Toddguy

Madison has had a very small loss overall since 2010, not one of the highest in the state by any means. Interesting to see that Indianapolis' home county lost population. That's bad news for Indianapolis considering the city includes most of Marion County. City estimates won't be out until May. Nationally, it seems that the majority of cities, even in Sun Belt areas, saw year-over-year growth rate declines. Of course, this could merely be a function of the estimates themselves rather than any real change. I think the Plain City area must be helping a bit. There is very little being built around West Jeff or London, and yeah it is about the same as 2010-which compared to many other areas in the state is not so bad. Also Marion County Indiana did not lose population, it gained over 3.000. But that also means Indy could not have gained more than that. 75 percent of their metro growth is happening outside the core county, about the opposite of Columbus-which is not so good for Indy. Hamilton County(Carmel, Fishers)alone gained twice as much as Marion County. I would think we would have passed them when the city estimates come out. I was surprised at how some places did not gain much-San Francisco adding 8,000 or so, Santa Clara(San Jose)adding less than Franklin County.

What about Minneapolis? That metro grew by about 25,000 last year per the recently released info.

Madison County doesn't really have much going on and is furthest from Columbus city limits. Even western Franklin County is pretty empty past 270. I can say "semi-rural Franklin County" with a straight face. I don't know about the Plain City area, but there has been virtually no new housing construction in the London or West Jeff areas. West Jeff is actually doing ok with it's business park expansion and annexing the Battelle property and expansion, but they have built just a few houses in the south part of town and the downtown is a shambles(what is left of it)-hell the building housing my dentist collapsed into the Main street not too long ago lol. The only thing new is a horrible Dollar General they stuck in a nook at 40 and Taylor Blair rd.-right next to the cemetery and it looks atrocious! Now West Jeff can claim both a Family Dollar and a Dollar General-but not a real grocery store. Smh.

From the 12/16/2016 Columbus Underground article that Casey linked: Well it is nearly April...has anyone heard anything about this? I hope it is the Wood/Schiff proposal.

https://factfinder.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?src=bkmk Franklin County and every county around it grew-except Madison-which had a greater percentage loss than any other Ohio county. Madison County-the hellhole county of Central Ohio! (yeah I am stuck living here now so I can attest for this personally). Interesting that Franklin County grew by over 14,000, while Marion County Indiana(Indianapolis)grew by only a bit over 3,000. Given that Indy could not have grown more than that 3000 and some change, and that Columbus was only about 3,000 people behind Indy last year, if at least half of that growth was within city limits(and it has tended to be about two thirds of it recently), then Columbus should pass Indianapolis when the city estimates come out in May(I think it is May). That would put Cbus ahead of Indy in city and metro. Glad to see Hamilton County grew and Cincinnati metro also grew decently. *Also 8 states lost population, but only 1 in the Midwest-Illinois.

If it's true that 50% of the population growth is natural (births minus deaths), then we're looking at not 45% but 45% of 50%, or 22.5%...which isn't far from jbcmh's figure. The 45% your addressing is 45% of net in-migration, not 45% of population growth (which is what jbcmh was talking about). Edit: Also remember jbcmh was talking MSA and my top figures were for Franklin County, so there should be some difference there. OK thanks for clearing that up.

It's a bit of a process to work it out. The Census does a county by county domestic migration map, but they are estimates, and I think the last one available was for 2013. I do know that the general breakdown for the Columbus metro is 50% natural growth, 25% foreign and 25% domestic, so right off the bat, about 75% of the growth has nothing to do with the rest of the state. Let me work out the numbers for the other 25% and I'll post back. Getting more detailed than this would take more time. (Note that I discounted all margins of error, assuming it's an overall wash.) Estimated annual net migrations to Franklin County: From other counties in Ohio to Franklin County: 6,115 From non-Ohio locations in the USA to Franklin County: -587 From Puerto Rico: 265 From foreign countries: 7,417 So Ohio makes up 46.3% of the net in-migration to Franklin. This doesn't account for whether a county is in Franklin's MSA, and it's possible non-Ohio domestic migration to the MSA is in the black, but it's in the red for Franklin. Source: https://www2.census.gov/programs-surveys/demo/tables/geographic-mobility/2013/county-to-county-migration-2009-2013/county-to-county-2009-2013-ins-outs-nets-gross.xlsx Ohio MSAs to Columbus MSA, net migrations: Akron: 518 Canton: 483 Cincinnati: 1865 Cleveland: 3380 Dayton: 770 Lima: 630 Mansfield: -293 Springfield: 93 Toledo: 451 Steubenville: -145 Youngstown: 790 (Total: 8,024) MSAs which include part of OH: Wheeling: 51 Huntington: 158 Source: https://www2.census.gov/programs-surveys/demo/tables/geographic-mobility/2013/metro-to-metro-migration/metro-to-metro-2009-2013.xlsx Remember, the 8,024 is for the Columbus MSA whereas the 6,115 number is for Franklin County. Additionally, non-Ohio counties are included in Cincinnati's MSA, which could have some impact as those would be included in the non-Ohio USA migration in the top figures. All of these calculations use estimates from the 2009-2013 American Community Survey. so we have 25% and about 45%..for domestic migration...which is correct?

How do you know this? I know that there is virtually no population growth happening in at least Madison County. Probably very little in Pickaway. Not sure about the others though.

Again not to be picky, but that is not really the case, especially with Detroit. Metro was 4.5 million in 1970, 4.3 million in 2010. Using CSA, it is at about the same population as 1970, about 5.2 million. This is more like Ohio cities really. The growth there was not in population but in sprawl. Chicagoland and metro twin cities both had good growth post war and also post 1970.

I did not mean to come off as nitpicky in my response to your post, sorry if it came off that way. And climate change is gonna be rough for Florida and supporting the vulnerable development there sucks I agree. But in a way, I would rather see a renewal starting in Ohio(maybe due to less risk from disaster/fresh water/etc) now...I mean if Ohio did have tons of growth in the 70's, 80's and 90's...what would that growth have looked like?-probably just tons of sprawl. Look at the sprawl that has happened with the low growth rate that we have had...populations barely growing or actually declining in areas but the built up area doubling in places. I think the cities would be in the same boat they are now, maybe not as bad, but just surrounded by even more and larger sprawling suburbs and exurbs exerting even more influence than what we have now. A would rather have an improving economy and a lower growth rate with smarter growth NOW. It is about the economy now in Ohio.

Actually that is not true. Ohio had slightly less than 8 million people in 1950, and now has over 11.5 million, so that is a growth of over 3.5 million, not the greatest but much more than one million. 1970 figures would be closer to what you are comparing, with Ohio only gaining slightly less than one million people in the last 45 years while Florida has gone from 6.7 million to over 20 million per 2015 estimates. Also not all of Ohio has grown (or not grown) equally. The Columbus metro area has just about quadrupled since 1950.

Great News. I am sure it will do well there. And this means that two thirds of the retail space in the building will be taken by this Urban Target and the rest will quickly be taken up by restaurants, etc. so it will not be vacant*cough South Campus Gatewaycough*. Plus if this is a success than maybe there will be a time for another one south of there(downtown?)

A couple points, The larger overall map at the bottom of the article is not necessarily any concrete plan that will ever actually happen, but rather a rehash of existing "visions" developed by the city several years ago. To date, there has been zero movement on virtually any of those things, and there are no real proposals for any of it now. Not to mention, moving forward with any of those parts and pieces can happen while leaving these existing apartments alone, their remaining doesn't impede other new developments at all. There is no way any new build would be able to exist in the same price range as the current apartments. They are proposing demolishing 130 well-maintained affordable units and replacing them with ~100 total, 10 of which would be "workforce housing." Additionally, this would likely be taking advantage of city funds dedicated to the development of new affordable housing which would be much better put to use elsewhere. I'd say that is a bad deal. Period. The real motivation here seems to be firstly profit, and second improving access to their parking garage, which is really not difficult or "unsafe" at all as-is. CDDC being involved gives me no confidence in the quality of the new buildings proposed or any developer that will be attached to them. CDDC selected Carter and gave us HighPoint, which is probably the worst new-build in downtown Columbus in decades. Grant Hospital has been promising to build a medical office building on that lot since the late 1990s when existing housing which had been on the site was demolished. They have applied for several extensions to the supposed time limit which was put on their operating a surface parking lot there since, and all have been granted. One day they may build something, but I'm certainly not holding my breath. Further, their last new-build medical building at State and 6th, is a 6-story urban design disaster. It is totally dead at ground level and connects to the main hospital via skywalk, certainly better than something the Cleveland Clinic would dream up, but not at all an exciting, productive addition to the streetscape. TL;DR, there is no shortage of empty suface lots and underutilized land in this part of downtown. Demolishing the one fully built-out parcel that houses a large number of well-maintained, desperately-needed affordable units is totally counter productive and has no net gain for the area. CML should be taken to task for this proposal IMO. Great post! I could not agree more. This really pisses me off. This is exactly what we should NOT be doing! It just makes want to protest or something it pisses me off that bad. I am going to have such a grudge against the library if they do this. What the hell is wrong with our city officials who will just go along with this?

I am not exactly thrilled with the park design(even what was proposed informally earlier is better IMO), but the park itself overall will be huge for the area IMO and will be an asset when getting that infill built between Belle and the tracks and certainly a huge improvement over the surface lots there now. I just hope there is sufficient density(yes that includes some height) in the upcoming infill. If it is nothing but cheap stickbuilt stuff it will be almost criminal. They had better not waste that downtown view.

Yes: http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,9206.msg815417.html#msg815417 I am so glad they are utilizing that long narrow parcel. As it is it is just wasted now. It will be decent infill.

This is very good news. With this nearly half of the North side of Broad in East Franklinton would be done. The building just west of this between Mill and Gift looks like it would be ideal for a small grocery store-about 10,000 square feet with room for a small parking lot behind it. Just saying and all.

It is that parcel running east-west along the alley. That parcel is exactly 26 feet by 235 feet.

This will be huge in getting $$$ into the part of the peninsula west of Belle. Once this is approved and a done deal and construction starts the developers will know that another big attraction will be right across the street from all of that land. I hope this park does what Columbus Commons did(minus the bad design of 'High Pointe at Kaliningrad' and all.)

Called it: http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/business/2016/08/05/plan-for-grandview-mercantile-site-switched-to-retail-offices.html http://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2016/08/05/pizzuti-cutting-height-of-short-north-project.html http://www.columbusunderground.com/new-plan-for-grandview-mercantile-calls-for-ten-stories-office-space-and-more-parking-bw1 Granted, it's not the 5 story brick box that I half-heartedly predicted. However it's still a reduction in height that really doesn't make much sense. I personally think that is a fantastic arguing point. My personal thought it that area residents and neighborhood associations see it more as it opening a pandora's box by allowing higher height thresholds (i.e. if we allow a 12 story building, what's to stop the next developer from proposing and building a 14 story building, then a 17 story building, then a 20 story building, etc). Then we're stuck with a 25 story tower in the Short North (as if that would be a bad thing!). I suppose their clairvoyance will prevent us from having an Atlanta-esque skyline stretching from the Brewery District to OSU akin their downtown to Buckhead: The difference is that the actual street level built environment along Peachtree Street from downtown to Buckhead in Atlanta is nothing like the denser, narrower High Street from downtown to OSU. The skyline is less important, the street having denser development connecting downtown and OSU and helping to support maybe a streetcar/some other mass transit and serve as an even more dense and vital connection between the two biggest employment nodes in the city is much more important. In a limited area like along High, and with preserving the decent buildings with character, you can only add density with height-there is no othe way..and 'appropriately designed' taller buildings(maybe with some spacing between them and some tapering) will actually help the neighborhoods on either side along with the street itself, not ruin it. JMHO. Developers and the city also have some responsibility overall in this. Offering only large boxes in brick, concrete, glass or metal-but still bulky looking boxes is not exactly endearing nearby residents to development, is it? Maybe the rules need shaken up and the area needs to be offered something different than the increasingly ever present yuppie box, be it three, six, nine, or twelve floors? -they all start to look the same-like a bland wall. Whatever happened to setbacks?

I seriously think this is true-particularly outside the official downtown area. But progress is progress...and this building is still progress and I am for it. It will increase density, help overall to connect downtown and OSU, and *hopefully* help to bring about another form of mass transit on or around High between those two nodes. I will not even mention the name of this particular form of mass transit as I may end up with an icepik in my skull from one of the disgruntled 'Villagers' hailing from either side of High.

I don't like the new design as much(from what I could tell). It looks a bit more box-like with only two major sections instead of three. But do they always have to cut the height? Is a ten story box that is more straight up and down better than a more tapered twelve story building? It is just done senselessly it seems. The Chrysler building is taller than the Met-Life Tower-but which is more 'imposing' and would have a bigger impact on any given nearby street? There is just a knee-jerk reaction to height and floors that is often not logical.

And it is cut to ten floors and all office and retail. I guess they did not need twelve floors to make it work after all...just cut the floors and change the use. Cut height cut height cut height it is the Columbus way!!!!!

Well to be fair they only mentioned 34 south Third, which is the Dispatch building itself. They did not necessarily comment on all of the property along Third down to State. Even around 25 years ago when the proposed that Capital Plaza tower the old Dispatch building would have remained. 'The next use for' suggests they are just talking about the Dispatch building, which I would imagine they would want to keep intact and all. At least this is what I am sticking with until I hear more.

Do you think that they might ever build a highrise upscale residential building where the boathouse property is-maybe behind it in part of the parking lot with structured parking or something? The views would be spectacular. If only..... These last few posts are looking good too! In this area 6 story infill is appropriate and can only help the Arena district itself-whatever they call it, Pen West, Arena west, I am all for it. Build! lol. * and is it so much to ask to have some 'Workforce housing' thrown in?

Congrats Cleveland! Go Cleveland! go OHIO!