jonoh81

The arguments about height and density are always the same hysterics regardless of the neighborhood. The problem is not that these views exist, but that commissions are either fully comprised of these people now, or they allow that vocal minority to dictate a neighborhood's entire development future. So far, virtually no one has been willing to take a stand and push back against the angry mob and tell them flat out when they're being absolutely unreasonable and ridiculous. If commissions won't reign them in, then the answer is that commissions should just not have the kind of power that they have now. I agree with others that their primary focus should be on things like aesthetics and leave density/height to the city. These people are actively holding the city back and making it more expensive for all.

https://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2020/07/24/ibew-development.html 'This, sir, is intolerable': Impasse continues over Kaufman Development's plans for IBEW site in the Short North Who believes this gets built?

It would look much better if the original brick was just exposed rather than painted again.

It's a bad project for the most part when it had every opportunity to be better.

Great news- certainly better than the 12-story hotel they were originally talking about for this site- but please, please, please do not let this be another fake-out like Millennial or aspirational height that ends up getting reduced with every future rendering.

I'm not sure you can really say that when the main suburbs are largely independent cities. There are 15 main suburbs within Franklin County. I believe only 4 of them are actually landlocked by Columbus- Grandview, Bexley, Worthington and Whitehall. Upper Arlington is not quite landlocked by Columbus boundaries, as there is township land between it and Hilliard on the western side. There are also several small independent places likes Riverlea and Minerva Park, but only a few of them are also landlocked. Suburban areas within the city limits are a little more subjective. Is Clintonville a suburb or just a Columbus neighborhood? Linden? Hilltop? I'm not sure that would be any different than neighborhoods in other cities.

You're right, I think I am mixing up the numbers. In 2010, Franklin County was just under 61.2% of the metro population versus just over 62% in 2019. Columbus was 67.6% of Franklin County in 2010 versus just over 68% in 2019. Cleveland, meanwhile, was about 31% of Cuyahoga County in 2010 and about 30.8% of the county in 2019. Cuyahoga was 61.6% of the metro in 2010 and about 60.3% in 2019. The county-to-metro populations are similar, but heading in opposite directions. So yeah, Columbus would still be the most compact in terms of where the population- and therefore the development- actually is. Columbus will pass Cleveland's density potentially within the next decade or so. The county densities are not as different as you make them out to be- 2706 vs 2475, and Franklin County will also eventually pass Cuyahoga's. Sprawl in Delaware County may be greater than in some other areas, but it still accounts for relatively little of the metro's growth. The city of Columbus added almost as many people by itself the last 10 years as all of Delaware County has in the last 30. Walkability is not directly related to density. Density is only the measure of the number of people divided by the area size. It doesn't address concepts like walkability or transit access or building type or height. Dense areas are more likely to be walkable, but not necessarily.

I'm not necessarily talking about area size. It's more about the amount of existing development considered low-density or "exurban" in nature.

I would suggest that had the Cleveland area’s population declined from its original population, but did not expand from that original size, it would now be in a vastly better position to revitalize itself.

Columbus is arguably the most compact metro in Ohio. More than 70% of its population resides in Franklin County, with more than 50% of that within Columbus itself. Its urbanized area also has the highest density in Ohio. There are at least 2 Ohio metros that have more of its srea development being low-density sprawl- Dayton and Cincinnati. No Ohio city sprawls like those in the Sun Belt, though.

If the site plan for 1778 High goes back to Pearl Alley, it'd be fairly easy to build a 7-story without demolition of the historic building. Most of the site is a 2-story modern addition that could be replaced while maintaining and incorporating the original structure just like the modern addition already does. It would be a lot like the Pavey Project in that aspect. Really no reason to tear it down, even with a parking deck if it can be built on the lower floor/s of the main building, but it seems the university area planners are determined to eliminate all buildings built before 2005.

The economic consequences are just beginning, especially with the virus still raging. Not all of the regained jobs are going to stick around if the economy wallows in the uncertainty of the virus and other issues. People stopped going out back February and early March before any restrictions even existed, and they've not fully returned to normal behavior even without them. It remains to be seen what the long-term consequences of all this are, but it's far, far too early to be thinking this was a few-month blip.

Not a fan of the design at all. There were like 30 previous designs for the site that were better. That said, at least something's going there.

What's that from? The numbers don't match the Census at all.

The fact is the economic collapse is going to have some collateral damage in terms of projects. I don't think North Market gets cancelled, but I wouldn't bet against further size reductions.

It's kind of funny how even though Columbus is growing quickly, it would still take it almost 145 years to reach Chicago's population right now.

I would argue that if you're someone sitting in a Hong Kong office ready to pump millions or billions into a foreign country/city, you're going to do your homework on where the best places to do that would be. Simply having more historic name recognition doesn't really pass the smell test as the single most important criteria a multi-national company would look at. If it did, Cleveland has LONG had more name recognition than Columbus, probably even now with Columbus passing Cleveland's MSA. It hasn't seemed to matter most of the last half century, though, in terms of trajectory. A company like Amazon would probably not care that Cleveland's MSA boundaries increased. It would care about the economic climate, distribution chains, the ability to attract talent, amenities, etc.

The Cleveland and Cincinnati cities and MSAs were larger than Columbus for most of the past 200 years. In any case, unless Cleveland and Akron meet the MSA guidelines, it's not going to happen regardless of who wants it. Even if they were added, I'm not sure how it helps attract people. It's not organic growth through attraction domestically or internationally. It's just incorporating more existing area. It might help with federal dollar allocation, but what else really changes? It would be 1 year of big growth followed immediately by the typical out-migration that's been the case for the past 60 years because none of the problems that cause out migration in the first place would be fixed. This would essentially be a temporary ego booster to claim to be the biggest, but otherwise meaningless. Chicago is the biggest city and metro in the Midwest. It is not anywhere close to the fastest growing, nor has it prevented other cities in the region from growing.

Morrow has been around a while. Perry and Hocking were the new metro counties in 2010. CSAs, IMO, are functionally worthless and they only seem to be useful in gauging the size of a local media market. Just as metro counties share a 25% threshold commuting pattern with the core county, CSAs are formed by using that measurement to add MSA/MISAs together into a CSA. CSA counties don't have to share much, if any, direct commuting with the core county, and that makes them, at least for me, a lot less relevant in determining the pull of the core county. I once lived in Logan County. Columbus might as well have been 1000 miles away. People didn't commute to work there, but many did commute to Honda in Marysville, which IS in the Columbus metro. Bottom line- MSA counties are strongly attached to the core. CSA counties are strongly attached to the metro, but not the core.

Actually, it seems to be a very bad way to do it considering the boundaries have changed relatively little over the last 50 years or so. Metros also lose counties, so it doesn't just go one way. I also misspoke when I said it was a 25% exchange with the metro in general. I believe it's a 25% exchange with the core metro county.

I assume Hocking is in the Columbus metro because there is at least a 25% commuting exchange between it and the rest of the metro. Lancaster is also in a metro county.

They've been forced to update their projections a few times over the past several years, so that could explain various discrepancies. Honestly, I just stick with the Census numbers. and don't really get into the projection side of things.

https://www.morpc.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/FINALDRAFT_2018PopEstMethod.pdf Here is what they use as methodology. They do not just assume similar growth projected out. I am the one who used that hypothetical. They use housing units, birth-death records, etc. For the record, here are the MORPC 2019 population estimates for the 15 counties (which came out in 2018) versus the 2019 Census estimates which came out last month. MORPC vs. Census Franklin: 1,318,164- 1,316,756 Delaware: 208,067- 209,177 Licking: 175,755- 176,862 Fairfield: 157,799- 157,574 Ross: 78,528- 76,666 Marion: 64,245- 65,093 Knox: 61,669- 62,322 Union: 58,285- 58,988 Pickaway: 58,339- 58,457 Logan: 45,751- 45,672 Madison: 44,609- 44,731 Perry: 36,172- 36,134 Morrow: 34,969- 35,328 Fayette: 28,582- 28,525 Hocking: 28,586- 28,264 Total: 2,399,520- 2,400,549 MORPC estimates were 1,029 too low overall, for an average difference of -68.6. I'd call that very close, which is more evidence that their numbers are pretty solid, at least in near-future predictions.

They're not calling those places part of Columbus, they're calling them part of Central Ohio for regional planning purposes. That description is obviously debatable, but MORPC is not actually saying they are part of the metro or even CSA. Morrow County is part of the metro. Franklin County alone adds more people per year than the entire CSA combined. So does Columbus all by itself. Whether most of those counties end up losing population seems irrelevant, as it will not affect official metro or CSA numbers. Population projections are notoriously bad, either too low or too high. The Census projected Ohio to stagnate and even decline by now. It hasn't, and actually has a higher estimated population now than the census projected it would have in 2030. The point is, no one should be taking long-term projections as gospel. They're going to be wrong one way or another.

The regular metro would be at roughly 2.72 million in 2050 if similar growth rates were achieved similar to the past 20 years. Obviously, we can't assume that will happen, but the projections are not based on nothing. To your point about natural growth, Columbus' average annual natural growth has been increasing every decade since the 1980s. This decade has been no different.