Htsguy

I hope Fitzgerald was a man of his word and did not provide any county help with this move (from a blue collar suburb to one that hardly needs the help).

Bumsquare...I have to agree with you...that was a very weak article....so unlike Litt when he dislikes something (which he clearly does here)....he is usually so over the top that you have to roll your eyes. Could it be that editors at the PD are making him tone it down? At least it was full of some useful information but very discouraging if what he states is true...looks as though he is resigned to the fact. Not a lot of great leadership from city hall on this issue...see what happens when you are desperate for $$.

UH must be desperate...this takes away a long strip of buildings that front on the sidewalk and replace it with a parking lot, bad architecture, neighborhood liter and fat kids. Progress.

^Agree....Steve Litt seems to be stragely silent regarding all this (either pro or con...my guess is that he would be con).

^I saw that and was going to post the quote as well. I recall that Myers did a major re-hab to the building when they took it over about 12-15 years ago. I am sure it is in better shape than many of the buildings downtown. I imagine that tenats were forced out (or given sweet heart deals to move out if their lease was not up) once Gilbert's interests bought the building with the intention of tearing it down (of course pure speculation on my part).

^I think we all decided that it was the Browns lakefront plans he was talking about.

^I have not been down there but I would have to agree with you that with the "spring" we have been having the site must be just one big mud pit. Due to this fact, I would imagine the gc and the initial subs are glad they had not been further along with a greater mobilization of equipment, materials and men. They would all be just sitting around with somebody bearing the cost.

^The welcome center is simply a nice warm lobby waiting room for those who valet park no matter how it is marketed to those desperate individuals at city hall.

^^My personal opinion is that not much of it was historic (at least the buildings...it is indeed the oldest part of Cleveland). There were a few old establishments (I think the Kinders Building if I am getting it right) that were torn down but much of it was already parking lots and recent buildings (especially many of those fronting the river...for example I think the place that had a Long Horns Steakhouse was completely new, built some time in the late 80's or early 90's and nothing to write home about)

^It is my impression that Wolstein still intends (and is actively promoting) that some version of his original plan will come to "fruition" and will be built. Now whether this will actually happen is of course debatable, but it certainly is not completely dead in the water as your post suggests.

^I like the fact that you put 'historic district' in quotes.

^No matter what the topic or issues, polls such as these and those presented by television stations are so unscientific that they make real pollsters gag.

^I guess I agree with Hootenany about the surface lots at this point, especially if they are temporary. Unfortuantely, in my experience surface lots in Cleveland are much like tatoos...very difficult to get rid of once done.

Isn't it interesting to watch grown men play games like this.

The "temporary custodian" angle is not my impression...Niko was doing everything he could to make the place work on the second go around including Sunday hours, late night hours, happy hours and various promotions. Nothing seemed to work and the place was dead (in fact very dead) much too often, especially during the week, despite some really great food. It is an attractive space so hopefully this new joint will take off.

KJP...I did not get the impression from the article that PH wants to build an actual 58 story building but just see 58 floors of residential in the district encompassing various new and old buildings. Of course that 58 number is kinda strange. Wonder where it came from?

Strange that Steve Litt has not weighed in on this...maybe it is early. I know he will have some fun with it.

I have already had a fit about that bridge in the demolition thread. If this happens this city has no soul.

In addition to the insanity of demolishing the Columbia Building, I cannot believe that the planning commission would even consider a pedestrian bridge diagonally across Prospect and Ontario. Is this phase one of whoring ourselves for this casino?

From the looks of the court docket, it appears that a lot of lawyers are making a lot of money off of this dispute...of course not necessarily a bad thing. :-D

^I imagine there will be no sales as long as that massive lawsuit is going on...who can get a loan for a condo with that litigation?

^Fortunately for Pittsburgh, Macy's has a slightly better philosophy (just slightly) when it comes to downtown department stores. I believe Dillard's decided to go strictly suburban a while ago...if I recall correctly, a while back, St. Louis had the last downtown Dillards. Maybe I am wrong. Is anybody aware of another (or if Dillards is still in downtown St. Louis)(and not to start going off topic).

^^^I have a vague memory from 4-5 years ago (I use to read the Post on line often in those days) of the city going nuts due to all the retail closings (if I recall Lord and Taylor was one of the department stores) after they had bent over backwards to draw the stores in, and what the city was going to do to turn the situation around...based on what jam40jeff states the city has not been that successful with the turn around (which of course is not unusual in most major American cities outside of 9-10, especially in terms of department stores). I imagine the Macy's is in the former Kaufmann's which is an institutution so it may be safe. Too bad about Saks.

^I might agree with you if these things were hidden on some side street. Fronting on Euclid...no way.

^^^A former neighbor is from Pittsburgh and he moved backed about 3 years ago after living in Chicago and Cleveland. I keep in touch and recall him saying the same thing about downtown Pittsburgh after 5:00. (although Cleveland can have the same issue).