Clevelander17

It's worth noting that there are only two districts in the state that receive more funding from the state that ECCSD: http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2015/07/rocky_river_independence_schoo_1.html I wouldn't exactly call that a pillar of stability. Once these two cities become one, anything is possible with Columbus calling the shots and state funding being so fickle. I'll bet a school district merger isn't that far behind regardless of what the residents may want.

Fine, you're right about what would legally happen after a merger between Cleveland and East Cleveland. (Although it's clear that the City of Cleveland and CMSD are intertwined in a manner that is unique in the State of Ohio, a point which you seem unable to concede or accept as being relevant.) But, let's do it this way: In your opinion, taking everything into consideration, what is the probability that if/when Cleveland and East Cleveland merge, that a merger of the two school districts follows within a short period (say 3-5 years) after? Do you really believe that the case will truly be closed and the issue won't be broached?

I stand corrected. What is Cleveland's current largest park? With Forest Hill, they'd be getting over 160 acres.

I think that Forest Park going to the MetroParks would be the best possible outcome if Cleveland and all of East Cleveland merge. I seem to remember it was Cleveland's mismanagement of the beaches it ran that lead to the MetroParks coming in and really improving things drastically. I certainly doubt the EC portion of Forest Hill would benefit from moving under Cleveland's jurisdiction. In regards to your second point about the residents in that area, maybe they should have a say in what they want to happen with their neighborhood? Maybe before any of this full-scale merger momentum moves forward any further they should start talking to CH about a possible annexation?

The whole setup is a mess and IMO borderline unconstitutional because then you have the residents of Bratenahl and Newburgh Heights. They don't get to vote for Mayor of Cleveland but are forced to deal with the consequences of whatever school decisions he makes regarding the choosing of the school board and CEO. This is what a small section of Cleveland Heights would be looking at were it ever to be pulled into CMSD.

Because Cleveland has enough territory to manage that it has neglected. It doesn't need any more. Cleveland Heights is better off taking control of the area exploiting the natural buffer between itself and Cleveland. And when I say "meat on the bone," why do you jump to the conclusion that I'm talking about "people"? Maybe you're the one with his mind in the wrong place? Regardless, the point remains that the area itself has a decent park with a lot of potential, a few blocks of nice (but not spectacular) homes, main roads that are in pretty bad shape, and a large number of blocks of deteriorating homes and apartment complexes.

Per Wikipedia: CMSD is the only district in Ohio that is under direct control of the mayor, who appoints a school board.[...]The school board appoints a chief executive officer, the equivalent of a district superintendent, who is responsible for district management. So again, while what you're saying is technically true, until the question is definitively answered I think it's worth the discussion because EC would fall under the mayor's jurisdiction.

Because it's the other way around in this case, and it involves the area of an entire school district. My suspicion is that if/when the merger goes through, it won't be long after that there will be talk of dissolving ECCSD into CMSD.

Yeah I mentioned that above. There was actually a push about two decades ago to have this area transferred into the CH-UH City School District. "Mayor" Kelley even got involved in trying to make it happen. My suspicion is that folks living in that area would put up a bit of a fight if that part of CH was to become part of CMSD.

First off, as a Cleveland resident, there isn't that much meat on the bone, so enjoy. Second, I fully understand that school districts and municipalities are separate entities. However, as a Cleveland resident, you should know that CMSD is not separate from the city, it is under mayoral control. That is why the question is one to consider.

Another interesting point just came to mind regarding the school district question: Part of Cleveland Heights is within the East Cleveland City School District (the streets near Caledonia Elementary School). If mayoral control of schools means the ECCSD is dissolved into CMSD, then I think there may be issues with including a portion of Cleveland Heights into CMSD.

In my understanding, based on some things I read a few years back, when two municipalities are involved it's technically a "merger," even if one is much bigger and the new combined area takes on the name of the larger municipality. And I think when a municipality brings in unincorporated land (for instance township land like Columbus has been famous for doing over the years), that would be an annexation. I guess I'll throw this out there again even though it's looking less and less likely: I would still argue that the uphill area of East Cleveland should merge with Cleveland Heights. Why do you think the Forest Hills section of East Cleveland and neighborhoods to the north and south of Noble Road should merge with CH and not Cleveland? Because I'm a bit parochial and have always felt like that area had geographic continuity with its bordering CH neighborhoods. ;) When this merger goes through, I'd like to see some serious consideration given for turning Forest Hill Park over to the MetroParks. I'd also like for both cities to find something productive to do with the Superior Triangle area that is currently a complete mess and, IMO, causing big problems for Cleveland Heights. If these two things can be addressed, I'd feel a lot more comfortable with Cleveland's merger with East Cleveland.

In my understanding, based on some things I read a few years back, when two municipalities are involved it's technically a "merger," even if one is much bigger and the new combined area takes on the name of the larger municipality. And I think when a municipality brings in unincorporated land (for instance township land like Columbus has been famous for doing over the years), that would be an annexation. I guess I'll throw this out there again even though it's looking less and less likely: I would still argue that the uphill area of East Cleveland should merge with Cleveland Heights.

The only question I would have regarding the schools is that because CMSD is technically under mayor control, would that mean something different for the otherwise independent ECCSD? It's certainly an open question in this particular merger situation.

I don't know, I think any NFL team in Los Angeles would basically be a license to print money for the ownership. It's a gigantic market and even with a potentially apathetic local fanbase, there'd still be enough people to sell out and make a lot of money through television rights.

Oh yeah, I absolutely agree, and I don't know if that's realistic. I can dream though, right? As an aside, I'd be curious to find out just how much Canton/Stark County residents are going to ultimately end up forking over for the new stadium. The naming rights are going to an out-of-towner, but I think that locals will be footing most of the bill if I remember correctly. Interesting to note, Tottenham Hotspurs of the English Premier League are building a fancy new stadium (which will also host two NFL games per year) and it appears that most of the funding for the project is private. I'd be curious to find out how common it is for stadiums for major sports in European countries to be built with public funds. My suspicion is that it's pretty rare and this is more of an American "tradition."

I chuckled at the Cincinnati-Cleveland confusion. But I agree with his sentiment. Pro sports owners in the United States collectively hold cities hostage to build new stadiums that include sweetheart deals where owners collect significant portions of the revenue. I've read competing economic analyses on whether or not it's worth it, but it would be nice if there were a way to force these billionaire owners to build their own new stadiums.

Yeah it's really an amazing neighborhood and a hidden gem of East Cleveland. Certainly not what one thinks of when they think of EC. Also take a look at Oakhill Road just a few blocks away. That neighborhood really looks like it could be part of Shaker Heights. Also very close in proximity to Forest Hill Park which is a bonus.

Wow, nice work!

My suspicion is that the "uphill" historic homes of East Cleveland have been pretty well-maintained over the years. It's the "downhill" EC homes on and off of Euclid Avenue--those that still exist--that are probably the most ripe for some serious rehabilitation efforts.

I believe this is why, on paper, Columbus proper's various population statistics (income, crime, etc.) do not look as dire as Cleveland's. The presence of significant suburban areas within the city boundaries of Columbus allow the city to offer the "suburban lifestyle" while still being actual Columbus residents. The existence of the Win-Win school district agreement even allows many of these Columbus residents to attend the more desirable suburban school districts like Dublin, Westerville, Worthington, etc. I imagine if Cleveland ever fully consolidated with Cuyahoga County, a similar outcome would exist with the vast suburban areas remaining suburban in character.

That's pretty much the deal that we already have.

In terms of lists of dumb-a$$ lists, that one ranks near the top. I don't even know where to begin.

So in looking at a solid depth chart we have for sure: PG - Irving, Williams SG - Shumpert, Harris SF - James, ? PF - Love, Thompson C - Mozgov, Varejao Am I missing anyone? I'll update it as we go along, I just wanted to lay something out to look out. Some interchangeable parts there as well.

Shump is officially in, as well.