CleveFan

That looks great but appears to be 40 stories or more

Thanks KJP- once again, great detective work and analysis. Well, we’ve gone from images of the mighty Amazon project to a 40 story maximum - but still we were thinking easily 600’- to now a maximum of 30 stories and “other buildings”. I have to admit I was really hoping for a 4th tower on PS that was iconic and that would have required something proportional to the Big 3. Sure, it’ll be fantastic to fill in “the missing tooth” - and this is still a mighty win for the city- but I think many of us were ready to paint the sky.

Looking at the Euclid Grand forum mention was made of the historic looking street lamps that used to accompany the no-longer existing Bond Building. There are many aesthetic considerations related to streetscape that are easily noticeable and seem correctable or at least improvable - but they seem to occur and sometimes persist (Other than pre-RNC). Just curious, who oversees these “details” in Cleveland? I know there are pressing “real” problems in basic quality of life issues...But are design-related decisions (such as the type of street lamps, etc) overseen by the CDC or are they random items that come before City Council?

Unless that Justice Center becomes an exemplar of fairness and excellence.

I was ready to make that sacrifice.

KJP for Mayor! I’ll take the 60 story version!

I recently saw Public Square on an “honorable mention” list of the world’s best public squares. (It was not a Cleveland- centric website.) I don’t think any of the others had buses crossing through the middle. Sometimes, you can’t have your cake and eat it too. Or you can’t be all things - you gotta pick your lane. Whatever phrase works. Not to relitigate the previous arguments from UO’s public square thread months ago - I just don’t think Public Square can be a world-class pedestrian gathering place while being traversed by Jersey Barriers and buses.

KJP’s busy, but here’s what’s going on:

I remember seeing that number and timeline too - that number (30,000) now seems very realistic in the next decade.

The images in the NEOtrans article of this “outlet mall” actually look nice. My first reaction to this was to shudder, bAsed on the previous version of an outlet mall, in the location closer to Burke ( I recall a “lipstick on a pig” post describing it). My concern this time is the location and how this could actually be a big missed opportunity. The idea that this property will draw a lot of people into the CBD for additional shopping or restaurant-going is a nice one but is pure conjecture at this point . I think this has the potential to be a very successful entity yet one that is very disconnected from the downtown. It’s location is problematic - it’s not a “walkable close” and I just happen to think that this outlet will tend to provide an “all-in-one experience” for most shoppers. The idea of a lot of new retail, the accompanying jobs and revenue for the city- all positive! But how cool would it be to create something “Inner Harbor”-like just a bit further west where RRHF and Science Museum tourists would have a walkable destination for shopping and dining. That could greatly help the Rock Hall and create an even more visited tourist Area. The RRHF will be cool 20 years from now as would an Inner- Harbor type shopping experience - but an outlet mall on its own? We’ve seen Malls that we’re once thought to be permanent become irrelevant within a few decades. I don’t know if this location is a done deal but that’s my biggest concern - the missed opportunity for something really special so very nearby.

I see what you did there!

Great pic! Love the Beacon in the background. More pedestrians, please!

Are those the last beams being put into place on the top 2-story mechanicals area? Looks like it’s just about topped out.

Drive-by shopping. Just far away enough to not bring people in to shop in downtown and just far enough away to not be a companion to the RRHF - which I think is needed to become like an Inner Harbor type attraction. And I don’t think a strip mall right there is going to really pull people in from the burbs.

Thanks for the usual great article KJP - The economic impact of SW’s decision to stay in CLE is going to be even bigger than one might initially realize. One line from the latest NEOtrans article that jumped out at me was that “the number of people visiting SHW’s seminars and 3-day training classes would fill more than 100 hotel rooms every weeknight for a year.” Talk about real impact, wow. That’s not even accounting for the restaurants and occasional sporting events, RRHF visits and shows that visitors might want to add to their work trips. Obviously beyond the skyline and the optics for Cleveland, there is an incredible effect at “street level” - a renewed energy from real people and real jobs. Yea, sign me up for that Urban Ohio Party. I’ll bring the Diet Coke.

(And Girls). Santa’s comin’ again

What’s the over/under on this thread getting locked again?

Upthread i posted pics of the NW Mutual HQ in Milwaukee- a conservative comparison to a possible SW HQ Tower - at 33 stories and 550 feet. Even at that scope; very impactful. But if a 75 story version was SW’s actual intention, some reasonable comparisons might be LA’s Wilshire Grand (73 floors and 1100 feet high completed in 2017) which is 14th tallest in the US and US Bank Tower, which dates to 1989 but is the still iconic LA skyscraper at 73 stories and 1,018 feet and 21st tallest in the country.

I’ve decided to take KJP’s advice and “enjoy the moment”. So, at the risk of seeming presumptive and speculative, I was trying to imagine something reasonably along the lines of what we might get for an HQ tower based on the latest bits we‘ve been hearing these past few weeks (e.g. Max 40 stories, etc.) I thought of Milwaukee’s quite New Northwestern Mutual Headquarters. 33 stories, 1,500,000 feet of floor space and 550 feet high - perhaps it’s even a bit shorter than what we might get but just to share the idea...

I’d say zero.

Gotta give props to the Cavs for their early season performance - coming within seconds of knocking off Philly in their building was notable. If they keep this energy up, this is going to be a very fun team to root for and watch.

ESPN just did over a half hour on this without commercial interruption. What Garrett did was unprecedented and, of course, completely unacceptable. But I do feel real bad for him. Not only did our best defensive player “lose it” on national TV and hurt his team for the rest of the season - but this young man’s career will be tarnished for a very long time. Any of us who have had a really bad very public moment should be able to empathize. It’s very unfortunate. Hopefully the Browns will be able to use this moment to galvanize and reset their commitment to professionalism and team first.

A true Urban Ohio guy with his priorities in order! I thought downtown looked really nice on some of the shots - multi-colored TT... Back to the Browns- I thought Baker did a great job on the post-game with Erin Andrews

Thrilled to see the Browns beat the Steelers but does Freddie Kitchen have control of these players? What Miles Garrett did tonight is the latest ugly example....