subclavius

Thanks for the invitation, but honestly, you guys haven't really presented yourselves as somebody I'd like to meet. Having moved several times myself, I'm more than happy to take a few punches if it means I can give someone a more complete view of Cleveland and help them make a well informed decision before they get stuck in a one year lease. So maybe its bringing up the fact that a Londoner isn't going to be as happy with our mass transit system as a native Clevelander would be, or discussing aspects of crime with a single female who is going to be more sensitive to that sort of thing, rather than just glossing over the unique, positive characteristics that many of the neighborhoods have. That being said, my time on this board is pretty much done. After a couple of weeks of lawyer-limbo (they were probably just playing golf) my client is going to keep me very busy for the next six months and after that my requested transfer to anyplace-but-Cleveland should kick in. I just hope that in future relocation posts you guys pay more attention to the needs of the person making the request and portray the neighborhoods in the most accurate light relative to their circumstances, rather than just the most positive one for the city.

Congratulations tbone14! Get a beater bicycle. I've got a fixed gear vintage Schwinn from the 50's with big fat tires on it and it is perfectly suited for the city. I've ridden it from Tower Press, at the far end of the Gateway/Avenue District to Tremont several times, although the ride back from the Greek Festival after chowing down on all that food was a little challenging.......

Here we go again, the provincial, narrow-minded social caste of Cleveland is on display, immediately attacking those they don't agree with, even if the person they are attacking is only trying to help someone, on a subject as important to a young woman as personal safety. As far as this board goes, everything is great as long as you only mention good things about the various parts of town, or candy-coat what you don't like about it and keep it brief. But mention a heartfelt negative aspect of Cleveland directly and unfiltered by hometown bias, and, God forbid, back it up with some facts, and you'll be attacked and your posts marginalized. Offline society in Cleveland is a little better, but just IMHO, it ranks at the bottom of any of the cities I've lived in...like in the very bottom. Dead last. rkvam, perhaps you should be more concerned about the society you're moving into, rather than just crime itself. The good news is, Cleveland is no longer ranked in the top 10 of Morgan Quinto's Most Dangerous Cities report. Last year it was number 7. http://www.morganquitno.com/cit07pop.htm#25 Another real question you should be asking yourself is, which is more important to you, partying or safety, because one will have to give to the other, to a certain extent. A lot of people live in the suburbs with safety and schools being their two main justifications, and those same people routinely drive into Tremont, Lakewood, OC, and downtown on the weekends. The term "white flight" didn't originate in Cleveland, but it continues here to this day. I'll let you Google that yourself for more information, if I provided you with any factual data they'll just attack and dismiss it as they've done here in the past. Your feelings of safety will also partially depend on your previous exposure to city life. If downtown is too much for you, the city neighborhood areas like Lakewood or Tremont might be a good compromise. They both have good restaurants and neighborhood bars. However, if you grew up in the prim and proper world of an upperclass suburban subdivision, those places might seem a little run down to you. I live downtown (technically, the Gateway and/or Avenue District) and have made the walk from Tower Press to the Warehouse District many times, and I've never been hassled. Then again, I'm a bigger guy (my Dad and Uncle were pro athletes...I'm sure the regulars here will be shocked to discover my Uncle played for the Cleveland Indians. Now, before they attempt to repudiate that statement by saying something like "Oh, so thats why the Indians used to suck" they should know he was World Series MVP for another team). Anyway, I'm less likely to be accosted on the street than a young single female, and most people think I'm an undercover cop or government agent, but even with all that in my favor, I still don't feel 100% safe downtown, and I'm used to downtown living. It would probably be worse for you. One thing you can do is listen to Cleveland's online police scanner and pinpoint the locations reported on an online map site. That would give you an idea of what crimes are happening and where, which isn't going to show you anything to like, but at least will show you where to avoid: http://www.cleveland.com/policescanner/ Good luck on your search rkvam!

At the risk of starting another posting war, the suburbs are generally considered safer than most of the inner city areas. If by "hip" spots you mean a trendy place to show off your Salvatore Ferragamo's, you'll probably want to live downtown. If so you'll want to minimize the length of your walks between your apartment and the various entertainment venues. That would put you in the Warehouse District or East 4th area. Some of the apartments have additional security and some don't. Statler Arms was one of the more security-minded locations when I was shopping for a place a few months ago, but I don't live there and can't tell you much more about them than that. Another place to consider is Tower Press, which backs up directly next to the Third District Police Department, the biggest PD in town. That means the cops are around 24/7. However, it's a bit of a distance to the Warehouse District clubs and most twenty-something single women wouldn't feel comfortable walking that far at night. It'd be an easy & quick drive as long as there's a Designated Driver in your group and you wouldn't mind paying for a parking spot by the clubs. I've come across some articles mentioning the PD building might close or transfer, but the local business owners and assorted community groups are interested in keeping it open, for obvious reasons, and it doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon. There are some great places in Lakewood, Ohio City, and Tremont which would also be considered "hip", but they're less flashy and have more of a neighborhood feel.

Thats why I used the word "occasionally"...and you supported your attack with another attack. Welcome to Cleveland, folks!

Besides craiglist.org, you might find a few places here: http://www.pluggedincleveland.com/rentals/

Thanks Pope, for proving my point about the provincial mindset that many people in Cleveland have. I doubt any of the regulars on this forum think you were joking or kidding. Usually forum Mods practice a little more diplomacy than that. As a former grad student I was trained to occasionally provide support for my opinions, rather than just my opinions alone. The article is something of substance that someone overseas can find online in order to help them make up their minds for themselves. It details the impact the changing demographics is having on the fabric of society and the living conditions in the area. The responses it generated unanimously agreed with the author, and included residents and public safety workers from Coventry. So here I am, attacked again when only trying to help someone. Maybe I just should start telling people to stay away and cancel their transfers so they don't have to go through what I did.

I'm not MTS, and I have no interest in pimping Shaker other than trying to help a Londoner working in the UH/CH area find the best place to live in Cleveland. I spent about a month in London and know there are some major differences in their urban lifestyle that invalidate the stock suggestions that may be appropriate for Americans moving to Cleveland, and that are given out reflexively on this forum. Once again, although Cleveland's mass transit system is better than most American cities, it pales in comparison to the London Underground and most native Londoners won't like it. You can go all over London just by hopping a couple of trains, never waiting too long for any of them, and staying in the "tube" the whole time. In Cleveland a similar length journey may involve multiple buses with a greater variance in timeliness, while the rider waits in a kiosk outside. In this case, that'll scratch out any neighborhoods west of the river. And whereas other Americans won't mind living in areas like Ohio City and making the daily commute, that can't be said for those coming from overseas where the cities aren't built around the idea of urban sprawl and two cars in every garage. Coventry's troubles are well documented in Lisa Rab's article Paradise Lost, which was published in the Cleveland Scene a couple of months ago, and supported by the many editorial responses it generated. I'm just a nice guy trying to use my own experience from overseas, and from living to Cleveland, to help someone in similar circumstances find a good place for them to live. One thing that has always disappointed me about Cleveland is it's lack of world view and reluctance to accept other opinions and lifestyles outside of the native Clevelander's own social caste. You know, like when someone tries to help another person on a forum and they get accused of being someone they're not, or of having a hidden agenda.

Long-term living at Reserve Square is like using AOL as your internet provider...it's for those who don't know any better. You're short-term so it would be OK. Some people aren't comfortable with the nearby Greyhound depot passengers who use the Square's grocery store, and the store itself is a little beat up, and the cashier's sure as sh*t aren't going to set any speed records...but they do have a guard in the lobby, there's always plenty of people around, and I've never heard of any of the Greyhound passengers causing any problems. Most of that seems to come from the Reserve Square residents themselves (false fire alarms and no sense of ownership in the surroundings).

I disagree, at least for someone coming from across the pond. Ohio City and all those places have unique and endearing qualities, but they're too far away for an European. Their cities aren't designed to be as automotive-centric as ours and the residents aren't used to spending a half an hour on the highway each way to work & back. And the London Underground is far more utilized and more convenient than our transit system, even though Cleveland's is better than most American cities. And let's not forget that the Clinic area is somewhat landlocked...... I would recommend the Shaker area. There's some good quality and affordably priced apartments there. I wouldn't recommend Coventry to an out-of-towner because some parts of it are failing, and how would they know where they are. Most of Shaker is right out up front and hard to miss, just stick to the myriad of apartments along the Square.

I got a Master's from FHSU in Hays and lived there for a couple of years, but my hometown was so small even the Kansans in KC haven't heard of it. Tremont is one of the more eclectic areas in town. There are a lot of rentals that look like plain old houses on the outside, but have modded-out loft style interiors. There's a few flats and a lot of wood-sided houses. I'm being perfectly honest here: I don't know about the rest of Ohio, but girls in Cleveland aren't as attractive as those in Kansas. Sorry folks, but it's true. The small-town farmer's daughter is no stereotype. They're all over Kansas, not just in the country. And most of the attractive Kansas women have very fine features and are very feminine. The difference is, there isn't much middle ground. It's either hot-Kansas-female or a butter-churning, corn-fed, wide-hipped woman. And the Kansas ladies tend to get married earlier, so there's more single "older" (as a relative term) women here in Cleveland if you like that sort of thing. In Cleveland, you'll find the souped up, dressed-out high maintenance women at the clubs downtown, and the casual bleached-blonde wolfpacks in Tremont & Lakewood. As far as crime is concerned, one mantra is repeated time and time again here, no matter which part of the city you live in: "Never leave anything in your car"

Hey tbone14, the same thing happened to me about 6 months ago. My main pick was a corner unit on East 4th but somebody else leased it a day before I flew into Cleveland to look at it. If an active younger scene is what you want, IMHO the choice is really between the warehouse/East 4th in downtown and Lakewood, a former suburban area near downtown. The warehouse district is more upscale and has fewer overall venues, but they are booming after 5 and on the weekends. The crowd is split between the young lofties that live there, and those the same age but drive in from the suburbs. Lakewood is much more casual, has more venues along the lines of neighborhood bar & grills, and the crowd is more local. There may be some families and younger married couples around, but there is no shortage of singles either. Just about everything in the downtown area is within walking range, which is great for avoiding DUIs. Lakewood, not so much. But the price of entertainment in Lakewood is cheaper, and rent is much, much cheaper. Downtown is great if you like lofts, Lakewood has more of the charming older apartments. You get what you pay for in downtown lofts, the expensive ones are generally well run, the cheaper ones have a lot of complaints. East 4th is supposed to be a good management company. I lived in rural western Kansas once so I don't know too much about what KC is like, but I did move to Cleveland from Madison, Wisconsin, which quite frankly had the best downtown scene I've ever lived in. And that includes Chicago, Philadelphia, and near downtown Houston (Houston's is almost all skyscrapers). The main critique I have for Cleveland is that the downtown is sparsely populated. For a city this size they're aren't a lot of people living downtown once outside of the warehouse/East 4th area. That might change in 5 years as the city is putting some effort into the area and there is some major development in the works, but it's not there yet. And more people live in the Bingham than in the entire small Kansas town I was once in. But if you live downtown, get used to going to the same places. If you go to Lakewood, be prepared for a bunch of short drives. Before moving I also looked in Tremont and 25th street. I loved Tremont and the people living there, but it was too isolated geographically speaking. 25th street has some seedy areas south of it and a rough area just to the north. You might want to take a look at the Statler Arms, a turn-of-the-century high-end hotel that was converted to apartments. It's fairly well managed, close to the East 4th area, has a wide variety of floor plans, and an attached parking garage. Something you'll really want to consider is where your work will be, because rush hour traffic is a bear here. One of the reasons I chose downtown is to reverse commute, going in the opposite direction of most 9-5ers. That part has been great. Lakewood doesn't have many quick & easy ways to get to the highway, and what there is will be congested heading into town during peak traffic hours.

Wow. This has been extremely helpful and I would just like to take the opportunity to thank everyone for contributing so far. Coming from a city noted for it's friendliness and personality I didn't know what to expect in Cleveland, but this is really getting me psyched up and looking forward to the move. Right now I'm arranging a visitation schedule and will spend one day in OC/Tremont and one in the various downtown districts. I'm trying not to have any favorite beforehand, but I feel myself sliding a little towards OC. It seems a little more local, whereas the Warehouse District looks like more of a party destination, and as such may play host to the SUV obsessed suburbanites and Stepford Wives that I'm looking to avoid. Plus, although most would consider me a (slightly offbeat) yuppie, I don't always want to be one 24/7 and OC seems like a place where one can let it hang out a little more often. But yet the Warehouse District seems to be almost everybody's #1 pick for some reason.....and holy crap, I just saw the brunch menu for Lucky's Cafe in Tremont. This is going to be tougher than I thought! There are a lot of rental options on W 25th between Detroit Ave and Train Ave, which seems surprising because this looks like a very active area as far as nightlife is concerned. Is there an issue with the location, like parking or noise? Thanks again, everyone, for the responses. Every city should have a forum like this one. I'll keep you posted on the visit next week and let you know where I end up.

Hi folks. I'm moving to Cleveland soon and won't have time for a thorough housing search-just a couple of days and that's it. I have a few questions about the downtown area that'll help narrow the effort. First, the requested info: Looking for a 1 bedroom rental, $650-$850 range, loft preferred, historic or stylish apt OK. Reverse commuter-job is past Independence, but I'm not interested in the suburbs. Shaker Heights and Coventry, although seemingly what I'm looking for in terms of culturally diversity, appears to be too inconvenient from a traffic perspective. The only real amenity I'm interested in is public or common space, where I can meet people or hang out and people watch. Coffee shops a plus. Casual bars and cool hipster places are OK, but definitely NOT a fan of the big dance clubs. I'm single, straight, and social. Here are the questions: How is traffic in the Gateway/Theater District? Do you have to avoid the streets on game nights? What is the state of the proposed large-scale construction projects by the Flats, and has that affected traffic? How bad is downtown crime, really? I've lived in other downtown areas and have a basic idea of what to expect. Have the recent shootings had any effect? Is the Warehouse District on the upswing or sliding downwards? Is it considered "safe" for someone living in the Theater District to walk to the Warehouse District, or vice versa? Is there any area that normally hosts public and community events? Places like Tremont are described as "walking communities". Do people really walk there to go to various destinations, or does the term just describe a more suburban and de-centralized setting? Is the Tower Press Lofts (1900 Superior) too far from downtown to walk at night? What is the condition of the bike trails, if any, and are they safe? Is bicycling downtown or in the "walking communities" a common sight? Could I ride a junker around and lock it up without returning a couple of hours later to find the tires slashed or the rims bent? (once or twice a year would be expected, just not once or twice a month) I get mixed reviews all the time about various areas, or that one area is good but it borders a bad area, etc. Just tell me flat-out, what are the bad areas or streets to be avoided in the neighborhoods bordered by Lakewood on the west, the Heights on the east, and within 480? Finally, I plan on having a backup suburban apt ready if the downtown areas aren't appealling. Are there any suburban communities around the Brecksville Reservation/Cuyahoga Valley National Park area that will suffice as far as culture and entertainment goes? Thanks in advance!