My husband is finishing up an engineering degree within the next year and will be looking for a job. We're fed up with the cost of living on the west coast (we live in Portland) and have been spending some time looking into possible cities to move to after his graduation. Our biggest concerns are the availability of jobs and cost of living. The weather is not an issue for us. He will have a degree in Civil Engineering and will be looking into completing his PE. I have a Bachelor's in English and Master's in Book Publishing. I am currently working at a hydropower development company as an administrative assistant/desktop publisher making 30k/year. I would love to work in publishing, but would be happy to work a similar job to the one I have now. We don't have children, nor do we intend to. We do, however, have a dog and would appreciate a city that is dog friendly (dog parks, doggy day cares, etc).

 

Based on this information, does Cleveland sound like a decent option for us? What are the pros and cons of living in Cleveland? We're also looking into Upstate New York and some areas on Pennsylvania. Does anyone have input on how Cleveland compares?

May I ask why you're looking at those places over Columbus or Indianapolis? All the places you mentioned are hemorrhaging jobs.

May I ask why you're looking at those places over Columbus or Indianapolis? All the places you mentioned are hemorrhaging jobs.

 

Depends on your job. I found a job in Cleveland after I graduated in computer engineering and the most interviews I got were mostly in Cleveland and Dayton and I was looking in all of Ohio and neighboring states.

 

The unemployment rates for the metros of Cleveland and Columbus are very similar.

Initially I was looking because I was thinking about going back to grad school and those places seemed like livable places for a student. Now I'm not sure if I want to pursue a PhD (because the likelihood of landing a tenure track job within 5 years in English is less than 50%). I'm definitely open to ANY suggestions of places to move. Unfortunately I'm not very good at staying on top of the news, so I don't know which places are getting hit harder economically than others. My whole family lives in the Pacific Northwest, so I don't have a lot of perspective from beyond Idaho. All I know is that I'm living in the state with the ninth highest cost of living coupled with the second highest unemployment rate and I want out!

Welcome Lanthiriel!  You've asked a very open ended question, but I think you'll find unanimity here that Cleveland (and many other rust belt cities) could probably offer you what you're looking for.  There are some dog owners here who can speak to the dog parks and other canine infrastructure, but needless to say your real estate dollar (rental or purchase) goes a looooong way in Cleveland and can get you into many different types of neighborhoods with many different kinds of amenities.  Without kids and the need to worry about schools, you would have lots of options.  Good luck!

 

Also, feel free to ask more specific questions if you are interested in your ability to live car free or with only one car, or if you are worried finding access to some favorite kinds of food, etc.

I'd love to tell you to just move to Cleveland, and I'm sure Cincinnatians would love to do the same for Cinci, Columbusites for Columbus.  But I think the real answer with this job market is that you should find a good job first, and go to it.  Especially if you aren't dead-set on a particular city.

 

In terms of living, Cleveland would compare well with the other places you've mentioned.  It's an inexpensive region of the country, has many great neighborhoods, you can find lots of single family homes with yards for your dog, plus parks and some dog parks.  Are you looking for an urban neighborhood, or suburban, or semi rural/small town?  There are a lot of great options for each, many of which you can find a lot of information about here on UrbanOhio.

 

Incidentally, I work with a guy who moved here from Portland.  Within a very short amount of time all he could talk about was moving back, and at one point had it all set up to do so.  But, some time later I asked how his moving plans were progressing, and he said he'd decided he really liked it in Cleveland and wanted to stay.  I don't know that it's something particular to Cleveland- I think it's just finding a job/neighborhood/friends/etc that you like in any city that matters.

The unemployment rates for the metros of Cleveland and Columbus are very similar.

 

And they're both lower than Cincinnati's:

 

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2010/03/15/daily55.html

 

Lanthiriel, I agree with the above posters that you'll find the cities in this part of the country to be extremely livable, in terms of amenities and cost of living.  Cleveland (and other cities in the general region) have lots of established universities, if you eventually end up pursuing another degree.  I'd say that X gave the best advice of all- no matter where in the country you're looking, in this economy, find a job first!

 

It might be more helpful for us if you can say what other amenities you're looking for in your new city.  We'll be happy to answer your questions as well as we are able!

Columbus maintains a lower rate with a growing population; Cleveland maintains a higher rate with a shrinking population.

 

I do agree, of course, that it depends on what kind of job you're looking for.

 

I'd say she should let a job or university acceptance determine where she goes. Especially if she's not too picky about things, generally. If she wants to be picky, she should at least visit all the potential cities. In which case, I'd suggest visiting the big three in Ohio, along with at least Indianapolis and Pittsburgh. I'm sure we could come up with an itinerary for (at least) her Ohio visits, to show off what each city has to offer.

 

I don't have much opinion about upstate NY, other than I don't think I'd want to live there.

Regarding jobs and job growth in the cities mentioned.  Keep in mind that the Cleveland "metro area" population has essentially stayed flat over the past decade or so..  However, what the numbers don't show is that Cleveland has shed thousands of blue collar jobs, but has increased white collar jobs over the same period.  So, if you're a factory worker, don't move to Cleveland, but if you're an engineer, doctor, nurse, lawyer, accountant, you'll have as much luck, if not more here than in the other cities you listed.

 

We moved here (Cleveland) three years ago from Denver after researching the Ohio big 3, and are happy with our decision.  I had a job, but my wife had to find a job once we moved.  It took her 2 months to find the same job (Commercial Underwriter) she had in Denver, paying $10K more a year.

 

My advice is to find the place you like most and make it work.  If you settle on one, but like another much better, you'll regret it in a few years.  You'll find that Cincy/Columbus/Cleveland (and Indy & Pitt) all differ quite a bit in regards to people, things to do, proximity to parts of the country; it probably won't take you long to get the good or bad vibe.

Cincinnati will have a streetcar in a couple of years. You'll feel right at home coming from Portland!

If weather is not an issue, and judging from where you are looking, it is not... that takes away the biggest knock on Cleveland.  As a matter of fact, you will be happy to find a few more sunny days than in Portland.  We can't say that to most newcomers.  I agree that you should find a job first.  It seems to vary for different people with different skill sets and experience.  A friend mine has been looking for 6 months and hasn't found anything.  My wife is considering switching jobs and put in two applications.  She was offered both jobs after interviewing.

 

If you do find a job here, come back and let us know where you will be working because that will help us make recommendations.  Cleveland is very diverse and you will find that the various neighborhoods are very different, each with its own strenghts/appeal.

Columbus maintains a lower rate with a growing population; Cleveland maintains a higher rate with a shrinking population.

 

So?  Fact is that there are more jobs per capita (and higher wages in Cleveland if you look at per capita income as well) than in Cincinnati.

Do not turn this into a city vs city thing, folks!

I have a degree in Civil Engineering with a PE, and do work within the Cleveland Metro Region.  As far as entry level right out of school, CE's in this area earn on average roughly 38k to 45k per year.  Most CE's that have their PE will fall in the range of about 65k to 100k depending on manegerial experience etc.  So, pay compensation in Cleveland for his degree is competitive with the other regions you metioned.  As far as employment opportunities in this region for CE's, it has dropped off.  Construction is starting to come to all time lows, and we are not enjoying the mild boom type activity we saw in the late 90's early 2000's.  In addition, school projects are starting to come to an end. 

 

I think for him at least, he will find just as much opportunity here as anywhere else...except Indy.  All my sources tell me Indy is really hurting right now in the construction sector.  My company does have an office there that boomed for years, and is now struggling.  it was a typical commercial construction driven town that really got hurt when the private dollars tailed off.  We may have lost manufacturing here in Cleveland, but we still do alot of work for the exiting steel, automotive, castings etc industry. 

 

Good luck to you both, and I hope a move works out.  Keep posting on boards like this however, and you may find people like me who can get you into that first job.  Presently, nothing here, but alot of companies are always looking for entry level. 

Thank you for all of your replies! I think I'll be adding Cleveland to our shortlist. We're trying to come up with places we'd be willing to move so that when the time comes for my husband to search for an engineering job we know where we'd be willing to move. Here is a little more detail about the setting we're looking for; perhaps you can tell me which cities in Ohio fit best:

 

The one thing that I like most about Portland is that it has all the convenience of a big city, but the change from urban to suburban happens very quickly. I grew up near Seattle where it's very difficult to find affordable housing (renting or owning) within about 20 miles of the heart of the city. My husband's not a big fan of all the hustle and bustle of downtown living, but I enjoy the variety it offers. I have about a 20-30 minute commute to work right now and could stand one a little longer.

 

We're not big on eating out; in fact, we're pretty much a couple of homebodies. I'm much more interested in making a comfortable home than I am in nightlife or trendy eateries. I do, however, enjoy the farmer's market type atmosphere and do a lot of shopping there.

 

As far as hobbies, mine is competitive agility with my corgi. We're training now to compete next summer in CPE and AKC. My husband likes to play tennis and occasionally golfs. (I'm making us sound a lot older than we really are! We're only in our mid-20s.) We enjoy camping during the summer, so having some camping options within a few hours drive would be nice.

 

And this is going to sound strange, but I'm interested in finding a town with down-to-earth, middle class people. I work for a sustainable energy company and support a cleaner earth. I'm a left leaning moderate, but Portland is just waaay too much of a hippie town for me. All of the stereotypes are true. I'm definitely interested in moving somewhere with less dreadlocks and where the height of fashion isn't alpaca sweaters.

 

 

@gotribe: Thank you for your insight into engineering jobs in your area. My husband is very interested in pursuing a PE license, but I didn't realize how much of a difference it made.

^^ Finally, someone with good information. :)

It sounds like most anyplace in the Midwest or Great Lakes region could meet the criteria you've set forth.  Cleveland is particularly good in providing farmer's markets and also has the Westside Market, which is similar in what you can get but not really a farmer's market.  Cleveland was recently rated by an environmental organization as having some of the best access to locally grown food in the nation.  I'll see if I can dig that up. 

 

For camping and outdoors adventures, I'd recommend anything within a day's drive of the Appalachians, which would include any of the main cities in Ohio, and of course Pittsburgh, which is sort of in the Appalachians.  Cleveland has a number of golf courses, though I don't know enough about them to say which are best.  I'm not sure about tennis.  Can't help you with competitive agility, that's new to me.

This is funny, as we have been studying Portland for awhile as a potential place to move to.  From my research (no, I've never been there), it has many things that Cleveland has but in bigger or more advanced fashion, or with more people.  As I understand it, Portland has a lot of manufacturing and a vibrant steel economy in addition to other lines of business, so there are probably a good amount of "blue collar" type folks.  On the opposite end of the spectrum, I think Portland is more cutting edge and forward thinking about lifestyle concepts than most of Cleveland.  Comparatively speaking for example, we have a lot fewer gays/lesbians in numbers, less tolerance of alternative or different lifestyles, less focus on healthy and organic living or work/life balance - Clevelanders are much less "crunchy" than people in Portland.  Mr. RNR and I are both pretty crunchy and this is part of the draw for us to Portland.  Also more employment there, more things to do, better weather, etc., and we'd love to be near the ocean.  But I digress.

 

That being said, in some ways because of the similarities, it could be an easy transition if you think about it as downsizing.  We have GREAT restaurants, lots of shops, a thriving arts scene, etc, but you have to look a little harder or be a little more knowledgeable (and drive quite a bit) to utilize all that the region has to offer.  Our public transportation system is postively anemic compared to what I understand Portland's is. 

 

Your money goes a lot farther here than it does many other places.  You can buy more house/condo or rent a bigger, nicer apartment for the money.  Your food dollars go further - the prices at even our upscale restaurants are a bargain compared to larger cities.  There are a variety of professional sports teams if you're into that, and overall I would say Cleveland is a big dog area, we have a lot of dog lovers.  We are an agriculture-heavy state so you have access to a lot of good and fresh and local food, but during the colder months (which is a LONG time - pretty much from November to April), you can't get any decent produce, and nothing really local.

 

We have a diverse ethnic population and a lot of ethnic festivals in the wamer months which are a lot of fun. We even have some decent wineries, though nothing compared to what wineries in Oregon are producing.

 

I completely agree that at least one of you should have a job secured before moving, it is essential.  You're not going to get much in book publishing here, but despite their continued economic troubles, you might consider applying at Penton Media (www.penton.com).  They produce trade magazines and trade shows (disclaimer - I used to work there).  Can't help much with the husband's job, not something I'm experienced with.

 

I love Cleveland a lot but am one of those for whom the weather is a killer. 

RnR - do you live on the West side?  Just guessing from the way you are describing Clevelanders. 

 

What I will add to your comment is that Cleveland's various neighborhoods have different "leans", levels of trendiness, etc. 

@rockandroller: Portland really is a pretty great place to live. It's just so expensive! Portland is very responsive to the gay/lesbian community, vegetarian diets, sustainable living, etc. There is also A LOT of recreation here. The Pacific Northwest is beautiful. Oceans, rivers, mountains... all at your back door. But if you're serious about moving out here, I would wait and see how our economy does. Oregon is a difficult state to live in. Instead of sales tax, the state just takes 10% off the top of every paycheck; about 30% of my income goes to taxes. Portland is the ONLY area in Oregon that has any job opportunities and they are not plentiful or stable. It is very difficult to find work here and the cost of living is very high. I would suggest looking in Washington if you're interested in living in the PNW. Olympia has a lot of job opportunities for both blue and white collar work. Seattle is doing a lot better than Portland, but it's also significantly more expensive to live there.

 

Sorry for the unsolicited advice, but I love the PNW. Too bad it's not a great place to be starting out. 

Rock and Roller...what are you referring to when you say "also more employment there (Portland)"  Are you referring to your field specifically?  The reason I ask is that Lantirthiel referenced in one of her posts that Oregon (or Portland don't know which) had the second highest rate of unemployment and ninth highest cost of living so she wanted out.  I did check Jan rates from the dept of labor stats and it indicates Metro Portland's rate was 11.3 and Cleveland's metro rate was 10.3.

If it's feasible, I would highly recommend scheduling a week or two to do a tour through Cleveland, western Pennsylvania and upstate New York. If you're planning on moving to a city based primarily on its feel, then I would definitely spend some time getting that feel.

 

Just a couple Cleve-oriented things that haven't been mentioned yet. As far as nature stuff goes, we're pretty well-situated. The city is adjacent to Lake Erie, bisected by the Cuyahoga River (the infamous crooked river), surrounded on the county outskirts by a "necklace" of really lovely Metroparks and immediately north of Cuyahoga Valley National Park, the 4th most visited national park in the country and the only national park in the Midwest. Over the next several years, municipalities are finishing the last few legs of the Towpath Trail, which will run from downtown Cleveland into the national park, to Akron and beyond (all told, 80 some miles of continuous bike path when complete). There's also a scenic, old-timey railway through the national park.

 

The winters are much colder and snowier here than what you've likely experienced in the Pacific Northwest, and it can be really brutal, but it also gives rise to skiing (great cross-country, decent downhill), ice skating and tobogganing.

 

The transit system is not perfect but solid. I've been car-free 5 of the 7 years that I've been in Cleveland, so it can be done; as of last I saw, it's the 9th largest transit system in the country.

 

One final seller for Cleveland as a writer is the Creative Workforce Fellowship, which annually distributes 20 $20,000 fellowships to artists of all disciplines. You have to be a resident for two years before applying, but after that, you could compete for a literary fellowship. To the best of my knowledge, this is the largest locally funded artist grant program in the country.

 

So there are definitely some great things about our city, and I hope you get a chance to check it out. When scoping out neighborhoods/suburbs to live in, I would take a look at Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, Lakewood, Ohio City and possibly Old Brooklyn. These are places where you'd have good proximity to all the urban stuff but still have a relatively natural, quieter setting for your husband.

 

I think Cleveland is a really incredibly city, but I would also check out Pittsburgh. It's another city that I find stunning (bisected by three rivers, ringed by hills, compact, dense downtown, neighborhoods with a lot of character), and it's home to one of the country's strongest small press communities, which could provide you a little more opportunity to pursue publishing.

 

Best of luck with your decision!

Oh, also check out Tremont. Cute, urban, artsy neighborhood that's just south of downtown but has a bit of a village feel to it. And tons and tons of dogs.

To answer and comment on some posts above:

 

by the OP: "homebodies...I'm much more interested in making a comfortable home than I am in nightlife or trendy eateries. I do, however, enjoy the farmer's market type atmosphere and do a lot of shopping there."

 

We have great farmer's markets on the E and W side, and the West Side Market downtown is THE place to get meats, dairy, etc.  It's very unique and you would love it.  And "homebodies" do very well here; lots of water cooler discussion is about what was on TV last night or about the local sports teams.

 

"My husband likes to play tennis and occasionally golfs. We enjoy camping during the summer."

 

I don't golf but feel the area is great for golf, we have a lot of courses.  Camping is very popular around Mohican/Loudonville area, about 1.5 hours out of the area.

 

"I'm interested in finding a town with down-to-earth, middle class people. I work for a sustainable energy company and support a cleaner earth. I'm a left leaning moderate..."

 

CHECK on the first part.  Not so much the 2nd part - those of us who feel that way are more the minority  here than the majority.  My feeling is the majority of folks here are Wal-Mart everything and I'm not going out of my way to recycle because it's a pain in the ass.  I would say our UO population online here is a much different slice of the population than the average Clevelander, who just wants to tailgate at Browns games and eat hot dogs and drink cheap beer.  Nobody at my office recycles their cans because they have to WALK DOWN THE HALL to put them in a recycling container, for example.  I keep a box in my office for plastic bottles I occasionally use, and then bring everything home to recycle when it gets full (because we only recycle cans at work) and people think I am a crunchy freak.

 

To Hts121: I live on the SW side by the airport but when I talk about Clevelanders, I'm not really talking about my neighbors from that area as we do very little in and around our home, and we don't know any of our neighbors. I do most of my grocery shopping at the WSM or at Buehler's in Brunswick or the NUFM in Crocker in the warmer months.  I'm talking more from my experience in working 30+ jobs in the Cleveland area and the people I've known through work as well as my work in the arts community.

 

@Htsguy re: employment.  My impression on this is not from any formal study.  I have job search alerts set up for jobs in my area/experience and mr. RNRs, and we both get a LOT more leads each day than we do for cleveland jobs.  I would say I get 5 links to jobs in Portland for every 1 in Cleveland. 

 

 

There how ever a big push to capitalize on Cleveland manufacturing expertise to make the city a  hub for renewalable/advanced energy. It is in it's infancy right now but there seems to a synergy building between the groups attacking the issue from different angles. The county taskforce just announced that an RFP will be going out in the next few months for a trial of 3-5 off shore wind turbines to be installed in Lake Erie. The group at Case is focusing on energy research and there is also a separate group working to match up Cleveland manufacturing (mostly former automotive suppliers) with wind turbine and other energy manufactures.

 

So it is a potential growing field in the city.

 

Edit: links, Confusingly they all are called Great Lakes but are seperate organizations.

 

Great Lakes Energy Development Taskforce

 

http://development.cuyahogacounty.us/en-US/energy-task-force.aspx

 

Great Lakes Wind Network http://www.glwn.org/

 

Great Lakes Energy Institute http://energy.case.edu/

 

Just a little fact correction, Cuyahoga Valley National Park is NOT the only national park in the Midwest.  There's Isle Royale in Michigan as well.

 

Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Columbus are all great choices for a young family.  I'd personally say Columbus but that's just my opinion.

^^^I agree with you to some extent- there are no doubt differences between the populations of the Cleveland and Portland metros overall.  But I don't know how much it matters.  My experience growing up in the eastern suburbs of the Cleve did not resemble your description of the area at all.  I suspect most people can find a critical mass of the types of folks they like associating with in most large metro areas if they know where to look.

I'm entitled to my opinion. How about just saying you don't agree with what I posted.

Okay, fair enough.  I don't agree with what you posted.

So, you don't agree that your dollars would go farther here than in Portland, which the OP describes as one of the most expensive areas in the country?  Or that we have a diverse ethnic population with numerous festivals in the warmer months that are fun to attend?  Or that finding a job before you move is a good idea?  That Portland has a manufacturing base similar to Cleveland? Seriously, how could anyone disagree with everything I posted there. 

 

I can tell you as a crunchy, hippie type person that I run across very few people that are like me and my husband here.  I do not know one person who cloth diapers and I have known a LOT of parents here over the nearly 20 years I've lived here.  Nobody I work with recycles.  Nobody I worked with at my retail job that I held for the last 2 years before I got PG recycled either.  Everybody I know buys all their meat at the grocery store or wal-mart, the only people I run into that I know at the WSM are folks I know from the arts community.  "It's too much trouble" to recycle, is what I've heard. "It's not going to make any difference."  "I don't like the light those funny light bulbs give off."  The gay games has been a topic of conversation that has brought out a lot of bigotry among my co-workers and casual acquaintances as well as other parents ("I sure won't be taking my kids to that" "I can't believe they are doing such a thing here" type comments) that is shocking to me.  Of all the mothers I know at work, and that's at least 20 that I talked to on my floor, as well as probably another dozen I talked to while pregnant on other floors while looking for advice about pumping when I returned to work: ONE mother breastfed her children. The others said "that's gross" or "I didn't want to have to bother with it" or similar comments.  At every office job I've held, which is around 10 jobs here, there is no work/life balance.  The emphasis is nose to the grindstone, come in early, stay late and answer email all evening and weekend to "look available."  I got chastised just today for not working from home prior to a mid-morning doctor appointment.  I was worked so hard prior to going out on maternity leave that I almost had a nervous breakdown, because they wanted to "get the good out of" the time that I had left.  These are people from every area of Cleveland, from Painesville to Brunswick to Solon to Canton and everywhere in between.

 

OP, I think Cleveland is a great place to live and offers a lot of similarity to Portland that I thin will make it a comfortable place for you to move to, and will be more affordable. From what I've researched about Portland (which you've backed up in your post about the alpaca-wearers, ha ha), there are just a LOT more people living or at least supporting alternative lifestyles and those who are laid back than I think there are here.  I'm glad some other people in Cleveland have had different experiences than some of the negative ones I mentioned ALONG WITH ALL THE POSITIVE THINGS I MENTIONED.

In all fairness, I think rockandroller tried to bring things back on topic but yeah, when we have someone trying to get information about relocating here, it's not the best place to have the back-and-forths or the tangental discussions.

 

Lanthiriel, welcome to UrbanOhio. One thing you have to admit about the forum - our members are passionate and aren't afraid to express themselves :-)

Okay - reopening this thread by request from several forumers. As always, keep things on topic and avoid the tit-for-tat arguments please :-)

Without doubt, there is a more conservative streak in the Midwest, so that is something to keep in mind. However, I would say that if it influences your move at all, greater Cleveland is more "blue collar liberal". My congressional district (the one that stretches eastward from Ohio City across the city and into the eastern suburbs) had 8 registered Democrats for every 1 Republican the last time I checked and was the seat occupied by the late Stephanie Tubbs Jones, a member who was vocal on issues related to poverty and congressional ethics. Our congressional delegation tends to represent the progressive end of the Democratic party (Kucinich, Fudge, Sherrod Brown) and fiscal conservative/socially moderate Republicans (Voinovich, LaTourette). As mentioned, Cleveland is also on the edge of some progressive ideas ... it's aiming to be among the first to develop an offshore wind farm, it's examining feasibility of waste-to-energy conversion, it's doing some really fascinating things around re-use of vacant space (see Pop Up City and Reimagining Cleveland) and it's pioneering the concept of worker cooperative models for establishing green businesses.

 

At the neighborhood level, I think you'll find that all three of the neighborhoods you mentioned increasingly are getting populated by 20- to 40-something progressives. Totally anectdotal, but Tremont and Detroit Shoreway seem to be drawing more of the artsy and hipster crowd, while Ohio City seems to home to a lot of the do-gooder / policy wonk set. Again, this is totally just the feel I get and not based on any hard data ... I would encourage you to feel out each for yourself :)

At your age, I would say go where the work is, get your experience under your belt and build the resume, and embrace the city that you land in.  With that said, in the CE field at least, the employment opportunities are pretty much equal in the above cities you mentioned.  As far as living experiences go, I think you will find neighborhoods in the Big 3 C Ohio cities that offer what you are looking for.  So which ever one you get the job in, I think you will be happy if you pick the right neighborhood. 

 

Under the microscope, you can find differences in Ohio's big cities, however, IMHO, to the naked eye, they are all very similar.  It is not like the PNW where you have Portland ruling Oregon, Seattle ruling Washington, SF ruling Northern California, and Boise ruling Idaho and the mountains are your retreat.  Ohio's Big 3 are seperated by abour 1.5 hours to 2 hours between each.  Not much changes along Interstate 71.  Again, that is just my opinion. 

With regards to the "left-leaning moderate" and "cleaner Earth" comments, I feel that the Heights area is definitely worth checking out (Cleveland Heights, University Heights, Shaker Heights).  The taxes are higher, but you will still be able to afford a great (and likely historic and architecturally interesting) house.  If you are not all about living downtown, nightclubs, etc., but still love being real close to the city, it's probably your ideal location.  Also, it seems to be the center of the left-leaning crowd without having a hippy feel (even Coventry has lost its "hippiness" now).  As far as grocery/food shopping goes, there is a year-round farmer's market at Shaker Square, right on the edge of Cleveland and Shaker Heights (and accessible by two lines of the rapid transit train).  Although most areas of Cleveland are dominated by the big box chains Giant Eagle and Wal-Mart, there are local and/or unique grocery stores all over the Heights area (Whole Foods in University Heights, Fresh Market in Shaker Heights, Zagara's in Cleveland Heights, Dave's in Cleveland Heights, Heinen's in University Heights and Shaker Heights, as well as some unique local food suppliers such as the Arab import store on Taylor road in Cleveland Heights or some places in Little Italy on the edge of Cleveland and Cleveland Heights).

 

For the sports your husband is interested in (I can't speak to your as much because I don't really know what it is), there are nice tennis courts all over the Heights.  Cain Park in Cleveland Heights (lighted until 11 pm from April to November), as well as concerts and plays at their nice ampitheater through the summer (www.cainpark.com).  University Heights has a city park with access for residents to nice courts.  The nicest country clubs in Cleveland are located around the Heights area, but there are unfortunately not too many public courses right there.  However, you are fairly close to a large amount of nice public courses in the eastern suburbs/exurbs and beyond.  In all, Ohio is considered one of the best states in the country for golf (I believe I read somewhere that we have the highest number of courses per capita and the public courses are known for being designed well and in good condition).

 

And for when you have to get downtown (or when your husband wants to go to a Cavs/Indians/Browns game), you have great options.  If you don't want to drive, you have direct train access to downtown via the rapid transit (which also goes directly to the airport via a downtown transfer).  The area is very walkable, but has the inner-ring streetcar suburb feel, probably similar to areas you like around Portland.  There are also many interesting historic shopping districts (especially around Cleveland Heights) such as Cedar-Fairmount, Cedar-Lee, Coventry, even to a small extent Fairmount-Taylor (and probably more I'm missing).  And for those times you absolutely need to big box shop, you're not secluded.  There is a Target in University Heights, Wal-Mart in Cleveland Heights, and Legacy Village (lifestyle center) and Beachwood Place (upscale indoor mall) in nearby Beachwood.

 

No, I don't work for the "Heights Chamber of Commerce" :), but I think it's an area worth looking into based on what you're looking for.

With regards to the "left-leaning moderate" and "cleaner Earth" comments, I feel that the Heights area is definitely worth checking out (Cleveland Heights, University Heights, Shaker Heights).  The taxes are higher, but you will still be able to afford a great (and likely historic and architecturally interesting) house.  If you are not all about living downtown, nightclubs, etc., but still love being real close to the city, it's probably your ideal location.  Also, it seems to be the center of the left-leaning crowd without having a hippy feel (even Coventry has lost its "hippiness" now).  As far as grocery/food shopping goes, there is a year-round farmer's market at Shaker Square, right on the edge of Cleveland and Shaker Heights (and accessible by two lines of the rapid transit train).  Although most areas of Cleveland are dominated by the big box chains Giant Eagle and Wal-Mart, there are local and/or unique grocery stores all over the Heights area (Whole Foods in University Heights, Fresh Market in Shaker Heights, Zagara's in Cleveland Heights, Dave's in Cleveland Heights, Heinen's in University Heights and Shaker Heights, as well as some unique local food suppliers such as the Arab import store on Taylor road in Cleveland Heights or some places in Little Italy on the edge of Cleveland and Cleveland Heights).

 

For the sports your husband is interested in (I can't speak to your as much because I don't really know what it is), there are nice tennis courts all over the Heights.  Cain Park in Cleveland Heights (lighted until 11 pm from April to November), as well as concerts and plays at their nice ampitheater through the summer (www.cainpark.com).  University Heights has a city park with access for residents to nice courts.  The nicest country clubs in Cleveland are located around the Heights area, but there are unfortunately not too many public courses right there.  However, you are fairly close to a large amount of nice public courses in the eastern suburbs/exurbs and beyond.  In all, Ohio is considered one of the best states in the country for golf (I believe I read somewhere that we have the highest number of courses per capita and the public courses are known for being designed well and in good condition).

 

And for when you have to get downtown (or when your husband wants to go to a Cavs/Indians/Browns game), you have great options.  If you don't want to drive, you have direct train access to downtown via the rapid transit (which also goes directly to the airport via a downtown transfer).  The area is very walkable, but has the inner-ring streetcar suburb feel, probably similar to areas you like around Portland.  There are also many interesting historic shopping districts (especially around Cleveland Heights) such as Cedar-Fairmount, Cedar-Lee, Coventry, even to a small extent Fairmount-Taylor (and probably more I'm missing).  And for those times you absolutely need to big box shop, you're not secluded.  There is a Target in University Heights, Wal-Mart in Cleveland Heights, and Legacy Village (lifestyle center) and Beachwood Place (upscale indoor mall) in nearby Beachwood.

 

No, I don't work for the "Heights Chamber of Commerce" :) , but I think it's an area worth looking into based on what you're looking for.

 

Very well said!

With regards to the "left-leaning moderate" and "cleaner Earth" comments, I feel that the Heights area is definitely worth checking out (Cleveland Heights, University Heights, Shaker Heights). The taxes are higher, but you will still be able to afford a great (and likely historic and architecturally interesting) house. If you are not all about living downtown, nightclubs, etc., but still love being real close to the city, it's probably your ideal location. Also, it seems to be the center of the left-leaning crowd without having a hippy feel (even Coventry has lost its "hippiness" now). As far as grocery/food shopping goes, there is a year-round farmer's market at Shaker Square, right on the edge of Cleveland and Shaker Heights (and accessible by two lines of the rapid transit train). Although most areas of Cleveland are dominated by the big box chains Giant Eagle and Wal-Mart, there are local and/or unique grocery stores all over the Heights area (Whole Foods in University Heights, Fresh Market in Shaker Heights, Zagara's in Cleveland Heights, Dave's in Cleveland Heights, Heinen's in University Heights and Shaker Heights, as well as some unique local food suppliers such as the Arab import store on Taylor road in Cleveland Heights or some places in Little Italy on the edge of Cleveland and Cleveland Heights).

 

For the sports your husband is interested in (I can't speak to your as much because I don't really know what it is), there are nice tennis courts all over the Heights. Cain Park in Cleveland Heights (lighted until 11 pm from April to November), as well as concerts and plays at their nice ampitheater through the summer (www.cainpark.com). University Heights has a city park with access for residents to nice courts. The nicest country clubs in Cleveland are located around the Heights area, but there are unfortunately not too many public courses right there. However, you are fairly close to a large amount of nice public courses in the eastern suburbs/exurbs and beyond. In all, Ohio is considered one of the best states in the country for golf (I believe I read somewhere that we have the highest number of courses per capita and the public courses are known for being designed well and in good condition).

 

And for when you have to get downtown (or when your husband wants to go to a Cavs/Indians/Browns game), you have great options. If you don't want to drive, you have direct train access to downtown via the rapid transit (which also goes directly to the airport via a downtown transfer). The area is very walkable, but has the inner-ring streetcar suburb feel, probably similar to areas you like around Portland. There are also many interesting historic shopping districts (especially around Cleveland Heights) such as Cedar-Fairmount, Cedar-Lee, Coventry, even to a small extent Fairmount-Taylor (and probably more I'm missing). And for those times you absolutely need to big box shop, you're not secluded. There is a Target in University Heights, Wal-Mart in Cleveland Heights, and Legacy Village (lifestyle center) and Beachwood Place (upscale indoor mall) in nearby Beachwood.

 

No, I don't work for the "Heights Chamber of Commerce" :) , but I think it's an area worth looking into based on what you're looking for.

 

Very well said!

 

Where the Heck have you been!

With regards to the "left-leaning moderate" and "cleaner Earth" comments, I feel that the Heights area is definitely worth checking out (Cleveland Heights, University Heights, Shaker Heights).  The taxes are higher, but you will still be able to afford a great (and likely historic and architecturally interesting) house.  If you are not all about living downtown, nightclubs, etc., but still love being real close to the city, it's probably your ideal location.  Also, it seems to be the center of the left-leaning crowd without having a hippy feel (even Coventry has lost its "hippiness" now).  As far as grocery/food shopping goes, there is a year-round farmer's market at Shaker Square, right on the edge of Cleveland and Shaker Heights (and accessible by two lines of the rapid transit train).  Although most areas of Cleveland are dominated by the big box chains Giant Eagle and Wal-Mart, there are local and/or unique grocery stores all over the Heights area (Whole Foods in University Heights, Fresh Market in Shaker Heights, Zagara's in Cleveland Heights, Dave's in Cleveland Heights, Heinen's in University Heights and Shaker Heights, as well as some unique local food suppliers such as the Arab import store on Taylor road in Cleveland Heights or some places in Little Italy on the edge of Cleveland and Cleveland Heights).

 

For the sports your husband is interested in (I can't speak to your as much because I don't really know what it is), there are nice tennis courts all over the Heights.  Cain Park in Cleveland Heights (lighted until 11 pm from April to November), as well as concerts and plays at their nice ampitheater through the summer (www.cainpark.com).  University Heights has a city park with access for residents to nice courts.  The nicest country clubs in Cleveland are located around the Heights area, but there are unfortunately not too many public courses right there.  However, you are fairly close to a large amount of nice public courses in the eastern suburbs/exurbs and beyond.  In all, Ohio is considered one of the best states in the country for golf (I believe I read somewhere that we have the highest number of courses per capita and the public courses are known for being designed well and in good condition).

 

And for when you have to get downtown (or when your husband wants to go to a Cavs/Indians/Browns game), you have great options.  If you don't want to drive, you have direct train access to downtown via the rapid transit (which also goes directly to the airport via a downtown transfer).  The area is very walkable, but has the inner-ring streetcar suburb feel, probably similar to areas you like around Portland.  There are also many interesting historic shopping districts (especially around Cleveland Heights) such as Cedar-Fairmount, Cedar-Lee, Coventry, even to a small extent Fairmount-Taylor (and probably more I'm missing).  And for those times you absolutely need to big box shop, you're not secluded.  There is a Target in University Heights, Wal-Mart in Cleveland Heights, and Legacy Village (lifestyle center) and Beachwood Place (upscale indoor mall) in nearby Beachwood.

 

No, I don't work for the "Heights Chamber of Commerce" :) , but I think it's an area worth looking into based on what you're looking for.

 

Very well said!

 

Where the Heck have you been!

 

See the off topic thread.  Apparently I've been missed.  I guess the forum was a bore without me.  >:D

Hello, Lanthiriel.

 

Pretty much everything that everybody has said so far is true, so I won't repeat their words. What I will add, though, is that there are core areas where folks with more liberal tendencies do choose to live, and these are all of the places recommended in this thread. If you live in these areas, you will almost certainly be surrounded by people who compost, recycle, use cloth diapers (on their kids; can't speak for the incontinent adults), birth babies naturally, enjoy art non-ironically, and eat local food and drink local beer (GLBC, FTW).

 

And, because we're the midwest, we'll also cheer for football (though probably not wear dog masks), play golf (and enjoy being able to walk onto pretty much any coulrse and play a round without a long wait), and we'll not judge you for any of this (at least to your face) nor will you have folks comparing their ecological cred.  We'll also tell you to secure your job first, because we have that kind of sensibility.

 

Good luck!

At your age, I would say go where the work is, get your experience under your belt and build the resume, and embrace the city that you land in. With that said, in the CE field at least, the employment opportunities are pretty much equal in the above cities you mentioned. As far as living experiences go, I think you will find neighborhoods in the Big 3 C Ohio cities that offer what you are looking for. So which ever one you get the job in, I think you will be happy if you pick the right neighborhood.

 

Under the microscope, you can find differences in Ohio's big cities, however, IMHO, to the naked eye, they are all very similar. It is not like the PNW where you have Portland ruling Oregon, Seattle ruling Washington, SF ruling Northern California, and Boise ruling Idaho and the mountains are your retreat. Ohio's Big 3 are seperated by abour 1.5 hours to 2 hours between each. Not much changes along Interstate 71. Again, that is just my opinion.

 

Great post and very true ... of course each and every one of the big 3's would be a great fit. No reason to try to downplay the other 2C's that happens to not be your place of residence. Let's just be real here.

 

I think it might help the OP out a lot if we post pics from the areas we're speaking of.