kjbrill

I will give you credit for at least one thing, you are consistent. Yes, you have put forth your evaluations based on the same 6-7 year old tired set of numbers. I doubted them then as they were the speculations of the streetcar advocates, and I doubt them now. If so accurate in their determination, why has the projected cost of Phase I of the streetcar more than doubled? Pardon me if I am waiting to see real life results from real life conditions. Let's just see how fast the populace votes to begin construction on the uptown phase of just the streetcar. My bet is it will not even see a ballot until Phase I is completed and operational. Not saying the streetcar is a bad deal. Just saying it benefits a far too small percentage of the citizens. If I were a citizen of Cincinnati, I would be standing in line asking where is my piece of this pie? But the subway tunnels, they can stay buried for another 50 years.

I am often criticised for not venturing downtown and therefore speaking on subjects I don't have personal experience in. I am the first to admit I do not venture downtown, for multiple reasons. But I do pay attention to what is going on in the City. And Smale Park is a Big Deal! My wife, her caregiver, and my sister-in-law are soon to leave for lunch. They will go to a local restaurant, the Houston Inn in Mason, one of our favorite places for over 30 years. They will have the soup and salad bar. The salad bar is famous in this area for their content, one being the deviled eggs. In addition, candied watermelon rind, old country style whole corn relish, a half dozen or so types of potato salad, spanish king and ripe olives, sweet and sour pickles. And real blue cheese dressing on the salad along with garbanzo beans, thin sliced radish, diced hard boiled eggs, shredded cheddar cheese, you name it, they got it. This is just one of the many reasons we seldom leave Mason. We have nothing against the City and relish in its doing well. At the same time, we have few occasions to go there.

I don't see the park going west of I-75 for a very long time. And years ago I couldn't vision it being where it is now. But at the rate I see this City changing its character, I wouldn't predict No on west of I-75. Why should the westside not desire to be blessed with the same level of luxury the downtown and eastside already have? As I said, this is a unique opportunity for Cincinnati, a several mile riverfront park anchored by a riverboat traversing its entire length. If you want to dream, Dream Big. Over 2/3rds of the park already exists. What is another 1/3 if you are saying come to Cincinnati and enjoy the greatest riverfront park system in the US? It is right there for the taking, what makes Cincinnati unique in the country.

Yes, and would probably never return the ROI the bridge will. People seem to forget all the traffic on the highway and bridge is either moving goods for sale from one section of the country to another, including Cincinnati, or moving people who stop, spend money, and otherwise enjoy themselves along the way. A far greater impact than MetroMoves.

[quote author=clvlndr link=topic=7694.msg705159#msg705159 date=1398223869I know it would be expensive and, yes, there’d be a fight but, is this at all doable? What would it take, now that the streetcars are coming? Does this fact make such a project more or less possible/likely? In my opinion, until the downtown phase of the streetcar is completed, in operation, and shown not to be a financial drain on the City, further talk of rail expansion is futile. And this includes completion of the uptown section of the streetcar (and start of). There is still a sizable segment of the City population which is anti-rail.

With each new section completion the Smale Park becomes an even bigger feather in the City's hat. What a tremendous welcoming addition to the City's front door. I remember when the riverfront was lined with produce distributor warehouses and scrap yards to the point you could barely see the river. In addition to being ugly they drove people away from the river and in my case away from downtown. Cincinnati deserves a great big hooray both for the concept of this park and the carrying it out. Once Smale is completed, the Parks Commission needs to turn its attention eastward for an update of Yeatman's Cove and Sawyer Point to the same level of excellence. Cincinnati has the opportunity here to have a riverfront park system unequalled in the US. I have enjoyed such as Eden, Ault, and Alms parks for years. But downtown, No Way when my kids were young. Now that my kids have kids and those kids are about to have kids, for a long time downtown has still been no way. You can only spend so much time at Fountain Square with a handful of squirmy kids. But Smale Park is changing all of that. It is becoming a shining beacon of Cincinnati to the rest of the world. All I can see that is missing is a museum to Cincinnati's river heritage. And it needs to be a working museum. By that, I mean it needs to have either a sidewheeler or a sternwheeler for cruises on the Ohio. Perhaps that can come when they push the park system west of I-75.

Craft beers. You mean that stuff which smells like a shunk and tastes worse. Just what is the attraction to craft beers? Might as well go back to home brew laced with moonshine. That stuff had a kick too, but who wanted to drink it? I can't think of anything which can kill the gentrirication of OTR faster than craft beer.

We just celebrated Doris Day turning 90. But guess what, at the end of this year Elvis Presley would have been 80. His actual birthday was Jan., 1935. That means on Jan. 8, 2015 he would have been 80. I still have a stack of Elvis 45s, starting with the song which launched him, Heatbreak Hotel, along with Don't be Cruel, Hound Dog, Jailhouse Rock, along with many others. I have several hours of playing time. I will admit being totally pissed when he divorced Priscilla. She was another favorite of mine. I do believe he died as a result of an overdose. By that time he had lost the ability to control his life. What a pity. I guess when you are born to a family of modest means in Tupelo, Miss and vaulted to fame and fortune there is a great danger in this. I still look at him as one of the greatest talents in my early life and dearly miss him.

Where did you get that idea? First of all the city where you work will collect its earning tax regardless. If the city where you live has an earnings tax you will also pay that unless that city grants an exclusion based on how much you pay where you work. The granting of an exclusion has to be written into that city's tax code and usually requires a vote of the citizens to grant it. In a number of locations in Ohio you can pay both their full amount. I never heard of a split between the two cities. Commonly only the city where you work is required to withhold municipal earnings tax. Where you live you must file a tax return and pay the tax accordingly, which may require you to make quarterly payments. And please identify where in Ohio a township can levy an earnings tax. I believe that is specifically prohibited by state law and is not a local option. The only exception is that state law provides for a school district to collect revenue via an earnings tax if the electorate so votes to enable it. But that is the school district, not the city or township and is in addition to any municipal earnings tax you may pay. Also, people having a principle place of employment but whose actual job frequently takes them outside of the city can apply for an exclusion to the earnings tax on the time worked outside of the city. This typically applies to trades people whose actual work site is frequently outside of the city boundaries. But if the actual work site is in another city which has an earnings tax you theoretically must file a return and pay them. An employer is only required to perform withholding for the city where their principle place of business is located.

Just another comment concerning industrial facilities. The company I worked for in Mason did have another feature designed for employee convenience. That was a fully equipped workout facility, featuring a variety of weight training and exercise equipment, etc. They encouraged employees to come early and utilize the workout facility. During the hours the workout facility was available there was always an attendant present, I understand for safety and liability reasons. After working out there were showers and dressing facilities. For those who desired, you could then go to the cafeteria for either juice, coffee and donuts, or have a cook whip up a hot breakfast of pancakes, bacon and eggs, etc. The cooks were there making preparations for lunch so preparing a few breakfasts was no big deal. You'd be surprised how many employees utilized this. There was no charge for the workout facility, it was just another company supplied availability. Sure beat going to some external gym type organization requiring a membership, and then trying to get to work on time.

It is an engineering function for crying out loud. Why do you want to walk to anything? You come to work, do your job, and go home, simple. Does it have its own cafeteria for lunch? Far better to have an onsite lunch capability. Just like the facility I worked at in Mason. We rarely went out for lunch as the internal cafeteria was just so much more convenient and cost effective as it was subsidized by the company. The cafeteria employees were our own people, not some farmed out operation. The cafeteria manager reported internally just like any other department head and the employees received company benefits just like the rest of us. When we had outside customers in for sales presentations there were a couple of small dining rooms for privacy but the food was prepared by our own cafeteria. It sure optimized the time spent rather than going to external restaurants. Our cooks were very capable and could easily work in a restaurant. But working for us they received benefits they would not typically have in the normal restaurant. All of the food was prepared onsite, usually from scratch, not just dumped out of a can. When our Mason facility was built, the company president decided the cafeteria would be our own operation and geared to keeping the employees onsite to minimize interference with the work day. I must say it worked very well. Since I retired, occasionally I will drop in to visit some of my former colleagues, and I always time it to be there during lunch. Industrial facilities are just that, industrial. Their purpose is to provide a pleasant and efficient environment for working. They are not designed to attract the general public.

But aren't we talking about a retirement community? Yes, retirees may get out of the community sometimes, and the community still needs workers and supplies, and visits from family, but isn't the whole point of a retirement community to be self-contained? That is, most of the residents won't leave the community most days? No, we are talking a new 1,400 acre development with 4,500 housing units of multiple types which happens to be next to a retirement community but not a retirement community itself. You don't plan soccer and baseball fields, a school, etc. for a retirement community. That is my point. The occupants of those 4,500 housing units are going to require employment, and with the lack of public tranportation this means they are going to have to drive to those jobs. No matter how well the new community is laid out for walkability, etc., the fact the residents have to drive to work pretty much destroys the new urbanist aspect of it. Note the new development has a different name Union Village Otterbein. This alone indicates it is not an expansion of the retirement community. And the name of the development company is also new Otterbein Homes Inc. The only real connection with the Otterbein Retirement Community is the use of the name and the exploitation of the 1,400 acres owned by Otterbein.

OHKID ... I am trying to digest your post a relate it to the development announced by Otterbein. If people are desiring to move to a more urban environment, why would they move to a large development in the middle of the country where there is no transportation to anywhere other than by car. As one poster related, the Warren County Transit is only a few small gas powered buses which don't even run on an established schedule. They are nothing more than a public taxi service to primarily assist elderly people. I see nothing in this development which is going to materially change that. There is no base to build off of. And those 4,500 residential units, how many people does that relate to? Let's discount kids, but if they are planning soccer and baseball fields they must be planning on kids. Buts lets just say 2 persons to a unit, that is a fair sized city of 9,000. Where are these people going to work? I didn't see anything suggesting a sufficient number of jobs to be created right in the development. So that tells me we are talking a car oriented environment having to drive some distance for employment. Pardon my pessimism, but I just see a suburban sprawl situation talking advantage of some salable land plopped down in an environment worse than most when it comes to such things as water supply, sewer, all the necessary infrastruture and being disguised as some kind of new urban living when there is nothing urban about it.

First of all, I have not observed a problem with the residents at Otterbein having a problem getting around. Otterbein operates their own busses to transport the residents, whether it be to the doctor, the store, or just on an outing. They don't reply on Warren County Transit which is admittedly quite limited. Here is a link to the article announcing the development in the Dayton Business Journal. http://www.bizjournals.com/dayton/news/2014/04/08/otterbein-plots-massive-mixed-use-development-in.html?page=all If you read the whole article, you will note they are talking about 4,500 residential units, a mix of multi-family, single-family, townhomes and rental units, plus a million square feet of commercial and retail. And additional space for a school, a university branch in junction with the University of Dayton, an equestrian center, parks. This is not a small development. Also note they filed the plans with Warren County under a new company name, Otterbein Homes Inc with the development itself tagged Union Village Otterbein. Also note this outfit operates 13 facilities around southwest Ohio, not shabby for a non-profit. Still say they are being permitted to operate in a manner only a for-profit should be capable of. When they begin competing with private developers I believe they should be bared from doing so. And 4,500 residential units sounds like private developer domain to me.

The announcement by the Otterbein Retirement Community in Lebanon this week that they are going to do a large development on 1,400 acres they own there was a disappointment to me. I think they are calling it a new urbanist development, whatever that is. It dwarfs the Austin Landing to the north and also the Liberty Center to the south. Otterbein has been a peaceful retirement community for a long time. I can't help but feel it will be adversely affected by this announced development just due to the scale. And the intersection of Ohio 63 and Ohio 741 is not going to come out like a rose either. Appears to me some managers hired to manage the non-profit saw all that land and just couldn't resist look at the money we can make by developing it. The area doesn't need it and Otterbein certainly doesn't need it. If they were planning on expanding Otterbein into the premier retirement location in the entire Tri-State area that would be one thing, as they could maintain its somewhat rural atmosphere and tranquility. But that doesn't appear to be the plan.

Despite the detractors, Liberty Center will be hugely successful. Just because there are so many people out here in the northern suburbs who will go there. It will draw from Lebanon and just about every other suburb out here. I have already stated I will likely be an infrequent guest, but strictly due to the travel problem my wife and I have. We need locations where we can literally pull the wheelchair van up to the front door. We are fortunate to have many locations in the Mason area where this is possible. My wife shops at Meijer off Tylersville in Butler Co. They park literally at the front door. From what I have seen from the artist's concepts of Liberty Center, it will be more dense, not sure if compatible with our needs. But that doesn't detract from the literally thouands of people poised here to be customers. Just like we are in the vast minority, many other vested posters appear to be the same. Liberty Center will be a success from day one when they open the doors. And it will have zero to do with downtown Cincinnati. The whole focus will be on the northern suburbs, and where people desire to live and shop. Now just where here did I knock Cincinnati? Cincinnati go your way, but permit us who have selected a different path to go ours.

There seems to be a dichotomy here. Please explain how the fact the City keeps losing population and the Metro gains does not equal a gain for the metro? I just don't understand why the Metro is not gaining the advantage. Perhaps you urbanists should pay attention to where people are actually moving to.

Yes I do. Just knowing I live in one of the most desirable locations in the Metro is enough to suit me. Part of my having no desire to go downtown is my age. There is absolutely nothing there which entices me to take the time and trouble to go there. My wife and I find everything we desire for a good existence here in Mason. Sorry if you disagree, but that is life.

Those who want to rehab every buildiing in siight, no matter what the raason. Quess what, Liberty Center will be one of the most successful retail centers in Cinciinnati, bare none. Why, becaause the people in the northern suburbs have no reason to go downtown, there is just notrhing there. Like it or not, the Metro regiion is surpassing the City in every endeavor.

There is a simplu solutuon no one wants to address. Do Not Route I-71 through downtown Cincinnati. You already have an existing bridge to route I-71 traffic across (The Daniel Carter Beard Bridge, better known as the Big Mac). So funnel I-71 traffic across I-471 to I-275 then South. Will this be a disruption? damn good and well it will! But look at the result. No through interstate traffic in downtown Cincinnati. Not only cap FWW, but maybe fill it in, This should get the urbanists going. Do I believe this is a hair-brained proposal? No I do not. If you have a current merging of the traffic of two interstates causing a clog, what is the best way to alleviate it - move the clog. If in the process of doing this you alleviate the conjestion of two interstates through the middle of downtown Cincinnati, what more can you ask for? Perhaps you can actually permit Cincinnati to make money on the deal.

The real lesson is don't go into ANY debt to start a business of this kind, especially hundreds of thousands of dollars. It doesn't work, especially when you're competing in an industry where most people start with cash from investors or family money that never has to be repaid. Those people are only paying rent, not rent + payments on a loan. Why don't people realize this? Sit down with a piece of paper and a calculator and sketch out your numbers, then the numbers of the guy next to you at The Banks who isn't writing a $4,000 check at the end of each month. He gets to use that $4,000 on advertising, to save for eventual renovations, or to save to start a second location. Your $4,000 is disappearing into thin air and you have almost no money left over to do any of the things your competitor is doing. The real lesson is don't trust city council who has zero expertise in these matters. the taxpayers funded Liz to the tune of 1 Million dollars. The other operators at the Banks have lines of credit they are using. If a family member loans you money and you don't repay the loan it is up to the damaged party to work this out. The only operator at the Banks who is delinquent on a loan to the taxpayers is Liz Rogers. Liz Rogers has a massive free start advantage over everybody else at The Banks. She can't run a business and turn a profit, she never has. $300,000 loan, $685,000 Grant for a $3,500 Sq. Ft. restaurant that is absurd. YES, YES YES !!! How many more times do we have to hear this same refrain?

No, what is feeding time is thinking every old building is worthy of conversion. If it was such a damn good building why was it not worthy of upgrading for its original purpose - as a school? Or did the architects who originally designed it have their proverbial heads up their a*s?

But many people couldn't even afford buying, keeping and feeding a horse, much less a cart or carriage. Correct, and since most people can afford to own a car today, though some may elect not to, why don't we tear out the street in front of YOUR house since I DON'T USE IT?

Glad to see the KY House had some guts to shoot down the tool aspects of a Brent Spence Replacement/Addition. Good to see some people around here have some sense.

Why would anyone want to redevelop a property into a hotel at a school location deemed inadequate and replaced by a new school? Just doesn't make sense to me. Tear the damn thing down and build a new structure worthy of being labeled a hotel.