Posted March 7, 201015 yr As a former Shaker Hts. national merit recipient it makes me proud to know we still stick it to the private schools... all that tuition... http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2010/03/shaker_heights_solon_lead_grea.html Shaker Heights, Solon lead Greater Cleveland with most National Merit Scholar semifinalists By Rich Exner, The Plain Dealer March 06, 2010, 6:45PM Statistical Snapshot Ken Marshall, PD Shaker Heights and Solon have the most National Merit Scholarship semifinalists in Greater Cleveland. Nearly 200 Northeast Ohio high school seniors are among about 16,000 semifinalists announced last year by National Merit Scholarship Corp. They represent less than 1 percent of high school seniors nationwide. Here are the area schools with the most semifinalists: Shaker Heights, 17 Solon, 17 Hawken, 15 St. Ignatius, 14 Hathaway Brown, 11 Beachwood, 8 University School, 8 Archbishop Hoban, 6 Hudson, 6 Orange, 6 EDIT: no west-side schools.
March 8, 201015 yr This information is interesting (though a little bit old), but as I said on another thread, I think that NMSFs are a product of the socioeconomic status of the students attending a particular school, and less an indicator of the academic quality of said school.
March 8, 201015 yr Shaker Heights, 17 Solon, 17 Hawken, 15 St. Ignatius, 14 Hathaway Brown, 11 Beachwood, 8 University School, 8 Archbishop Hoban, 6 Hudson, 6 Orange, 6 EDIT: no west-side schools. Ignatius is on the West Side.
March 8, 201015 yr Shaker Heights, 17 Solon, 17 Hawken, 15 St. Ignatius, 14 Hathaway Brown, 11 Beachwood, 8 University School, 8 Archbishop Hoban, 6 Hudson, 6 Orange, 6 EDIT: no west-side schools. Ignatius is on the West Side. Barely. :) And I'd still venture to guess that a large chunk of their NMSFs were eastsiders considering the wide geographic draw of Ignatius.
March 8, 201015 yr By westside-eastside I was primarily directing that remark towards public schools. This information is interesting (though a little bit old), but as I said on another thread, I think that NMSFs are a product of the socioeconomic status of the students attending a particular school, and less an indicator of the academic quality of said school. I agree to a certain extent but the numbers don't correlate 100%. Certainly East Cleveland isn't going to be churning out Ivy Leaguers anytime soon but then what is the excuse for Westlake, Bay Village, Rocky River, Lakewood, Avon, Brecksville and all the other exurbs I hear about all day? I would wager that many of those cities have equal if not higher average incomes than Shaker and no where near the types of urban issues and yet they are no where to be found...
March 8, 201015 yr I've never even heard of national merit scholar until this post; I had to go look it up online. Very interesting.
March 8, 201015 yr I've never even heard of national merit scholar until this post; I had to go look it up online. Very interesting. Seriously? It is as well known as the ACT or SAT in high schools.
March 8, 201015 yr Well, I guess I agree in part about the "socioeconomic status," argument but the thing is that "socioeconomic status" is a huge umbrella of a term. For example, suppose you have someone who is the child of two private schoolteachers. Private schoolteachers generally earn less than their public counterparts. That family income might be under $50,000. It's almost certainly under $75,000. However, if you count the "socio-" part of "socioeconomic status," that child may well have a lot more social than economic capital backing him up and be a frontrunner for a National Merit Scholarship, or comparable measures of success. I would guess that most National Merit Scholars are children from above-median-income households. However, I would guess that an even greater portion of them are children from at least stable households: parents that aren't divorced, alcoholics, stoners, 70s music fans, etc. I think all of that fairly falls within the "socio-" prefix, so on that ground, I agree with the premise. I would also hypothesize that National Merit Scholars are only slightly more prevalent per capita at the 99th income percentile than at the 75th or the 60th. The difference between the 1st, 25th, and 50th income percentiles is likely incredibly striking, however.
March 8, 201015 yr I would also hypothesize that National Merit Scholars are only slightly more prevalent per capita at the 99th income percentile than at the 75th or the 60th. The difference between the 1st, 25th, and 50th income percentiles is likely incredibly striking, however. So what explains suburbs like Westlake, which have on average very stable households and >75th percentile household incomes, not cracking the list (and in some cases not having a single NMSF)?
March 8, 201015 yr Some schools - Shaker Hts - really try to separate their exceptional students moreso than other public schools. They are in smaller classes with more advanced students. Much more than your average AP program. Cleveland Hts High used to do something like this when I went there, but I don't think they do so much anymore with the whole dividing the HS into four separate schools.
March 8, 201015 yr I would also hypothesize that National Merit Scholars are only slightly more prevalent per capita at the 99th income percentile than at the 75th or the 60th. The difference between the 1st, 25th, and 50th income percentiles is likely incredibly striking, however. So what explains suburbs like Westlake, which have on average very stable households and >75th percentile household incomes, not cracking the list (and in some cases not having a single NMSF)? Here is the answer viewed through tainted lense of an urban snob: Why do you find more NMSFs in Shaker Heights as compared to Westlake: Truly smart people appreciate good architecture.
March 8, 201015 yr I would also hypothesize that National Merit Scholars are only slightly more prevalent per capita at the 99th income percentile than at the 75th or the 60th. The difference between the 1st, 25th, and 50th income percentiles is likely incredibly striking, however. So what explains suburbs like Westlake, which have on average very stable households and >75th percentile household incomes, not cracking the list (and in some cases not having a single NMSF)? Here is the answer viewed through tainted lense of an urban snob: Why do you find more NMSFs in Shaker Heights as compared to Westlake: Truly smart people appreciate good architecture. As far as demographic goes, I really wouldn't say there is much of a difference between Solon, Orange, Hudson and Beachwood compared to Westlake.
March 8, 201015 yr I would also hypothesize that National Merit Scholars are only slightly more prevalent per capita at the 99th income percentile than at the 75th or the 60th. The difference between the 1st, 25th, and 50th income percentiles is likely incredibly striking, however. So what explains suburbs like Westlake, which have on average very stable households and >75th percentile household incomes, not cracking the list (and in some cases not having a single NMSF)? Is Shaker that much richer than Westlake? If anything, I thought the reverse might be true, but I don't know my Cleveland suburbs as well as my Columbus ones (and Akron ones, to an extent).
March 8, 201015 yr I would also hypothesize that National Merit Scholars are only slightly more prevalent per capita at the 99th income percentile than at the 75th or the 60th. The difference between the 1st, 25th, and 50th income percentiles is likely incredibly striking, however. So what explains suburbs like Westlake, which have on average very stable households and >75th percentile household incomes, not cracking the list (and in some cases not having a single NMSF)? Here is the answer viewed through tainted lense of an urban snob: Why do you find more NMSFs in Shaker Heights as compared to Westlake: Truly smart people appreciate good architecture. That might be the most touche response I have seen on this board in awhile (not including my own responses of course ;))
March 8, 201015 yr ^I'd guess educational attainment by parents is an even better predictor of NMSF than income. And even though average incomes may be similar (I haven't checked it), what distinguishes Shaker from Westlake and most other suburbs in the region (other than the corridor heading due east to Gates Mills/Hunting Valley) is the educational attainment of its residents. Proximity to University Circle has a lot to do with it, but the architecture, reputation and the mass of others with similar backgrounds also matter. NMSF totals don't tell you anything about quality of school except that it's supportive enough to cultivate smart kids who are probably from smart families. And the NMSF numbers tell you where there's probably a large population of very well educated families with high educational ambitions. It'd be interesting to look at percentage of students who are national merit. That would probably put the independent schools (Hawken, HB, US) on top of the list.
March 9, 201015 yr I re-ranked the list according to StrapHanger's conjecture. The correlation is undeniable. NMSF/Enrollment Hawken 15% University Schools 6.7% Hathaway Brown 4.95% Shaker Heights 4.47% Beachwood 4.44% Solon 3.95% St. Ignatius 3.89% Orange 3% Archbishop Hoban 2.67% Hudson 1.27% So clearly the near east side privates are in their own tier and it seems that Shaker, Beachwood, Solon and Orange are all within a few students give or take every year of being neck and neck.
March 9, 201015 yr I would also hypothesize that National Merit Scholars are only slightly more prevalent per capita at the 99th income percentile than at the 75th or the 60th. The difference between the 1st, 25th, and 50th income percentiles is likely incredibly striking, however. So what explains suburbs like Westlake, which have on average very stable households and >75th percentile household incomes, not cracking the list (and in some cases not having a single NMSF)? Here is the answer viewed through tainted lense of an urban snob: Why do you find more NMSFs in Shaker Heights as compared to Westlake: Truly smart people appreciate good architecture. Snobbish but true, when I worked in Westlake in 2008 and people found out I lived in Shaker they told me to drive down Hilliard Blvd to see some "Shaker houses"... needless to say I almost threw up when I saw portico after portico that looked like they were stolen from Saddam Hussein palaces. Wish I had a picture of this one in particular on the South side of the blvd with all these crazy animal statues... I thought to myself... NBA or NFL?
March 9, 201015 yr There's a Cleveland school with almost one in six students getting into the National Merit Semifinals? That's impressive. I hadn't even heard of this Hawken School in more than passing until just a few months ago (and I think it was on these boards).
March 9, 201015 yr I re-ranked the list according to StrapHanger's conjecture. The correlation is undeniable. NMSF/Enrollment Hawken 15% University Schools 6.7% Hathaway Brown 4.95% Shaker Heights 4.47% Beachwood 4.44% Solon 3.95% St. Ignatius 3.89% Orange 3% Archbishop Hoban 2.67% Hudson 1.27% So clearly the near east side privates are in their own tier and it seems that Shaker, Beachwood, Solon and Orange are all within a few students give or take every year of being neck and neck. From where did you obtain enrollment numbers? And were you doing it for one grade (since NMSFs is limited to 11th graders)?
March 9, 201015 yr There's a Cleveland school with almost one in six students getting into the National Merit Semifinals? That's impressive. I hadn't even heard of this Hawken School in more than passing until just a few months ago (and I think it was on these boards). I was going to comment that I thought that 15 number was a bit a maximum outlier for them, but from doing a bit of research, I see they had 16 and 12 in the previous two years. Pretty amazing!
March 9, 201015 yr There's a Cleveland school with almost one in six students getting into the National Merit Semifinals? That's impressive. I hadn't even heard of this Hawken School in more than passing until just a few months ago (and I think it was on these boards). Indeed and I may not be a statistician but from growing up around here I can tell you this, U.S., H.B. TEND to attract a W.A.S.P.ier student body where as Hawken, though diverse, attracts many of the orthodox and conservative Jewish students of the east-side. Coupled with the fact that this more conservative group of Jews is tight-nit geographically and socially, generally successful... clearly this does not account for all of the NM at Hawken but where certain groups have strong traditions and "pipelines" is worth noting. (note: hawken is very small in comparison to the other privates, regardless I checked 2009 stats and they had 15 in 09 as well) I think it is well known and accepted in America that Jews put particular importance on academic performance. The Catholics (except myself... yay public school) go to Iggy and so on... Conversely Solon has a very large Asian population that work at Solon based tech firms and also University Circle jobs. I would bet a good chunk of their NM students represent that fact. I am making no assumptions based on ethnicity, I just find it interesting and worth bringing up.
March 9, 201015 yr I re-ranked the list according to StrapHanger's conjecture. The correlation is undeniable. NMSF/Enrollment Hawken 15% University Schools 6.7% Hathaway Brown 4.95% Shaker Heights 4.47% Beachwood 4.44% Solon 3.95% St. Ignatius 3.89% Orange 3% Archbishop Hoban 2.67% Hudson 1.27% So clearly the near east side privates are in their own tier and it seems that Shaker, Beachwood, Solon and Orange are all within a few students give or take every year of being neck and neck. From where did you obtain enrollment numbers? And were you doing it for one grade (since NMSFs is limited to 11th graders)? Even though the PSAT is taken in the 10th-11th grade I looked for stats of either, A. senior class or if "A." could not be found B. total enrollment of high school/4. To be fair I did not find a reliable source that had every stat so some stats are from different sources. (some are school websites, some were from city-data.com and some were wikipedia) That being said they are by no means to be taken as absolute fact. Thats why I stressed the statistical "groupings" that seemed to have formed. i.e. the elite privates, near east site publics and others...
March 9, 201015 yr I re-ranked the list according to StrapHanger's conjecture. The correlation is undeniable. NMSF/Enrollment Hawken 15% University Schools 6.7% Hathaway Brown 4.95% Shaker Heights 4.47% Beachwood 4.44% Solon 3.95% St. Ignatius 3.89% Orange 3% Archbishop Hoban 2.67% Hudson 1.27% So clearly the near east side privates are in their own tier and it seems that Shaker, Beachwood, Solon and Orange are all within a few students give or take every year of being neck and neck. From where did you obtain enrollment numbers? And were you doing it for one grade (since NMSFs is limited to 11th graders)? Even though the PSAT is taken in the 10th-11th grade I looked for stats of either, A. senior class or if "A." could not be found B. total enrollment of high school/4. To be fair I did not find a reliable source that had every stat so some stats are from different sources. (some are school websites, some were from city-data.com and some were wikipedia) That being said they are by no means to be taken as absolute fact. Thats why I stressed the statistical "groupings" that seemed to have formed. i.e. the elite privates, near east site publics and others... Good deal, it's hard to pin these numbers down. Another reliable source is the NCES website. In a perfect world we'd be able to find out how many kids took the test at each school each year, but that information would be nearly impossible to track down.
March 9, 201015 yr Indeed and I may not be a statistician but from growing up around here I can tell you this, U.S., H.B. TEND to attract a W.A.S.P.ier student body where as Hawken, though diverse, attracts many of the orthodox and conservative Jewish students of the east-side. Coupled with the fact that this more conservative group of Jews is tight-nit geographically and socially, generally successful... clearly this does not account for all of the NM at Hawken but where certain groups have strong traditions and "pipelines" is worth noting. (note: hawken is very small in comparison to the other privates, regardless I checked 2009 stats and they had 15 in 09 as well) I think it is well known and accepted in America that Jews put particular importance on academic performance. Plenty of secular and reform Jews at Hawken, but unless things have changed dramatically in 15 years, virtually no Orthodox. Still lots of WASPS there too, but as you say, diverse. Partly because it's co ed and less traditional, it tends to attract a more "progressive" student body too. Is Shaker that much richer than Westlake? If anything, I thought the reverse might be true, but I don't know my Cleveland suburbs as well as my Columbus ones (and Akron ones, to an extent). Median household income may be lower in Shaker because of its economic diversity and large multi family stock (grad students, newly weds, retirees, working class), but I believe median family income is higher than Westlake, and I would bet good money average family income is significantly higher. Getting back to the socioeconomic explanation for NMSF on the East side: here are all the census tracts in the Cleveland area that were among the top 1000 "neighborhoods" nationally in mean (average) household income per the 2000 census (as compiled by Stephen Higley on his fascinating web site http://higley1000.com/about-this-site/methodology/neighborhoods-by-metro) 1: Hunting Valley (Hunting Valley) Mean Household Income: $373,181, Higley 1000 #33 0.0% Black, 0.0% Asian, 0.0% Hispanic and 99.3% Non-Hispanic White. View Hunting Valley on Google Maps 2: Boulevard-Malvern (Shaker Heights) Mean Household Income: $235,706, Higley 1000 #431 4.8% Black, 1.9% Asian, 0.0% Hispanic and 93.4% Non-Hispanic White. View Boulevard-Malvern on Google Maps 3: Bentleyville (Bentleyville) Mean Household Income: $233,809, Higley 1000 #446 0.7% Black, 1.3% Asian, 1.3% Hispanic and 96.6% Non-Hispanic White. View Bentleyville on Google Maps 4: Laureldale (Shaker Heights) Mean Household Income: $203,990, Higley 1000 #768 7.0% Black, 2.1% Asian, 2.8% Hispanic and 86.4% Non-Hispanic White. View Laureldale on Google Maps 5: Kirtland Hills (Kirtland Hills) Mean Household Income: $199,979, Higley 1000 #824 0.0% Black, 0.0% Asian, 0.0% Hispanic and 99.1% Non-Hispanic White. View Kirtland Hills on Google Maps 6: Gates Mills (Gates Mills) Mean Household Income: $196,913, Higley 1000 #877 0.7% Black, 5.2% Asian, 1.1% Hispanic and 93.1% Non-Hispanic White. View Gates Mills on Google Maps 7: Pepper Pike (Pepper Pike) Mean Household Income: $191,935, Higley 1000 #960 5.0% Black, 4.3% Asian, 0.0% Hispanic and 90.3% Non-Hispanic White. View Pepper Pike on Google Maps
March 9, 201015 yr Very interesting link! I hadn't seen that one before. Sites like that are porn to stats junkies like me.
March 9, 201015 yr Note that Gates Mills and Hunting Valley are home to the uppers campuses for Hawken School and University School, respectively, and the two Shaker Heights neighborhoods on the above list are home to Hathaway Brown and Laurel. Just a coincidence, but very interesting, none-the-less. Orthodox Jews don't tend to use the public or private/independent schools. They have their own system of schools, such as Fuchs Mizrachi and a few others whose names escape me at the moment. I had a number of Jewish friends growing up who attended U.S. or Hawken for high school after attending grade school at Agnon.
March 9, 201015 yr Note that Gates Mills and Hunting Valley are home to the uppers campuses for Hawken School and University School, respectively, and the two Shaker Heights neighborhoods on the above list are home to Hathaway Brown and Laurel. Just a coincidence, but very interesting, none-the-less. Orthodox Jews don't tend to use the public or private/independent schools. They have their own system of schools, such as Fuchs Mizrachi and a few others whose names escape me at the moment. I had a number of Jewish friends growing up who attended U.S. or Hawken for high school after attending grade school at Agnon. That and Solomon Schechter (sp?). Don't forget University Lower School (k-8) is in Shaker, same neighborhood as Laurel, Laureldale. I live in the Malvern neighborhood in Shaker and its a shame they shut down Malvern elementary in the early 90s... I had to go to Onaway and I always missed the damn bus.
March 9, 201015 yr There's a Cleveland school with almost one in six students getting into the National Merit Semifinals? That's impressive. I hadn't even heard of this Hawken School in more than passing until just a few months ago (and I think it was on these boards). $17,000+/yr for Kindergarten!!!... and the price goes up from there. I think Hathaway Brown starts at $18,500. U.S., Laurel and Gilmour are in that range as well. And I would not necessarily call US and Hawken near-east side schools anymore. The University School building in Shaker Heights used to house the entire school for 80 some years. But their upper campus was built on a 400 acre lot in Hunting Valley. They have a maple syrup factory and fish hatchery in addition to great athletic fields. Hawken also moved its upper school from its Lyndhurst campus to just across the county line in Geauga. I think they transformed some kind of gigantic farm into their new campus. It sits on a very large parcel, with trails and endless fields.
March 9, 201015 yr Note that Gates Mills and Hunting Valley are home to the uppers campuses for Hawken School and University School, respectively, and the two Shaker Heights neighborhoods on the above list are home to Hathaway Brown and Laurel. Just a coincidence, but very interesting, none-the-less. Orthodox Jews don't tend to use the public or private/independent schools. They have their own system of schools, such as Fuchs Mizrachi and a few others whose names escape me at the moment. I had a number of Jewish friends growing up who attended U.S. or Hawken for high school after attending grade school at Agnon. That and Solomon Schechter (sp?). Don't forget University Lower School (k-8) is in Shaker, same neighborhood as Laurel, Laureldale. I live in the Malvern neighborhood in Shaker and its a shame they shut down Malvern elementary in the early 90s... I had to go to Onaway and I always missed the damn bus. I grew up near Northwood School in UH and the same thing happened to me. I started elementary school a few years after it was closed, so I had to attend Canterbury, and unfortunately, I was just barely close enough that I was ineligible for bus service, so I had to walk. It's cool that Shaker Heights found a way to re-purpose those classic old school buildings and not tear them down. Sussex is the family center, Moreland is the main library, Malvern is home to a private school whose name escapes me, and the other elementary school I believe is sitting dormant (the one near Shaker Square off of Van Aken). CH-UH tore down a few of its beautiful old school buildings (Taylor and Coventry, perhaps one or two others) and replaced them with ugly 60s/70s style monstrosities. Also, although SH doesn't have nine elementary schools like it used to, it's good that the district kept some semblance of its neighborhood school system. SE-L had to all but abandon its neighborhood schools a year or two back. I've always been struck by just how beautiful the architecture of the CH-UH and SH school district buildings are. Really unique for this area, and probably even statewide. You just don't see many old buildings like that around these days, especially not in the suburbs. Though I do get the impression that they're very expensive to maintain!
March 9, 201015 yr There's a Cleveland school with almost one in six students getting into the National Merit Semifinals? That's impressive. I hadn't even heard of this Hawken School in more than passing until just a few months ago (and I think it was on these boards). $17,000+/yr for Kindergarten!!!... and the price goes up from there. I think Hathaway Brown starts at $18,500. U.S., Laurel and Gilmour are in that range as well. And I would not necessarily call US and Hawken near-east side schools anymore. The University School building in Shaker Heights used to house the entire school for 80 some years. But their upper campus was built on a 400 acre lot in Hunting Valley. They have a maple syrup factory and fish hatchery in addition to great athletic fields. Hawken also moved its upper school from its Lyndhurst campus to just across the county line in Geauga. I think they transformed some kind of gigantic farm into their new campus. It sits on a very large parcel, with trails and endless fields. Yes, the newer campuses of U.S. and Hawken are, in a word, expansive. Hawken is technically in Chester Township but they have a mailbox across the street so they can claim a Gates Mills address. I don't know how one can define the identity of those split campus schools. Both maintain significant presences in the inner-ring eastern suburbs, and both clearly have a strong draw in that area, but it's also apparent that their student base has slowly progressed further east in each successive decade. Although each seems committed to keeping their lower campuses in place (for instance Hawken just built a new middle school and U.S. has made significant capital investment to their Shaker campus), I wouldn't be shocked if at some point in the future either or both moved their entire campuses to Hunting Valley/Gates Mills. Hopefully the trends of sprawl reverse themselves before that becomes an issue!
March 9, 201015 yr Malvern is home to a private school whose name escapes me... Hanna Perkins School P.S. I forgot Hawken has an upper campus as well... I remember going to watch my gf in highschool play lacrosse there. The grounds there are amazing. I would love a spread out in the cut like that and maintain my permanent address here in Shaker... Mega Millions every Tuesday and Friday!
March 9, 201015 yr And it's worth noting that many of the most successful high schools in struggling urban school districts are in older, nicer, architecturally significant buildings. Stivers in Dayton, Walnut in Cincinnati both come to mind. Also, a friend of mine from college went to Gilmour Academy in Cleveland. I'm pretty sure it's nice but do you guys know anything about it? I assume it's much smaller than St. Ignatius. Another question: a girl I know went to Western Reserve boarding school. How did it stack up? She was kinda crazy so I'm not sure if it's great or just a boarding school that's in Ohio.
March 9, 201015 yr Yes it is (Gilmour) quite small when compared to St. Iggy, probably 1/3 or 1/4 the graduating class if I had to guess. It is located in Gates Mills, which is for comparison sake is somewhat identical to Hunting Valley. (bucolic new england style wealth). It is a Catholic school and my neighbors sons go there. (my other neighbors sons go to Iggy come to think of it) St. Ignatius also is a powerhouse in athletics, they are in the heart of Cleveland right by the west-side market and offer scholarships to some of the areas best athletes. If you are good at football in the city of Cleveland, you transfer to Glenville (public) or you go to Iggy or Eds. Western Reserve DEF. has that reputation. I knew three girls that went there and they only went there AFTER they had gotten in so much trouble, drinking/drugs/sex that their parents couldn't handle it. I am sure there are exceptions but that was and is my perception. It is the oldest boarding school outside of the North East and to be honest boarding is not all that prevalent here as I am sure you know.
March 9, 201015 yr I don't know how one can define the identity of those split campus schools. Both maintain significant presences in the inner-ring eastern suburbs, and both clearly have a strong draw in that area, but it's also apparent that their student base has slowly progressed further east in each successive decade. Although each seems committed to keeping their lower campuses in place (for instance Hawken just built a new middle school and U.S. has made significant capital investment to their Shaker campus), I wouldn't be shocked if at some point in the future either or both moved their entire campuses to Hunting Valley/Gates Mills. Hopefully the trends of sprawl reverse themselves before that becomes an issue! All true and good points- especially since all four of the east side independent schools used to be located in the city of Cleveland before moving to the eastern suburbs to follow the wealth 8o years ago. On the flip side, Hawken made a large investment in the City of Cleveland when it bought a large house at University Circle a couple years ago so it could ramp up certain kinds of education programming. Very interesting link! I hadn't seen that one before. Sites like that are porn to stats junkies like me. Tell me about it! The site sorts through those 1000 neighborhoods in several ways- it's really interesting stuff.
March 9, 201015 yr St. Eds, The Holy War. The game draws 10k and is held at Byers Field in Parma. http://www.stadiumconnection.com/stadium.php?id=1160 They go at it in everything, football, basketball, hockey, track, baseball... Iggy also has a pretty sweet Crew team. Benedictine will try to get in the mix every once in blue moon. Gilmour is not at their level in those "revenue" sports. Hockey maybe sometimes close. They are pretty solid in golf and tennis year in and year out though.
March 9, 201015 yr I graduated from Gilmour. I graduated with a class of 75, so it's tiny compared to Ignatius. My senior year, Gilmour made a big push in hockey....but Gilmour really isn't known for its sports.
March 9, 201015 yr I don't know how one can define the identity of those split campus schools. Both maintain significant presences in the inner-ring eastern suburbs, and both clearly have a strong draw in that area, but it's also apparent that their student base has slowly progressed further east in each successive decade. Although each seems committed to keeping their lower campuses in place (for instance Hawken just built a new middle school and U.S. has made significant capital investment to their Shaker campus), I wouldn't be shocked if at some point in the future either or both moved their entire campuses to Hunting Valley/Gates Mills. Hopefully the trends of sprawl reverse themselves before that becomes an issue! Don't forget about the new Montessori High School in University Circle. It is drawing kids from all over the world.
March 9, 201015 yr I graduated from Gilmour. I graduated with a class of 75, so it's tiny compared to Ignatius. My senior year, Gilmour made a big push in hockey....but Gilmour really isn't known for its sports. Isn't Gilmour a boarding school (or at least a portion of the student body)?
March 9, 201015 yr ^Yeah...we had a few. I think about 10 percent of the student body were boarding students.
March 9, 201015 yr This discussion has become very interesting. Although I really feel like a dumb public school from the country after reading all of these posts. Link to the complete list: http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/09/national_merit_scholarship_sem_1.html
March 9, 201015 yr Hawken and US both recently made SIGNIFICANT investments in their lower campuses. They aren't moving east anytime in our lifetime. Scrabble, check out this photothread for more on WRA - http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,18895.0.html Don't forget about the new Montessori High School in University Circle. It is drawing kids from all over the world. I am looking at Ruffing Montesouri in Cleveland Hts for my son. Same class size as the other privates, but half the cost. I also think that method of instruction fits his personality nicely.
March 9, 201015 yr Hawken and US both recently made SIGNIFICANT investments in their lower campuses. They aren't moving east anytime in our lifetime. Do not forget HB, the new (ish) wing that houses sciences and the cafeteria is stunning... I should do a photo thread today of the area.
March 9, 201015 yr ^ Yes. But I was responding to the thought that US and Hawken might someday abandon their lower campuses and consolidate with the upper schools. HB is beautiful though. All the private school Shaker and CH campuses are.
March 9, 201015 yr Yes it is (Gilmour) quite small when compared to St. Iggy, probably 1/3 or 1/4 the graduating class if I had to guess. It is located in Gates Mills, which is for comparison sake is somewhat identical to Hunting Valley. (bucolic new england style wealth). It is a Catholic school and my neighbors sons go there. (my other neighbors sons go to Iggy come to think of it) St. Ignatius also is a powerhouse in athletics, they are in the heart of Cleveland right by the west-side market and offer scholarships to some of the areas best athletes. If you are good at football in the city of Cleveland, you transfer to Glenville (public) or you go to Iggy or Eds. Western Reserve DEF. has that reputation. I knew three girls that went there and they only went there AFTER they had gotten in so much trouble, drinking/drugs/sex that their parents couldn't handle it. I am sure there are exceptions but that was and is my perception. It is the oldest boarding school outside of the North East and to be honest boarding is not all that prevalent here as I am sure you know. St. Ignatius doesn't give out athletic scholarships, and in fact, I think you'll be hard-pressed to find any Catholic school that does. I've never heard of WRA being a school for kids that had screwed up, but admittedly I don't know much about them (other than playing them in hockey a few times in high school). Gilmour is technically a Catholic school (was established for wealthy Catholics), but they really have more in common with the other east-side independents than most Catholic schools. Ignatius and GA are like night and day (urban vs. exurban, all-male vs. co-ed, gigantic vs. tiny, etc.). St. Eds, The Holy War. The game draws 10k and is held at Byers Field in Parma. http://www.stadiumconnection.com/stadium.php?id=1160 They go at it in everything, football, basketball, hockey, track, baseball... Iggy also has a pretty sweet Crew team. Benedictine will try to get in the mix every once in blue moon. Gilmour is not at their level in those "revenue" sports. Hockey maybe sometimes close. They are pretty solid in golf and tennis year in and year out though. Gilmour definitely has a solid hockey program, but they haven't been able to get over the hump in recent years. But really they're right on par with the traditional area powers like Eds, Padua, U.S., Ignatius. Benedictine is much smaller than Eds or Ignatius. Benny plays Eds and Iggy in most sports, but the Bengals are in a different OHSAA division so it's not as intense as it might otherwise be. Benedictine also has rivalries with VASJ, Youngstown Cardinal Mooney and Akron SVSM. Don't forget about the new Montessori High School in University Circle. It is drawing kids from all over the world. I've heard great things about it, but it's tiny. I'd be curious to see if they're planning on expanding enrollment and how they'd handle such potential growth.
March 9, 201015 yr Hawken and US both recently made SIGNIFICANT investments in their lower campuses. They aren't moving east anytime in our lifetime. Do not forget HB, the new (ish) wing that houses sciences and the cafeteria is stunning... I should do a photo thread today of the area. Yeah, I don't believe HB or Laurel are any threat to go relocate, though Laurel did open up and eastern extension campus in Geauga County a few years ago. All true and good points- especially since all four of the east side independent schools used to be located in the city of Cleveland before moving to the eastern suburbs to follow the wealth 8o years ago. Yes, and it's no coincidence that many of them ended up in Shaker Heights! The Van Swearingens wooed them to leave the city for exurban/rural (at the time) Shaker Heights.
March 9, 201015 yr St. Ignatius also is a powerhouse in athletics, they are in the heart of Cleveland right by the west-side market and offer scholarships to some of the areas best athletes. If you are good at football in the city of Cleveland, you transfer to Glenville (public) or you go to Iggy or Eds. Check your facts on Ignatius. They don't offer athletic scholarships. Financial aid (outside of a few academic scholarships) is the only way to get reduced tuition and it is handled by an outside firm to ensure fairness. If you take a look at the football team, the vast majority come from the suburbs. While Ignatius is racially more diverse than St. Eds, you'd never know it from the looks of their sports teams. St. Eds is a different story.
March 9, 201015 yr I also wouldn't worry about any of the elite east private schools relocating. Replicating a first class facility is very costly. While these schools are very well off, I don't see them justifying the expense. If they were to locate out in Geauga county, they'd only be farther from their students. To get the available land that they'd need, they'd really have to go out quite far.
March 9, 201015 yr If Iggy does not pass out "athletic" scholarships now, that practice has changed since I was in HS in the 90's. More than one kid from my team was "approached" and a friend of mine from another district was given a full ride and he was not a good student at all at a bottom tier public school. I know US does some of this too (I went there for my freshman year in HS). Sure, they don't call them athletic scholarships.... and they are "need-based".... but there certainly are kids that would not have been accepted to these schools but for their athletic talent. I would consider that an athletic scholarship.
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