BCCLE1

Am sorry to see the last remnant of the HAAB family "empire" gone, but am also glad. Sad because of all the memories of the HAAB family, the bakery, and my many, many times spent with them. Mrs. HAAB was a very kind and giving person (she is living with her daughter in Bratenahl now). Mrs. HAAB moved in with her daughter after her own home in Duck Island burned down some years ago. She owned many of the homes in the Duck Island neighborhood that are now gone. My sister was married to one of the HAAB brothers; he passed away in May 2014. The other brother who ran the bakery for many years after taking it over from Mrs. HAAB passed away in 2013. That left only the daughter who gained control of the HAAB "empire", and didn't want anything to do with the properties. The daughter sold off all the properties/land last year, and my doing so has actually helped make some of the redevelopments happening in Duck Island possible. As much as I was involved with the HAAB family for twenty five plus years due to my sisters marriage to one of them, and having spent many, many times in the bakery, the home my sister and brother-in-law lived in (the Seltzer Home "mansion" that was on W. 20th), now demolished, and the home behind it in which one of my nephews and his family lived in for a number of years, I am glad the HAAB family "empire" has come to an end. Not only due to the new development happening or soon to happen on the properties, but because when the properties now since demolished were owned by HAAB family, they were not kept up very well, and some people would probably have considered the HAAB family slum lords. Also, I had an Uncle and Aunt who lived on Columbus Rd. hill for many years too, and seeing all the changes going on there is great too. I really do like what I see happening in the Duck Island neighborhood.

Again, no offense meant on posting to the Ohio City thread, but what house on Denison Ave. may be the oldest residence in Cleveland? The Wirth House, Beltz House (both of which are in danger of demolition do to the lack of care my the leaders of the city [Landmarks Comm., Councilman, etc.]), or some other home I am not aware of?

My thanks too! You always take great shots of our beloved CLE.

10th picture down, why is ATL honoring our mayor Mike White? lol. And can we move all of Buckhead to the CLE?

The Super K-Mart site is being looked at for a Menards.

Here's an option that could add parking on both W. 25th and W. 24th. Turn W. 25th into a one way street going South from Franklin Blvd to Chatham Ave., and turn W. 24th into a one way street going North from Chatham Ave to Franklin Blvd. This would provide 2 lanes of traffic on each of the streets going in the appropriate direction, and parking could be changed from curb parking to back-in angled parking on each street. This would add plenty of needed/additional parking spaces, but probably not enough parking spaces as a whole. I know W. 24th would have to be extended by taking away some of the "farm land" that is currently being utilized where an extension would go, but IMO the greater gain outweighs the loss of green space. W. 25th is a federal route, and getting approving the feds to assist in helping the traffic/parking problem would take "an act of congress", but W. 24th would become the northbound part of US-42. Don't know if this is a good idea, or not, but wanted to throw it out there.

Columbus is listed twice, spot #159 and #309. So if you are a fan of the COL, brag about #309, if not #159. Yep! Another dumb-a$$ list.

Let's visit this topic again, unfortunately. Looking for an internet service provider in the CLE proper. Does anyone know of any alternatives to AT&T U-Verse internet? They talked me into changing my original internet service I had with them and was satisfied with, and sold me on an upgrade of which they said I would be saving money. Yes, I fell for it and now I'm paying the price. Well actually I not paying for the additional fees they tacked on above and beyond what I was told would be my monthly bill, and I am tired of going round and round with them about their deceptive practices and tactics. Now their sending me past due notices with late fees of which I refuse to pay. I am not interested in satellite, so Dish and DirectTV are out, but can people comment of TWC, WOW, or some other IPS that I, or others do not know about. Help please.

Forest City or Concrete City? Which is it? On the one hand, everyone wants the CLE to be more green, and the other density. The Lakewood side of Edgewater Dr. and Lake Ave. look great densely packed, and there is even enough greenery to satisfy both the density advocates and greenery advocates I would think; on the CLE side many here on UO want all density it seems. The only problem I see with Edgewater Dr. and Lake Ave. on the CLE side is the bland ranch homes. I think the mix of some apt buildings on Lake with the beautiful mansions is a great mix. The only out of place structures are the ranch homes. If they could be torn down and mansions replaced them, both streets would look even more beautiful. The proposed townhomes on the south side of Lake Ave backing up to the shopping center to me is the perfect transition from the single family homes with lawns to the shopping center on Clffton/W. 117th. The proposed townhomes even compliment the ones on the Lakewood side but architecturally are much more beautiful, and the developer is even including the right amount of green space to help the transition from the single family homes on the north side of Lake Ave., to the townhomes, to the shopping center.

I went to GNP in 2014 by way of Spokane, WA. Traveled through Coeur d'Alene, ID., then to Kalispell, MT./GNP. If one has the time, this is a great trip to plan. Spokane I think is the largest airport nearest GNP, but as stated in 2009 there are other options. Spokane has a very nice downtown with quite a few restaurants. There is a really nice all purpose trail that has great views of downtown Spokane. The trail runs along the Spokane River. Coeur d'Alene is a summer resort town, and sits on its namesake lake. It has lot's of local restaurants, locally owned specialty shops, and cool thrift stores. Not counting GNP, this was my favorite part of the trip when thinking of man made places we visited Cannot add to Clevelumbus' post about GNP. The pictures say enough. It is a must go for anyone who has not been there.

I agree that proposal is ugly. In-fill has to be done in historic neighborhoods, but I believe any in-fill should reflect and/or compliment the character of the structures that made the neighborhood a historic neighborhood to begin with. In-fill to me should say "I'm here", but not to the point that it says "I'm here, and look at me instead of the historic structures".

Probably going to start a debate here, but IMO they got it wrong. Honey Hut is the best in OH. I've had both, and IMO there is no "contest" between the two. HH it is, hands down, or should I say sticky fingers!!!

Here is that rebuttal. Article:How best to save a neighborhood? The case for rehabilitation: Jeffrey Johnson The fight to save our neighborhoods by removing abandoned houses through demolition appears to many to be a rational and important strategy. We have heard from some that vacant structures lower the values of surrounding properties and have devastated the local property tax base. Jim Rokakis, director of the Thriving Communities Institute, recently said: "Our studies showed that demolitions increase property values; increased property values mean more stability and more stability means fewer foreclosures." It is easy to be persuaded by what appears to be a strong argument for demolition as a logical strategy for growth in our communities. Many of our most influential leaders have jumped on the demolition bandwagon. Members of Congress, state and local officials and others have all joined in to sing the same song of "demolition now." I believe, however, that all of them are tone deaf to the long-term negative impact of their message to our communities. Remainder of article has been removed for copyright issues. Please provide a link to the original article and never post more than 2-3 paragraphs from the original article. Thanks. - Mods (ryanlammi[/member])

The below article was written by Jim Rokakis a couple years ago. And to me shows that this new undertaking to photograph and rate every Cleveland property is not in the best interest of those who want renovation, restoration of properties to be a part of any endeavor to make Cleveland great again. Jim would rather see noting but vacant land in the city of Cleveland rather then renovated and restored homes. Why are not "free" government funds available to rehab homes, but yet are available to demolish homes? Article: How best to save a neighborhood? The case for demolition: Jim Rokakis Plain Dealer guest columnist By Plain Dealer guest columnist on July 07, 2013 at 4:52 AM, updated July 07, 2013 at 4:53 AM These are difficult times for Ohio cities. Foreclosures -- while on the decline -- are still three times their "normal" pre-foreclosure-crisis levels. Add to that problem the now-vacant thousands of structures -- made vacant largely as a result of the crisis -- and it is obvious Ohio is suffering from a double-whammy of ailments. Sadly, there is no end in sight. For that reason, it was good news last month when the U.S. Department of the Treasury, after considerable lobbying from Northeast Ohio members of Congress and community leaders, agreed to allow a portion of the "Hardest Hit Fund" -- money set aside by the Obama administration in 2009 to assist distressed homeowners facing foreclosure -- to be used for blight clearance as well. Michigan already has moved $100 million to blight clearance. Ohio is considering at least $60 million. The White House and Treasury understand that vacancy abatement is a national priority, since the collapse of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and their takeover by the federal government means that we are backstopping nine of 10 mortgages in this country. They understand that vacancies are lowering property values. They understand that neighborhoods with abandoned homes are less safe. Most important, they understand that vacant properties are shaking the confidence of homeowners to the extent that they are starting to walk away from these mortgages -- and that the federal government will have to make good on these mortgages. .... Remainder of article has been removed for copyright issues. Please provide a link to the original article and never post more than 2-3 paragraphs from the original article. Thanks. - Mods (ryanlammi[/member])

20 years old, or 105 years old like my home; every structure needs work/maintenance/upgrades done at some point. 20 years old is not old in a general sense, but for a building of any kind no matter how "young" or "old", there comes a time for upgrades or repairs. I see the problem as one in which the city/Gateway should have been putting aside money for the time at which upgrades are needed. Do we as home owners not have to do the same thing for when projects are needed on our own homes either by choice, or necessity. Did the city/Gateway put money aside on an ongoing basis for this time? Probably not, and so now Gateway/Cavs are looking to the public to pay, and we should as said in another post, we the tax payers own the structure.

This article is in the April 2015 issue of the Plain Press Detroit Shoreway residents vote to remove landmark status from historic Watterson Lake School building to make way for demolition by Chuck Hoven At a March 18th Community meeting held in Bethany Presbyterian Church, residents voted 22 to 3 to have historic Watterson Lake School Building on W. 74th and Detroit Avenue removed from its landmark status and demolished. The school, built in 1906 and designed by architect Frank S. Barnum, has been vacant since the 1980s. Students currently attend a newer Watterson Lake built in 1969 next to the old building. After the vote, Ward 15 Councilman Matt Zone said he would immediately work to get on the agenda of the Landmarks Commission to pursue removing landmark status of the building so it can be demolished this summer. In the discussion prior to the vote, Councilman Zone noted the meetings held over the years to attempt to save the building. He recalled attending a meeting in 1995 where restoration of the building was an issue. He said Detroit Shoreway Community Development Organization presented the school district an analysis of the building in 1988. Resident Sharon Dossa, who attended school in the old Watterson Lake building, recalled the schools’ former principal working to save the historic structure. Dossa said something of the school could have been saved years ago when the school was “not as visibly terrible as it is now.” She said what happened to Watterson Lake was “demolition by neglect by the Cleveland Metropolitan School District.” Residents attending the meeting were given a list of the recent meetings of the West Clinton Block Club where residents sought answers from the school district about the condition of the building. In response to these efforts the school district produced a number of reports. An October 2013 Sebesta & Associates airborne asbestos report “showed significant potential for exposure to airborne asbestos fibers and fungal spores in the 1906 building.” An April 2014 Masonry Prism Testing for Compressive Strength recommended demolition rather than trying to save the 1906 walls. Councilman Zone said he also asked local developer Marous Brothers Construction for an opinion, and in February of this year they told him the building was unlikely to attract an adaptive use developer. He said other builders and an architect with expertise in historic preservation have given him similar feedback. Councilman Zone said the Cleveland Metropolitan School District has agreed to cover the cost of demolishing the structure. Zone said the entire cost of the demolition would have to come from district funds – the state will not match the cost because there are currently no students in the building. A November 2013 Barber & Hoffman cost estimate determined the cost of demolition to be between $400,000 and $500,000. An additional $250,000-$300,000 would be added to the cost to brace and preserve the façade. It was also noted some of the terra cotta work in the design of the façade fell off in 2013. With Watterson Lake’s 1969 building eventually slated to be closed by the school district after a new Waverly-Watterson Lake building is constructed on the current site of Waverly, Councilman Zone said a decision had to be made whether the old building should be torn down this summer during school recess or to wait and tear both buildings down at the same time. Councilman Zone said the school district had agreed to see if it could separate the parcels and tear down just the old building and prepare the site for potential development. He said that demolishing the school now would allow the option of keeping some of the artifacts for incorporation into the new school planned for the Waverly site on W. 57th and allow for a small development site on Detroit Avenue. Councilman Zone assured residents that every precaution would be taken in demolishing the building to assure air quality safety in the nearby neighborhood.

It would be a great lobby for any building(s) built on the east/west/north side of it, whether office/residential/theatre, etc...

Change.org is not correct in stating that Tamir Rice was "minding his own business". The reason the police were called out to Cudell Recreation Center that day was because Tamir was pointing the "gun" he had at others. If Tamir would not have pointed the "gun" at anyone that day, the police probably would not have been called. I do not have a verdict yet in my mind as to whether the police involved with the events of that day are not guilty/guilty, or should be charged with a crime. I have seen the video many times, and I do question why Tamir's life was taken in less than a second after the one officer was out of the patrol car, but unless ALL the evidence is presented to me, I am not going to sign any petition. Let law enforcement, and the judicial system do its due-diligence.

"A murder would be a murder regardless of whether it was pre-meditated or not". This is a wrong statement because all murder is pre-meditated, there is no "or not". Murder and Kill have been so intertwined in society/the news/etc., that people think they are one and the same. They are not, and our government recognizes this. That is why there are different laws for murdering someone vs killing someone.

"Thanks" for respecting others views Hts121. I appreciate it. HA! HA!

Not sure if you meant that seriously about turning the YMCA into a hostel. Does anyone know if CLE is in need of a second hostel? What occupancy rate has the hostel in OC incurred since its opening a couple years ago? Is it to consistently at capacity? Anybody know.

I think it's a stretch to compare violent youths in Cleveland to poor violent kids in Brazil. The kids in Cleveland appear to be doing it for a thrill, evidenced by recording it on their cell phones. The kids in Brazil are probably stealing just to get a meal. They can't imagine having a phone to record the violence on... Agreed, there is no comparison to Brazil. In Brazil, it's Brazilians attacking Brazilians. In both of these case in downtown CLE, it is blacks attacking whites. What with all the different "types" of people around in both cases, why did the blacks choose whites to attack only? It seems obvious that these two incidents look like hate crimes against whites, but let the investigators figure it out if they can catch the attackers. On the Racism thread there is a video of a white man being attacked by blacks on a transit train in St. Louis this past Monday. Is this also a hate crime? The video shows only that one white person vs. many blacks were on the train. Why did the white man get attacked but no blacks? And all three of the above incidents were not reported for days. Were they not reported for days by the news media do too the nature of the crimes? (blacks on whites vs. whites on blacks). It sure looks that way. Just because the black young men of American are "frustrated" does not give them the right to commit a crime. Period! Whether it is a crime against other blacks, or whites, or anybody.

I had to go to Lakewood today, so on the way back home decided to check out the Enhance Clifton project on the Cleveland side. I like the way it has turned out, especially the mediums with the trees, and the additional, or replacement trees along the tree lawns. I do have one question though about something I noticed, are the steel poles that had the old traffic signals going to be removed? It was odd to see the new poles/traffic signals, and yet there were still all the old poles there.

GREAT NEWS IMO! Harry Reid has decided not to run for reelection. http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/03/27/senate-democratic-leader-reid-announces-retirement/

You're being silly, flying is safe, you're not risking never seeing your kid again. Ha. I fly probably 12-15 times per year, so I'm pretty used to it. That said, the slightest bit of turbulence, and my thought basically is "oh god, i'm gonna die!!!" I take solace in that domestic plane crashes seem to be much rarer than overseas carriers. Also, the vast majority of crashes (unless intentional I guess) occur during take off or landing, so it's always a good feeling when you've reached cruising altitude and flight attendants start beverage service as that tells you everything is fine. I flew every week for 2 years from 2012-2014, and was never afraid of getting on a plane. Even in the last year I have flown 4 times without any thought of not getting on a plane. The last week of this past Feb. I flew from Cleveland to San Francisco, and back. After 9/11 happened, my mindset was to not be afraid to get on a plane because I was not going to stop living my life, and letting the terrorist win. Just because there have been 2 or 3 crashes in the last year where it is looking like the planes were deliberately brought down by pilots, I still will get on a plane without any hesitation. It has been said over and over, and over, flying is still one of the safest ways to travel, and it is proven by the statistics. There are thousands, and thousands of flights everyday across the US, and the world without any incident. So how can you put your mind at ease for your upcoming trip. I think (weather right, or wrong) you have to face your fear by just getting on the plane. Once you get to CA and back you will start to overcome your fear of flying. Fear is a powerful thing, and I still have certain fears, but I am also working to overcome those fears by not letting any fear stop me from doing what I was put here to do, live life to its fullest.