brownsfan1226

Had to wait for the thread to unlock, but here's the Crains article about the construction delays/redos: Sherwin-Williams new HQ, R&D center face delays over protective coating https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-estate/sherwin-williams-hq-faces-delays-over-protective-coating

I also wonder if theoretically, Cleveland Cliffs Headquarters stays in Cleveland, and US Steel's stays in Pittsburgh. As others have stated, I'm hoping it's posturing as opposed to a complete abandonment of the Cleveland headquarters.

Yep. I did remember that, which could make an express route feasible. But from an infrastructure standpoint, downtown still seems to make far more sense when it comes to public transportation. And as others have said, it's not as if there isn't significant room for improvement to get downtown, yet alone BP.

Even if a closer rapid stop was added, which I agree should be happening, I struggle with how feasible it would be to cram Green, Blue, and Red Line riders into one red line train from Tower City, all while needing to pick up riders west of Tower City... at least as the routes are currently structured. Unless they were adding a whole bunch of cars to one train, there would almost have to be an "express" route from Tower City, and a "local" line for the existing west side Red Line stops. Not to mention the fact that people would almost certainly try parking at the current Brook Park station lot, creating a snarl there as well. Almost like the lines were made to start and end downtown, and not Brook Park. But I digress 🤣

Will the bridge require a steeper incline up and/or an onramp from W 3rd? Or will it essentially need to be rebuilt from W 3rd-westward to avoid that issue?

The lack of Red Line accessibility should be yet another non-starter for any plea for public subsidy. These flashy renderings and seemingly out-of-thin-air economic impact figures their study came up with have personally made me even more jaded about even a penny of public funds going towards this. If HSG wants this, they can pay for it.

Aer Lingus incentive deal in Cleveland may be extended, possibly for more Dublin flights https://www.cleveland.com/travel/2024/11/aer-lingus-incentive-deal-in-cleveland-may-be-extended-possibly-for-more-dublin-flights.html

One of my biggest takeaways from that report continues to be that a mixed use development would not only be completely out of place for this part of the county, but that it would also likely have a parasitic impact on the other mixed use developments in the region (plus downtown, obviously).

Plus, Brook Park and its airport proximity would make perfect sense for a relocated post office. I've also been hoping that this idea could somehow be revived.

Anyone know what the deal with the old Winking Lizard space is? While this addition seems like a nice addition to the area, the WL site continues to sit empty in a very prominent corner. Is it a layout and/or landlord/price issue?

Is the team and/or Brook Park still making an announcement or having any sort of press conference today?

Timing wise, the attempted Friday News Dump this was supposed to be seems absolutely bizarre to me. The Cavs just fully committed to Downtown Cleveland, the Guardians are in the ALCS and are upgrading an arguably already above average (and downtown) stadium even further, and the lakefront plans just took a large step forward. Meanwhile, you have a floundering football team that may end up being completely hamstrung by the salary cap for the next half decade, character issues on the personnel (I'll leave it at that), and an ownership group that seemingly negotiated in bad faith with Cleveland while frequently touting its success with Columbus...and one who has publicly requested over a billion dollars in a city/county that needs a new jail, courthouse, airport, and several other large scale projects. To me, I don't think public sentiment towards the team and ownership could be any lower. I'm very interested in what the funding proposals will be for this, including highway reconfigurations. A lot of unanswered questions right now.

I'm wondering if this is all just a (bad faith) effort by the Haslams to squeeze as many public dollars from all possible sources as they can, only to eventually privately fund a dome and/or accept a significantly smaller figure than $1.2B.

If there's presumably going to be a big hole in the ground where the stadium is, I also thought about an amphitheater, but where the actual stadium bowl currently sits.

Assuming it's more or less a done deal, I'm very interested to see how both the stadium and airport highway interchanges will be engineered. Will they be split? Or will there be game day/event traffic and airport traffic constantly butting heads? Also curious if any hotels will be accessible to the airport by enclosed walkway. Like the airport director indicated, I hope these types of logistics have been thought out, especially since the airport interchanges are already a total mess.

Greyhound and Barons Bus will move from downtown Cleveland to Brookpark Rapid Station https://www.cleveland.com/news/2024/08/greyhound-and-barons-bus-will-move-from-downtown-cleveland-to-brookpark-rapid-station.html Apologies for the paywall. I thought it was established that they were moving to the STJ Downtown Station.

I work across the street from it and saw some pickup trucks and staking equipment on the lot this week. I forgot to snap a picture, but will try the next time I'm on the office if they're still there next week. Haven't seen or heard anything beyond that unfortunately.

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2024/07/heres-why-reopening-the-lower-level-of-clevelands-detroit-superior-bridge-could-make-great-sensecommentary.html New design for Bridgeworks?

As others have indicated, the overall traffic makeup at CLE is completely different than the hub days. On an almost daily basis, anyone who has sat on 237 or has gotten stuck on the frankly absurd "entrance" to the airport....a traffic light for 3 separate lanes of traffic can attest that the current infrastructure was not designed for an airport with the amount of non-connecting, origin and destination traffic the CLE currently has. Add 70,000 stadium fans plus tailgaters who all would have to use the same 2 exits as the airport, I think the concerns are more than warranted. Would there even be time to address numerous highway interchanges by the end of this decade? My guess is no, unless planning has already been in the works.

Part of me wonders if the "forced" stay over may be part of their strategy to boost tourism too. My pipe dream continues to be splitting the LHR and DUB flights between PIT and CLE, where they alternate between the airports (CLE gets DUB the days PIT gets LHR, and vice versa) and the combination effectively serves each city daily.

My parents are running into that exact situation. They land in Dublin, but have to connect in Amsterdam to get to Prague via KLM. You would think they could push the CLE flight up a few hours for better connectivity. Perhaps they don't have the slots or gate space?

Definitely a game of chicken! My gut is actually leaning the other direction. I think that they're just seeing what they can squeeze out of every possible public source for either option ahead of ponying up their own cash. But since they do have deeper pockets as the result of selling Pilot/FlyingJ, I think that they'll end up going with whichever is the best possible combination of public financing and amenities, and then will fund the rest. I personally think the only way they stay in the current stadium is if the public financing is leaps and bounds better than whatever the Brook Park package becomes. I still hope a new build in Cleveland Proper becomes an option. We shall see though.

I think the article is implying that it would be a non-starter for the team to stay in the current stadium with this type of proposal. Meaning, if the city's renovation proposal to the Browns was a bare-bones, purely structural renovation proposal with none of the (still unknown) "enhancements", that the Haslam's would move full steam ahead with the Brook Park proposal. I'm not suggesting that that's the right thing to do, or even the feasible thing to do. I'm just saying that I agree with the article's implication that the discussions wouldn't go very far with this type of hypothetical "3rd" avenue.

The problem, as the article indicates, is that the bare bones renovation is a non-starter for the Browns: "Just one problem: According to the city, that’s a non-starter with the Browns. The stadium’s 30-year lease expires at the end of the 2028 season and the Browns have “expressed that a renewal is contingent on upgrades they feel are necessary to bring a fan experience that is on par with other teams in the NFL,” Sarah Johnson, the city’s chief communications officer, said in an email. “If the city of Cleveland does not make any upgrades, we can expect the tenant will not renew their lease and the stadium will need to either find a new long-term tenant or will remain empty following the duration of the current lease in 2028”". From a pure dollars perspective, this would obviously be the lowest cost option. But if it's a proposal that the Browns won't take, unfortunately it doesn't hold much weight.

Cleveland State's Waterfront Line Study Urges Apartments on the Muni Lot, New Loop Connections https://www.clevescene.com/news/cleveland-states-waterfront-line-study-urges-apartments-on-the-muni-lot-new-loop-connections-44408491?fbclid=IwY2xjawDFm0pleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHThiaGJBdNIJYmxj9fe4DnbGY9zBZPoCcVsT7eNUCGQpyMegsvvNLLjQvg_aem_AY9nNodxjZpPgmELbfdX_ZC0kNEm4TjWrQkJFinzMJW5HF4UcpfgF3jTfsBGR9yiXzXz1E0lO0gQo_2mG5jxHAt1 I wasn't exactly sure where to post this. Please feel free to move as needed.