babysfirstxmas

This is your typical response to all of Geis' projects so at least you're consistent! To be fair to them, the design process in OTR is hemmed in by relatively strict historical design standards that must be met and approved by a historical design review board.

Correct. The value of the 100% tax abatement provided in less desirable neighborhoods does not offset the cost of construction and the lower rents one would get in those neighborhoods. You can't just invent a market that doesn't exist. The lower tax abatement in stronger rent neighborhoods will only necessitate that rents get pushed higher if a developer even feels like those are justified. If they don't feel that those rents are justified, then they won't build. Then you could have a lack of supply in the desirable neighborhoods as people continue moving there so rents will only get pushed further. Cleveland unfortunately is not a city with a strong enough population to support non-tax abated development for new product.

Just imagine the entire proposed project but instead of the townhomes, there will be a green field until townhome or other phase 2 is conceptualized. The rest of the project and park will be delivered.

Yea there’s a site next door which was being developed by the guys who were doing Rockefeller (Pintus and Wolf) but they ran into issues getting it over the finish line. There’s a different developer looking at the site now. Not the same developer as the PAG building/townhomes.

Was on site yesterday. Here are some photos from the roof deck. PAG who is developing the multi family bought the approved townhome land from Knez when Knez decided to sell. PAG is completing all necessary site work in order to deliver the promised parkland to the community and will develop it into something at a later date.

There’s no saying it won’t be a coffee shop. The exterior would look similar to what is proposed. It could be a coffee shop, restaurant, retail, or office. There is no tenant in place. The interior fit out will be dependent on the end user. The exterior will be renovated and should be representative of something similar to what is shown here. If you know a good coffee shop or tenant who should look at it, forward them the designs!

Just trying to help people understand the approval process in the city. The community especially does not have a sense for how the approval process works and tends to believe that a concept rendering is indicative of a final project design or a potential tenant. For this project, many community members assumed there was a coffee shop going into this location and there was pushback about "not needing another coffee shop" in the neighborhood. This was simply created in order to go through the approval process to change the zoning. The more information people here and the community at large has and understands how "the sausage is made" in the development process, the better off it will be for everyone. As a general aside as it relates to development: Happy to answer other questions about design choices, surface parking vs. covered vs. underground, etc. Everyone wants the highest designed product out there with the lowest rents possible, but someone has to pay for it, so developer's have to meet the market where it is.

Correcting this to help illuminate the approval process: These are simply concept renderings in order to receive landmarks approval and in turn BZA approval. The building needs to be rezoned from 2 family to commercial before being able to lease. There is no tenant in place or guarantee that it will be any sort of coffee shop. This is simply all conceptual and the tenant can be anyone.

I don’t think that mid rise is the highest and best use here and the cost per acre is probably too high to justify unless you really push rental rates.

It’s a great and fun idea, but there is no clear, short term, economic incentive to turn it into public space. Unless they see public green space as an amenity associated with a future, contiguous development

Great insights! Thank you! How does Industry compare to something like 1010 OTR or The Blonde?

Checking in from Cleveland here. Any sense on how Industry is leasing up? Are you all hearing any pushback on asking rents? How does the Pendleton rental market compare to OTR for new product? I know they're next (?) to each other but am interested in understanding whether Pendleton has premium rents?

This is correct. The case against the second development was soundly rejected by the court and the case was dropped.

Damn, who hurt you?

Ha! Woodhill Little Italy is called The Monroe.