3231

Look back at the University Circle thread, I think that they may be in there somewhere. Engineering is in process, so the exact looks of the new intersection may change.

By the way, construction should be begin in summer of 2010 for the new intersection. Goodbye traffic circle.

http://www.crainscleveland.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080602/SUB1/688593882/1071/TOC&Profile=1071 If they build it, who will come? Jacobs' downtown tower plans coincide with site searches by Baker, Huntington By STAN BULLARD 4:30 am, June 2, 2008 The public airing last week by Richard E. Jacobs Group of plans for a 21-story office tower on Public Square shows the stakes for developers are rising as they vie for the few tenants likely to anchor new office buildings in downtown Cleveland. Brian Conroy, co-manager in the Cleveland office of real estate advisory firm UGL Equis, views the May 28 announcement by Jacobs Group of the proposed joint venture with big, Houston-based developer Hines Interests as a sign that more is afoot than touting the proposal.

Wine Tasting: http://ohiocity.com/index.cgi?id=131&l=2&p=6345 Ohio City Run & Crawl http://www.ohiocity.com/index.cgi?id=131&l=2&p=5700

On another note: Ohio City is starting a series of Wine Tasting events. Check them out The Ohio City Run & Crawl is slated for June 21st. Sign up early and get a t-shirt and 25 cent beer ticket for Bier Markt.

Werff, Perception and reality are two totally different things. Check out the crime stats and you'll see that Tyler Village has a very low crime rate.

I've heard similar things regarding Pittsburgh. I am also a little puzzled by the "attacked" comment. But anyways, what is the makeup of Squirrel Hill? Is there also a large number of subsidized housing projects and poverty nearby as in Ohio City or is Squirrel Hill able to overcome that to reach the level of activity that you described?

Just an aside.. GE is moving a bunch of good jobs from Louisville to the light bulb research hq in Cleveland.

I think that a few of them (there are not that many) are independently owned. I know that the middle-aged guy who works the counter at the University Circle location is the owner of that particular coffee shop.

I don't mind the PD at all. Maybe it is because I compare it to the papers of the last three cities in which I lived (Detroit, Nashville and Memphis). If you want a bad paper, Nashville's Tennessean is a perfect example. Scene and Free Times have become muckrakers. I try to stay away from them. It is sad because The Free Times used to be pretty good.

You can't build a convention hotel on Public Square if you don't know where a convention center will be located.

^Stark still had some big gaps to fill in his financing. He was looking to do it with some creative TIFs. Creative TIFs need legislation. His overall timeline didn't match up with the timeline of some of the prospective tenants. I'm not 100% sure of this, but I think it is a fairly close explanation.

^I believe that costs go up significantly if you build over 21 stories due to more intense foundation work. I think we have our signature structures on public Square. I'd rather see a tall tower built somewhere else in the cbd.

^I don't think that Jacobs owns the Huntington. There was an article a few weeks ago that talked about the owner. I really don't think that it was Jacobs.

^I've heard that FEB will also be using that composite metal.

Psychological influences are strange. I don't see how Jacobs' development plans resemble what the rest of Cleveland is "settling for". I didn't know that we were are shareholders in Jacobs Inc.

If we are a "small-time" city, then why do you suggest we develop skyscrapers as if we were a "big time" city.

Badge, welcome to UO. Glad to see another sign up. Your input ignores basic economic and urban planning principles. Of course we'd love to have a handful of new 60-story towers going up downtown. However, we are not at the point where that is economically feasible. There appears to be a disconnect between how a city looks from afar and how it works on the downtown sidewalks. If we built cities for those who drive by on the local highways, then we'd have a dead skyscraper sculpture garden on our hands. We will have a vibrant 24-hr city only when we have various contiguous blocks of mixed-use, sufficiently dense structures. I can sense that a lot people who don't understand how a city works simply revert to "big is best" view on things. Take a look at Portland's downtown--are tall skyscrapers making that place a vibrant city? What would Cleveland feel like if Key Tower and the BP building were broken down into 10 ten-story buildings and scattered throughout the WHD and along Prospect. Imagine the in-fill that those buildings would have generated by now. Cleveland would be a much more vibrant city.

^NCB stock jumped 50% with this news. I've also heard that the retro cobol-based applications are really popular with Japanese teens.

I'd love to see something huge on Prospect across from E.4th street.

^I think design is very important. However, this block is such a huge and damaging hole in our urban fabric. I'm willing to accept a half-*ssed design if we could plug this hole in downtown.

i know because I pay attention to the office market. You obviously do not. How many cities in the US have seen 16 years pass without putting up a single office building? We need to understand our strengths and weaknesses. We are seeing some office tenants relocate within downtown. This is not expansion, is it relocation. It is good to a point. Please let me know which other office tenants are looking to expand in or to downtown that would justify such a large building. The current roster does not justify such growth. I have an idea. Let's build a 200-story building on Public Square. It would make us look so cool. Streetlife is so overrated--kind of like oxygen's importance to the human race. I think PHS would be a great location for a skyscraper. If the tall buildings are spread out over a cbd, it helps create the feeling that the downtown is larger. Take a look at downtown from 490 or 90--it appears that we only have three buildings in our downtown. That said, a skyline is the least important thing for a downtown. An active streetlife is what brings and keeps people downtown.

After thinking about this, I feel that it is much much better than tossing up another 65-story tower. Please, let's be real. Cleveland does not have the office market at this point to digest a such a huge tower. We'd probably see another 15 years of no-office-growth if we over built during another recession. Sure, the skyline pumps up our ego. But honestly, Key Tower does nothing for street life. Image if we had three 20-story towers interspersed throughout the WHD--that would create so much more life and give downtown a much more active feel. Here are my thoughts: -a huge tower would put a huge dent into the local office market. This would stunt future mixed-use developments. -it would create some serious traffic issues because of the parking garage that it would bring along with it--let's be honest, Jacobs is not counting on future workers to take the bus and ride the rapid. -tall towers tend to provide a lot of amenities that keep occupants from leaving the building. -tall towers make us feel proud -tall towers look good during the NBA and MLB playoffs -tall towers suck the life out of other parts of downtown -demanding a 50+ skyscraper is the short-sighted and egotistical way to go. A bunch of 20-story and 10-story office buildings will do a lot more for street life than a tower ever will. -tell me, how does the street level retail look around Key Tower?? This is the best case scenario. Architecturally, it allows Key and Terminal to stand out. I think that our taller buildings are already too concentrated in one area. I'd love to see one pop up in PHS some day--we need a little balance to our skyline. When they are concentrated as they currently are, it makes the rest of downtown look miniscule.

nasty.

Cool stuff. But KJP, you totally missed the Thomas the Tank Engine train on the Cuyahoga National Valley Scenic RR this weekend!! We paid a nice $60 bucks for a 25 minute train ride for the 3 of us (luckily the 3-month old didn't count). We should've rode the rapid for a total of $4. Boy do we need some better TOD developments with these gas prices.