Zimzolla

It was an anecdotal remark by Jennifer Coleman. There were some sort of plans for redeveloping a surface lot with a several stories building, and the owners of nearby businesses freaked out. (shes not just chair of Landmarks, also downtown design review). It was anecdotal, I don't recall the building, the point was the parking issue down there. I have heard of one interesting way to combat parking lots (or empty lots). I have heard in some cities that an undeveloped piece of land in the center city is taxed more than developed land, an attempt to halt demolitions of buildings to decrease taxes. It could be a piece of the puzzle to force parking lots out too.

Believe it or not, restaurant owners in the WHD have opposed infill on parking lots because of the fear in losing the customers.

It has only been empty for 15 years because CSU wanted it that way. This building held a, from what I heard, quite successful Kinko's until CSU bought the building in 1996, gave Kiinkos a year free rent to break the lease so that CSU could tear it down then to make way for a new bookstore. Its been fifteen years and CSU never got around to it, and they let the building fall into disrepair, and they never wanted to develop plans because they have always assumed it was coming down. This is demolition by neglect.

If anyone wants to support the Wolfe Music Building please come to the landmarks meeting on December 8th at 9:00 am. We want CSU to explore all their options, not just the easiest, and get them to look again at keeping the Wolfe in their plans for the new structure. Landmarking is one such way. If you can't make it, send an email to Jennifer Coleman and the other members of the commission.

KJP, I don't think you are giving Johnson enough credit. All I know is that Johnson already has a track record for historic preservation, and he in all my interactions with him over the past few months appears to have a genuine respect and appreciation for historic buildings, and I am happy and thankful that he has taken on this project. Here is how I see it. Johnson saw a group who within his ward asked him to save the Wolfe music building. Since the only way to get a building nominated for landmarking is for the councilman of the ward to nominate it, he is simply fulfilling the wishes of those he represents. Will he get publicity? is it a perk? sure. But I do not believe that it was his motivation. Johnson is a preservationist, rare in this region from what I have seen. This isn't a protest against new constructions, this is a protest for the few remaining relics of Euclid avenue's past. Besides, is progress putting CSU into debt on a new science building when the old one can be rehabbed? CSU has avoided debt thus far even with all the new building going on, this 25 million bond will set us on the wrong path.

Wow, I thought we would have a little more time. Myself and some members of SLPA are still working with the Cleveland Restoration society on this, and are close to some sort of breakthrough, though I don't want to get into the details yet. Just want you UO'ers to know we are still advocating for the Wolfe music if anyone cares anymore. Now ignoring the preservation aspect, I am not so crazy about this plan. I don't quite understand what they mean by the BGES, Chemisty, and mathematics departments moving to this building. What about the huge, though admittedly run down Science and research center? Will all the professors research labs move here? What about their offices, the teaching laboratories, the lecture halls? Are they leaving the physics department behind? I cant believe that CSU would separate any of these components apart, it just wouldn't make sense, so I must assume its all moving down and across the street. The building will need to be massive, though the current plan is to demolish the whole block (yes rascal house and peabodies too). So what, now the science building will be empty? This get a meh from me. I am excited at the prospects of a new science building, and that classrooms may cross Euclid, but what of the hulking Science building? And I don't see any way the wolfe can fit into this plan at all.

:clap: :clap: :clap: Why are you clapping? This is terrible--it's going to be a complete mess for those of us that need to be on campus or in that area on a daily basis. I'm all for saving history, but come on now, Cleveland State is not a museum. It's an actual functioning college campus with a vast majority of enrollment being commuters. Parking is already an issue on campus during peak hours, and this is going to cause big problems if they don't have a legitimate alternative. Maybe Cleveland State should simply move out to Beachwood or Independence. That way school officials can have their brand new campus with plenty of parking and everyone trying to save every little bit of history at all costs over progress can have their empty historic buildings in the most recently abandoned section of Cleveland. :laugh: I think you need to take another crack at reading this thread as you are horribly confused. The North Campus development is occurring on CHESTER AVE, while the Wolfe Music building is on EUCLID AVE. The North Campus district is replacing parking with a mixed use apartments, the Viking Hall/Wolfe Music development is nowhere near beginning construction, and will not affect your ability to park 5 feet from your classes. Maybe you should be less worried about the Urban planning of Cleveland State and a little more focused on your reading comprehension.

CSU's plans for the building is basically, "Whatever the developers want to do with the site". Here is a rough draft of a write up I did on the building for the committee overseeing this project per their request, I focused on history, another of my compatriots is focusing on architecture. Hopefully this will convince anyone who is on the fence to at the least write a letter and let those in power know someone cares. Its really rough, and more hopefully will be added. Any comments and/or information about the tenants or other history would be much appreciated. Also the Cleveland Restoration Society has officially recognized this project and has sent a letter to Cleveland State, we are still waiting for the National Trust for Historic Preservation, but I am confidant we will have their full support soon. Wolfe Music Building Letter draft The Wolfe music building at 2112 Euclid Avenue was first built in 1927, and was designed by the illustrious architecture firm Walker and Weeks. The firm Walker and Weeks have designed such Cleveland landmarks as Severance Hall, the Cleveland Public Library, and the Federal Reserve Bank, and are arguably the most important and famous architecture firm in Cleveland’s history. The structure was built for the Wolfe Music company, a business that would be moving from 641 Prospect Avenue to its new location on the up and coming showcase for arts, culture, and commerce on Euclid Ave, Cleveland’s very own answer to Fifth Avenue. Euclid Avenue in the 20’s was thus in a transitionary period; the single family homes and mansions that formerly made up millionaire’s row were being cleared away for these new commercial structures. The buildings that would come to occupy this new showcase, according to Dr. Klein, were built to be landmark structures that would stand the test of time. The Wolfe Music building would thus reside with the beautiful New Amsterdam Hotel and the grand Trinity Cathedral designed by Charles Scheweinfurth. The Wolfe Music Co. would occupy the structure until 1930, when structure became vacant until 1943. In 1943 the Wolfe Music building came to be the home of the national Register company, which occupied the building until 1958. In 1966 The Cooper School of Art would come to call the building home, and would remain there until 1972. The most recent tenant was Kinko’s, which operated there until CSU purchased the property in 1996/97. The building has recently been nominated for entry into the National Register of Historic Places by Robert Keiser, but it has been stalled due to lack of photographs of the interior. Thanks to Robert Keiser for the history he has already written on the building in his nomination for the structure. Thanks to Dr. Klein for his knowledge on the history of Euclid Ave. in the 20’s.

Effective september 29 csu will lose 436 parking spots from lots s3 s2 and j for construction of campus village to begin. I'll also use this opportunity to plug my effort. Save the wolfe music building, send in those letters. I have a lot of work ahead, but we are making progress. Maybe I'll have time to update everyone next well if you are interested.

I changed my original post. its Engstrom not Angstrom, my apologies.

Surely we will organize a petition, but I wouldn't mind pestering a few people to get started. This is really in the very early stages and is just getting off the ground now. Hopefully we will see this take off soon. Give me some time, and in the meantime, let these people now someone cares.

Alright, after calling around CSU (who is being very cooperative) I have amassed a master list of contacts, all emails regarding the protection of the building should be directed to all these people. Ronald Berkman: President of CSU [email protected] Ed Schmittgen: CSU Architect [email protected] Joe Mosbrook: CSU Director of Strategic Communications [email protected] Stephanie McHenry: CSU VP of Business and Finance [email protected] Nathan Engstrom: CSU Campus Sustainability Coordinator [email protected] Laura Clark: Cuyahoga County Senior Development Finance Analyst [email protected] @Pugu, go to http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=oa.246246748741522&type=1 for photos of the building, what you are refering to was the building on prospect that housed their offices. That is renovated and occupied. @willyboy, the national trust huh? do you have connections? Any bit of support helps, the more organizations that weigh in, the increased likely hood of success. All who started emailing, send to the new people on the list too.

I think the issue here was the University Architect was not present. The people heading the meeting may not have heard anything, and since the Architect did not agree with you he probably kept your conversation to himself. At the very least my comments will go into the public record and the grant application. That is why I provided the emails, this is the person who charged me with garnering support and an argument, he should be the one to note the public support from now on. ClevelandOhio, email him, hell, tell him about your discussion with the Architect. It can only help.

Just trying to get the word out. The three story Walker and Weeks designed building adjacent to Viking Hall is in imminent danger of being demolished. Go to the CSU college town thread for more info http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,13086.new.html#new I have a full report on a public meeting regarding it. I have left it up to mods to decide where we should discuss it, thus is why I am cross posting.

Alright here is the low down on the three story Walker and Week’s building adjacent Viking Hall. The meeting was today, and only myself, a student filming it for a class (not urban related, just a film class) and our dear friend Mr. Frangos were in attendance. The plan is to raze the two buildings, with grants for asbestos removal and other environmental factors, and a mixed use building of unknown size and shape will be its replacement. They are waiting for a developer to come along similar, I think, to how Polaris is handling North Chester. All I know is CSU does not have anything specific in mind. The building will be commercial and institutional, apparently there is a 5 year freeze on residential development from CSU due to all the new residential currently being added. They said if everything goes according to plan, demolition and redevelopment can happen as early as late 2012, early 2013. Grants need to be granted, developers need to come forward, etc. I raised questions as to whether or not CSU had looked into redevelopment. I was informed that the University Architect had deemed it unhistorical. After attempts at refuting that, bringing up the famous Walker and Weeks firm, its age, its handsome façade, what else makes a building historical? The main concern was the economics of redeveloping the site, as it is in great disrepair. They said two things must be done to create a case for preservation, one, make an argument that the building is indeed historical, and two, there needs to be more public support. They said that so far I am the only one to raise these questions (obviously they don't read UrbanOhio). I will be working with SLPA and the Cleveland Restoration society to see if anything can be done here. Maybe Urban Ohioans would like to get into this too? I'll keep you all updated as this develops. These two emails were given to me, as they charged me with the responsibility of preparing a proposal for why the building is historical. (I will work on this with SLPA and hopefully Cathleen Crowther). If anyone wants to email them and start getting the message out there that some people care about this building, please do. Let them no its not just me who cares. Joe Mosbrook, Director of Strategic Communications [email protected] Forward to Laura Clark, Senior Development Finance Analyst for Cuyahoga County [email protected] Laura Clark is the County, I dont know, overseer? Liaison? Helper? of this development. Something along those lines. **mods, I am going to post a link to this thread in the Cleveland demolition thread to route discussion here, just to get the word out in case people dont read the CSU college town thread but want to read about impending demolitions. Or you can redirect discussion there, whatever is better.**

Milton Manor has 80 units http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/15885160/2344-Prospect-Ave-Cleveland-OH/

I thought it was funny... :cry:

If the church really wanted to have the Landmarks commission allow them to demolish those houses, they should have just set aside spaces for casino parking.

ClevelandOhio, this is so so so cool, thank you so much. Since Google maps got rid of there real estate thingie, I really had no easy way to find this info, plus this is much more comprehensive and accurate. Oh and I am pretty sure the building to the immediate west of Walker weeks on Prospect is apartments, street view said its called Milton manor. A friend of mine who lived at Walker weeks knew someone who lived there, said it was a flea bag, but apartments nonetheless. And yet another edit. When me and a friend were looking for possible apartments North of CSU I spotted this place called Superior apartments I had seen on goolge maps right across from Tower Press on 19th. I thought the building looked cool. We buzzed in saying we were looking for apartments to rent, and as we walked into the building, the first thing I thought was, this place looks institutional. We walked up to a woman in white behind a glass window who informed us that "first of all we are full, and second of all this is a mental institution" (well something of that sort, mental institution, maybe some sort of halfway house, there were some comotose looking people siting outside.) Needless to say we thanked her and hightailed it out of there. Its not apartments, but people do stay there, is it section 8 esque? Obviously its a health instituiton but people seem to stay there. idk

Public meeting at CSU regarding Viking Hall and the former Kinko's building (or the Wolf music building as SLPA has been calling it) Im going to go and see if something can't be done to save the Walker and Weeks designed building.

As a CSU student I would say that we have plenty of greenspace. We do have a quad, with the Student center to the North, Main Classroom to the West, Rhodes Tower/Library to South, and main parking garage to the east. Its is a large, pleasant, and very much used greenspace. In the nice weather, that quad is always hopping with much activity, students studying, socializing, playing frisbee, smoking :| , its a cool place with an interesting design. It has plenty of grass, plants, trees, benches, lights, a fountain, etc. Alternatively there is a lovely garden in between the Law building and music/communications building with a nice curved path and some interesting plants, and in general most of the University side on Euclid from 21st to 18th. I don't mean to pile on you Hts121, but do you know what "more greenspace" gets us? That building on Euclid torn down next to Moe's Southwest grill to make way for a nice winding path that leads to an alley way that I have never seen used. Plus we lost the street wall, why? So we can see the Wolstein center? Its still not easy to get there from that path.

Well, when I met Bob Brown at a City Club event (which is fantastic by the way, the speakers are very interesting, and its a great way to network) we discussed how he got into urban planning. He told me that what first sent him down the path was "The Death and Life of Great American Cities", something we have in common (myself still being an undergraduate but nevertheless)

Willy boy, you were asking about Cimperman. He came in and basically said "I know change is hard but we cant stand in the way of progress, I support the demolition, etc." Also although I am doom and gloom, I do want to say that I was speaking with some of the core members of the save lower prospect (not the founder Greg Solstis but Andrew Gotlieb who spoke on behalf of the group, and two others) and they want to take the current energy of save lower prospect and transform it into a broader historic preservation group and to create a watch list. I suggested the Walker and Weeks designed three story building next to Viking hall on the CSU campus as a great candidate. And to all those who complain about us woe as me people, hey, I'm pissed, and yeah, I question Cleveland leadership and their decisions, and maybe I will leave the city (I am a college student, the world awaits me), but that doesn't mean that right now we are not dedicated and that even if we leave we won't always be dedicated in some way to Cleveland's prosperity. We lost a piece of history, it is not light matter, and give us a little time to grieve, if you don't want to hear it, why don't you log off for a couple days so we can blow off some steam and get it out.

The meeting was a great experience, though disappointing in outcome. There were a lot of labor unions there testifying for the demolition of the Columbia, which caught me off guard. The place was absolutely packed. Most of the talking by the commission was done by Thomas Coffey who spoke passionately to save the Columbia, and Brown who made every chance he could to make the demolition seem like the best/only alternative. Lots of passionate speeches from the save Columbia side, some even have done studies as alternatives, but to no avail. We have lost the Columbia building, and I know that I myself need to do a lot of soul searching as to whether or not Cleveland is developing in a way that I want to be a part of. Also pardon my french, but Forbes is a douchebag. I mean really, he just is, he acts it, looks it, talks it. He is so smug, I hate him.

Hts121, although I don't know very much about the processes that are at work here because this is my first real look at the system, but I assumed that the Landmarks commission was more concerned with the actual decision of whether parking is an appropriate replacement for the columbia building, and that they left all design critique to the city planning commission (which ok'd the project except for the bridge design). Am I incorrect in this assumption? I thought any design critique at this point is irrelevant. Also I am very pleased to hear that they tabled the discussion, its not as good as saving the columbia, but its a million times better than hearing that they condemned it. It shows that they are not taking this issue lightly, which was my biggest worry considering the planning commision approves it, including Brown who is on landmarks, and the mayor approves it who just wants that garage sold.