down4cle

use the camera proceeds for road diets.

So being against Robocops makes us think we can run red lights? I was definitely planning to murder a random person with an M-16 but then I found out that someone might have a camera on their drone and snap a pic. That's the only thing that stopped me, really, rather than the myriad of other reasons not to do it. the point went right over your head at 10mph over the speed limit.

If a camera ticket is not a criminal charge is does not violate constitution. It's no different than parking ticket or ticket for not paying toll. We've discussed this already. The constitution doesn't protect your right to exceed the speed the limit.

They also think they should be able to whip around corners and get mad at pedestrians trying to cross the street.

If the driver is recklessly exceeding the speed limit and kills a pedestrian, they will be charged with manslaughter and punished accordingly You seem to think it's just fine to go a little over the speed limit. Is it reckless or is it fine? You need to make up your mind.

Ok, lets put it into perspective. If you are going 5 miles over in the school zone, that makes a big difference if you hit someone. If you are going 68 in a 65 and you hit someone, it will not make a difference. Quit pretending otherwise. Again, if you are paying attention, you will see that this argument has nothing to do with speeding, it is about the rights of the accused. Your sole argument is that speed cameras reduce accidents and that those who speed break the law and deserve whatever punishment they receive and the ends justify the means to ensure they receive their punishment. Fortunately, there is the Constitution to protect the accused from opinions like this, so that the poor in society have a chance to defend themselves. Traffic cameras are usually set on city streets. Quit pretending otherwise.

I feel like bad drivers are not punished enough. We go so lenient on people by calling things accidents that are not accidents. When someone goes 35 in a 25 and kills a pedestrian, I don't think that is an accident. It is reckless and the driver should be majorly punished but they they are not usually punished because everyone feels that driving is a god given right.

To expand on my previous post here is some data that shows a few miles per hour makes a difference. The fatality rate for pedestrians hit by vehicles increase exponentially as vehicle speeds increase. http://humantransport.org/sidewalks/SpeedKills.htm

as a matter of fact a few miles per hour makes a huge difference in reaction time. A few miles per hour is the difference between a pedestrian surviving an impact. Again, you do not have a constitutional right to endanger the lives of other road users. Driving is a privilege if you don't like the rule then please don't endanger the rest of us. Your Minority Report analogy is so ridiculous I won't even touch it.

We had cameras in Cleveland for many years and managed to not get any tickets by driving in a safe and prudent manner. Some of you seem to think you have a constitutional right to endanger everyone else on the road. I wish we could bring the cameras back and have more of them for the truly terrible drivers.

I fail to see the difference between the fine for speeding and the fine for not paying a toll. You claimed that criminality was the difference but there is none in a camera ticket situation. I feel no empathy to people who endanger others safety.

Camera tickets are usually civil infractions and carry no points. Therefore it is a contractual agreement.

^ Isn't there a contractual obligation to obey the speed limit on roads and the "fine" is merely the contractual cost for driving beyond that speed. You have mentioned a distinction without a difference as far as I am concerned.

^ but what if someone borrows your car and does it?

Nope. He wouldn't likely have an estate worth greater than $5 Million.

Bleed them dry then if they are dumber than a dog.

I agree that road design is the first remedy to be used but as a cyclist and pedestrian I come across drivers who see to have no concern for the safety of others around them. I am all for people speeding on city streets getting tickets in the mail.

It is the right to confront your accuser. If you challenge a speeding ticket, the cop has to appear in court or else it gets dismissed. WIth traffic cameras, you have no ability to confront your accuser. That is a constitutional violation first and foremost. Bottom line, this is a losing battle for the cities, they just need to back down. THis has nothing to do with public safety, it is all about raising revenue. The city of Dayton is the worst at bilking fines from their citizens. Most other Ohio cities are not to the level Dayton is. Regulating speed and safe roads can be accomplished in other ways without violating individual rights. Other than DUI speeding is the number 1 killer of people in auto accidents. Excuse me if you want a constitutional right to be a menace to society.

^ I fail to see the distinction. You break the law, you get a citation. Speeding and running red lights are dangerous and driving is a privilege.

There is no individual right to break traffic laws.

TIf's in Cleveland do not include the school portion. CMSD continues to receive it's share of taxes. NuCleus is attempting to get a full TIF and providing the school with upfront money.

Don't count on it. Foxconn loves to over promise to get their handout and under deliver. America and the Foxconn Dream https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-07-27/america-and-the-foxconn-dream

Yes.

I'll make one final comment and then I will stop taking this thread off topic. The following statement can all be true 1. Wisconsin is doing well 2. The Foxconn deal is a terrible example of "economic development" 3. The state government in Wisconsin is pissing away decades of investment in higher education to dole out tax cuts and road infrastructure cuts 4. JobsOhio is terrible with the exception of Columbus 2020 That is all

Let's go back and read what I said earlier, it's a wait and see game. Nothing has been set in stone. Tell me how JobsOhio has been such a huge success with the incentives they have thrown out? High unemployment rate and going on two years of sluggish job growth. Ohio's economy isn't exactly on the fast track to success. Obama's policies are reaching down to the state level, and we are seeing many states grow and prosper, meanwhile in Ohio, the growth is well below average and I see that as something to be concerned about. Incentives are not really going to grow your economy. You grow your economy by investing in education and attracting educated young prople. Wisconsin has prospered because they historically invested in higher education. Since walker took office Wisconsin has decreased investment in education and pretty much everything else. Those cuts will take time to hurt Wisconsin who's now playing the pay for jobs game.