FakeCinEnquirer

They can't backtrack at all but my guess is they'll think of new "problems". Its like when COASTers lose an argument when looking at the facts. That doesn't deter them. They just make up new arguments usually based on ridiculous predictions or loosely based facts that they take to an extreme level of hyperbole

But no. Don't you see? "Cincinnati's different" "Our utilities are different" ------ "It will work in those other Cities, but not Cincinnati" In my mind, Duke is stalling.

Does this open the door to yet another Chris Finney lawsuit? He's claiming people are urging the Hamilton County Commissioners to sue as well Cincinnati solicitor won't seek injunction to stop streetcar http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2012/02/29/cincinnati-solicitor-wont-seek.html

Its true. Barry Horstman has become so efficient at walking that he sold his car. He now walks up and down I-71 to work weaving in and out of traffic. He cut me off the other day and gave me the finger as he blurred by me like Road Runner In fact he's gotten so efficient walking that 700wlw now will not put him on the air to promote his non car lifestyle

I've talked to numerous people from the suburbs and city, many of whom I NEVER thought would be for any form of mass/rail transit, who now firmly support light rail in the region. Current and future gas prices are really changing peoples minds out of necessity...finally...across all demographics. Cincinnati can be a leader in Ohio. The problem, of course, is not getting any help from the Governor and state elected officials.

Where'd you get that picture of Chris Finney?

I'm more of a Yvette fan as of late

New Video

Which means suburbanites will become even more ill-informed with AM radio . By the way, Mark Miller just tweeted "Islamic extremists love streetcars". These people are the 'experts' for 700wlw

Eric Deters posted a picture on facebook of him benching 300lbs from the 80's...I sh*t you not

I believe it was Quinlivan on 02/16/12 and Mayor Mallory on 02/17/12 Thanks for maintaining the list! I'll fix it. Thanks!

Doc Thompson Show/Time(Now Scott Sloan) Slot: 11/22/10 - High Speed Rail 11/27/10 - Tom Luken 12/3/10 - Mary Kuhl vs the streetcar 12/8/10 - Streetcar 'boondoggle' & laying off police 12/13/10 - Berding/COAST issues 12/15/10 - Tom Luken 12/22/10 - Jeff Berding 12/23/10 - Norwood mayor to get outsider view on Cincy Politics 12/24/10 - Chris Monzel When he was on council 12/27/10 - Leslie Ghiz 12/28/10 - Cecil Thomas 12/29/10 - Quinlivan 12/30/10 - Leslie Ghiz and Berding 1/17/11 - Tom Luken 2/10/11 - Tom Luken 2/9/11 - Fight the Streetcar 4/13/11 - Says streetcar is probably dead 5/5/11 - Streetcar 5/13/11 - Daryl Parks Streetcar 5/23/11 - 2 hours of Barry Horstman and walking the streetcar route 6/28/11 - Leslie Ghiz 6/30/11 - Dusty Rhodes 7/5/11 - Darryl Parks Streetcar 7/6/11 - Darryl Parks Amy Murray Council 7/13/11 - Amy Murray 7/25/11 - Guest compares streetcar to others across country 7/27/11 - Chris Smitherman Streetcar petition 7/29/11 - Streetcar 8/1/11 - Leslie Ghiz 8/5/11 - Chris Smitherman streetcar petition 8/10/11 - Streetcar petition 8/15/11 - Leslie Ghiz 8/16/11 - New streetcar signs 10/17/11 - Talks about Streetcar issue and how the wording will confuse voters 10/31/11 - Talks about 'waste of 48 million dollar transit center' 11/1/11 - Talks the issue particularly voting for Issue 48 11/7/11 - Urging people to vote for Issue 2 and Issue 48 11/8/11 - Urging people to vote for Issue 2 and Issue 48 11/9/11 - Election results/whining 11/29/11 - Chris Smitherman 11/30/11 - Talks about Chiquita moving to Charlotte. Digs at streetcar 12/8/11 - Chris Smitherman 12/13/11 - Talks about how roads are falling apart while dogging public transportation 12/15/11 - Talks about LaHood and streetcar 12/15/11 - Chris Smitherman 12/16/11 - Talks about new streetcar money 1/3/12 - Talks about streetcar costing more 1/6/12 - Chris Smitherman 1/11/12 - City Council/Signs/Streetcar 1/12/12 - Streetcar 1/13/12 - Chris Finney 1/18/12 - Chris Smitherman 1/25/12 - Chris Smitherman promoting Anti-Streetcar meeting 2/9/12 - Duke Energy Spokesperson 2/17/12 - Groundbreaking with Ghiz Bill Cunningham 6/7/10 - Chris Bortz conflict of interest 7/9/10 - Leslie Ghiz streetcar 7/27/10 - Eric Deters streetcars 9/23/10 - Leslie Ghiz 11/1/10 - Leslie Ghiz 11/12/10 - Streetcar 11/15/10 - Leslie Ghiz streetcar 11/23/10 - Leslie Ghiz 11/30/10 - Dusty Rhodes 11/30/10 - Leslie Ghiz 12/2/10 - Tom Luken 12/21/10 - Leslie Ghiz 12/22/10 - Laure Quinlivan 12/24/10 - Eric Deters - Council all the way to 12/31/10 12/27/10 - Eric Deters 12/28/10 - Eric Deters 12/29/10 - Eric Deters 12/30/10 - Eric Deters 12/31/10 - Eric Deters 2/24/11 - Chris Smitherman 2/25/11 - Leslie Ghiz 3/7/11 - Leslie Ghiz 3/10/11 - Chris Smitherman streetcar 3/18/11 - Jeff Berding 3/29/11 - Laure Quinlivan 3/30/11 - Leslie Ghiz 4/1/11 - Amy Murray 4/8/11 - Wayne Lippert 4/12/11 - Eric Deters streetcar 4/20/11 - Chris Smitherman 5/9/11 - Chris Smitherman 5/12/11 - State Rep Danny Bupt and Leslie Ghiz Streetcar 5/17/11 - Chris Finney 5/24/11 - Leslie Ghiz streetcar 6/1/11 - Leslie Ghiz and Chris Smitherman streetcars 6/9/11 - Chris Smitherman 6/21/11 - Leslie Ghiz 6/30/11 - Leslie Ghiz 7/6/11 - Leslie Ghiz streetcar 7/8/11 - Chris Smitherman 7/21/11 - Caroll with Leslie Ghiz 7/25/11 - Chris Smitherman and Tom Luken 7/27/11 - Leslie Ghiz 8/2/11 - Leslie Ghiz and Chris Smitherman streetcar 8/8/11 - Chris Smitherman streetcar 8/15/11 - Chris Finney streetcar 8/16/11 - Quinlivan/streetcar signs 8/18/11 - Dan Carrol ' dumb streetcars' 10/17/11 - City Issues 11/7/11 - City Issues Election Coverage hours 1 and 2 Election Aftermath - Chris Smitherman 11/30/11 - Leslie Ghiz 12/6/11 - Chris Smitherman 12/14/11 - Leslie Ghiz 12/15/11 - City Budget PG 12/16/11 - City Budget 12/20/11 - Chris Smitherman 1/11/12 - Quinlivan 1/17/12 - Cost of streetcar/Dan Monk Business Courier 1/25/12 - Chris Smitherman calls in 1/31/12 - Chris Smitherman 2/6/12 - Leslie Ghiz 2/9/12 - Chris Smitherman 2/17/12 - Groundbreaking Quinlivan 2/21/12 - Streetcars with Finney Sloan and Tracy 1/3/10 - Leslie Ghiz -Gap in podcasts- 1/19/11 - Quinlivan 2/22/11 Amy Murray 3/10/11 - Laure Quinlivan streetcar 3/17/11 - Leslie Ghiz 4/12/11 - Streetcar near dead 8/1/11 - Dan Carroll with Kathy Harrell Union Pres of FOP 11/8/11 - Election coverage 11/9/11 - Chris Seelbach and Leslie Ghiz 11/21/11 - Dusty Rhodes 12/17/11 - National underground museum/streetcar 12/28/11 - Leslie Ghiz Marc Amazon 1/13/11 - Amy Murray 1/14/11 - Jeff Berding 1/19/11 - Leslie Ghiz 1/27/11 - Leslie Ghiz 2/8/11 - Amy Murray 2/17/11 - Streetcar 2/16/11 - Quinlivan 3/16/11 - Amy Murray - Streetcars 3/21/11 - Jeff Berding 3/22/11 - Chris Smitherman - streetcars 3/23/11 - Wayne Lippert 3/24/11 - Chris Smitherman 4/14/11 - Chris Finney - Streetcar 4/21/11 - Amy Murray - streetcar 5/4/11 - Chris Smitherman and Leslie Ghiz- Streetcar 5/5/11 - Chris Bortz - Streetcar 5/12/11 - Charlie Winburn streetcar 6/16/11 - Amy Murray 7/20/11 - Quinlivan 8/4/11 - Chris Smitherman 9/5/11 - Dan Carroll Chris FInney streetcar 10/17/11 - Tom Luken Streetcar 10/25/11 - Jason Gloyd COAST 11/8/11 - Election coverage 11/18/11 - Chris Finney 11/22/11 - Dusty Rhodes 12/15/11 - Jeff Berding streetcar 12/26/11 - Chris Smitherman on the mic 1/26/12 - Chris Smitherman and Charlie Winburn 2/17/12 - Groundbreaking Finney Dan Carrol Weekend show Doesn't have active podcasts yet(Many many smitherman/coast/streetcar shows though) 1/15/11 - Chris Finney - Streetcar 2/12/12 - Briefly touched on streetcar Darryl Parks -sporadic podcasts 1/30/10 - 3c train stupid 5/22/10 - Streetcars 7/10/10 - Streetcar coming even though you don't want it 11/6/10 - Streetcar instead of cops 1/8/11 - Chris Finney - streetcar 6/4/11 - inclines 11/7/11 - ballot issues 10/31/11 - transit center 2/6/12 - Indy/Cincinnati comparisons 2/11/12 - Streetcar 2/18/12 - Streetcar Chris Smitherman Guest Host 1/15/12 - 2 hour segment on streetcars 2/12/12 - 2 hour segment on streetcars ----- 700wlw segments(At least 1 hour) devoted to bashing the streetcar by the numbers as described in their podcast description. This does not include bringing up the project in a negative tone casually that happens seemingly everyday. In fact, These streetcar numbers on 700wlw are estimated very conservatively and are probably much lower than the actual number of venom spewed seemingly daily about this project: 'Doc' Thompson/Scott Sloan segments *13 segments from November 22, 2010 - Dec 30, 2010* *32 segments in 2011* - Includes 24 from July 5, 2011 - Dec 16, 2011 - Includes 11 from November 1, 2011 - Dec 16, 2011 * 9 segments in 2012 ----------------------- Total Numbers for 'Doc' Thompsons show(RIP) # of hours devoted to the streetcar since Nov 22, 2010 *54 Hours (19 from Nov 1, 2011 - Present) * Chris Smitherman appearances - 7 confirmed(Not including drive by call-in detailed summary of podcasts) - Appearances started on 7/27/2011 * Other Anti streetcar related guest appearances talking about the issue(Luken, Finney, Kuhl, Ghiz, Berding, Murray, Monzel, Rhodes etc) - 19 * Pro Streetcar advocate segments invited on to discuss streetcar -2 (Quinlivan and Thomas) *Anti Streetcar Guest segments -26 *Pro Streetcar Guest Segments -2 Bill Cunningham Segments *19 segments from 6/7/2010 - 12/31/2010 (Includes Eric Deters/some Dan Carrol filling in) *39 segments in 2011 (Including 2 Election coverage segments and Excluding his bashing of the project in casual interviews with Seelbach, PG, Quinlivan, and Simpson) *8 segments in 2012 ---------------------- Total Numbers for Bill Cunningham show # of hours devoted to the streetcar since 6/7/2010 - Present *66 *# of Chris Smitherman appearances/call in anti-streetcar segments (Beginning with his first in 2/24/2011) - 16 * # of Leslie Ghiz appearances/call ins always touching on the streetcar project - 22 * # of anti-streetcar related guest appearances/call ins(Smitherman, Ghiz, Murray, Lippert, Luken, Rhodes, Berding, Finney, -46 * # of pro streetcar related guest appearances(Bortz, Quinlivan) - 6 Sloan/Eddie and Tracy *11 segments from 1/19/2011 - 1/26/2012 - All were in the year 2011 ------------ Total Numbers for Sloan/Tracy # of hours devoted to the streetcar since 1/19/2011-1/26/2012 *11 *Anti Streetcar related Guest segments(Ghiz, Murray, Harrell, Rhodes) - 7 *Pro-Streetcar related guest segments (Quinlivan, Seelbach) - 3 ----------------- Mark Amazon show *28 segments in 2011 *Anti Streetcar related Guest segments(Smitherman, Finney, Rhodes, Bortz changing position, Berding, Ghiz, Murray, Gloyd, Winburn) - 22 *Pro Streetcar related guest segments(Quinlivan) -2 2 in 2012 1- Chris Smitherman and Charlie Winburn (1/26/2012) 1- Finney Weekend shows Podcasts aren't updated, many gaps in between, and very few pages to even go on. Information is sporadic and the podcasts are completely unreliable. Here is what we know for sure: *Chris Smitherman has had 6 segments called Smitherman on the Mic *Chris Finney also was invited on Dan Carrolls show on 1/15/2011 to talk about the streetcar. Dan Carroll touched briefly on 2/12/12 *Darryl Parks has brought up the issue 11 known times from 2010-Present (Almost all of his podcasts missing though including a Chris Finney interview) Total numbers of known podcasts: *19 known segments ------------------------- Total 700wlw Streetcar Numbers thus far * 180 Known podcast detailed segments(at least 180 hours) about the streetcar -110 of which had anti-Streetcar guests on including Smitherman on the mic(61.1%) -13 of which had pro-streetcar guests on(7.2%) *# of podcast detailed Chris Smitherman anti streetcar appearances including smitherman on the mic Since 2/10/2011 -34 (18.8%) Smitherman alone has been on more than twice than all the number of appearances from a pro-streetcar guest combined *Again, its important to note that this stats derive from the podcast description from 700wlw about the streetcar. There are probably dozens of more appearances from anti-streetcar guests calling in or discussions on the streetcar that wander off topic*.

Ummm....I've been to all of those cities except Leningrad Saint Petersburg. YES! I would LOVE to be a part of that club. Besides...Communism is SO 20th Century. If he's trying to keep up with the Tea Party he should be labeling it Socialist. Whatever, COAST... Socialist and Muslim are interchangeable. Socialist, Muslim, Radical, Fascist, anarchist, communist, monarchy, dictatorship, totalitarianism, and liberal are all interchangeable to COAST. Streetcars cause democracies to collapse upon construction

Looks like COAST is now trying the "Streetcars are Communist" angle COAST @GOCOAST · Open #1-Leningrad #2-Budapest #3-Prague #4-Warsaw #5-Moscow, world's top streetcar cities. Is this REALLY a club we want to join?

^Those paint lines refer to EXISTING utilities, with colors indicating the various utilities as JJakucyk said. The standard protocol is to mark PROPOSED utilities (for example, streetcar track) in white. They may or may not paint the streetcar tracks, however. I am not aware that ANY of the utility relocation work has been started yet. If someone knows otherwise, please share. No utility work has been started that I'm aware of. Water mains are being re-located.

Because Duke is used to throwing its weight around. They are not obligated to provide documentation. Duke is in a position where they could care less if the streetcar gets built or not. They have no incentive, financial or otherwise, to see this project get built. Then can replace their aging utilities with or without the streetcar project. Pretty much everyone across the board is hurting in this economy, and just like everyone else, Duke is not in the mood to be spending money unnecessarily. So, maybe Duke is being uncooperative; I'll give you that. That's not something that the city can do anything about. Duke has made an offer to do the required utility work for a certain price; the city had a choice to either come up with the money, or turn down the offer. The City chose to turn them down, but instead of disagreeing peacefully, they issued a letter to the media stating that Duke was being unreasonable, and then followed up with a groundbreaking ceremony. To me, this seems like a grave mistake. Now, the conflict has been elevated beyond the technical details of dimensions between rails and utilities; it has become a battle to see who is stronger, Duke or the City. The letter issued by the city was a shot across the bow; a line in the sand; a rattling of swords. I do believe that Duke is trying to make a statement that they are not going to be pushed around by the City of Cincinnati, or any other city. Duke is a corporation, and they are the servants of their stockholders and their customers, but not of any municipality. I don't think Duke is fearing a PR nightmare, because the streetcar project is already extremely unpopular outside of a core group of streetcar supporters. I do not think that Duke is going to give in, and I think they will go to court before moving any utilities. Even if the city wins in court, the construction schedule will have been set back significantly. Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel that this is serious. If anyone has any information that I don't know about, please feel free to share. A couple things ... Duke is a corporation franchised by the City of Cincinnati to provide service to our city's families and businesses. And that includes the City of Cincinnati. Duke can't simply pick and choose the projects it wants to support or not support within the city limits. It has more or less been granted a monopoly to operate, so it's not like Duke is a grocery company which can close a store and cease serving a neighborhood and move on if that's what its "mood" is. The City did not "issue a letter to the media." Duke did. I know -- they sent it to me too. And probably to some other people on this list. It wasn't a nasty letter, but Duke clearly fired the first shot here. "Grave mistake" or not, it wasn't the city's. And I disagree that this has been "elevated beyond the technical details of dimensions between rails and utilities." Precisely the opposite. Throughout the long history of this project, the arguments have been anything but technical, i.e. "No one will ever use the streetcar." Now things have become very technical. I know that benchmarked against the other seven cities that operate or are now constructing modern streetcars, Duke is an outlier in terms of what it is demanding that the city pay for. So the city is saying, in essence, "We'll pay for the utility moves that represent best practices nationwide, anything more than that is on you." It's a defensible position. Then there's this: does anyone believe that with all the scrutiny this project has (will) endure(d), that the City would ever put itself in a position where it could not factually defend what it is doing with respect to Cincinnati Streetcar? Think about it. Is Duke fearing a "PR nightmare?" I think it's revealing that following a week of intense PR on radio, TV and in print media, Duke's PR execs have now gone radio silent, leaving it up its engineers to defend its position in the Business Courier. I like the people I know at Duke, my company works with them often, but Duke is no longer the revered local enterprise it once was. Cincinnatians voted for gas and electric aggregation by wide margins without anyone having to lead a campaign to get them to do so. Many Cincinnatians feel that Duke's pricing is aggressive and that its bills are difficult to understand. So the PR here is not easy to read. I'm guessing that going to court, if it comes to that, would not delay the project. The city may simply accede to Duke's demand to move the utilities eight feet and then rely on a court to determine who pays for that. Sort of what happens in eminent domain cases where compensation is decided long after the "taking." From what I know, I'd much rather have the hand the City is holding. I've come to know Milton Dohoney pretty well. I would not want to play poker with him. Well said. I'm looking at this from a non technical/logic point of view. 1) Duke comes out with the one safety requirement out of nowhere and one price tag relocation of utilities analysis 3 times the amount project by the city with no documentation on every radio outlet, tv outlet, and newspaper 2) Duke's first claim of safety feet is easily disproven by photographic evidence all across the country(one of which their own project) This gives Cincinnati leverage on their second claim. Duke's inflated utilities cost was weak initially when it provided no documentation. Now, they have absolutely no leverage after one of their initial claims were debunked.

Its already been disproven as evidenced by Duke's own project in Charlotte and projects all around the US. So if they want to go to court(which probably won't happen), they'll be shot down with plenty of visual evidence of their own project. Utilities costs all around the US, including their own project in Charlotte, aren't even close to the number they are projecting here with zero documentation. I don't know what their motivation is for lying or trying to halt the project they have supported in the past, but this will be resolved. A Duke Energy guy just said on TV that negotiations are going well with the Mayor In the meantime, why would the city wait to start construction on things that don't involve utilities? If they wait, there's a variety of things that could happen...None of which positive. Who knows maybe Smitherman puts another charter amendment on the ballot. Why wait when you can take care of the other stuff? The Banks started construction before everything was finalized. This really is no different in that regard I'm more concerned about the $11 million Blue Ash Airport money being disputed now

There is a tremendous amount of evidence circulating that disproves Duke's 'safety' claims, one of the projects in Charlotte is from DUKE ITSELF. The Business Courier picked up. Seeing that they have been disproved on on this basic safety issue, why should they take Duke at their word with no documentation? Duke is going to have a PR nightmare if they keep this up.

I think the Duke Energy deal will come eventually. I'm more worried about the Blue Ash Airport funds

WLWT http://www.wlwt.com/video/30485604/detail.html It was a cool ceremony. I'm sure the videos will load soon. First, Tom Luken streaked through the aisle yelling "Boondoggle". He threw off one of the bodyguards but was tackled by Mayor Mark Mallory himself. Then Chris Smitherman took the mic from Ray LaHood mid-speech and said "My man Mark Miller has one of the best twitter accounts of all time" before being tased & escorted out. After everyone settled down, Tom Luken broke past security and streaked again. He outran police and ran off into the CBD. Then after the conference, Chris Finney dove on the rock Mallory was digging up to try and prevent groundbreaking. He was escorted away by police while smacking his butt and telling David Pepper to "Kiss my ass". He is calling into 700wlw tomorrow to talk with Darryl parks about suing the city for injuries caused by the rock Eric Deters screamed treason and said he will conquer Cincinnati using 'White women and Pot'. Fortunately he was exposed as a phony after someone saw his "Obama '08' tattoo on the small of his back. Everyone pointed and laughed. Nelson from the Simpsons mocked Deters as he turned around, head slumped, and they walked off into the distance together Bill Cunningham had a stand in staged in the crowd to call his show at precisely 1:00PM and say to his audience that the streetcar has caused a bout of Bubonic Plague in the tri-state. Chris Smitherman later called in to confirm it. Darryl Parks was there covering the story for 700wlw and prepared for his 700wlw show tomorrow by putting in ear plugs and putting on a blindfold. He then accidentally stumbled into Washington Park. Panhandlers felt sorry for him and offered him change Leslie Ghiz screamed at a supporter. 'Its G with a hard G!' before telling cameras in front of a crowd of 400 'NO ONE WANTS THIS'. Laketa Cole scaled down the building in a Wonder Woman outfit, grabbed a hold of Ghiz and scaled back up. PG Sittenfeld told reporters he was against the project before he was for it but right after he was against it. He then said he was a huge Yankees and Red Sox fan, Loved Obama and Santorum, and Liked Skyline and Gold Star. Doc Thompson tried to make an appearance even he, in addition to everyone else, forgot who he was so he gave up Brian Thomas of 55krc sat down in the middle of the road, crossed his legs and arms, and whined. A four year old screaming about not getting ice cream suddenly stopped, looked at Thomas and said "Grow up". He was escorted into the paddy wagon with Finney and Smitherman already scheming about how to take over Cincinnati Mark Miller interrupted the ceremony as well. He pulled out his cell phone from his bright pink tie dyed fanny pack and tweeted "12.5% of your fire department browned out because of this boondoggle". CincyCapell rushed over, took his cell phone, threw it to Mallory, and proceeded to play keep away as Miller kept chasing the person with the phone. Yvette Simpson had a nice catch and behind the back pass to Seelbach who threw to a diving Quinlivan who threw to Wendall Young who threw to Thomas who threw to Cincy Capell. Capell crushed the cell phone inside of his right hand. Miller crumpled to the ground in a fetal position and bawled. Police picked him up and put him in the paddy wagon as well. Then Luken streaked back through the crowd and off into the sunset. Nothing too exciting

Capell, Can you start a "I've been blocked by Smitherman or Deters for disagreeing with them" group? I just got blocked from Deters as well

So this is the infamous Barry Horstman? Either that or Greg Brady from the Brady Bunch http://www.flickr.com/photos/taestell/6892906827/#in/set-72157629361021689

Didja notice that lone protester had a pair of very dirty pants? Ewwww... And a fancy sombrero. THAT GUY was a protester?!?

I hate to bring down the high and emotions of the groundbreaking but we have a very very important question that needs a definitive answer soon. Who is going to start the "Cincinnati Streetcar Construction Update" Thread? :laugh: