Vulpster03

^ I'm clearly talking about Issue 5 (the smoking ban), which won 58% of the votes.

^ hey, I never said that I didn't encounter people thrilled with the ban, but I sense that there are enough people who could have made the issue passage even closer if they had known all the details and/or voted based on other considerations beside if they personally smoke or not.

Just checked out the current lease plan and it was interesting. A lot of changes since last time I checked it out.

I've heard this statement many times now. Why would you vote for something if you didn't know what you were voting for??? The text of the issue was available to read for a while before election day and the language was on the ballot. Do people not even bother to read? It's disturbing. I believe not every detail was included on the ballot. I don't remember reading or knowing anything about all the stipulations for tobacco shops on election day.

I am encountering more and more people who wish they hadn't voted for issue 5, because they didn't realize how strict it was. A lot of people for instance didn't realize that hookah bars would be included, or what a "private club" was considered under the ban. Private clubs have to be nonprofit, and all employees have to be members of the club. A lot of clubs were under the impression that they would be exempted from the ban like vetrans lodges, but apparently thats not the case. Also, the stipulations regarding tobacco shops is completely ridiculous. 80% of revenue has to come from tobacco in order to allow smoking, which is higher than the stipulation under the Columbus ban as well as other cities. I don't have the facts for certain, but I believe 80% is a higher requirement than New York and California, based on my observations when traveling there. Another ridiculous stipulation of the ban is that existing tobacco shops cannot expand their space if they are not a free standing building, and any new shops must be free standing; what a way to hinder small business development in higher density areas if you ask me. It will also be interesting to see what happens when the weather warms up and people start to use outdoor patios, because i have a feeling there will be a lot of confusion about allowing smoking there. I feel like there will be a lot of debate because of the proximity to entrances and servers (employees) providing table service. A lot of places for instance open up the inside completely to the outside patios, and I think the anti-smoking contigent will protest permitting smoking on a lot of patios. And in my opinion, there honestly wasn't enough talk about "rights" in the deliberation prior to the election; rights of business owners, rights of individuals. From a background in political theory, I find it dangerous to formaly institute "health" upon the general public for one. And dangerous to attempt to remove people and their lifestyle from public presence for second. The ban also undermines culture. Hookahs are certainly a cultural practice for one, and smoking cigarettes is also a cultural practice. Smoking is a more regular practice in rural areas or certain neighborhoods in urban areas and indeed part of the culture. Smoking culture is not uniform throughout the state, and this law undermines it. And we all know there is huge confusion/controversy over enforcement, which is public administration nightmare. Honestly, I think that the stricter Smoke Free Ohio and its supporters push for interpretation and enforcement of issue 5, the public will advocate its repeal. Only 58% supported issue 5 in November. I guess we'll see what happens in June.

FYI - Avon is putting in a newer and more elaborate park and ride with bus shelters at Rt. 83 just south of the tracks.

I'm still smoking in bars. No one has told me not to.

I'm still smoking in Oxford bars. The owners don't care.

I don't want to read this thread anymore. It upsets me too much.

Wait a minute... I always thought the day the smoking ban would go in effect was January 1.

I generally think its helpful to spend one day downtown to see the sights (Tower City, Arcade, Civic Center, Rock Hall), afternoon in Ohio City, and a night on W.6th and/or E.4th Street. The other day should be devoted to University Circle, afternoon in Little Italy, and a night in Cleveland Heights or Shaker Square.

Alright, a new Ohio band has renewed my interest in hip hop. they play to packed crowds now and are gaining a strong following; Soundscape. Lots of jazz influences. One of my friends is in the band. Check out sample tracks on these sites: http://www.myspace.com/soundscape http://www.soundscape-music.net/

One of my favorite places to light up was in the lobby of the Renaissance Hotel downtown Cleveland on the plush couches near the fountain under the chandeliers. It went smoke free only a year ago. The end of era. Europe is going smoke free now as well - something I thought would never happen. I've come to the realization that they're political culture when it comes to things like smoking isn't really that much different than the United States. Less and less people are smoking in Europe and there are pushes for bans, restrictions, etc. It is only that they are about 10 years behind the U.S. in terms of smoking culture. I remember being 18, and arriving in the Madrid Airport. People just lit up as soon as they got off the plane, so I did as well and walked around everywhere with a cigarette. I don't know about the Madrid airport now, but last fall semester I was in Europe and didn't experience anything like that to the same degree. Brussels and Vienna airports have designated smoking areas, train stations are all smoke free, and many trains now are smoke free. Switzerland, Germany, and Austria seem to be the most reluctant to adobt smoking bans, and I think it has something to do with the post world II culture. Even France and Italy are going smoke free.

I think most workplaces have been smoke free, but I know quite a few business/offices that had a smoke room for employees up until just ten years ago. Heck, it wasn't that long ago that you could smoke on airplanes. People seem to easily forget how it use to be.

true. i got a little discount being a student, but the exhibit is twice the size as normal special exhibits.

Barcelona and Modernity exhibition at CMA. don't forget about that. I've already seen it once, and I plan on seeing it again.

I just don't think sexuality is a black or white issue. There has to be a lot of grey, and I don't think people should be necessarily forced into either category; gay or straight. Most scientific studies indicate that the majority of the population is bisexual to some degree.

The Cleveland Library has a long history of progressivism as well. It was the first library to allow patrons to browse the shelves on their own. And it is the first to lend MP3 audio books (on playaway devices). But yeah, the library really is awesome. It is also one of the few public library branches that have "research" library status. The building on the right is the library. Bottom building is a Federal Building, Top building is the board of education building.

I find this statement offensive

Is it likely this would this route be assumed under RTA operation, or would another organization or company be in charge of operation?

woah woah woah, keep me unassociated with that right wing fascist. You know nothing about my political thinking.

I hope church property would be exempt too. I know that at St. Edward, they always let the ladies smoke in the cafeteria during bingo nights.

huh, interesting and odd. thanks for that wording.

So I know that even in places that have passed such smoking ban measures, that some places seem to get around the law legally. I wonder what the exemptions included in issue 5 will yield? For instance in New York, Club Macenudo immediately charges patrons for a cigar - and then they are free to eat, drink, smoke cigarettes if they want to. http://www.clubmacanudo.com/. I also remember in San Diego's Gas Lamp Quarter encountering a number of coffee shops/tobacco stores that permitted smoking. "Exempt from the smoking restrictions certain locations, including private residences (except during the hours that the residence operates as a place of business involving non-residents of the private residence), designated smoking rooms in hotels, motels, and other lodging facilities; designated smoking areas for nursing home residents; retail tobacco stores, outdoor patios, private clubs, and family-owned and operated places of business" I'm most interested in what was meant and intended for about "family-owned and operated places of business". It seems that a lot of smaller bars are family owned and operated. Would they be exempt?

Speaking of smoking in cars, I have a feeling thats next.