Vulpster03

I will defend Crocker Park here, but I think I do so for good reasons. First of all I think people need to understand that a semi-upscale shopping center on the West Side was simply inevitable. The population is growing and the market is pretty much there. Stark's plan for a shopping center on the West Side was a lot better than the other option that was on the table; Dick Jacob's plan to build a sprawling shopping "mall" in Avon (which is outside of Cuyahoga County). Assuming the inevitablity of a semi-upscale shopping center on the West Side - the fact that Crocker Park includes residential, office, public transit, and civic functions with a medium density and parking garages is pretty impressive. It has also been fairly sensitive to its surroundings with the incorporation of the Promenade, Crocker Rd. streetscape and pedestrian improvements, extension of Crocker Park Blvd., Union St., and Market St., across Crocker Road into land for other developers to build. BTW, the Sierra Club did endorss this as a good development.

I'm not an architecture expert, but I've browsed Bialowsky's projects on the web and some of them seem a lot better than others. I think we have to keep in mind that even though Crocker Park architecturally speaking might look awkward to serious architecture enthusiasts - it actually fits the architecture quite well being propogated throughout Westlake, which is a lot of traditional revivalism we are seeing in a lot of applied postmodernist structures. In my opinion it does create an appropriate "downtown" there - at least stylisticly. I don't think Crocker Park's design is over-the-top phony like Legacy Village, or something out of Vegas or Disney World.

That is certainly an interesting idea, however I'm having trouble imagining what the water in that vast "inner-harbor" would look like. I'm not one of those Cuyahoga River bashers, but creating a whole inner-harbor with that water might be a little sketchy to put there.

The whole convention center thing seems to be stalled or dying, but the two sites remaining for consideration are a riverfront site attached to Tower City, and the existing site on the Mall that would include renovation/expansion (possibly over the railroad tracks to the lakefront). A convention facilities authority was created to do the studies and make decisions. http://www.conventioncleveland.com/

Don't forget the Little Bar

Thanks for the link. Isn't there some developer planning residential units on the riverfront areas of the Peninsula? I remember hearing about that not too long ago, but I forget the details.

I don't think you can deny that Crocker Park is a pretty intelligent development for a city like Westlake, but when then do things like this it certainly does border on the absurd. Did you know they are putting croquet lawns in the residential phase being designed by Coral Co.?

I was disappointed that plan is no longer available to view on Calthorpe's website. I look at the Peninsula everyday at work through the window at my desk, and it just pisses me off to no end. It would be awesome to build a new mixed-use neighborhood there on the river. If there is any demand for urban housing in the heart of the city - then any units there would fly off the shelves. Assuming some pedestrian infrastructure linkages to Tower City, Ohio City, and Tremont - that would be exactly the urban neighborhood I'd like to live in Cleveland.

I thought this was an interesting case of neighborhood amenities moving within communities to serve new residents rather than established ones... ridiculous. First of all - most of the new residents off Walker Road have private neighborhood pools. Westwinds, Legacy Pointe, Landings, and Waterside Crossings all have their own pools and serve A LOT of people that make up the newer and growing "Walker Road" population. Second of all - there is no reason to toss the old pool. I was just there yesterday in fact. It is a really nice pool - and one of the largest public pools in the area by the way. The current pool is located in a pretty nice established park area with baseball diamonds, tennis courts, basketball courts, volleyball, a and a large playground across from a lakefront park. New aquatic center idea floated Thursday, July 06, 2006 By Kim Guffey The Sun AVON LAKE _ After 44 years of service, the city pool soon may be put out to pasture. The city's parks and recreation commission recommended the city install a $3 million aquatic area on Walker Road to replace the aging city pool on Electric Boulevard. The suggestion came after the commission reviewed a 12-week feasibility study conducted by Brandsetter Carol Zofcin, Inc. City Council's finance committee will discuss funding options for the new facility, which could include asking voters for bond approval, said Councilman Martin O'Donnell.

Here is another little odd novelty they've added to Crocker Park. They have actually added carriage rides. I was extremely skeptical about this succeeding, because the route through Crocker Park isn't that long to merrit a carriage ride in my opinion - but people are using it quite frequently. Not only is it being used frequently, but occasionaly there are lines of people waiting.

I sense jealousy in this reaction.

There are opportunities for street level retail vacancies on Public Square right now that would be a good place to start: The May Company Building - obviously The street level retail space of the Renaissance Hotel building Numerous space available on Ontario St. The possiblitly of altering the BP Atrium. The parking lot on Public Square. I do agree that the quadrants are in a state of disconnect that should be adressed. To connect them I'd like to see the outer edges connected with a unified walkway similar to that of the pedestrian portion of Las Ramblas in Barcelona. The walkway would be set in from the street a little with a tree-lined buffer, and have benches, permenant tables and seating, and vendor stands.

In a starring role, our fair city is poised to get oohs and ahhs Sunday, July 09, 2006 Julie E. Washington Plain Dealer

The websites for the Warehouse District and Gateway neighborhoods are also terrible.

The theory I have developed regarding Public Square or any "public square" for that matter is that it doesn't really matter too much what is inside the square, rather than what is around its perimeter. First of all - you take any famous town Square in Europe and you will find that it is essentially just a large flat paved (or rather cobblestone) surface. There is hardly any landscaping, greenspace, amphitheaters, decoration, signage, etc. What makes European squares so great and vibrant are the buildings and pedestrian activity around the perimeter. Brussel's Grand Platz, Madrid's Plaza Mayor, or San Marco's in Venice are just a few examples that come to mind. Second of all - permanently closing a square off from automobile traffic doesn't exactly make it more vibrant. There are instances where squares open to traffic do just fine. People don't seem to avoid Times Square just because automobile traffic cuts through it. I'm not opposed to making some of the proposed changes to Public Square, but some of the arguements for these changes I find flawed. You won't get people to just go hang around in Public Square by making all these changes. When the surrounding buildings and adjacent districts to Public Square improve; so will use and enjoyment of Public Square. By the way, the shutting down of Ontario avenue in Public Square today revealed such a traffic calamity that it was ever permanently closed, then I doubt it could be tolerated on a year-round basis.

Packs of cigarettes in Cuyahoga County are already about 90 cents greater than Lorain County.

I think these taxes on cigarettes are some kind of evil. It is a shame the government is exploiting addicted smokers. It would be one thing if this tax revenue was directed at tobacco prevention programs in schools, anti-smoking campaigns, etc., but to put the burden of funding philanthropic projects that benefit the entire public on smokers alone seems morally repugnant. Very twisted public policy.

The Grand Prix and Air Show are also reasons not to be so quick and build over Burke. I think it is kind of cool and unique to be able to have events like that right downtown and on the lake.

Flights to Frankfurt would be the best next best direct service after London. It is a great location and major rail hub (and a really cool station too).

I thought there was a thread with discussion about new international flights recently. I don't think I found it. But I have a tip that the two new direct service flights are being planned for Cleveland to Amsterdam, and Cleveland to Paris.

I've noticed that a lot of developers in the suburbs are increasingly disregarding trees. At least in the developments i've seen that were built in the 1980s and before - the builders would save a great deal of trees from the virgin forest that was there. There are a lot of developments in virgin forest land that are cutting down virtually all the trees except for what they call a "greenspace buffer" in the last few yards of the rear of the lot. In Avon Lake this has been a huge problem in new developments. Developers give a bunch of reasons why, but it is obviously about saving costs. It is a lot easier for them to level a lot for construction when there are no trees.

I'm not a huge advocate of closing Burke all together - at least at this point. Stark's "pescht" plans for the area north of the East Bank and west of the Brown's stadium seem much more like an area to tackle first to create a new neighborhood. But the block directly east of the Rock Hall is WAY underused and if there is one site in the city that could be an extremely profitable "tourist-oriented" development - this would certainly be it. A mixed-use development with a hotel, restaurants, clubs, and a little retail with lake, skyline, and Rock Hall views would draw a ton of people. I'm glad that Jackson is making press about the issue, but to me it sounds like the same plans/steps were taken by Brown during the Campbell administration for the lakefront. Until they get a developer signed on, I don't see how this article indicates any progress- other than Jackson endorssing "Campbell's" plan.

Did anyone else listen to the tour yet?

I'm not an authority on Forest City's original plans, but I think that was the plan for the Scranton Peninsula.

Fantastic news! I do believe this will be highly transformative. In regards to Tower City; I just don't know if the timing and consumer trends were right when it was installed in 1990. Of course there wasn't much of a residential base then, but I don't know if people really had much interest in living "downtown" anywhere in 1990 - at least not like today. To me it seems like a lot more people in a lot of cities want to go back to into the city to shop, dine, live, work, etc. I know a lot of people in my generation feel this way more so than the baby boomers. I also think the opinion growing in a lot of people is that since suburbs keep sprawling they tend to go out of fashion as new ones pop up; downtowns look a lot less speculative nowadays - especially if they are done well and made to be attractive. And you have to consider that in 1990 there was no Rock Hall, no Gateway, and not nearly as many hotels downtown for some reason. What about that decrepid parking deck at the corner of W.6th and Superior? Is that land controlled by Stark now?