KTM

cle2032-- Thanks. I looked up you mom's house. After what you wrote, I'm almost embarrassed to tell you that your mom's house is exactly what we are looking for. Although I do see it's very close to I-71. I am going to check it out during my next days off. We are scheduled to look at a house on Ken Dr. as well so we will be in the neighborhood.

I didn't think a fella like you would serve this country. And for the awkward pass at me, no thanks.

Well, here is my reasoning. Between my wife and I, we have given the City of Cleveland more than it's chance. We have lived in Payne/Superior neighborhood, Slavic Village, Collinwood, and now 3 different houses in the Old Brooklyn area. This is over a span of 40 years. I have never lived on the far west side to be fair. I have seen EVERY neighborhood I've lived in (again, lived in, not heard about) go down hill. My neighborhood now is on the verge---- I know this from experience. I've had enough. I, nor my wife, has ever been robbed. I have had numerous car break ins, twice my cars were nearly to be stolen, 2 motorcycles were stolen, one car was shot through the side, one car had a window shot out, my garage was vandalized (to say the least), I clean trash from my tree lawn almost daily,,,, and I pay to live hear---- not like the section 8 neighbors who live a few houses down. These complaints are just from my last 2 houses. I will leave the other neighborhoods out. I can't send my kids to public school. I now pay $11,000 a year just for their education. And to MyTwoSense: Thanks to the number for Uhaul, but I already have my own box truck. But, keep the number for yourself for the day you wake up and pull your head out of your 4th point of contact (I'm sure you weren't in the military, so ask someone, other than me, who served this country proudly what your 4th point of contact is). All of the other cities are still open for my family. My point regarding Brunstucky is I want to hear the faults of cities. An agent will not tell the truth. But, those are complaints that are far less than I have right now. So thanks to cle2032 for posting them.

cle2032--- Even with all of your complaints regarding Brunswick, it would only take me about,,,,, oh,,,,, 1 second to switch my Cleveland house for your mom's Brunswick house.... I would love to only complain about such trivial things..... I failed to hear you complain about shootings, robberies, car theft, the lovely section 8 neighbors, a pathetic school system, litter almost everywhere, pollution, stripped houses,,,, I'm going to stop. As a matter of fact, we have been looking to buy in Brunswick. If your mom's house has 3+ bdrms, 2+ baths, and a full basement, I would love to check it out. Who knows, maybe both of us will get what we want.

As I understand it, a judge in Summit County ruled against the city of Akron, ruled in favor of the workers regarding the unconstitutionality of residency requirements.

^^^^ It's nice to give those options, but some may not be disciplined enough (and they will be the first to admit it) to follow through. To some, paying a little extra in taxes per paycheck ensures you will 1) not owe at the end of the year and 2) may have some cash for home improvements, vacation, tuition, or whatever. To each his own!!

I checked with a couple friends and they both said 1 member of CFD and 2 members of CPD have moved out of the city, advised the city with a Change of Address Form, and all 3 are still on the city payroll. I can't verify this because I do not know those 3 individuals, it's just what I was told. If this is true, they just may be able to start packing the U-hauls.

I will say it may be difficult to find individuals who say they have never felt a form of racism. Significant or not. At least around Cleveland. From a purely legal stand point, it is against the law to discriminate based on gender and also any ethnic background. With one exception. Of all of the combinations one can construe, the only combination where it is legal to discriminate against is that of a white male. This is the only individual who can legally be passed on an acceptance and/or hiring, based solely on gender and race, in order to give the position to any other combination of race/gender. Not only is this form of discrimination legal, it is encouraged. If this form of discrimination is not enacted, the employer is called "racist." How ironic. An employer/institution is "racist" for NOT hiring based on skin color.

I will have to check out Bruno in "Black White" on FX. Never heard of the show nor the character. I'll tell you if you are right. I agree that we look at things from different perspectives. The "right of entitlement" and the "black tax",,, I don't agree. We CAN agree to disagree.

WOW MyTwoSense... You may be the 1st person I ever heard of to look at Cleveland through those glasses. I think it is the exact opposite. Cleveland boasts the following: The African American Museum, The African Descent Foundation, Minority Contractors Assistance Program, Minority Training Centers (multiple), Minority Recruitment for the Cleveland Police, Minority Recruitment for Cleveland Fire, Black associations in both the Police and Fire Departments, Black on Black Crime, down payment assistance in certain neighborhoods, FREE $20,000 second mortgages in certain neighborhoods, renamed Liberty Blvd (honored thousands of WWII veterans) Martin Luther King Jr. Blvd, give more points on civil service tests to residents than to anything else (i.e. military, college, etc.), require certain number of minorities to be given city contracts (i.e. costruction projects etc.), have more blacks on City Council than any other race, has a black mayor, created a Black Liaison Officer when there was a white mayor (Campbell), the Black Pages (so one can patronize black owned businesses). And this is only what I can think of. I'm sure if I looked into it, I would find alot more. I do agree that Cleveland is racially divided. How to fix that, I don't know. But unwelcoming to people of color? You've got to be kidding. Cleveland is unwelcoming to the middle class-- no matter what the race..

Are you are asking me (KTM) this question? If so, I'm not sure why. I live in Cleveland so I am well aware that blacks are the majority in Cleveland.

I could not agree with you more.

You should probably check out WET.com's study as I doubt that BET.com was focusing on the caucasians. Come on...... Everyone knows in this politically correct country whites are the only race that are "racist" if they have anything that promotes Caucasians. I'm sure you were being facetious.

If Cleveland is "the worst" for blacks, how bad is it for the other races in Cleveland? They have to contend with most of the same issues, AND are in the minority.

And what are you trying to convey here? Yes, nationwide the prison system is filled with African Americans, yet we make up 12% of the population. What does that tell you? Does that mean that we are violent by nature, or does that tell you something different? I'm not going to comment on your remarks here, however if you are ignorant to the reasons why African Americans make up a large percentage of the United States prison system, and truthfully want to know why, I will gladly inform you. I agree this is not the place for this discussion. I am sure I know what you will say the reason why blacks make up a larger % of the prison population. I for one do not believe that answer. If the answer is something other than what the liberal media conveys, please school me. I would like to use you for an example. You are black, young, male, wear baggy cloths, listen to hip hop, yet have no criminal record. Why were you "spared?" I would guess it's because your nose was/is in your books (obvious to me by your soon to be degree) and/or work instead of being idle and doing the wrong thing. I'm done here because It's off the subject.

Oldmanladyluck-- I too would be troubled if in the presence of a KKK member, and I am white. But realistically, who has ever seen a KKK member in person?... And not on the Gerry Springer Show. Most everyone has seen groups of the "biker" looking whites. My point is this: Just because someone feels anxious around a certain group of individuals, it does not mean they have a "misconseption." If a person from the farm land in Nebraska (and I only use Nebraska because I am under the impression it is vastly Caucasian) gets nervous when he/she encounters a group of blacks, well then I see your point. The folks in Euclid, or surrounding areas of Cleveland are not ignorant... By "ignorant" I mean: IGNORANT (ig'ner ent) adj. Lacking awareness; Uninformed; Inexperienced. Sometimes life experiences teach when to become defensive and/or protective of oneself. That does not mean whites, or any race is wrong when they feel unsafe around certain groups,, groups of blacks or others. Like stated above, I believe those same group of whites would react the same way when encountering a group of tattooed, leather clad whites. Do I blame them? No. Do I think it's a "misconseption?" No. Do I think it's in any way the color of their skin? No. It's life experiences. I also do not think the whites you speak of only look at the skin color when it comes to the groups of blacks. I would only agree that it is in fact a "misconseption" if those same whites were apprehensive when in the presence of any/all black person(s). "PEOPLE" refer to the human race. I too will attend the Old World Festival again this year. Maybe I'll see you there. Also, "white devils" was WAY too much. My apologies to you. I just got a little fired up. I really get sick of the way whites are always assumed wrong when it comes to race issues. Not that whites are always correct, but whites are not eternally awry. Congratulations on your education.

Let's face it- when an older, white suburbanite sees a black youth dressed in baggy clothes, the suburbanite probably thinks "uh-oh, here comes trouble", though the young African-American may be a straight-A student. I bet it's perfectly fine for those same older whites to think "uh-oh, here comes trouble" when they see a group of tattooed, leather wearing white guys with bandannas and Harley jackets on. God forbid anyone think ill thoughts about a group of blacks,,, regardless of their experiences. If you think Euclid is the same as years ago,, just take your family to the Old World festival. I can't tell you how many times in the past 5 years I've SEEN (not though it may have happened, not heard it happened, but DID SEE IT happen) those same groups of young blacks in baggy clothes jump unsuspecting individuals. Now, I know it's just horrible to state what I have seen. Somehow, I must be racist to have seen those incidents. Just look how different the Slavic Village festival is within these past few years.. What's the common factor?? Why is the Little Italy festival still thriving?? I don't blame those people one bit for feeling the way they do. By the way,, since its a "misconseption" for these whites to feel leery, what are they to look for? When is it politically correct for older people,, or better yet, white devils to feel unsafe when approached? Why is it people don't feel uneasy around the majority of blacks ----- the black families, the black boyfriend/girlfriend, black children, black elderly, black ministers, well dressed blacks, and so on. People feel uneasy about groups from every race. Cloths, numbers, & street language are all taken into consideration. But,, if people feel uneasy about a group of black, they're wrong. If people feel uneasy about a group of whites,, fine,, good job,, way to be aware of your surroundings. Trivisono relayed a fact on 1100am radio the other today. The population of Ohio is 11% black. But, blacks make up 48% of the prison population in Ohio. That is a fact. Not a "misconseption." Maybe that's the reason people (and not just whites) feel uneasy when they see groups of blacks with their cloths saggin'.

3231-- The following is a reprint of the last paragraph of Judge Corrigan's ruling. Having considered and reflected all the City's arguments, this Court grants summary judgment in favor of the State and the safety forces and denies summary judgment in favor of the City. In so ruling, this court specifically determines that R.C. 9.481 was lawfully enacted by the General Assembly to provide for the general welfare of employees of Ohio's political subdivisions and is a matter of statewide concern. Section 34, Article II of the Ohio Constitution is the controlling constitutional provision, and conflicting local laws passed pursuant to the city's home rule power found in Section 3, Article XVIII must succumb to state law. R.C.9.481 is constitutional and is upheld. IT IS SO ORDERED Peter J. Corrigan, Judge Date: February 23, 2007 Hope this helps a little. It's all I could find. By the way, this was drawn up by Sen, Grendell (sorry on the spelling, but if it's wrong, it's close) who is a constitutional lawyer.

Just when I thought there may be some humor on this site.............

Sure, agreed. But to have this as a criteria for any job is fundamentally wrong. Lets face it, there is a population of young, educated professionals who are leaving Cleveland. With this newly enacted freedom, maybe some will stay in at least Northeastern Ohio. Plus, how many qualified individuals wont even think about working for the City of Cleveland because they would be forced to uproot their families? Or, they simply don't want to live in a city. Now, they will have the luxury of filling out the applications and actually accepting positions. That cannot be bad for the city.

"a few" is from 3132. To be exact, that would amount to .00048% of Clevelanders. How pathetic that a city is relying on such a minuscule amount of it's population. MayDay--I do happen to know a number of city workers. Most are following your advise,, MOST. I do not want to see neighborhoods go down hill. Between my wife and I, we have moved to several different neighborhoods in Cleveland. Collinwood, Payne, Slavic Village, & Old Brooklyn-- three different streets. I have never lived next to a CPD nor CFD employee. I never lived in the neighborhoods you mentioned. But, maybe this will force the City of Cleveland to realize they no longer can count on people living here. Maybe they will change things to make it desireable....... not a 25 year sentence. That's all I can hope for. I think it is fundamentally wrong to force a person (a law abiding individual) to live in a particular area. Obviously, my view is seen by the folks who voted this unconstitutional in Columbus, and by multiple judges.

3231 wrote: "Way to skew things, KTM. The entire city of Cleveland (all the little guys) will suffer so that a few can benefit. So why do the rights of a few trump the greater good??" Well I, as well as the judge, disagree with you. By the way, why would you suffer if only "a few" (your words) move? Nobody says they HAVE to move. Rather, they still have the choice to live in the city, but like everyone else, they now will have a choice to live elsewhere.

Not my words. It's a copy and paste: County judge throws out Cleveland residency law Posted by kturner February 23, 2007 15:47PM Cleveland police, firefighters and other city workers should be free to live where they choose and cannot be bound to the city's borders by a residency requirement, a judge ruled this afternoon. Cuyahoga County Common Pleas Judge Peter Corrigan rejected every argument the city put forth to defend its residency requirement against a lawsuit city workers' unions brought last year. Cleveland's lawyers argued, among other things, that a recent state law banning municipal-employment residency requirements infringes on cities' home-rule powers. Corrigan rejected that. He also scoffed at Cleveland's prediction of dire and irreparable harm if the residency requirement would be abolished, saying that if Cleveland wants to keep its employee residents, it should make it worth their while to stay. "This court cannot speculate as to the accuracy of the crystal ball that prognosticates these employees will all abandon their neighborhoods and neighbors in a mass exodus of biblical proportions," Corrigan wrote in a ruling he released at 3:30 p.m. "However, the city may employ its considerable resources to entice its employees to live in the city by any lawful incentives available in the same manner the city uses to attract businesses, tourists and other sources of revenue." Categories: Breaking News

2-23-06 (Cleveland) Residency ruling: Judge Corrigan rules in favor of the little man, city workers. Rules against big business, the city!!!!

Hows about: - The "Whore on the Shore" District. - The "Goin' Down in C-Town" District. - The "Feel Cheery on Lake Erie" District - The "We put the "HO" in Ohio" District - The "Cum back again" District