3 Dog Pat

Most of the funding is coming from bonds, funded by turnpike tolls

I wish I would have tweeted or facebooked my quote. I was in my local bar in the French Quarter with 3 minutes left, and everyone was congratulating me (pretty much THE Browns fan in the 1/4) and I said "There ain't no way the refs will let the Browns win, it will be like Chicago all over again" In the event I cursed the Browns with my declaration, I apologize.

^surface parking (I kid, I kid)

KJP, Musky....anyone who wants to weigh in, how likely is this to be actually built? Is this just a study for a study's sake, or will one of the alternatives likely be built?

They could. But the data is showing there isn't enough potential ridership for a full-blown extension of a double-track, electrified rail line that's separate from the NS line. The study team is considering a DMU (self-propelled diesel rail cars) running on the NS tracks from Windereme to the Euclid Park-n-Ride and possibly beyond. The extension of a DMU beyond the Euclid P&R is what Laketran would have to consider studying and funding on their own. And the Lake County service would likely need the extension of NS's second main track that already exists west of the Euclid P&R. But this is beyond the scope of the Cuyahoga County-focused GCRTA study. Thanks!

Could Laketran finance rail for a Lake County portion of a Red Line extension? Does the cost per mile for rail go down if there a bunch of miles?

We should move, and continue the conversation about rust wire and it's authors to the local media thread.

I also tweeted a suggestion that they give a hat tip to the Progressive tower that was never built, so if the constructed some mesh, cage looking thing, I would like that too (I'm realizing I can be easily pleased with new construction)

I'm probably in the minority, but I would not mind it it was a great big billboard for current or upcoming shows at the CC.

^Thanks Strap. I think the reason that stuck with me was the fact that I didn't know he was Baptist. (I guess Southern Baptist vs. turn of last century Cleveland Baptist) To get the thread back on topic......Personally, I am sad that Peter Lewis has passed, and I am grateful for what he has contributed to Cleveland.

RE: Rockefeller This is from CleveScene a few years back. A Century of Bumbling Cleveland's civic ineptitude isn't new. It goes all the way back to Rockefeller. by Michael D. Roberts http://www.clevescene.com/cleveland/a-century-of-bumbling/Content?oid=1488713 "In the 1880s, Rockefeller, who grew up in Parma and founded his oil business here, was living in New York City, but spending summers at his Forest Hills mansion in East Cleveland. His wife, Cettie, loved the family estate and insisted upon returning each year. Then, in 1913, Cettie became ill and was unable to return to New York. Rockefeller stayed with her beyond February 8, 1914, the date that determined legal residence and the levy of a personal-property tax. Rockefeller had already paid his tax in New York. But Flackner and Agnew, the county tax commissioners, nonetheless sent a tax bill of $1.5 million to his Forest Hills address. (Today's county commissioners would not only give Rockefeller a tax break, but would eagerly arrange Port Authority bonds to help him reclaim as much of the suburb as he needed for a golf course.) Flackner, who lived in East Cleveland, bragged that when this tax was paid, residents would enjoy a 20 percent cut in their taxes. He and Agnew further warned that if the tax were not paid immediately, there would be a 50 percent penalty. It was a political move, designed to appear as if a blow had been struck for the poor against the rich. The only problem was that Rockefeller, refusing to become hostage to this demand, took it to federal court and won." ... "In his lifetime, Rockefeller gave away $530 million, which in today's dollars would be more than 20 times that amount. Yet his hometown of Cleveland got little. Scholars estimate that he probably gave about $3 million to area schools, churches, and parks. "New York has always treated me more fairly than Cleveland, much more," he once said. Writes Chernow: "How many New York hospitals, museums and churches would be enriched by Cleveland's blunder!" Following Cettie's burial and the destruction of the Forest Hills mansion by fire, Western Reserve University asked Rockefeller for the land, so that the campus could be moved and expanded. He refused. Ironically, the refusal came years after Rockefeller had approached another civic leader, J.L. Mather, who made his fortune in iron ore, and offered to help the same university, of which Mather was a patron. Rockefeller told Mather that the city needed a first-rate university, one that would be looked upon with the same respect as those in the East. Mather disagreed. Fine Cleveland families sent their children to places like Yale, of course. There was no need to build a great university here. It would be wasted on working people. Rockefeller went on to fund his dream by establishing the University of Chicago." (It is Clevescene so take if for what its worth. I also heard that he wanted to establish a Baptist School, and at the time Baptist leaders pushed for a Chicago location, rather than Cleveland, which they deamed too far east.)

^Just to play devil's advocate, Peter Lewis was an outside the box thinker. Outside the box thinking in CLE is often (not always) met with scorn. For example see the reaction to the PH Square chandalier, or the skylift from the likes of Rustwire. People are free to not think any idea is a good one, but I was disappointed with the level of anger and mocking. That said, I think Lewis and his ex-wife Toby definitely had a positive influence on both the "creative community" and in making the connection between arts and the economy.

How do I contact the hotel people , I am more motivated to suggest the hotel bring in elements of projects that here never built, especially the progressive tower

Since it is money that the city is already obligated to pay, I don't see how this is a bad deal for the city. The original lease is another story, but this deal doesn't cost the city anything extra

For reference, my shotgun HOUSE down here in NOLA is 780sqft. I think its roomy (but I did have to buy a shed) Maybe they are targeting empty nesters in the suburbs and exurbs who are used to McMansions?

with the new development, I'll *BUMP* this thread

^Agree 100% When Comisky became US Cellular park, all of that money went into renovations of the ballpark (they did a good job too)

I still think a small corner or strip of the park for a dog park would be heavily used and make the space more lively.

I wish I could go. What I would suggest to the architects is to draw inspiration from the Cleveland that never was. All of the major projects that were planned and never came to be, such as the Progressive Tower at the edge of the malls, the Ameritrust building on Public Square, the Rock-O-Meter, or even whatever Daniel Burnham originally proposed for the site. Probably just us urban ohio nerds would like it, but anything is better than plain and boring

Awesome to hear! I say lower, because every time I would say I was from the East side of Cleveland nearly all of the responses would be, "Oh, where in the Heights?" So Lower as compared to Heights.

^Thanks for all of your hard work for the neighborhood. Its nice to see the lower east side of Cleveland getting some love. Do any of the Waterloo projects spill over into other parts of Collinwood, like E. 185th?

Sorry I can't make it. I'll cyber cheers y'all from the French Quarter

Wow! Thanks

^economics of new construction don't work out right now, but they are getting better

My friends own Wilde, glad you liked it Thanks for the pics