don't think you can see it anymore. Mead would be the obvious name choice for the "new" company, but I'll bet MWV hangs onto it. I do know that Mead's cardboard operations were bought by Smurfit-Stone, so the new Mead wouldn't be quite what she used to be.

In what capacity do you work "on the front lines"? I'm suprised to hear such simplistic generalizations from someone thus informed.

In lieu of a rant, I'll just give this subject a :roll:

Dayton has become Clear Channel hell. Between the avalanche of commercials it's nothing but ghetto thump, low-rent Korn wannabes and Free Bird. The local talk station (WHIO) is an all day assault by the right-wing nut jobs, so I've resorted to the NPR station out of Oxford. It's ok, but sometimes I wonder if I'm actually listening to a SNL skit of public radio. For instance, a few days ago there was an hour long interview with the author of a book about earthworms(!) They even had callers! Caller:"When I'm walking my dog in the park after it rains, worms are all over the sidewalk - I push them back into the grass with a stick - Is that good? Guest: "Oh, you're a good friend to earthworms" :|

If Toledo gets rail trans. before Cin-Day there'll be hell to pay - Hell I say!!

Not at all - that sums it up about as concisely as I've ever heard.

My name goes waaayyyy back to the early days of the internet - 1995. Back then ISPs charged up to $10 per hour for access and total strangers would e-mail each other just for the thrill of getting mail! This was the heyday of the IRC (inter-relay chat I believe) A free-for-all chat network with multitudes of "channels" covering every interest from needlepoint to satan worship. The novelty of this network was the ability to "register" your screen name. If someone logged on using your registered screen name, you could boot them off the network. I logged on one night after watching The Doors movie and chose "MojoRisin". This name went over pretty well & I got a lot of compliments on my "cool name". Before too long, I found myself kicking off "imposters" almost every time I went on. Unfortunately, I was off line for a few months and my registration expired. Sure enough, "MojoRisin" had been snapped up. Hence OldMojo, to distinguish myself from those "Mojo-come-latelys" Wow - my handle is nearly a decade old!

Click on the aerial link in my above post, then magnify the southeastern section. The crapload of sprawly streets & lots outlined in yellow are part of Clayton too. Clayton village is kind of spread out and faces all directions. You'd almost have to level it and start over.

This type of history fascinates me. Anyone know of any good books on Youngstown? I'm currently re-reading an excellent book on the decline of the steel industry: Homestead: The Glory and Tragedy of an American Steel Town

...and here's a HUGE aerial photo of the area: http://www.clayton.oh.us/images/City%20Map.jpg

Your point is well taken, but since this involves the city of Clayton, it seems doubtful that they would choose to site this project in Dayton. I don't know how familiar you are with that area, but Clayton was formed in 1997 from the rump of Randolph Township not already claimed by the cities of Union & Englewood. It consists of the original Clayton village west of Englewood and a swath of residual sprwal between Englewood & Trotwood. The rest is rural. That being the case, Clayton does not have a CBD. It seems they intend to create one, and I'm glad they're choosing this model. Perhaps I'm naive, but if Clayton is successful, I wonder if it might have some influence in curbing the march of sprawl to the south. I know a few people with houses that use this. It uses underground water, which I believe is a constant 50-some degrees year-round, which is pumped through a heat exchanger in the house's HVAC unit. Thus in the winter, the heater is only making up the difference between 50 degrees and room temperature, rather than the full spread between the outside air temp and room temp. Cooling on the summer is done the same way in reverse. It's used as a natural boost for conventional systems.

:clap: Clayton plans Towne Center Residents would walk or bike to activities, services By Chuck Smith For the DaytonDailyNews CLAYTON | The Clayton City Council wants to create a European village in the corn fields across National Road from Northmont High School. The new Towne Center will be an alternative to the typical auto-centered development, as the estimated 1,500 to 2,500 residents will be able to walk or ride bicycles to most shops, restaurants and services. The council Dec. 2 approved a preliminary plan for a $125 million mixed-use development on 145 acres of farmland north of U.S. 40 (National Road) and west of Haber Road. Read More...

Sweet Jesus - look at all the cul-de-sacs. They look like some sort of festering bacterial infection!

Pictures must be hosted - that is they must be stored on the web. You can use a web hosting service like pbase.com, or chances are that your ISP may provide some web space that you can use to store pictures as part of your account. If you right click on any of the pictures here and look at its properties you'll see where they are located and what site is hosting that picture. Pictures hosted thusly can then be posted by inserting them with the "img" command line. Example: {img}http://imagehost.com/user/randompic.jpg{/img} except substitute these brackets {} with these:[] And hey - if you're gonna post pics, go ahead and register first. That way you establish authorship and you exist as a "person" rather than an "entity". And welcome!

I question the motives of those who try to villify smokers, and I think much of the motivation behind these bans is indeed simply a case of people trying to tell others what they can & can't do. A possible upside to consider though, is that many bars might set up patios, balconies & beer gardens to lure the displaced smokers. I the wintertime they might even have fires going like they do at Hofbrau and The Courtyard.

Is that the "Winfred Louder" building?

Interesting spread. This makes so much sense it's silly. But where do they get $85-130 one way by car from Cleveland to Cincy? Maybe in a Hummer!!

It must be obligatory to include a huge glass atrium in libraries nowadays. Vancouver & Salt Lake have similar designs, probably a host of others. I've studied in libraries that had the older dark, cramped stacks as well as newer ones with the open floors. I'd have to say I enjoy the seclusion available in the former.

Excellent post Striking indeed - puts the concept of "efficient" American food production in perspective. It also underlines the fact that the carrying capacity of the planet is really based on the oil supply.

I wouldn't consider BP to be neo-deco. It's definitely PoMo, and I'd say one of the better examples of it. However, I've never heard anyone say it's one of their favorites. Now Key Tower is definitely neo-deco, with its height, setbacks and limestone color. Sounds like your original post is referring to what I call those "jet age" buildings that use a lot of concrete "buttressing" or give the appearance that they do. A good example of this in Dayton would be the Miami Valley Bldg: Another would be the hideous Admiral Benbow Hotel, my nominee for the ugliest building in Dayton. There's a great example on the corner of Stanley & Kuntz, it's the headquarters of an automotive supplier. Some of you might be familiar. Unfortunately I don't have a pic.

You're kidding, right? If not, I must ephatically disagree. Even if you don't like Art Deco (which it seems you don't) you have to recognize the artistry and attention to detail that those buildings display. I just have to think that you haven't given them a chance. Take a closer look and maybe you'll change your mind.

This BS about closing obervation floors and such is ridiculous. "Sorry sir, we can't allow anyone up there - they might be carrying a fuel-laden airliner in their pocket" As for that hypothetical terrorist with the nuclear device crammed up his colon or whatever - Does it matter where he detonates it? 58th floor, 1st floor, across the street, Public Square - I'd say you're equally screwed. It's the institutional equivalent of duct tape.

Anyone have any better pics? I'm intrigued.