clvlndr

For once, I agree with RTA, at least as it relates to ending the Nos. 7, 9 and 32s at Red Line stations… However, I do agree with doctabroccoli that the 7 and 32 probably should be extended a few blocks west to the massive Cleveland Clinic campus where they could be looped back to the Heights… Also, the 9s down Mayfield could be extended 1 block past the new Little Italy stop to the Euclid-Mayfield corner where riders could transfer to the frequent Health Line for direct service to the Clinic, CSU or other trip generators down Euclid into downtown. These short extensions should gouge RTA’s budgets that much but, however, I’d only extend certain runs (not all) of these lines whereby the majority of them would terminate at the UC or Little Italy RTS stations. Rush hour Heights riders on these routes wouldn’t sacrifice much as they are already rather spoiled with their 1-seat bus ride all the way downtown competing with high frequency, high capacity routes: the real rapid transit, and the Health Line bus rapid (which of course is better than a regular bus route). These RTA changes are in accord w/ my view that much money could be saved by ending RTA’s many bus routes running past/competing with Rapid routes. It’s wasteful and ending this practice does not actually end service for these riders … it’s just not quite as cushy….

^Once again, RTA is reeeeaaallly making it hard for the transit agency to win friends and influence sympathizers when, on one side of (down)town, you have Joe Calabrese poised to wield a king-sized service meat cleaver on a severly economically struggling populace while, on the other, you have a bunch of, allegedly on-duty, $50/60K (guesstimate) per-year transit cops hanging out in Tower City -- where it's not only safe but also at the one Red Line station where faregates actually prevent cheaters (so that, theoretically, the fare cops aren't even needed there), when RTA has drummed into us that these guys are supposed to enforce the new fare POP policy while making the system safe -- and yeah, in my 2 round Red Line round trips (Tower City to Airport) since POP has gone into effect, this is exactly the situation we witnessed... Isn't this exactly the type of Rapid fare irresponsibility/mismanagement the PD dinged RTA for last year when it reported probably tens of thousands of dollars in fares were wasted each year by non-collecting Rapid drivers and booth attendants? Talk about a transit agency talking out of both sides of its financial mouth.

^^ MyTwoSense, as a fellow 40-something who grew up in Shaker (riding the old yellow trolleys, up to when SHRT was flat broke and needed RTA to bail them out) and lives in Shaker Sq., you've got to be appalled at the condition of the trench from S. Square to Woodhill. It's filthy and nasty like it's never been -- it's now a dump for trash (couches, matresses, Big Wheels, strollers -- you name it -- and it smells) and it's not being picked up... and in the spring/summer, the brush is not being trimmed and scratches train car windows... Things have NEVER been this bad on the Shaker Rapid!! And yes, cars are also filthy often with bottles and cans rolling around in them; I've gotten on at Tower City and seen drivers step right over such mess -- it's not their job to clean but they should be contacting maintenence to do so... that's not just the lack of $$$$

The all-night NY Eve rail service should never have been dropped (I believe by the current RTA admin) in the 1st place (and btw, it was never free). Now that it's gone, you're right, politically, it's probably difficult to get it back... Both you and, particularly the Calabrese administration misses the point, nobody wants RTA to run at a loss, financially, because obviously it jeopardizes its ability to offer its SERVICE. I have stated often here that I support JoeC's effort to receive increased subsidy from the State and like the idea of capitalizing bus fuel costs to remove them from barred "operating expenses" under Federal guidelines and allow funding as capital expenses. People get that. But if RTA is to be run like a business, and it should, it should not always give the public the impression it is being done so, because people rightly feel that with tax dollars funding it, through the 1% sales tax, capital projects as well as steeply increasing fares and its quasi-governmental status, it's a business that belongs to them... And RTA has been very short on people skills. Cleveland and Ohio cities are not the only ones who are having their transit systems squeezed to the max, dollar-wise -- just look at Chicago... But yet, here, people often don't sense that RTA is doing what it can to offer them the best service it can within its financial constraints... Cutting the NY Eve service is just one thing -- one relatively small thing, in the financial scheme of things, but one that has a great deal of impact, esp given the high number of drunk drivers that were (when it was offered) and can be removed from the streets... Cutting it, esp when there are seemingly smarter, more efficient ways to run the system, for example, ending oft redundant services, would seemingly be a better alternative. I'll leave it at this for now, ... but trust me, plastering window-blocking stickers touting a 2007 Best Transit System in N. America on RTA vehicles, when rail cars, buses and rail right-of-ways are filthy, there's a seeming lack of aggressive participation and/or rail/commuter rail expansion (or even discussion of such) by the GM, when such is happening in other cities -- other economically DISTRESSED cities like Cleveland (Pittsburgh, Detroit, the Twin Cities, St. Louis... and others – and even here under JoeC’s RTA predecessor; the same predecessor who, according to KJP and others, had numerous expansion “studies” shut down by JoeC), isn't going to win RTA many friends... even when there are the cool, slick-looking, new buses cruising down a slowly rebuilding Euclid Ave....

It's rather weird. The old Taylor's Dept store sat crumbling for years and became part of the urban fabric. Then the scaffolding went up and Euclid was limited, traffic-ise as a result, and you noticed it... Now that the scaffolding is gone and Euclid's back to normal, 668 seems ... like it's been there in this exact condition, all the time... That said, it looks nice if a tad bit staid... I it meshes well with the restored Euclid streetscape, even though I'm still trying to visualize how the torn-down Dollar Bank building space is going to fit in... I've heard great things about the units and that there are some unnamed pro athletes already leased... Caddyshak sounds cool, esp to this part-time duffer; as an "active" place, like Corner Alley, that features something fun and out of ordinary (see: not the usual sit-on-your-ass sports bar-ish type joint downtown has in abundance)... I'm hearing that the number of units in 668 is making the place huge by downtown standards, esp for Gateway (or maybe I read this earlier in the 37 previous pages of this thread I'm simply too lazy to thumb back thru)... All in all, 668 is much welcomed and will surely juice what is already the hottest, rising part of downtown. I hope both the Euclid & Colonial Arcades, which are lovely (esp the Colonial) really benefit from 688, and that we can get a nice restaurant to fill Indigo's old, still empty space.

Good news from Hopkins Airport: I see after at least a year or more, the new-ish touch screen information system has FINALLY added, under Transportation Options (get this), the RTA Red Line rapid transit into downtown Cleveland. They even have a photo of a Red Line rail car to emphasize the point!! This means that our Cleveland Hopkins International Airport, which was the 1st airport in the Western Hemisphere to be directly connected by a rapid transit/high speed rail line to its city's downtown 42-years ago, is now, actually, finally, listing the same rapid transit as a transportation option for new visitors as a means of getting to downtown Cleveland -- and listing it right up there with the cabs and limos, which were the only options listed as recently as last summer!... ... will wonders ever cease...

^ We're talking only one night per year and 4 extra hours to cover the gap in rail service from around midnight/12:30a to 4/4:30a (make it hourly train service if we must)... And maybe, per my 'let's think creatively/collaboratively mantra of above, the County should get involved in seeking funds for this annual service... Of course, I don't think NYE rail is more important that bus routes to get auto-less people to/from their jobs. And yes, MTS, I am going to get involved with CAB (and get a transit accountant involved, as well) because I want to scrutinize the cuts RTA is making vs. those it chooses not to. In many if not most cases, I smell politics more than I do costs...

Why? This is Ohio. Exactly my point. One of the top 10 largest states population wise with 3 major metropolitan areas directly in the middle between NY and Chicago. Plus, Ohio is a swing state. Politicians should be falling over themselves to do us favors! No they shouldn't. Residents need to call their politicians to let them know there wants and needs. Politicians are reactionary, not innovators. Right now the pressure on the so-called "anti-rail hitmen" and their buddies in Congress is overwhelming for Amtrak projects like 3-C's. The naysayers are isolated to the extent where, only an absolute fool/moron, would vigorously argue against it.. Thank God we're in a period where -- although I hate to see the economic hardship our state and neighbors are suffering -- we have an Obama, a Strickland, a Sherrod Brown and others who understand, and are pushing the envelope; power people who understand that a 3-Cs project is exactly what an urbanized, struggling state like ours needs.

Great New Year's Eve night sight: after the partying died down, saw a stretch (articulated) No. 26 bus headed west on Superior towards the D-S Bridge and Detroit Ave. loaded with revelers... RTA should be the way to go on NYE. Our party, along w/ many others, had downtown jumping off the hook last night; and many party goers were struggling with their liquor... It still galls me that Joe Calabrese came in and ended the RTA tradition of all night Rapid service allegedly to save a few shekels... RTA is a SERVICE and not a BUSINESS and there can be no greater service than saving lives, which the expanded Rapid service was designed to do. And because of our (thankfully) tight downtown configuration, whereby most clubs and restaurants are within a few blocks of the Tower Rapid terminal (in either Gateway or the WHD -- and the Flats, too, what entertainment Flats is left), Rapid use would be a natural... Kudos to the 26 riders (and other bus users) for doing the SMART thing and letting RTA do the driving... Meanwhile, more heat should be brought to bear on JoeC for doing the TOTALLY IRRESPONSIBLE thing of killing off all-night NYE Rapid service.

^I'm stunned the New Haven Springfield line is single track; esp given the high population and high number of colleges that exist in the Pioneer Valley (Greater Springfield region)... No question that the Keystone Corridor is a model for this service, Ohio and any other region looking to establish or expand regional passenger train service. Aside from the hand-me-down railcars and AEM-7 electric engines, Keystone seems as fast an reliable as the NEC, sans the new Acela trainsets.

I 2nd your AMEN to 327... our perpetual 'helpless' posture is why, overall, we're in the state we're in...

That is not unique to Cleveland. A lot of transit systems have that (or something similar) posted on their trains/buses, along with the "please stand behind the (color) line." I don't mind if the message is clearly safety oriented -- I know NYC and Philly-area commuter rail lines have adopted the London-esqe "mind the gap" saying re high-platform boarding... But I totally agree w/ cleveland1979, the cellphones/dinner comments, esp the silly dinner one, is totally annoying, and I have not heard such announcements on any rail system I know that has prerecorded messages (Chicago, Philly, D.C. or New York) ... And when you have it repeated at EVERY STATION, you want to stick an index finger down the throat... I don't know whether to blame faulty GPS equipment or a lazy, inattentive driver for this...

The problem is less about leadership and more about market forces. Yeah, it's painful to see certain lots developed so lightly, but I'm not sure what you're expecting RTA or the City to do here. Buy and knock down the gas stations? Reserve empty lots near transit for high density housing that's unlikely to get built anytime soon? What the government can do is steer publicly financed projects near transit and that does seem to be happening. The key is vision and focus and, yes, if there was a plan, those gas stations could easily be torn down, even with the tedious/expensive issue of draining/removing gas tanks under the ground... the spot the 2-year-old Social Sec building is on at E.116 was the site of a gas station, too... As for who? Your question focuses on precisely the vexing problem Cleveland always has. Who? We don't get stuff done here because leaders are content to stay in their own little camps (Frank -- pickup the trash; JoeC, run the buses, CPC, ... frankly, I'm not sure what they're doing sometimes)... I can't for certain answer that question. But I can oftentimes it takes LEADERSHIP to step outside the box to make things happen... ... yeah, I know, I hold Ron Tober on a pedestal... but there's a reason. The one example: Gateway, Progressive Field and the Q (current names, of course) were stuck. Sure, huge tax bennies help bring Gund/the Cavs in from Richfield and spur Progressive Field, but Tober stepped forward w/ a novel idea: why not build a walkway from the Rapid terminal at Tower City so passengers can move quickly and indoors directly to the stadiums and make both more attractive... Tober/RTA were definite factors in making this hugely important (to the City) project materialize... And yes, Mike White -- the hated ex-mayor -- really pushed the parties to make this happen... Tober, White, Gund and Jacobs (and others) worked in tandem to make this happen. ... We don't see enough of this kind of cooperation and vision these days. Especially as regards our Rapid transit system which, frankly, doesn't even exist in the minds of our current leaders... Honestly, in the last 18 years since Gateway broke ground, have you seen ONE project, aside from tiny (and worthy) Eco Village, where planners have said: we're building this to take advantage of rapid transit? ... so as usual, we're stuck with asking who? how?, etc... in other places (and in a brief other time, even here in Cleveland) our leaders were taking the bull by the horns and getting things done.

Definitely I'd prefer Rapid/and or commuter, in/on the NS railroad ROW... I don't doubt what you're saying about the difficulty of getting rail funding in a declining metro area, but that being the case... it makes no sense; esp to apply a broad brush and punish a city that already has rail and near that (Clifton) corridor, already. Thus Cleveland's criteria (existing physical plant, repair/storage facilities, existing/direct route to downtown, etc..) SHOULD be considered differently than, say, Detroit, which would need considerably more in terms of new-start capital costs... It's absolutely crazy for the RTA, Columbus, the Feds, ... whoever, to continue to look and act like Cleveland has no rapid transit at all...

I'm glad RTA's building a new station at E. 116, but... I was just driving past there the other day, and the new Harvey Rice Elementary Sch. is just about finished (and looks partially open). It visibly adds to the area. However, it is right up on the E. 116 station... where, we thought, the high-density St. Luke's Pointe condos/apartments would be... but obviously, the project has flopped; a precursor to the credit collapse/foreclosure grip Cleveland would suffer. Unfortunately, this prime Rapid Transit station is surrounded on 4 corners by: a school (govt, non-revenue generating), the new small, 1-story Social Security building (ditto), and 2 gas stations... Sure would be nice if we had leadership at City Hall that would look at Los Angeles, Denver, Dallas, and other cities eagerly expanding rail at the potential of TOD development, esp in a distressed city like Cleveland... If Frank Jackson spent as much time touting the potential of the rail system we had as he did fronting for the Opportunity boulevard/freeway, ... as I always ask about out troubled city: where is the friggin' leadership???? Btw, as to the Clifton BRT proposal... I am NOT excited. If RTA had vision and a spirit of cooperation, they'd be supporting rail transit (of some form, West Shore commuter, rapid transit ... something) rather than pumping BRT -- which L.A. has strongly rejected in favor of traditional LRT for it's planned Santa Monica route. As for the Blue/Green Lines new/altered automated GPS station-call voice service: whatever upgrade is chosen, can we have focus MORE on station/connecting line info and less on overly-talky and/or RTA self-promotional stuff -- ie, ... "thank you for riding RTA, ... like we got for every station from the Airport to Tower City on the Red line!?

Jerry, I certainly hope your surgery went well and you get back on the healthy track... Well, I'm glad the Buckeye BRT issue can be put to rest, and I'm glad both E.116 and Woodhill will be getting new stations... One lagging issue: after the Blue/Green rail maintenance shutdown, what is the situation with the 2 large steel bridges (over the railroads) on the elevated section of Blue/Green lines? There are slow zones over both bridges; do they need to be replaced? Some drivers really creep over these 2 bridges -- at times, going like 2 MPH -- it has really slowed trip times down; the Rapid hasn't been so rapid... This has been going on for the better part of the year... Also, having returned home from the Airport and riding the Red line for the 1st time since early last summer, I see a more conversational automated voice has replace 50s/60s Rosie the Robot voice... the new guy is cool, if a tad bit talky...Unfortunately, I see "Rosie" has been transferred to the Blue & Green lines... Any timetable for getting her choppy voice replaced?

No I haven't. But it's not a bad idea; something I'll probably explore... I really wonder, MTS, how much impact the CAB has given the cuts that RTA has gotten thru. I do admire the way they stood up for the Community Connectors and put JoeC on the defensive... realistically, though, my strong gripes about BRT up Buckeye vs the Rapid would probably seem arcane to the CAB, which are mainly, and wisely, more concerned about bus route cuts rather than long-range planning... But I'll check CAB out, nonetheless.

As you know, this is not a true BRT in the HealthLine sense of the word. A more apt description is running the existing articulated buses in a transit corridor with around transit stops. The same thing is proposed for Clifton. As you also know, there is federal capital funding available for transit but not for operating costs. Thus I'm hopeful this will also include signal prioritization for transit vehicles on these "BRT light" and other routes to reduce travel times, reduce vehicle's, improve reliability, increase fuel efficiency and reduce wear and tear on brakes. I understand the concept on Clifton -- this is a wide street; a heavy bus corridor (w/ the 55s) and does not compete, directly with any of the Rapid lines... Buckeye is exactly the opposite on all counts, and makes no sense. Most importantly, it's a very light transit line -- at most times of day, it could be run with the shorter/mini buses; even smaller Connector vehicles... So why is a Buckeye BRT, in any form, under consideration and study? ... paralleling and 1 block from high-speed/high capacity rapid transit KJP? .... surely, something else is going on here, and I'd sure like to get some answers from RTA.... I've been silent on JoeC and his incompetence/agenda for some time, but this really pisses me off, esp in light of the dirty stations, filthy corridors (esp along that Shaker Blvd trench which you NEVER saw before), the continued slow zones on rail's elevated portion (with no explanation why -- at least that I've seen -- and no timetable towards fixing the tracks) ... in other words -- as others are echoing -- the general state of transit operations, esp rail, have sucked... and now we're going to ask the Feds to expend money to "study" how we can expend money on an expensive bus proposal -- whatever BRT form -- to COMPETE with our rail system; from a transit GM who's hostile to rail... KJP, this is beyond an abomomination... ... and to hell with the 2007 Best North American Transit System mumbo-jumbo JoeC loved to tout... I'd love to call it a sick joke, but too many too many Cuyahoga County lives are being jerked around in the process.

You raise some interesting points... as to crosstown buses. These were tried recently, but RTA decided to go back to the old system and now, once again, radial East and West Side buses, once again, terminate downtown... I do think there should be, at least, a continuation of West Side buses thru to CSU, which is a major trip generator... Of course, the other idea, people have floated, is extending the Trolley to Ohio City-- which probably won't happen because, imho, it would siphon of fares with a free ride service. Marketing, you're right, RTA is horrible, there's little real marketing other than for the hot new (expensive) flava of the month -- the Health Line. Everywhere I look, it's Health Line, all the time... Even the Airport Rapid is 2nd fiddle (actually, no fiddle right now).. But all this leads back to the original point: generously, RTA is a rudderless ship that lurches from scandal to crisis-- (the Bus-turning death/subsequent honking debacle; the pre-POP 10s to 100s of thousands of $ lost in lost Rapid fares not collected (because of no coherent fare collection system) w/ no accountability; the Health Line concrete mixing fiasco, and now the poorly designed POP fare machines on the Red Line -- where does it stop? In terms of service, it seems RTA only puts for the minimal effort to stay just ahead of criticism which, for the most part, it cannot avoid. There's a 'Public Be Damned' attitute wafting from W. 6th Street. And the meat-cleaver approach towards cuts -- where we clearly understand the belt tightening needed against a very stingy Columbus in terms of transit funding -- still, I think JoeC's cuts are hasty and have given little though to other cuts that could be made that would have a lesser impact, especially for services that greatly impact low income folks who have no alternatives. ie -- why do so many buses have to enter downtown? Why can't more be diverted to Rapid stations (ie W.25th Ohio City where literally a hundred + buses, each day, zip right past (or w/in a block) and head for Public Square)... Why no cuts here? At least, people would have an alternative; they just wouldn't have their cushy 1-seat ride to Public Square... Isn't this the way rapid transit is supposed to operate -- oh yeah, I forget, our transit GM doesn't believe in rapid transit... But the proposed BRT on Buckeye is the most disturbing twist I've seen. Somebody -- JoeC or whoever -- needs to be called on the carpet for this. If JoeC is crying broke, I want to know why anyone would be STUPID enough to propose using the 2nd most expensive technology in use (BRT) to compete against our fastest, large capacity Rapid system... If collectively the town sits in silence for crap like this, the whole City loses... Inexcusable!

My understanding is that RTA has discussed actively spending (someone's) money on studies for additional BRT (Buckeye and 55th come to mind), and that nobody is forcing them to do this. My understanding is also that once per month I buy a pass from some clownish mockery of a fare machine that has RTA's name on it. If these understandings are factually incorrect, then please by all means give me a hard time. Wait-- on second thought, don't. Glad you mentioned this... why the hell is RTA studying BRT on Buckeye? This is a narrow street and has, historically, light bus traffic because the street parallels and is a few blocks away from the main trunk, high-speed portion of the Blue & Green Rapid lines, which sucks the lion's share from both Buckeye and Woodland/Larchmere (11 & 12) bus routes. This makes absolutely no sense ... Unless, of course, this feeds Joe Calabrese's long term goal of converting our rail transit system to buses; which would not entirely surprise me... But again, returning to 327's point, who authorized this Buckeye/BRT study especially from a transit system that's crying broke and cutting bus and rail services left and right? While I'm of course sympathetic to the gross govt underfunding and even agree w/ Calabrese's advocacy for capitalizing fuel costs in order to allow Federal subsidy, I have zero confidence in the leadership or vision of Joe C. who has clearly established himself the foe of any transit that involves rail (including Amtrak 3-C)..

I wouldn't necessarily look at FasTracks of the moment. Fact is, almost all large rail transit builds face some overbudgeting, controversy and slowdowns. If you look at DC's shining 107-mile Metro and think it was smoothly dropped in place, you'd be badly mistaken... ditto with Dallas' quickly unfolding DART. Denver may have temporarily stubbed its toe, but it already has made substantial progress and I believe all or most of its projected system will be built. Most transit planners plan beyond what they actually believe will be realized, and only few cities achieve or even surpass what they''ve planned: DC and San Fransico are the only 2 that come to mind... Progress is never achieved without struggle and some empty pockets along the way... but as the saying goes: if there is a WILL there is a way.

Wow, to think that in the 34 years of RTA, there's been only one GM with a true and positive vision for transit: Ron Tober... and we let him get away (to develop Charlotte, NC's LRT and commuter rail)... we're still waiting for commuter rail here in NEO.

I think it is, from the looks of the housing... The density of the old buildings proves what some may find hard to believe: Detroit, like every old metropolis, grew along (streeetcar) transit lines.

Nice, but does RTA even have an iron in the fire (viz any WFL extension)?

"To make matters worse, a constitutional amendment Ohio voters adopted in 1947 forbids any portion of the gas tax from being used except on highway programs. The amendment is outdated and ought to be changed. The ban may have been appropriate when Ohio needed to build highways, but it's no longer justifiable. In the 21st century, the public needs buses and trains to ease congestion, cut pollution and streamline travel while boosting jobs. " PD editorial Thanks PD. Glad you read my UO posts. :wave: