jbcmh81

For the year over year period, January 2011 to January 2012: Employment in Cleveland January 2011: 972.5 Employment in Cleveland January 2012: 991.6 Change: +19,100 Where are you getting your data from? I promise I'm not trying to be a jerk, but the CES series data I link to in my quote shows different numbers for Jan11 and Jan12 with very different implications. Would be very helpful if you sourced your data more specifically than "BLS" so we could figure out where the difference is and so we know what to make of all your posts. I definitely appreciate it when people post data here. http://www.bls.gov/eag/eag.oh_cleveland_msa.htm Just hit the button that says "Back Data". It breaks it all down by month and year for basically the past 20 years in most cases.

Typo. It should read -3.2%. I typed it all up pretty fast, bound to make some of those errors.

There isn't. In fact, I would like to see more 2009-2012 information because that hasn't been covered.

The post I responded to said January 2011 to January 2012, the information of which I posted above.

And finally, the percentage changes for January 2007 to January 2012. Civilian Lavor Force Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +0.8% 2. Cleveland: -0.8% 3. Cincinnati: -1.2% 4. Dayton: -3.8% 5. Youngstown: -3.9% 6. Akron: -4.1% 7. Toledo: -5.8% Total Employment Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: -1.6% 2. Cleveland: -2.5% 3. Cincinnati: -4.2% 4. Dayton: -5.6% 5. Youngstown: -6.3% 6. Akron: -6.6% 7. Toledo: -7.4% Total Unemployment Change, best to worst. 1. Toledo: +13.1% 2. Dayton: +20.5% 3. Cleveland: +23.8% 4. Youngstown: +27.5% 5. Akron: +35.5% 6. Columbus: +48.8% 7. Cincinnati: +50.0% Total Non-Farm Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: -1.5% 2. Cincinnati: -3.9% 3. Dayton: -5.5% 4. Youngstown: -6.0% 5. Akron: -6.3% 6. Toledo: -7.4% 7. Cleveland: -8.8% Mining/Logging/Construction Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Youngstown: -20.7% 2. Akron: -23.3% 3. Columbus: -24.0% 4. Cleveland: -26.5% 5. Cincinnati: -27.5% 6. Toledo: -27.5% 7. Dayton: -29.1% Manufacturing Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: -9.6% 2. Akron: -16.3% 3. Cleveland: -16.5% 4. Toledo: -17.0% 5. Youngstown: -17.8% 6. Columbus: -18.4% 7. Dayton: -22.4% Trade/Transportation/Utilities Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: -5.0% 2. Toledo: -7.2% 3. Cincinnati: -7.3% 4. Dayton: -7.9% 5. Akron: -8.0% 6. Cleveland: -10.7% 7. Youngstown: -11.8% Information Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: -9.8% 2. Toledo: -10.5% 3. Columbus: -10.7% 4. Akron: -17.8% 5. Cleveland: -19.0% 6. Dayton: -19.8% 7. Youngstown: -30.3% Financial Activities Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: -3.6% 2. Akron: -4.9% 3. Cincinnati: -7.5% 4. Youngstown: -9.4% 5. Cleveland: -10.8% 6. Toledo: -14.2% 7. Dayton: -15.1% Professional and Business Services Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Youngstown: +8.0% 2. Columbus: +2.9% 3. Cincinnati: +0.9% 4. Toledo: +0.3% 5. Dayton: -1.6% 6. Akron: -3.3% 7. Cleveland: -6.2% Education and Health Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +24.9% 2. Akron: +9.6% 3. Cincinnati: +7.9% 4. Cleveland: +7.8% 5. Dayton: +7.6% 6. Youngstown: +6.9% 7. Toledo: +3.2% Leisure and Hospitality Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: +3.3% 2. Dayton: +2.0% 3. Toledo: +0.3% 4. Columbus: -0.9% 5. Youngstown: -4.2% 6. Cleveland: -10.7% 7. Akron: -13.9% Other Services Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Akron: -4.4% 2. Columbus: -5.1% 3. Cincinnati: -5.7% 4. Dayton: -5.7% 5. Youngstown: -5.8% 6. Cleveland: -6.2% 7. Toledo: -11.7% Government Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Dayton: 0% 2. Youngstown: -2.2% 3. Akron: -2.7% 4. Columbus: -3.3% 5. Cincinnati: -5.5% 6. Cleveland: -8.0% 7. Toledo: -9.8%

Here are the percentage changes, first for January 2011 to January 2012, by metro. Percentages may be a bit more accurate picture of recovery because it's not based on metro size, but change relative to the invidual labor force. Civilian Labor Force Change, best to worst. 1. Dayton: -0.9% 2. Columbus: -1.0% 3. Youngstown: -1.1% 4. Cincinnati: -1.3% 5. Cleveland: -1.4% 6. Toledo: -2.6% 7. Akron: -3.4% Total Employment Change, best to worst. 1. Cleveland: +2.0% 2. Dayton: +1.0% 3. Youngstown: +1.0% 4. Cincinnati: +0.4% 5. Columbus: +0.3% 6. Toledo: -0.6% 7. Akron: -1.9% Total Unemployment Change, best to worst. 1. Toledo: -18.2% 2. Youngstown: -18.0% 3. Dayton: -17.5% 4. Akron: -17.4% 5. Cincinnati: -16.6% 6. Columbus: -14.9% 7. Cleveland: -5.0% Total Non-Farm Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: +2.3% 2. Youngstown: +2.3% 3. Dayton: +2.0% 4. Columbus: +1.6% 5. Toledo: +1.6% 6. Akron: -0.2% 7. Cleveland: -0.3% Mining/Logging/Construction Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +8.8% 2. Akron: +4.2% 3. Toledo: +3.1% 4. Cincinnati: +2.7% 5. Youngstown: 0% 6. Cleveland: -2.5% 7. Dayton: -3.1% Manufacturing Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: +6.2% 2. Akron: +4.2% 3. Toledo: +4.2% 4. Cleveland: +2.4% 5. Youngstown: +2.4% 6. Columbus: -0.3% 7. Dayton: -1.0% Trade/Transportation/Utilities Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Toledo: +2.3% 2. Akron: +2.1% 3. Columbus: +2.0% 4. Cleveland: +1.7% 5. Dayton: +1.5% 6. Youngstown: +1.1% 7. Cincinnati: +1.0% Information Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +0.6% 2. Toledo: 0% 3. Youngstown: 0% 4. Dayton: -1.2% 5. Cincinnati: -1.4% 6. Akron: -2.6% 7. Cleveland: -3.2% Financial Activities Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +2.4% 2. Cleveland: +1.2% 3. Akron: 0% 4. Dayton: 0% 5. Youngstown: 0% 6. Toledo: -1.8% 7. Cincinnati: -5.5% Professional and Business Services Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Dayton: +10.2% 2. Toledo: +3.8% 3. Youngstown: +3.8% 4. Cincinnati: +2.0% 5. Columbus: +1.6% 6. Cleveland: +0.5% 7. Akron: -1.3% Education and Health Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +7.1% 2. Youngstown: +4.2% 3. Cincinnati: +2.8% 4. Dayton: +1.6% 5. Akron: +0.2% 6. Toledo: +0.2% 7. Cleveland: -1.2% Leisure and Hospitality Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: +9.0% 2. Dayton: +6.7% 3. Toledo: +5.1% 4. Youngstown: +4.0% 5. Columbus: +1.8% 6. Cleveland: -3.2% 7. Akron: -8.0% Other Services Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +1.2% 2. Dayton: +0.7% 3. Cincinnati: 0% 4. Toledo: 0% 5. Youngstown: 0% 6. Cleveland: -0.5% 7. Akron: -1.5% Government Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Youngstown: +1.0% 2. Cincinnati: -0.7% 3. Dayton: -1.5% 4. Akron: -1.9% 5. Toledo: -2.3% 6. Cleveland: -3.2% 7. Columbus: -3.7%

This information was already posted above.

Every year since 2007 showed losses or gains to make up the final 2007-2012 total. Here is the year over year breakdown for each metro for Non-Farm Jobs. The numbers are, again, from from January to January. Akron 2007-2008: +3,800 2008-2009: -12,100 2009-2010: -15,200 2010-2011: +3,300 2011-2012: -600 2007-2012: -20,800 Cincinnati 2007-2008: +10,100 2008-2009: -35,700 2009-2010: -38,200 2010-2011: +3,100 2011-2012: +20,300 2007-2012: -40,400 Cleveland 2007-2008: -2,900 2008-2009: -40,600 2009-2010: -40,100 2010-2011: +2,200 2011-2012: -3,300 2007-2012: -84,700 Columbus 2007-2008: +6,000 2008-2009: -21,000 2009-2010: -26,800 2010-2011: +13,400 2011-2012: +14,700 2007-2012: -13,700 Dayton 2007-2008: -1,900 2008-2009: -19,200 2009-2010: -12,500 2010-2011: +4,300 2011-2012: +7,300 2007-2012: -22,000 Toledo 2007-2008: -5,300 2008-2009: -18,200 2009-2010: -9,000 2010-2011: +4,200 2011-2012: +4,700 2007-2012: -23,600 Youngstown 2007-2008: -3,000 2008-2009: -14,400 2009-2010: -3,200 2010-2011: +1,500 2011-2012: +4,900 2007-2012: -14,200

For the year over year period, January 2011 to January 2012: Employment in Cleveland January 2011: 972.5 Employment in Cleveland January 2012: 991.6 Change: +19,100

Apparently, neither Columbus nor Indianapolis have proven to be the "wunderkinds" that they were so tooted to be in the early 2000's, while Cincinnati is quietly coming on stronger and stronger. Cleveland is yet another story. It's coming back very strong, but with too much fanfare and premature congratulations. Some things to consider from the numbers about about Columbus in relation to other cities: 1. It lost the fewest number of non-farm jobs in the 5-year period of any of the major metros, even though it's significantly larger in population than all but Cleveland and Cincinnati. 2. Cincinnati lost almost 4x more and Cleveland about 7x more non-farm jobs, and their strong recovery (well, not so much Cleveland if you look at all the numbers) has to be balanced by the fact that they both have much further to recover to pre-recession levels. 3. Columbus saw more job catergory gains in the last year than any other metro, even if the total amount of jobs gained was 2nd. 4. Columbus was the only metro to see it's labor force grow during the last 5 years, yet it still maintained the lowest unemployment rates. 5. Columbus seems to be booming in health/education jobs. 9,900 in just the last year is amazing. Health and education was the one catergory that every metro grew in over the last 5 years. Columbus' 27,000 new jobs in this catergory was more than 2x the next metro, Cleveland, which has made a reputation out of health care. So the news isn't really all that bad. In any case, I'll try to get the percentages up later today. That will give a better picture, I think. Expect to see smaller cities like Youngstown doing very well in recovery.

I just posted jobs numbers on the economic discussion forum for January 2007-2012 if you guys want to take a look.

And now for the jobs/emploment changes from January 2007 (prior to recession start) to January 2012. This data shows the full extent, really, of how the recession hit the state. Again, the numbers are for metros. January 2007 to January 2012 Total Civilian Labor Force Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +7,800 2. Cleveland: -9,000 3. Youngstown: -10,900 4. Cincinnati: -13,400 5. Akron: -15,600 6. Dayton: -16,100 7. Toledo: -19,400 Total Employment Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: -14,700 2. Youngstown: -16,200 3. Dayton: -22,200 4. Toledo: -22,900 5. Akron: -23,700 6. Cleveland: -25,900 7. Cincinnati: -43,800 Total Unemployment Change, best to worst. 1. Toledo: +3,500 2. Youngstown: +5,300 3. Dayton: +6,100 4. Akron: +8,100 5. Cleveland: +16,800 6. Columbus: +22,600 7. Cincinnati: +30,500 Total Unemployment Rate Change, best to worst. 1. Toledo: +1.5 2. Cleveland: +1.6 3. Dayton: +1.8 4. Youngstown: +2.3 5. Akron: +2.4 6. Columbus: +2.4 7. Cincinnati: +2.9 Total Non-Farm Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: -13,700 2. Youngstown: -14,200 3. Akron: -20,800 4. Dayton: -22,000 5. Toledo: -23,600 6. Cincinnati: -40,400 7. Cleveland: -84,700 Total Mining/Logging/Construction Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Youngstown: -1,900 2. Akron: -3,000 3. Toledo: -3,800 4. Dayton: -3,900 5. Columbus: -8,600 6. Cleveland: -9,700 7. Cincinnati: -13,000 Total Manufacturing Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Youngstown: -6,600 2. Akron: -7,700 3. Toledo: -8,200 4. Dayton: -11,300 5. Cincinnati: -11,600 6. Columbus: -14,200 7. Cleveland: -23,800 Total Trade/Transportation/Utilities Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Toledo: -4,500 2. Akron: -5,400 3. Dayton: -5,400 4. Youngstown: -6,100 5. Columbus: -9,500 6. Cincinnati: -15,300 7. Cleveland: -21,200 Total Information Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Toledo: -400 2. Akron: -800 3. Youngstown: -1,000 4. Cincinnati: -1,500 5. Columbus: -2,000 6. Dayton: -2,400 7. Cleveland: -3,500 Total Financial Activities Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Akron: -700 2. Youngstown: -900 3. Toledo: -1,800 4. Columbus: -2,700 5. Dayton: -3,000 6. Cincinnati: -4,900 7. Cleveland: -7,900 Total Professional and Business Services Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +4,200 2. Youngstown: +1,600 3. Cincinnati: +1,300 4. Toledo: +100 5. Dayton: -800 6. Akron: -1,600 7. Cleveland: -8,700 Total Education and Health Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +27,000 2. Cleveland: +13,400 3. Cincinnati: +11,000 4. Dayton: +5,000 5. Akron: +4,400 6. Youngstown: +2,900 7. Toledo: +1,600 Total Leisure and Hospitality Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: +3,300 2. Dayton: +700 3. Toledo: +100 4. Columbus: -800 5. Youngstown: -900 6. Akron: -4,100 7. Cleveland: -9,400 Total Other Services Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Akron: -600 2. Youngstown: -600 3. Dayton: -900 4. Toledo: -1,700 5. Columbus: -1,900 6. Cincinnati: -2,400 7. Cleveland: -2,700 Total Government Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Dayton: 0 2. Youngstown: -700 3. Akron: -1,300 4. Toledo: -5,000 5. Columbus: -5,200 6. Cincinnati: -7,300 7. Cleveland: -11,200 So there they are. Keep in mind these are just raw numbers. To get a better impression of how the metros are doing, especially in comparison to one another, you'd need the % changes to the total labor force. If I get around to it, I'll get those posted too.

Rankings based on employment/jobs info from the BLS. All numbers are for metros. Ohio January 2012 Unemployment Rate: 7.7% January 2012 Unemployment Rate, best to worst. 1. Columbus: 7.3% 2. Cleveland: 8.1% 3. Akron: 8.4% 4. Cincinnati: 8.4% 5. Dayton: 8.8% 6. Youngstown: 9.3% 7. Toledo: 9.5% First, January 2011 to January 2012. Total Civilian Labor Force Change, best to worst. 1. Cleveland: +14,500 2. Youngstown: -3,000 3. Dayton: -3,800 4. Toledo: -8,300 5. Columbus: -9,500 6. Akron: -12,800 7. Cincinnati: -14,600 Total Employment Change, best to worst. 1. Cleveland: +19,100 2. Cincinnati: +3,700 3. Dayton: +2,700 4. Columbus: +2,700 5. Youngstown: +2,500 6. Toledo: -1,600 7. Akron: -6,400 Total Unemployment Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: -18,200 2. Columbus: -12,100 3. Dayton: -7,600 4. Toledo: -6,700 5. Akron: -6,500 6. Youngstown: -5,400 7. Cleveland: -4,900 Total Unemployment Rate Change, best to worst. Toledo: -1.9 Youngstown: -1.9 Dayton: -1.8 Cincinnati: -1.6 Akron: -1.5 Columbus: -1.2 Cleveland: -0.5 Total Non-Farm Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: +20,300 2. Columbus: +14,700 3. Dayton: +7,300 4. Youngstown: +4,900 5. Toledo: +4,700 6. Cleveland: +4,300 7. Akron: +600 Total Mining/Logging/Construction Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +2,200 2. Cincinnati: +900 3. Akron: +400 4. Toledo: +300 5. Youngstown: 0 6. Dayton: -300 7. Cleveland: -700 Total Manufacturing Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: +6,400 2. Cleveland: +2,800 3. Toledo: +1,600 4. Akron: +1,600 5. Youngstown: +700 6. Columbus: -200 7. Dayton: -400 Total Trade/Transporation/Utilities Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +3,600 2. Cleveland: +3,000 3. Cincinnati: +2,000 4. Akron: +1,300 5. Toledo: +1,300 6. Dayton: +900 7. Youngstown: +500 Total Information Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +100 2. Toledo: 0 3. Youngstown: 0 4. Akron: -100 5. Dayton: -100 6. Cincinnati: -200 7. Cleveland: -500 Total Financial Acitivities Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +1,700 2. Cleveland: +800 3. Akron: 0 4. Dayton: 0 5. Youngstown: 0 6. Toledo: -200 7. Cincinnati: -3,500 Total Professional and Business Services Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Dayton: +4,700 2. Cincinnati: +3,000 3. Columbus: +2,300 4. Toledo: +1,200 5. Youngstown: +800 6. Cleveland: +600 7. Akron: -600 Total Education and Health Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +9,900 2. Cincinnati: +4,100 3. Youngstown: +1,800 4. Dayton: +1,100 5. Akron: +100 6. Toledo: +100 7. Cleveland: -2,300 Total Leisure and Hospitality Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Cincinnati: +8,500 2. Dayton: +2,300 3. Columbus: +1,500 4. Toledo: +1,500 5. Youngstown: +800 6. Akron: -2,200 7. Cleveland: -2,600 Total Other Services Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Columbus: +400 2. Dayton: +100 3. Cincinnati: 0 4. Toledo: 0 5. Youngstown: 0 6. Akron: -200 7. Cleveland: -200 Total Government Jobs Change, best to worst. 1. Youngstown: +300 2. Akron: -900 3. Cincinnati: -900 4. Dayton: -1,000 5. Toledo: -1,100 6. Cleveland: -4,200 7. Columbus: -5,900

Ohio has a low cost of living and for doing business in general. If the list had included all metros with over 1 million, Columbus and probably other Ohio cities would be up near the top as well. Sorry about their luck, jbcmh81, but none of those smaller cities were mentioned--so let's all just pause and give credit to the #1 CITY among the 27 largest metros, Cincinnati. (okay?) The study only included metros of 2 million and over, so it obviously wouldn't have included several Ohio cities, including Columbus. My point was not to take anything away from those cities on the list, only a general observation that pretty much all of Ohio would've scored well had smaller metros been part of the study as well. This was based on the fact that Ohio has a low cost of living and a positive business climate.

Ohio has a low cost of living and for doing business in general. If the list had included all metros with over 1 million, Columbus and probably other Ohio cities would be up near the top as well.

I have domestic and international migration numbers for major Ohio metros since the 1990s. Here's that info. Domestic Migration Average by Decade and Metro 1990-1999 Columbus: +4,889 Cleveland: -11,464 Cincinnati: +2,885 Dayton: -5,695 Toledo: -4,116 Akron: -447 2000-2009 Columbus: +3,800 Cleveland: -15,216 Cincinnati: -1,961 Dayton: -4,935 Toledo: -4,256 Akron: -1,924 International Migration Average by Decade and Metro 1990-1999 Columbus: +1,367 Cleveland: +1,909 Cincinnati: +1,055 Dayton: +450 Toledo: +370 Akron: +317 2000-2009 Columbus: +4,544 Cleveland: +3,214 Cincinnati: +2,569 Dayton: +623 Toledo: +703 Akron: +634 Total Average Migration (Domestic and International combined) by Decade and Metro 1990-1999 Columbus: +6,256 Cleveland: -9,555 Cincinnati: +3,940 Dayton: -5,245 Toledo: -1,873 Akron: -130 2000-2009 Columbus: +8,344 Cleveland: -12,002 Cincinnati: +608 Dayton: -4,312 Toledo: -1,777 Akron: -1,290

Columbus' Downtown Population (Census Tracts #30 and #40) 1940-2010. 1940 #30: 4,720 #40K 6,811 Total: 11,531 1950 #30: 4,535 #40: 7,557 Total: 12,092 1960 #30: 4,506 #40: 4,322 Total: 8,828 1970 #30: 998 #40: 1,314 Total: 2,312 1980 #30: 180 #40: 1,408 Total: 1,588 1990 #30: 1,578 #40: 2,709 Total: 4,287 2000 #30: 2,179 #40: 2,195 Total: 4,374 2010 #30: 3,105 #40: 2,941 Total: 6,046 Now, I've seen peak Downtown figures put as high as 30,000, so I'm not sure what is all considered to be "downtown". These two tracts cover the majority of the CBD, though. You can certainly see the results of highway construction and general "urban renewal" from 1950 to 1980.

Chase seems to focus on expanding pretty much exclusively in the suburbs. I would not expect that to change.

I'm not so optimistic, but that's based on all of the recent development in annexed Columbus which is the same as it has been for decades: more sprawl. There is absolutely no effort to retrofit any of it. There is also a very limited area in the urban core where infill is occurring, so it better be on the very dense side of things. There's ongoing or planned development in the following areas near or in Columbus (inside 270): Upper Arlington Grandview Heights Short North Victorian Village Italian Village Central Downtown OTE Brewery District Arena District University District Weinland Park Harrison West Franklinton Milo-Grogan Parsons American Addition (yes we know how you feel about this) Hilltop West Side Worthington Clintonville South Side 5th by NW Those are just the ones I can think of. As usual, you have a very selective view of what's going on there.

I'm glad that they won't be held to the 5-story limit that the area approved recently. It gives hope that future large projects may be given the same exception.

I wonder what happened to the houses that existed where the 1970 building is now. If you look at old photos, there were houses just as nice as 773.

And there still is a ton of work to do, though if you looked at photos from 2000 and compared them to today in many parts of the area, the differences would be significant.

Another reason for the growth is Hispanic immigrant populations that tend to be younger and have more kids. Natural increase through birth rates is an important part of domestic increase.

Ohio has as many jobs and as low as or lower unemployment rates. Population growth was due almost entirely because of either retirees moving south or because there was several decades of general decline in much of the North. That is no longer the case.

The last thing Ohio should strive for is to be more like Texas.