cadmen

As anxious as we all are for this conversion to get started l think we have to cut the developer some slack. Other than trying to figure out what to do with the Tower City complex this building has to be the most difficult to pull off. It has a massive footprint that will ensure multiple users (residential along with maybe a boutique hotel, some kind of creative use of that fantastic lobby and perhaps a little retail. Through in possible office space and you've run the gamut of potential uses. That can't be easy and it won't come cheap. No guarantee it works either and l don't see anyone else waiting in the wings to take over if it fails. At the moment it's Centennial or bust. This building is too important, the location too critical to fail. So let's give Millenial a break and hope they can eventually pull this off.

I think what sets the US apart is our unique emphasis on the individual rather than the group. Also we are at our core a transactional people. I have lived in other countries and traveled the world for decades and one of the first things l noticed is how much people elsewhere prefer socializing outside with the neighborhood rather than spending time alone or in small groups. Americans value privacy while most of the rest of the world values community. As a transactional people we seem to favor stripping down the act of purchasing something to its simplest form which today is buying it online while we are alone. In other countries people seem to value the face to face negotiation/relationship more than actually owning the thing. We like have more toys. They like experiencing the purchase more than owning the item. So l think it comes down to culture. There's a reason why we live a more material existence while at the same time having a greater percentage of lonely/alienated people. Just one more reason why l feel at home much more in the rest of the world than l do here. Look no further than city life. They are out and about creating lively cities while we are more likely to be isolated in our homes in front of some screen.

Or they are just taking a nap like old people do. Hell, they probably forgot they even own the property.

Sure they're not opposed to the Park as long as they can sell their little corner for many times what they paid for it. Their civic virtue is mind-blowing. Gee if l didn't know any better I'd have thought that property has been in the family for generations. Classic carpetbaggers.

^ Exactly right. My first choice for the SHW R&D center was as part of the new headquarters but if that wasn't a great location due to some environmental issues then the next best (and maybe even the best) location was that property on the peninsula. Keep the jobs and activity local and maybe really kickstart the next development in the Flats. But no...Scranton Averell was more interested in doing nothing. It's their property sure, and their right but come on... That peninsula is in a strategic location. Developing it properly could lead to a tremendous amount of other development in the area. And that kind of development, tying Tremont to the Flats to downtown is important to the progress the city is trying to make. Just another example of won't do rather than can do that has impeded this city's growth.

The land on both sides of the river from this area north to the lake has to be one of the most unusual combinations of property usage in the country today. We have what was once one of the most industrial areas anywhere now being used for recreation, housing, entertainment and industry. There is a natural tension over land usage that is still being hashed out. In general l'm a fan of using the unique river curvature for everything but industry going forward. Of course change will inevitably result in stepping on some toes. It would be nice if industry could somehow be made whole by moving it further south but in reality that's probably not possible without causing financial harm. In life there are winners and losers and in this cause l think it's industry that will ultimately lose. Still, until the full transition occurs we are going to have some strange bedfellows. On this particular site imagine living right next to those piles of stone/slag. As you look out the window of your $600,000 unit you will literally be feet from an industrial legacy. Before l recently bought a home in Lakewood l looked in that very area in the industrial valley. As much as l wanted to move to Tremont the idea of industry right outside my front door was something l couldn't abide. I wonder how many other potential buyers feel the same way? At any rate, watching the transformation of an industrial heritage into something completely different is interesting to say the least.

Of course if we wanted to we could create a much better waterfront and perhaps we will someday. But even if we decided to do that there is a big difference between a year round waterfront and a seasonal one. Its more difficult to entice development when you are limited to a few months a year. Imagine our lake and riverfront really open year round. If you are a businessman or a developer thinking about opening something and you know you can count on 12 months of business vs. 5 or 6 that difference might be the dealbreaker. That's just reality.

NR, you are singing my song. I'm a retired Clinic researcher. Over the course of my career l have watched local medical research grow exponentially and l have had the privilege of working with other large medical research facilities around the country. In that time l have seen what happens when a region is able to galvanize local and state politicians, business leaders and medical establishments to create something from virtually nothing. Research Triangle is a perfect example. What was once smallish independent hospitals have turned into behemoths by working together to leverage research dollars to entice medical reserve companies to locate in a small footprint. We are already doing something like that here but if we could somehow manage to get all parties to grow in the same direction we could be so much more. The bones are in place now. All we need is the focus and leadership to become so much more. I've seen the benefits and they can be spectacular.

The biggest thing separating us from them is the weather.

No.

At that price l can't imagine Bedrock NOT building something substantial. The question is when?

Man, people are so creative. Thanks Dave.

I say again...can't this city somehow figure out how to get all those bridges lit up? I swear whatever the cost it will be more than made up for by new investment. There's a reason businesses use colorful lighting...it attracts people.

Considering the quality of the current product they're lucky it's that high. And l'm STILL one of those subscribers. Habit l guess.

Sorta on topic: I swear l read an article years ago that said because tourism is such an important economic element Florida politicians somehow got a law passed that stipulates the Federal government must rebuild their beaches with new sand everytime one of them gets damaged or destroyed by a hurricane. And the rest of us pay for it! What's next? A law mandating they must have sunshine too? Give me a break.

The size of the revision is more in scale with its neighbors so in that regard l guess l like it better than the former submission although l usually prefer larger than smaller. What can l say...l'm just as size biased as the next guy and l'm only 5'7" lol. At any rate, this new downsized version is a better look and it's the kind of neighborhood improvement you see all the time in other cities like Chicago, Boston etc. It's little projects like this that continue to enhance our development and indicate that we are part of the normal growing cities and not one of the dieing cities.

Sounds like one of those cool ideas with a short shelf life. It's probably too gimmicky, especially for a city like Cleveland that doesn't get the number of tourists the LA's, Miami, or even Chicago do. I can see it opening here to great hoopla, occupancy hitting in the 80's. Fast forward two years later and the novelty has worn off. Two years after that it's in bankruptcy.

Not sure how the new admin building fits in architecturally but from the pics of the enhancementthe rest of the reno looks really great. Like everyone else l'm glad to see the container boxes go. They fit like a square peg in a round hole. I actually liked the look of the old Terrace Club (thought it looked like it was ie. exclusive. But l get it. We're in different times now so it was no longer feasible. The change to that section looks seamless. In fact both the old Terrace Club and the upper right field deck changes look modern enough while at the same time fitting into what is an old retro designed ballpark. And the changes allow for what fans of today appear to want. Which is flexibility in how they enjoy the game. And for me the best thing about the ballpark continues to be the location. Love how it is placed within downtown with some great views of the skyline. Whenever l see a stadium sitting in some field somewhere surrounded by a sea of parking my first thought is what a waste. Cities are meant to be active. Removing a stadium from downtown also removes its energy. The fan experience is wasted on a parking lot. Thank god we didn't have to deal with that.

Wait, did l miss that the lower level of the Detroit Superior bridge is for sure going to be turned into a park or is this just wishful thinking?

That IS great news. If we don't have a downtown comprised of mostly narrow streets then the way to take advantage of our oversized ones is to put a continuous center strip of trees and bike lanes. They will not only be beautiful but they should cater to bikes and walking/jogging. And you, it's things like this that make young people say "I could live here. "

Ha! Guess l'm not the only one then.

I guess l'm the persnickety type but l really don't like seeing the side wall of 668. Wished City Club was built up to the front wall of 668. Oh well.

This purchase by Bedrock is both exciting and perplexing. On the one hand a developer with the ability to put something meaningful on a very important blank piece of real estate has bought in. On the other hand said developer seems to have their hands full with the massive Tower City project. Perhaps they can walk and chew gum at the same time. l wonder about that. But does it make financial sense to pay 30 million for the site only to mothball it for a later date? And why would you pay that kind of money only to build something "underwhelming?" Logic seems to suggest something very large will be built sooner rather than later. Then again, does Bedrock have the ability to do that now along with Tower City? I think that's a big ask and that's why l say the whole thing is both exciting and perplexing.

Americans are just stupid. Clevburger got it right. We overthink and overregulate. Too many different agendas and way too many lawyers. In Europe they mix everything together and guess what? It works and leads to a way more vibrant and organic scene.

That makes some sense. Build a large garage now in preparation for the Ballpark Village then ultimately build some kind of tower later on the rest of the site. Gateway is going to need some kind of garage if the Village is built. Plus, wishful thinking, if Bedrock builds a garage now then the Village can concentrate on filling in the land with buildings and not worry about sticking a large garage in what is a smallish footprint.