RiverViewer

I guess I read this as indicating we southerners were less diverse: But perhaps I read something into that. I guess reading that Cincinnati is hostile to diversity (without any evidence, again) led me to the unintended conclusion that it was less diverse. But regardless, what about the other points?

Wow, I hadn't even read these when I wrote the post above: Citation, please? It may be true, but it would mean a 75% jump in the last five years of those years - it would mean going from an annual growth rate of 2.6% during the 1990's to an annual growth rate of 12%!!! Could be true, but I'm not going to take it on faith based on your assertion. Citation, please? It may well be that their growth rates are not the same, but I'd love to see some statitics, not just assertions. I'm not trying to be a snot here, but you've been dead wrong way too many times in this thread already for me to take your assertions as facts.

You keep saying that - do you have any documentation to back that up? I went hunting for some historical data, and have found this, from the 1990 census. Lucas County's population was 462,361; its Hispanic population was 15,658. That's a 3.39% Latino population. In 2000, it was 4.50% of 450K, which is 20,300ish, about 4,600 more people. Yes, the community has grown, by 33% - but to say the community materialized after 1990 is just false. I pulled down the census's .pdf's on 1980 data, but they don't divide race by MSA, far as I could see. However, the total Hispanic population in Ohio was 120,002 in 1980, compared with 139,696 in 1990 - it grew by 16% between those two years. If you'd like to assert that Toledo grew at a significantly faster rate than the rest of the state, I'd be interested to see how you know that - but I haven't seen any numbers to back that up. So, let me make a list: 1) You asserted, without any citations, that Southwest Ohio was less diverse than Northwest Ohio - that wasn't true. 2) You asserted, without any citations, that Toledo's Latino community is a 1990's/2000's phenomenon - that wasn't true. 3) You asserted, without any citations, that Toledo's economy is in the shitter, that there are no jobs there. With an unemployment rate of 6.5%, that's hardly in the shitter. Historically, it's not fantastic, but we're not talking about a dustbowl here. So, following all of this, you assert that it's the political climate that has caused Toledo's Hispanic population to boom, without either giving a citation or explaining a plausible mechanism by which that works. Meanwhile, ColDay's been saying that folks move where they can find work and feed their families, and you say that's too simplistic. Fine - but please don't be surprised if some folks don't find your arguments persuasive...

Oh, I am so there...talk about cool...

Wow - pretty amazing pattern from the ward map - the closest ward to downtown that Pepper won was Price Hill (and parts of Sedamsville/Saylor Park are closer) - everything else was in the outer ring: Sedamsville/Saylor Park Price Hill Westwood Covedale Hyde Park Mt. Lookout Mt. Washington/California All of the other 19 wards went to Mallory, some of them by huge margins...Brian Griffin suggested yesterday that Pepper should run in the 2nd Congressional District against Jean Schmidt next year...that's a really huge jump up politically, but with his supporters, and his being almost a Republican anyway, I wonder if he might not be able to pull it off...

I've always seen Cincinnati as having many more "mini-enclaves" of whatever sub-grouping, and fewer regular enclaves. Like, where I used to live in Clifton on Ludlow, there were four houses in a row with gay folks, with the rainbow flags flying and a huge Gay Pride Parade Block Party kind of thing, with different people moving in and out (most of them were rentals), but always a little island of gay-itude...it was very cool, but it was just one corner, not a whole community. I see it most notably in the housing stock - little pockets of beautiful houses amidst a bunch of blight, or little pockets of blight amidst a bunch of nice neighborhoods... I haven't made a study of it by any means, but that's always been my impression, and could be one of the reasons we don't seem to have a big gay community, and that where we have one, they aren't as impactful at turning a place around...

Just to put a few facts out to round out the discussion a touch...Hamilton County actually has a higher percentage of foreign born people than Lucas County does - 3.4% to 3.2%. Overall, Cincinnati and its surrounding counties are pretty much just as diverse as Toledo and its surrounding counties - it's just that Toledo has more Latinos, and Cincinnati has more black folks, but both have about the same percentage of non-Latino whites. Here's some numbers I pulled from the census: Foreign Born Hispanic Black White Total Population Lucas 3.20% 4.50% 17.00% 75.40% 450,632 Henry 1.30% 5.40% 0.60% 93.00% 29,382 Fulton 1.30% 5.80% 0.20% 92.70% 42,919 Wood 2.40% 3.30% 1.30% 93.30% 123,278 Ottowa 1.10% 3.70% 0.60% 94.60% 41,407 Area: 2.73% 4.36% 11.45% 81.60% 687,618 Foreign Born Hispanic Black White Total Population Hamilton 3.40% 1.10% 23.40% 72.90% 814,611 Butler 2.70% 1.40% 5.30% 91.20% 346,560 Warren 2.30% 1.00% 2.70% 94.70% 189,276 Clermont 1.60% 0.90% 0.90% 97.10% 188,614 Area: 2.89% 1.13% 14.02% 82.67% 1,539,061 ...and by the way, Lorain County blows Lucas County away on Latino population - it's 6.9% Hispanic in Lorain County, vs. 4.5% in Lucas County. Now, is that because Lorain County is so much more Blue than Lucas County? Well, Kerry won Lucas County 60/40...he won Lorain County 56/44...Lucas is bluer than Lorain, but Lorain has 50% more Latinos than Lucas. Sandusky, with a 7.0% Hispanic population, went for Bush 56/44; Franklin, with a 2.3% Hispanic population, went for Kerry 55/45. I guess I'd have two questions here: 1) Is there any evidence that politics is in any way related to diversity in general, Latino diversity specifically? I mean, it's easy to assert it, but I see nothing that corroborates it in any way. Maybe Bush/Kerry is an inadequate measure of the politics asserted - what would work better? Maybe counties and county groups are too small to see the trends emerge - what would work better? 2) What's the mechanism? How do these politics actually work? Do Latinos in rural Georgia decide to leave their job so they can live in liberal Rhode Island? That sounds like hyperbole, but it's not unreasonable - perhaps successful Latinos do gravitate towards more accepting areas (which they measure how?), and then are the key for bringing friends and family with them. I know of a very large Russian, particularly Jewish Russian community here in Cincinnati - because a couple enterprising folks made it out of the Soviet Union in the 80's, then sponsored a cousin, who brought his brother, who brought his parents, etc., etc...is that how this is working? If there is any relationship, by the way, I suspect the causality is reversed - that a community grows up somewhere and impacts the politics, not that the politics in any way impacts the initial immigration. I could be wrong, but I'd love to see something more than assertions on the subject...

Wow, thanks for digging that up. Hope it gets cleared up soon...I'll report on here the first day I hear anything happening...

Aargh...but thank you for the review of where things stand. You should free-lance for the Enquirer! Mr. Comprehensive Overview...

I drive past it every day, and can hear the construction sounds from my house when they start up at 7:30am, and can report that they haven't done much of anything in probably more than a month. Last week one day I heard what may have been some pounding, like someone driving a metal pole into the ground with a sledge hammer, and since it was 7:30, I thought it might be construction related, but it stopped right away. That's all I've heard or seen in a long time now.

Just drove past it this morning on Eastern (er...sorry, on Riverside Drive), and it's cool that it's so prominent, sticking up above the trees. I'll have to pay attention, see if it's visible from Columbia Parkway, or if Twain's Point gets too much in the way.

^Absolutely...though in a different way...

Very cool...I wanted to get down to see it today, but the wife and I slacked today...thanks for the pictures!

^Yeah, winkies are helpful, though, especially if one is just scanning through, reading things quickly... I'm thinking the $100-$150 range is great, because I don't know if I'll actually stick with riding regularly or not. I'm not really good at doing anything that isn't very fun just because I think I ought to...so I love hiking and walking, but walking regularly for exercise gets old, since I can only go so far in the morning...a bike would open up a whole world, relatively speaking. So then, if I'm still interested in riding regularly by, say, next summer, I can upgrade to a higher-end model then, and give my old one to my brother or a friend or something...and if I'm not, then I'd rather have a cheap bike gathering dust than a pricey one! I'm going to Reser's tomorrow - my wife and I will either be walking there (depending on the weather), or I'll just drive down there...I'll let you all know how it goes! I'm sure you're all waiting with bated breath!

I think with all the hills around here, and my not-very-athletic physique, that lots of gears will probably be helpful. Of course, I imagine my low gear will primarily be "walking next to the bike" gear...but I've gotta say, Rob, you look like an ass-kicker in that picture, with your black jeans and long sweatshirt and that "don't even try it" look... I think I'm going to go to Reser in Newport, because I can walk there - my wife and I were talking about walking to T. M. Berry Park to see the new sculpture thing that I think Grasscat posted on earlier, then over to Newport for a movie, so I'm going to walk down to Reser as part of that. Won't be buying anything yet until I save up a little cash, but I can figure out what might work...plus we'll be close enough to Riverside Korean to stop in for a meal! Fantastic food there...

I've seen stories that say they decrease safety - that accident statistics go up at intersections with red lights. I don't think they're a panacea... Here's an Instapundit post on the topic, with a few links to stories about increased accidents at camera'd-intersections...

Didn't Citibeat used to have a series like this? Maybe we should send the thread to them and ask them to revive the series...maybe Grasscat could free-lance it for them!

Any urban cyclists on the board? I'm thinking of buying a bike for exercise/exploring purposes, and was hoping maybe someone here could give some insight into gear/routes/riding etiquette/general recommendations/etc... Regarding gear, I want to get something geared (I'm in Cincinnati, which means hills galore) and fairly cheap (since I'll probably lose interest in short order and return to drinking and smoking for entertainment) - but I don't need to go off-road, and don't want to be hunched over all the time. I'm 6' 1", so I don't know if this Mongoose Placid or this Schwinn Tornado would be comfortable enough...or should I go to a bike shop, or is buying used good enough? I'm also wondering about accessories...what are good helmets, headlights, locks, air pumps? I can't tell if speedometers and odometers come standard on the bikes or not - if not, are there cheap and reliable ones? Any thoughts/observations are very welcome, and thanks for your help!

At last! Now the folks in the Tri-County area will finally have access to some retail! Sorry, a touch o' sarcasm there...

Oh, yes...they had me at "A new entrance with unobstructed views of downtown." I can't believe they haven't made use of their amazing view of the entire basin before. This alone is worth the project - the fact that they'd also be displaying more of their permanent collection is just bonus points!

I was in Main Strasse years ago (actually, it was during the riots in April, 2001), and remember seeing signs posted in all the businesses about not wanting a jail in their neighborhood...this issue has simmered for years...

Wow...those views get cooler and cooler... Anyone have any idea how they create these pictures? Like this set Grasscat posted in the Overlook at Eden Park thread...

Thank you as always! These threads and updates are just fantastic - a tour of activity across the area - just wonderful!

^I'd considered that, or getting off at Reading (haven't been that way in a while), but had one of those "fuck that, this is a public goddamn street" moments...normally Sunday morning is my exploration time - I play organ and sub at assorted churches now and then, and will often go exploring after the service - 11am on a Sunday is normally a good time for getting lost and seeing what's out there. But yeah, 5pm on a Sunday afternoon is a completely different scene...

I'm coming into this late in the game, but I did want to object to this comment. I wouldn't drive up Vine Street at 11pm on a hot Saturday night. I would only drive up Linn at the same time if I had to. But I would (and do) drive McMillan or Gilbert any hour of the day or night, straight through Peeble's Corner, and not give it a second thought. I don't think there's any comparison between the two. There will sometimes be people hanging out along McMillan, but maybe due to a wider street, all one way, with ample sidewalks, I've never felt intimidated there. But just the other night my wife and I went to a movie at Newport OTL, and needed to go to CVS in Clifton to refill a prescription - I took 471 to 71 and got off at Liberty, to Vine, then up the hill - the fastest route. And on Vine, between Liberty and McMicken, there were crowds of bored people standing around, throwing shit across the street. The whole west side of the street was drowning in litter. It just takes one dumb-ass kid (and I was a dumb-ass kid, so I know how little it takes) to decide that a rock thrown at a car would be fun, to make the fastest route at best an expensive pain in the ass, and at worst an incident - there have been a couple stories of "mini-riots" on Vine that didn't get much play in the media, where groups of kids started throwing beer bottles at cars, and it escalated when the cops got there. I LOVE this city - I want nothing but wonderful things for everyone who lives here, to preserve the architecture and the culture of all the communities. But if it's preserving the city vs. the safety of my wife, I'm serving the city up a big steaming plate of Fuck You Fondu. Ain't nothing worth that. The asshole that assaulted Mary Poole did far more than just assault a person - he stole a city from her. That's unforgiveable. Is OTR as bad as they say? I'd say no (depending on who "they" is and what it is they're saying) - you can drive there, walk there, shop there, live there, and be fine most of the time. But the more important question is, "is it bad enough to fuck things up for the whole city?" And the answer is, without a doubt, yes.