OCtoCincy

^ underground parking is certainly part of the process. 3CDC's original site study said it was a necessity.

How many years has the Brent Spence plan been talked about? How far is it from starting? Duke is already moving utilities for Brent Spence and the state is not paying them. They are doing a massive project in front of Longeworth hall to prepare for the new bridge and it's all paid for by rate Payers. Decided?!? I don't think you know how negotiations work. This has been being negotiators for 2 years. All other utilities have settled. Duke is going to upgrade these lines in the next few years as the cast iron gas pipes become dangerously old. They are currently on a 15 year program go replace all 1200 miles up gas lines in southwest Ohio. This includes downtown and OTR. They actually raised our rates to fund this a few years ago. This is simply a ploy to get brand new pipes paid for by the city.

I don't think anyone has said streetcars make gas lines explode... Have they??? I don't get where that came from. A street Can be ripped up to access a line. The streetcar line cannot (as easily) be ripped up at a whim. The safety thing I don get- but moving the utilities is expected, always.

^ it's a much more complicated issue than that. Plus, there are no gas lines overhead. All of those are underground. I'm not saying duke is being reasonable, but it's false to call this a non-issue.

I even think there was an argument on this forum because some people misread the article. It said everything else (water, Cincinnati bell, etc) is $10 mill total, and Duke is the only thing that is still not figured out.

But I doubt any bank is going to finance a high rise condo tower that isn't 450-700,000 units.

^ they didn't have an agreement. For some reason a lot of people misread the Biz Courier article and states there was an agreement. One of the biggest disagreements beyond cost is that Duke wants utilities moved 8 feet from the line, although that's part of why cost is so high on their estimate.

http://uptownaccessstudy.com/Images/PDFs/Open_House2%20materials/AltF.jpg This is the preferred alternative for the two way conversion.

0 chance of any of that before mill creek/Brent Spence is complete. After that, (2030) who knows, it might be an option, but considering the width of I75, not likely.

"Dunnhumby would own its offices. Non-profit developer Cincinnati Center City Development Corporation (3CDC) would own and operate the rest. " -Enquirer. That does NOT say Dunnhumby owns the entire building and that 3CDC & the City (Who owns the land and will likely be providing major financing) would have no say. It's Definitley not a certainty that there will be residential, but it's not solely Dunnhumby's decision at all.

^ the Enquirer article that announced the deal. And QCS has never been considered large in terms of SF per floor. The P&G office building (not the towers) has almost twice the Square footage per flood as QCS. Their current site is roughly 35,000 SF per floor. They clearly prefer large open floor plans.

P&G's, the Kroger one, and a couple others are privately owned. The City won't be taking those down ever.

Ahhhhh has no one read anything???? They physically can't fit at the Banks site. It is a MAXIMUM 250,000 square foot building over 15 floors (revisions in construction limited the buildings size from the original plan). That is about 16,000 square feet per floor. They want 250,000 square feet TODAY and to own the building. That means, if 5 years from now they hit their 1000 staff goal (currently 515 employees) they might need to move again. And who would buy a building only to have to move 5 or so years later since it has no room for growth. Dunnhumby has now on several occasions very clearly said they want large open floors, hence they are going with 40,000 square foot floors instead of the 16,000 square foot floors they would have been limited to at the Banks. It's lovely to fantasize about what's best for downtown. But we have to face reality and Dunnhumby was not going to move to the Banks site. Period. Finally- this is not the end of the world. The old enquirer building, Barlett co. building, etc. are all empty. Updating beautiful old office buildings to residential is all the market is interested in. No one is taking old c-class office space from 120 year old empty buildings and making into new apartments. Finally, if anyone watches citicable religiously, yes, guiltily pleasure, the City manager said residential is still part of the plan.

^ agreed. It went from a differing opinion to just being obnoxious.

I'm guessing it's for the Hops garden vines to grow on.

I'm not saying its "expensive" but it's foolish to compare market prices in Cincinnati to Market prices in Chicago or New York. Micro-markets set their own prices that lead to different pay, costs, value. Etc. More importantly- $850 with parking for a 1 Br in downtown is a good price for the quality that this place will offer.

Wow! They have moved FAR on the fine details of this: http://www.thereservecincinnati.com/residences/ Clicking on any bedroom combination, you can see the square footage of individual units, which way they face, floor & floor plan. Additionally, amenities are quite detailed, including: Valet Dry cleaning, maid services (extra cost), complementary morning coffee bar, Door man, etc. Prices are a on the moderate-high range- 1bd/1bth is 750- however it seems parking is included in which case price is very appropriate. For those who don't know, this project was originally dreamt up by attorney/property investor Lanny Holbrook. Mr. Holbrook has always had great intentions but often seemed to bite off more than he could chew. He purchased the parking garage (a completely separate entity) adjacent to 4th and race tower and racked up almost $90,000 in delinquent taxes before the project (sometime in late 2010) shifted from his control to that of the current developers. Mr. Holbrook has recently passed away. The garage is where residents will park although I think it will continue to be available for daily rentals as it's a 110,000 square foot garage.

With 3CDC managing the development I'm sure it'll be something good. I wonder if this will mean in the next 10 years we'll see the neighboring Fountain Square West come to fruition...

^ Agreed. I'm betting that the Reserve at 4th & Race is full within.... 4 months from the beginning of leasing. But I digress...

I will say that nothing in this article implies the entire building will only be Dunnhumby. It's highly likely that they will get 5ish floors and at LEAST 4-5 more floors would be built as well- with Dunnhumby as the anchor tenant while 3CDC works to fill the rest of the site. Having ~45,000 sq/f on just one floor will be VERY unique for downtown and potentially could lure in some typically suburban businesses. Assuming that two floors are built for street level retail, then several parking decks, then 8-10 floors of office space, this could easily be a 18-20 story building. That sounds good to me! And if that means 5th and Race has no residential, I'm ok with that. I'd rather see C Class office space converted to Apartments (Federal Reserve (already happening), Old Enquirer, Bartlett building, etc.) than new construction condos/apartments go up.

Fountain Square, the largest underground garage in the city, is 600 spaces. You will never get 1000 spaces underground Built by the city.

Well sure. But if you go By the loan ordinances you can say the project started in May 2010. Or when the utility negotiations started so eary 2011. Or when issue 9 failed. Since the project "started" in 2007 you could argue that's when it started. The more important part is that since nov 8 2011 it Wont be stopped.

To 99% of people "starting" means ground breaking. Hell, I won't even say its started until groundbreaking. I still say its going to happen & will start soon. By that logic it started when the bids were issued... Or when the negotiations started for utilities. Which is all sort of true- but no one will believe it until a road is ripped up.

^ as you can see from his Post count, Kj has not been posting on here for years, and only insiders are aware how close this project is to breaking ground. The average person does not know we'll be starting in a matter of weeks Regards to "dying" I'm pretty sure it's a sarcatic reference to his age. Not everyone on here is in their 20's or 30's. Rest assured, this project is moving forward.

^ I agree. But in terms of initial buildout, who knows.