edale

There is a lot more 'historic' stuff in Cincy than your list, and I'm glad that people take a more expansive and informed view on preservation. It might sound crazy to you that people would travel to take in a beautiful built environment, but that is literally the foundation of tourism in tons of the most iconic cities in the world. Who goes to SF and doesn't fall in love with the rowhouses and finely detailed Victorian architecture? If the same bars and restaurants that are found in the French Quarter were instead found in strip malls and ugly stucco boxes do you think NOLA would have the tourism and appeal that it does? Charleston and Savannah are both pretty sleepy places, but their built environments make them unique and worthy of tourism. Cincinnati's architecture and topography ARE unique, especially in the context of the Midwest. Other cities, save maybe St. Louis and mayyyybe Louisville, don't have anything even remotely approaching what Cincinnati has, and that's after we demolished so, so much. It boggles my mind that people really think the loss of historic buildings throughout the city is no big deal, as long as it's replaced by some cheap student housing and a Quiznos. I get that sometimes buildings have to go to make room for progress, and I'm not saying the city should be preserved in amber, but it's tiring to see the continued dismissal of the assets the city has. IMO, the architecture and topo of Cincy is what makes it unique and memorable among its midwest peers.

“Fundamental safety and quality of life issues hang in the balance for many thousands of people,” Sittenfeld wrote. “City Hall must prioritize those who live, work, and play here; the priority should never be to turn the streets of our urban neighborhoods into super-highways simply for the convenience of occasional visitors or those speeding through.” About exactly what you’d like to hear from an elected official, I think. You can see why the guy gets votes.

1215 Coffee and Wine bar on Vine and Coffee Emporium on Central Parkway and Walnut are also good places to grab coffee. Urbana Cafe in Pendleton would be another good spot.

This should be good for The Banks, I imagine. If we can't get another hotel down there (hello, remaining phase 1 office pad), this is probably the next best place for one. These buildings are also very visible to people coming and going to Reds games, and they have been vacant as long as I can remember. It will be nice for all those people going to games to be able to walk by a hotel rather than vacant buildings.

Yeah, it's definitely better than Compton, and it's actually going to gentrify really quickly with the new NFL stadium and the Crenshaw rail line that goes right through downtown Inglewood. I was just using it as a quick example of how ludicrous the housing situation is here, and relative to that, how amazingly affordable these beautiful, restored buildings are in the West End. I have to imagine there is a fair amount of property crime still in the WE, though, and I probably wouldn't feel great walking my dog around there after dark, but even still, what a steal.

Those first two on Dayton are absolutely stunning. If this area can ever experience a true revival, and I think it will, getting a building like that for 500k would be a total steal. Thinking about the homes in LA that get those price tags is utterly depressing. I could get this shack in Inglewood for the price of 929 Dayton: https://www.zillow.com/homes/for_sale/Inglewood-CA/pmf,pf_pt/20337666_zpid/45888_rid/globalrelevanceex_sort/33.988669,-118.302155,33.9179,-118.394423_rect/13_zm/

^ Interesting. Thanks for the explanation. I know the budget was very tight with this project from the beginning, but it seems like it would have been a wise investment to get it done right the first time. Mixed-vehicle transit is a dicey enough proposition, as it subjects trains to traffic, stop lights, and a greater number of potential blockages. Add in vehicles that weave across lanes at different locations along the route, and these issues become that much worse. Are there sewer mains under all of the north-south streets downtown? If this was a big issue, maybe it would have made more sense to route the streetcar on a street without these built in challenges.

^ Sounds like Main is a real hold up for buses and the streetcar, so I understand trying the bus-only lane on Main as opposed to Walnut. Is there a good reason for why the streetcar doesn't stay in the right lane on Main St? That has long been one of my primary frustrations with the design of the system. By zig-zagging across lanes, you lose the potential for a transit-only lane to have a meaningful impact on the streetcar. Very poor design there, though I'm sure there is probably some sort of explanation for why this occurs.

If a project needs subsidies to be viable, the city can absolutely shape it. If the project could be built without subsidy, and the developer wasn't requesting a zone change or variance, then yes, there wouldn't be much that could be done to stop it. "There is no question that the site will be more costly to develop than our typical site and will thus require some type of public-private partnership." Says it right in the announcement. I'm really surprised to see such defeatist outlooks here. This is not the only kind of retail Cleveland can draw. Just look at your in-state neighbors, and the success they have had at luring retail back to core neighborhoods. OTR 10 years ago was one of the worst, poorest, most crime riddled ghettos in the country. When the redevelopment there started, I don't think anyone imagined that one day chains like Warby Parker and Bonobos would be opening stores on Vine St. in less than a decade. Commercial storefronts were first filled with restaurants and small, local retail. These initial concepts proved successful, and momentum started to build. Chain retail is struggling, but the small store, interesting location driven retail seems to be picking up steam in urban locations. You're not going to magically convince Victoria Secret and Banana Republic to open stores downtown. Those days are probably in the past, outside of the most premier markets. But there are a lot of retailers that do look for urban neighborhoods, and locations that reinforce their brand. See Anthropologie opening in the Short North as a prime example. Claiming that you have to accept a presumable eye sore of an outlet mall on lakefront/downtown property because the city is down on its luck or whatever is really sad, and shows a total lack of vision. This will not be something that will lead more people to discover the charms of Cleveland's urban neighborhoods. People will drive in and drive out. Jobs will be created, yes, but that in itself is not a reason to support the project. A landfill also produces jobs. Should the city turn this property into one of those? How about a scrap yard? If this property is really not favorable to exciting development, why not pursue a light industrial user for this site? Warehouse jobs are booming all across the country right now, and many of those jobs not only pay better than retail, but they offer opportunities for people to get training and experience that they could use in careers for the rest of their lives. Part-time jobs at the Bath and Body Works outlet are not going to lift anyone out of poverty. I just think Cleveland could do a lot better than this proposal. Focusing on retail in actual neighborhood centers would be much more productive than chasing outlet malls and the like. Strong business districts support residential development by giving neighborhoods amenities and greater senses of place. This project will achieve none of that.

Mary Kuhl is a perpetual thorn in the side of Cincinnati. I wish she would just move to Green Twp. or something already. It seems like Westwood has largely been able to get around her lately, though, which is fortunate, because she really could poison just about any discussion. I was in a meeting once where she attended, and several other prominent Westwoodians finally told her off, and said that she doesn't speak for the whole community, but rather just her narrow interests/obsessions. It was amazing. She got so red in the face and ultimately stormed out of the meeting. Love the Kuhl Goul nickname lmao.

But...but...

Yeah, I get that you achieve more day time density with office workers than residents. I'm not against office being included in the redevelopment of OTR, but it seems like the great majority of new projects have been office related. The Strietman (sp?) building over by Music Hall is huge. Is it filling up? There is also the Empower Marketing HQ, 15th and Vine, the 3 buildings announced in this phase of redevelopment, etc. The neighborhood needs all types of uses to be vibrant at different parts of the day, but offices are empty at night and on weekends, and they require lots of off-street parking, and too much office space can create a sterile environment. With a large CBD with lots of vacancy and room for new development right next door, it just seems somewhat backwards to be pushing for office in OTR. We have a streetcar that was designed to link the CBD with OTR so they could work symbiotically. I think OTR is becoming more and more of a tourist destination, and I would love to see some hotels pop up in the neighborhood. I'd love to see an Ace hotel locate in OTR, but I don't know where they could locate that would allow for enough rooms to be built. With all the restaurants and bars, arts institutions, and residential structures, the groundwork is already laid for OTR to become an iconic historic district ala the French Quarter. You don't see a ton of office space in these types of places, but you do see hotels.

Anyone else feel like 3CDC is building a bit too much office these days? I know they want office workers to create day time vibrancy, but I feel like OTR first and foremost needs to be a residential neighborhood. I understand that companies find the small footprint, historic building thing attractive, but it just seems odd to put so much emphasis on office when the CBD is right next door. The Meiners building looks like it could have been converted to some very cool housing units.

Damn! Are there no more surface parking lots in downtown Nashville?

Not sure about that. We can still build Beaux Arts buildings and the like, but it's just very expensive to do so. Many of the cities in Europe essentially built exact replicas of old streetscapes that were destroyed in WWII. I think buildings like the Terrace Plaza are more significant for being exemplary of a particular style or a pioneer of a style, rather than their aesthetic value or special materials or design that would make it impossible to construct today. It's the history of the building, and the way that it reflects early modernism that's important here. Outside of challenging retrofits, modernism has pretty squarely moved into desirable territory for many Americans. Be in Mad Men's influence, or simply just becoming old enough to become cool again, it seems the general public loves Mid Century Modern design and architecture. The next big preservation debate in this country is going to come from brutalism and post modernism. With styles that hold less obvious aesthetic value, it's a harder sell to preserve something just because it's a fine representation of a past style.

That's a dumb take. The brick facade of the lower portion of the building is an important characteristic of its modernist design. Now, you can say that the needs of modern users are incompatible with the original design, and therefore, some sort of compromise will have to be made between preservationists and those looking to see the building reactivated.

I'm a bit torn on this one. On the one hand, the windowless mass is kind of the whole point of this building, and it is widely regarded as a modernist masterpiece. On the other hand, the base of the building is basically unusable in its current form, and the building has sat vacant for years, at great cost to downtown. Unless and innovative solution can be found, I favor altering the building if it means reactivating the site. I do wonder about the plausibility of converting the base to parking, as that seems to be in perpetual need, and there is no need for daylight in a garage. I also wonder about the viability of Anderson Birkla to complete this project. They were the development team in charge of converting the 580 building to apartments, and that has been the slowest moving project ever. Seeing how the Terrace Plaza is a much more complicated project, do these guys really have the chops?

^ ok, now you’re being ridiculous. I gave you the benefit of the doubt!

^ I didn't get that vibe from the post. If anything, it just sounded a little cranky/NIMBYish to me. A non-OTR resident said he wants to see a bar on the first floor of a development, while a resident of the neighborhood replies with "not everyone wants to live above a bar." Seems like a pretty normal exchange. Visitors and residents of urban neighborhoods often have different priorities.

How is it controversial to say that not everyone likes living above bars or restaurants? I enjoy living in urban environments, but I also enjoy peace and quiet at home. I would not want to live right on Vine or someplace like that. I do love unexpected retail outlets, like the ones on Republic that jimicha listed. There is a difference between not wanting to live above a bar, and not wanting mixed use development. The latter is puzzling in a neighborhood like OTR, where there is no true business district, and most of the main streets function as mixed use corridors. I love the feel of Logan St., at least on streetview. I like how the Boys and Girls club building helps to insulate the neighborhood to the east from Central Parkway. I hope whatever replaces the building is able to retain this feeling. I also don't think this area needs to have bars and restaurants, as it's close to Findlay Market and all the restaurants in and around it. Something low-key would be nice. I love stuff like this in Boston: https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3588145,-71.0698467,3a,75y,225.83h,88.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1svJV3NP1-2nE2Q22rphEacQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

^ 4 year contract with the Lakers. If GS ceases to be the Monstars after next season, who knows what direction the league will head. Philly went from comically bad to contending for the East in just a few seasons. The Cavs were complete shit for a couple seasons before Lebron came back and took them to the finals 4 years in a row. Who can say.

The Golden State run will come to an end in the next couple years. It's hard to say what the future holds after that team splits up.

^ I've had fun at Nats games, but even those have felt like a giant corporate function or something haha. I absolutely love DC's architecture and neighborhoods, and some of my best friends live there, so I'm not trying to hate on DC!

The whole fan club aspect of MLS seems incredibly weird to me. Rival fan clubs of the same team is just stupid. That whole article about the opening of stadium in DC was pretty lame. People complaining about wifi availability and which fan club gets preferential treatment from the team just sounds so...nerdy? Maybe it's a DC thing more than soccer, though. In my experience, DC has the most boring, white bread, square population of any major city I've spent time in.

If it gets suburbanites to vote for the levy, I'm fine with it. It's not like there aren't huge road related infrastructure projects that are desperately needed, too.