Grew up in NE Ohio, but have lived in Nashville, Dallas, Austin, NYC, and Savannah, GA all post college. I currently reside in Chicago. I have enjoyed many aspects of living in those places, but I'm now seriously considering moving back to the Cleveland area to be closer to family and to be a small part of contributing to the city's hopeful rebound.

 

My family is in Oberlin, Avon Lake, and Vermillion. While nice places in their own right, if I move back to Cleveland I'm living in the city proper.

 

In my research the above 3 areas jumped out for being relatively walkable, urban, and vibrant areas that Cleveland desperately needs.  I'm late 30's and my girlfriend is late 20s (she's from Chicago) and we both appreciate the amenities a Chicago provides, but we're not non-stop bar crawlers or need a hip restaurant on every block. Just give me a few places that are within walking distance and a more urban vibe and we're good to go. We will be starting a family after we get married and would like to raise our kids in Cleveland proper.

 

Of the 3 areas I mentioned Detroit Shoreway is really starting to impress me and could be the best investment out of all of them. Ohio City and Tremont look great as well.

 

Would probably rent at first, but buying could be a possibility. Rent up to a $1,000 and buying a house for about $200,000. 

 

My girlfiend is used to using public transit and would probably work in the city, so safety would be a concern using the train late at night.

 

Anyone from those areas want to chime in with their thoughts? Thanks in advance.

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Chicagoist, and welcome to UrbanOhio (and hopefully back to Cleveland!)

 

The areas you mentioned are definitely good choices.  I live in Tremont, car-free, and I do a lot of transit-taking (and walking around) fairly late at night.  I'd be happy to answer any specific questions you have about the neighborhood or about taking transit, either here or by PM if you'd rather. 

 

Tremont and Detroit-Shoreway have the best access to 90 for getting out to see the family in Lorain Co., and it's pretty easy to get to the freeway from Ohio City, too.

 

You may also be interested in checking out Downtown, particularly the Warehouse and Gateway districts, Asiatown, as well as University Circle, Little Italy, and especially the Shaker Square neighborhood.  The last few areas are harder to access by freeway.

 

Your budget will get you pretty far in Cleveland, probably just about all but the largest/most expensive apartments downtown.

 

Feel free to pepper us with questions (we love that :) ) and again, welcome!

Thanks Confit!

 

You mentioned all of our backup areas too. I'm not particularly wedded to the westside by any means. Going to be in town to catch a Cavs game and will be driving through all of the areas.

 

Downtown is a real possibility, but not sure there is a real community feeling...too transient???

 

The idea of moving to a community that has a lot of pride in the area and Cleveland itself is an important draw.

 

Did you move to Cleveland or did you grow up in the area?

 

Thanks again and I may PM you in the future

 

 

 

Three suggestions:

 

1. when you visit, don't drive around the neighborhoods you're interested in. Park the car, get out and walk around.

 

2. do not limit yourself to the west side. While the west side is probably most like Chicago (it feels and looks more Midwestern), the east side feels and looks more East Coast-ish. Check out University Circle, Little Italy, three vibrant neighborhoods of Cleveland Heights (Coventry, Cedar-Fairmount and Cedar-Lee), the Shaker Square area and even consider downtown. You might like the Warehouse District (centered at St. Clair/West 6th but might be a little loud on weekends), East 4th (also can be loud on weekends) and the Gateway area (centered at the intersection of East 9th/Prospect/Huron). I say this as a west-sider (I've lived in Lakewood for 14 years -- this is another area worth looking at and a great urbanized area to raise a family!) and a former east-sider (of 26 years).

 

3. don't buy, rent at first. Then take your time exploring the city all over again.

 

Welcome back!

Chicagoist I am in a similar position as you, live in San Francisco but looking for a house in the Cleve for a possible move back eventually and require something close to the urban experience I am used to. Have spent a lot of time in the City the last few years in all the neighborhoods you mentioned and in my opinion Detroit Shoreway def has the most potential to be the next best neighborhood, somewhat rough around the edges but really has a lot going for it and probably get more for your money regarding housing. Tremont and to a lesser degree Ohio City are more on the way to being gentrified or whatever you want to call it but both have amazing charm, character and urban options. The other area I think is really worth looking into on the east side is University Circle and Little Italy area because there is so much to do and I think will continue to grow although I have not checked out the housing options as much. Also if you're planning on being in the area for a while I would seriously consider buying versus renting, there are some great deals and it would probably be less expensive than renting especially if you have the ability to put near 20% down. What we haven't considered in our search is schools since we have no children so others could give you more info on this subject, which can be a sticky point to many. Lastly if you want to stay in Tremont during your next visit to get a feel for the area, which is of course is close to OC and DS, look into staying at a place called Tremont Place Lofts which offers furnished apartments which are no more than your typical hotel and it's really a great place. If you want more details on it let me know and I can give you the scoop on what apartments to ask for since I have stayed there a lot. Anyway good luck, I love that you are making it a priority to live in the city proper!

KJP and sfbob...thanks!

 

KJP: Good tip on walking the hood and not just driving around. Checking it out at different times of day should help too.

 

sfbob: Thanks for the heads up about the Tremont Loft. Ive seen pics of them and it looks nice. You're right about wanting an urbanized experienced. I/m glad others are seriously considering moving back after living in big cities like SF and Chicago.

 

This may sound corny, but I have to live in the city so I can have a Cleveland mailing address. It would be like a status symbol to me.  :-D

 

 

I do like Little Italy and University circle. Don't know much else about the east side, but Ive heard good things about Shaker Square.

I echo all of KJPs points, and am also a west sider who doesn't think you should rule out some of the E side neighborhoods he mentions, particularly Cleveland Heights.  My suggested times to look at a neighborhood are around 5:30-6pm on a weekday (so you can see what it's like during rush hour/when people come home) and then on Saturday night around 10 (to see what kind of noise/partying is happening).

 

If you plan on having kids, you should probably do some research about which areas of the city have at least relatively decent public schools; this is one area that I believe the city comes up short every time in comparison with the suburbs.  I believe the West Park neighborhood has good schools, and a very good community/pride feeling, but it's not particularly urban.  One of the main reasons we have not moved to the city is the lack of a proliferation of great schools.  I'll admit I haven't done as much research as others have and there has been discussion on here about certain schools in certain areas that are still good. You might want to do a live chat with a librarian from cleveland public library (cpl.org) and see if they can direct you to some resources for further research about what schools are still good, and look at those areas.  If you're not going to have children, then that's completely n/a.

 

JMO but given what you're looking for I would not suggest downtown proper.  Less of a community pride feeling than what I've felt/seen in places like Tremont.

I lived in the upper half of a rental in Tremont for 7 years.

 

I now own in Detroit-Shoreway (since august). 

 

Both areas are great, I would Say DS is where Tremont was 10 years ago or so.  Including the housing prices, not sure about rents..I was paying $650/mo for 950 sq ft with an off street parking space in the "less nice" section of tremont (South of 490).  Bought for under $100 a square foot for something with a 2 car garage and 3 story views of the lake/park/marina in DS---TAKE THAT CHICAGO :-)

 

Both areas have their +'s and -'s. 

 

Freeway access cannot be beat from Tremont,  Public transit is more frequent and reliable from DS.

 

DS has 5 Bars/Restaurants, Tremont has 20. (not exact numbers but you get the ratios)  DS is adding to theirs, Tremont is pretty built out....but Oh how nice it is  multiple choices at all price points and huge range of styles of cooking, from italian to thai to vietnamese to sushi......

 

DS has the Capitol movie theater, Tremont has a dog park.

 

DS has access to the Lake/edgewater park, Tremont has Art Galleries/Art walk.

 

Both are 3 miles from downtown.  and about 2 from Ohio city.

 

Tremont has Steelyard Commons, DS is a bit closer to a "traditional" grocery store, both are the same distance from the west side market.

 

DS is a little bit closer to your family, but not so much closer than tremont that it should really affect your decision.

 

and of course, Little Italy/Shaker Square/University Circle even Old Brooklyn are all worth exploring.  There are also any number of inner ring burgs that would probably be worth looking at, but they aren't Cleveland. 

 

One thing about the East side locations is it will add 30 minutes to getting out to your family, which can be good or bad :-)  1 hour away might be a "better" number than 30 minutes, depends on your family dynamics :-)  DS to Avon is 20 - 30 minutes depending on traffic and exactly where you are starting ending.

 

If you are planning on children you will want to explore options other than Cleveland Public schools, my friend/neighbor/landlord had his kids in Urban Community which is near the west side market...I think they also have a facility on Detroit Rd near Detroit Shoreway....It is run by the catholic church but does not teach theology.  I think they have a considerable waiting list and charge a sliding scale based on your income....but definitely look into your options.

 

If you plan on coming to town any time soon I would be happy to share my opinions of all things Cleve over a pint of Guinness.

 

 

I think everything that's been mentioned so far is sound advice. Just wanted to weigh in on neighborhood transit.

 

Of the neighborhoods you mentioned, Tremont is the least-served by public transit (due to recent budget cuts, the community circulator that used to connect to Ohio City is no longer in operation). Two bus lines run through Tremont (although the further you move from W. 14th, the more likely it is that you would only use one or the other). They run at least hourly until at least midnight (maybe later ... I haven't checked them out beyond that). The neighborhood has a bit of a "village unto itself" feeling. Highways and the river valley separate it from other neighborhoods, which makes it feel quaint and charming (it's a really, really adorable neighborhood) but also makes it a pain to walk to either Ohio City or downtown.

 

Detroit Shoreway does have a nice train station, but it's unfortunately a little removed from the amenities that are drawing people back to the neighborhood (with the notable exception of the EcoVillage, which is close to the station and which you might want to check out). While the station is a nice one, its access points are not along the main thoroughfare of W. 65th; during the day, it's absolutely safe and a 10-minute walk to the Gordon Square Arts District and 5 minutes from the antique shops on Lorain and probably 20 to Battery Park and Edgewater Park. At night, I would hesitate to recommend it to someone ... not that's it's necessarily dangerous, but its exit to the north spills onto a blocked portion of the street, so there's that sense that you're the only one around. Just my opinion; I would scope it out and see how you feel. That being said, if you're in the northern part of the neighborhood, you're far more likely to take the 26 bus anyway; it runs frequently down Detroit Avenue and the bus stops are in well-lit areas with lots of pedestrian traffic.

 

Of the three, I think Ohio City hands down has the best public transportation offerings. The West 25th St. train station spills right onto Lorain Avenue across from the West Side market, and there are a ton of buses servicing Lorain, Detroit and W. 25th. As a car-free guy, my bet would be that it would be the easiest of the three to get around without a car. In Cleveland, I would say the easiest places for getting around car-free are Ohio City, Shaker Square, University Circle/Little Italy and downtown. And all of these areas have good lighting, pedestrians and automobile traffice, retail corridors, etc. that make them more palatable for riding trains and buses late at night.

 

That being said, all three neighborhoods you're concentrating on are really charming in their respective ways, and we have a decent transit system, so you can do the car-free thing pretty much anywhere in the city. As others have mentioned, I would definitely just check out the neighborhoods on foot to get a feel, and then maybe do a nighttime drive-through of your top picks to get a taste of that.

Second Ohio City as very good possibility.  And it is in between Tremont and DS.

 

it also has it's +'s and -'s. 

 

One thing that could tip the scale to one neighborhood over another would be where you (and your significant other) might be working. 

 

I work out on the east side---Beachwood, and the move from Tremont to DS added 10 minutes to my commute each way.  from 20-35 mins to 30-45.  If I worked in Westlake it would have dropped it by that much.

 

Public transportation is great but if it takes 3 hours to use it to get to where you need to go....well then you are going to drive.  And I have a fist full of bus passes and use the RTA whenever it is practical, but that is just the reality.

 

http://www.riderta.com/maps-schedules.asp  has a system map and schedules....you can plot out some sample trips to see how public transport will work for you....

 

Hub and spoke system, everything is geared around downtown.  so if you are going or coming from downtown it is fairly efficient, if you are trying to start or end anywhere that isn't downtown...well then things start getting much less usable in a big hurry.  nothing like a 2 bus 1 train 3 hour trip somewhere to make you decide that driving is a better option....especially when our rush hour traffic here looks like 3 am Traffic in Chi-town.  Generally speaking traffic moves at 50-60 MPH during rush hour...outside of a couple of problem spots and/or an accident.  AND this was before the latest round of RTA cutbacks.

 

The longest drive you would have to make from somewhere in the city of Cleveland to anywhere in cuyahoga county (and most parts of Lorain, medina, or Lake that you might need to go to) will NOT take an hour, most trips will be significantly less.

 

For instance if you are in the medical field and plan on working at the Clinic or UH, then Shaker Square or Little Italy would probably work out better for you.

kson and 88shade:

Great info! I appreciate all of the public transit stuff. While I don't use it in Chicago that much, my girlfriend uses it all the time and would like to continue to do so. My understanding is Cleveland has one of the better public trans systems for a city its size. Ohio City does seem best, but not a deal breaker by any means.

 

My job would be in Mentor, Westlake, or beachwood most likely. Her job would probably be in the city. Dealing with Chicago traffic and a 45 min to 1 hr commute every day, I'm not that concerned. If I go Mentor, Little Italy and University Circle will jump higher for consideration.

 

 

I traded a few emails with a forumer who had lived in NYC for many years who relcated to OC with her husband and she said it was a great experience. The food scene was surprisingly good and the social scene was solid as well.

 

Thanks for the breakdown between DS and Tremont. That's the type of info that is so helpful.

 

Does anyone have friends who have rented or bought those modern looking townhome near the lake in DS?? I think Progressive Urban Realty markets them..they look a little isolated, but I love the design.

My wife moved here from the Upper east side of Manhattan....she just went back to visit some friends, she doesn't miss it.

 

Which townhouses?  if it isn't battery park, take a look at google maps and give me some cross streets.  None of them are really isolated, access to/from the park/lake is limited but everything south is pretty darn dense.

 

Battery park is currently being built (probably what you are asking about) ...they run between W 73 and W 76th.  There is at least one person on these boards who lives there and there is a very extensive thread, 24 pages,  in the Development section on this development. 

 

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,1684.0.html

 

here is their website

 

http://www.batteryparkcleveland.com/

 

There are what I call the "modern Nautical" ones along W. 67th St.

 

here is a real estate listing for one of those

 

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/1207-W-67_Cleveland_OH_44102_1117492795

 

And in between are some slightly more traditional looking ones between W. 69th and 70th.  I know someone in this development.

 

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/1211-W-69Th_Cleveland_OH_44102_1111733699

 

also take a look at this

 

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/1343-W-49Th-St_Cleveland_OH_44102_1109330671

 

and this

 

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/5311-Herman-Ave-Unit-3_Cleveland_OH_44102_1116457594

 

and NO I am NOT a realtor....we bought in this neighborhood 7 months ago after I spent 2.5 years looking for what would meet our needs.  Those 2 (along with the first 3) sound like they are kind of what you are looking for, which was remarkably a lot like what we were looking for.

My wife and I recently moved into a townhome on W. 54th, north of Detroit.  I also own a place in Tremont (shameless plug: looking to rent/sell the place).  DS, Tremont, and Ohio City pretty much run together, so whichever neighborhood you choose, the others are just a short ride/walk/drive away.  Anyway, having lived in 2 of the three neighborhoods (albeit only for a brief spell in DS), I think they are both great, for all the reasons stated by the other posters. 

 

I would add that another great thing about both neighborhoods (and Ohio City) is that there is a very strong sense of community among many of the residents.  The fact that there are so many active block clubs in all three neighborhoods is an indicator of this. 

Chicagoist, what neighborhood in CHI do you like the best?  I live in Chicago for years and know the neighborhoods well, maybe I can suggest a place based on your answer.

 

If I were moving back home, I would move to DS without a doubt.

Another Detroit Shoreway-er here. I moved in in January after renovating an old Victorian house. You're right, the best deals of the three near West neighborhoods you mention are definitely here. There's also good energy among the residents and a general spirit of "let's chip in and make the neighborhood better" - at least the sub-neighborhood north of Bridge, between W. 54th and W. 70th. Lake access is unbeatable - we strolled to Edgewater one night last week and hung out at the lake... lots of other people around doing the same. Very urban, very beautiful. What you're trading is easy access to certain amenities (no decent grocery store, no ATM(!)) and of course you're a little further from downtown.

I do think that Ohio City is a great transition neighborhood for folks moving back to Cleveland from a bigger city. It's got perhaps the best balance of intact urban fabric, access to transit, array of amenities and proximity to downtown of any neighborhood in the City. When I moved back to CLE from Brooklyn, NY, I rented on Jay Avenue and the only thing I had to drive or bike to was a drug store. Everything else is in walking distance.

blinker

 

there is a chase with an ATM at 67th and Detroit (walk in, not drive through), it hasn't been there long but it is there now.

Chicagoist, what neighborhood in CHI do you like the best? I live in Chicago for years and know the neighborhoods well, maybe I can suggest a place based on your answer.

 

If I were moving back home, I would move to DS without a doubt.

 

I live in Oak Park, but hangout quite a bit downtown (Gold Coast, Streeterville) and the LP, Old Town, Andersonville...general North Chicago hoods. Some Wicker Park and Bucktown, but not as much. I work in Skokie.  I picture Ohio City, and to a lesser extent, Tremont as more of the Wicker Park, Bucktown molds...could be wrong.

I agree with Tremont <=> Wicker Park.

 

If you can follow me on this one, Detroit Shoreway is kind of like a Roscoe Village from the year 2000.  Close to the hip neighborhoods, but at a time when the people from LP, Wrigleyville, Southport etc got married and had kids, they wanted a single family home, and they found Roscoe Village.

Back in 2000, it was still kind of a sketchy area, but in 5 short years, the real estate BOOMED there.  I loved living in RV. 

 

Between the new restaurants, arts scene, people investing in their homes, and the potential shoreway redesign to a 35mph boulevard, I think DS is going to be the place to be in 3 years.  My brother bought a house there in the early 90s, and I have seen the neighborhood change and grow.  It has just gotten better.

 

Just my opinion

Hola Chicagoist!  I concur with all the warm love for DS.  We moved in three years ago to the small neighborhood sandwiched between Battery Park, Detroit Ave, W76 & W73.  Someone has coined it as EdgeWater Hill and there are definitely some fixer-upper bargains to be had!  PM me for more info.  Community spirit is alive, and as such we had a fun neighborhood scale public art project installed last fall. There are also folks working on a food cooperative. I mainly get around via bicycle and foot (bus in winter/rain) though I have the benefit of doing most of my work/meetings in OC or dwntwn.

The #26 serves DS very well with service avg. every 20 minutes.  The lack of a grocery store is a minor inconvenience with the WSM and Dave's less than 2 miles away and a pretty good Asian grocer on Detroit 'round W.53rd and a slowly growing farmer's market from june-oct + a Save-A-Lot for desperate times....

And the lake.....ahh the lake... a short five minute walk from our 'hood via well maintained ped/bike access @ W. 65 and much improved bike/ped access to come at W.76 this summer.  In the summer months Edgewater is home to many multicultural celebrations and the park is alive from dawn till dusk....w/ sand volleyball at Whiskey Island only a few minutes east.  In the winter, the sledding is good!

ksonic - Is the Chase ATM accessible outside bank hours? Last time I checked there was no after-hours access.

re: the chase ATM, it is open 24-7 with entry through a door that requires a swipe from an ATM card to open it

Not sure....My wife has a chase account/ATM card. 

 

The couple times she has used it the bank has not been open...like 6 pm.  but I think you need at least an ATM card to get into the vestibule, not sure if a different bank ATM card would work to get in after hours...or if it is accessible to anyone after say 9 pm all "after-hours" not being equal and all.

 

Next time she has to visit and I am with her I will see what I can figure out.

 

It isn't clear on-line...Some of them are labeled 24 hour access and that one is not given that designation.

 

 

I used that ATM late night when I was home for Thanksgiving.

 

Group, could that conversation be taken to PM please?  Thank you.

 

Back on topic

With all due respect punch...

 

When deciding which neighborhood to live in, what amenities are in or nearby that neighborhood, such as a 24 hour ATM, is absolutely on topic.  There is one in Tremont and at least 2 I know of in Ohio City.

 

For instance the closest gas station I would send my wife to alone is the get-go at 117th, and there is no dry cleaner that I am aware of.  But there is a drug store, Rite-aid, at 65th and Franklin

 

All of this information is important in deciding which neighborhood to live in.

The ATM info is helpful and the safety factors for my girlfriend as well. We're fortunate to be in an area of Chicago with all the amenities one could ever need. It does spoil you to certain extent. I'm certainly not expecting the same convenience to amenities as we get here in Chicago..but but...having said that and it has been mentioned on these boards numerous times --- using the walk score calculator gives you some interesting information.

 

There are neighborhoods downtown and Ohio City that are almost as walkable as those found in Manhattan! Tremont and parts of DS are up there too. I haven't walk scored East hoods, but I'd be curious if they rank as walkable...time to do some research!

 

 

^It wasn't on your list of neighborhoods, but Shaker Square is probably the most walkable neighborhood on the East Side and is among the most walkable in the whole city.  I think it's the only neighborhood in the city with a movie theater, full service grocery store, farmers market, wide selection of restaurants, and high quality rail and bus transit service.  Also good public schools (Shaker Heights) and great parks.  But no Lake Erie. And further from downtown (though only 13 mins by rail).

Tremont and OC are more "mature" as gentrified areas, DS is getting started. 

 

Things to think about are the things you do on a daily, weekly, monthly basis. 

 

Like where do you get your car serviced?

Doctor/Dentist/Eye care?

Banking?

Church, mosque, synagogue?

Morning coffee? Newspaper?

Grocery, drug, convenient store?

Dry Cleaner?

Hair cut, pedicure/manicure?--A work friend moved here from Youngstown...it took him 3 years to find somebody to cut his hair in any sort of satisfactory way.

Hobbies?

 

An important one for me.....Ice Cream

 

Some of these I end up doing near work, some I do near where my mother lives.  Some are more important to you than others, I probably haven't listed some that are very important to you, and some that are on my list aren't for you.

 

But think of the things you do regularly and semi-regularly....you will need to replace that here, some will be easier than others.

Tremont and OC are more "mature" as gentrified areas, DS is getting started. 

 

Things to think about are the things you do on a daily, weekly, monthly basis.  

 

Like where do you get your car serviced?

Doctor/Dentist/Eye care?

Banking?

Church, mosque, synagogue?

Morning coffee? Newspaper?

Grocery, drug, convenient store?

Dry Cleaner?

Hair cut, pedicure/manicure?

Hobbies?

 

An important one for me.....Ice Cream

 

Some of these I end up doing near work, some I do near where my mother lives.  Some are more important to you than others, I probably haven't listed some that are very important to you, and some that are on my list aren't for you.

 

But think of the things you do regularly and semi-regularly....you will need to replace that here, some will be easier than others.

 

A quick list:

Convenience store at least once a day

gastro pub/hole in the wall bar

ethnic food

good place to run/work out

coffee shop (does not have to be starbucks)

bookstore

acess to public transportation

movie theater

good grocery store

definitely access to Cleveland pro sport facilities..one of the bigger draws for me, my GF much less so. She hates LeBron...too full of himself.  Oh, the heresy. ;)

 

If it was just me, I'd sleep in a tent outside of Browns Stadium and I'd be fine. For my dear GF, being able to use public transit late at night and feeling safe would be very important. We both like to do similar things, although the cultural amenities and having access to a dance studio, thirft stores, and retail is much more important to her. I'm the neandrathal.  She rides the Chicago "L" all over the city at all times of night by herself or with friends.

 

We're going to be checking things out this weekend and I'll definitely share my thoughts after our visit.

Stop by Stone Mad pub and the Parkview in DS on your scouting trip.

 

and have brunch at latitude 41 North... de. lisc. ous.

Everything is walkable from the "center" of DS  65th and Detroit unless otherwise noted.

 

A quick list:

Convenience store at least once a day

 

The Rite Aide/Save a lot will probably meet most of these needs, otherwise you will need something near or on your way to work....at least currently the convenient store options within walking distance are pretty sketchy.

 

gastro pub/hole in the wall bar

 

This is covered, Luxe, Reddstone, Stone Mad, Happy Dog, latitude 41

 

ethnic food

 

Mihn Ah, La Boca, and the Puerto Rican Place inside the arcade...Harp might be a bit outside the walking zone @45th st.

 

good place to run/work out

 

Run in Edgewater Park.  There is the Y, a fitworks and that new place at 558 to work out downtown ...it is 3 miles away on the 26 bus route.

 

coffee shop (does not have to be starbucks)

 

Gypsy bean

 

bookstore

 

going to have to leave DS

 

access to public transportation

 

1/2 mile to the red line rapid train, the 26 and 45 buses come through the intersection of 65th and Detroit.

 

movie theater

 

Right at 65th and Detroit.  Capitol Theater Grand re-opening last fall, they serve beer/wine with your popcorn.  Show first run and some Indy films.

Cleveland Public Theater is also located at this intersection.

 

good grocery store

 

Going to have to leave the hood...there is a good butcher on Detroit, the West side Market is 3 or miles away, Giant Eagle is at 117th, there is a Sav-a-lot on Detroit low end groceries Aldis equivalent if you have those in Chi-town.

 

definitely access to Cleveland pro sport facilities..one of the bigger draws for me, my GF much less so. She hates LeBron...too full of himself.  Oh, the heresy. ;)

 

Take the 26 (or the train) downtown and you are a pretty easy walk to any of the sports faculties.

 

If it was just me, I'd sleep in a tent outside of Browns Stadium and I'd be fine. For my dear GF, being able to use public transit late at night and feeling safe would be very important. We both like to do similar things, although the cultural amenities and having access to a dance studio, thirft stores, and retail is much more important to her. I'm the Neanderthal.  She rides the Chicago "L" all over the city at all times of night by herself or with friends.

 

Late at night we take a cab.....$10 from downtown to DS or Tremont, can be a little less to OC.  The train is less sketchy.  Actually it is more where you have to stand and wait for the public transportation that can make you feel very uncomfortable more than actually being on it...and where the Train lets out can be a long lonely walk to DS, OC it is much closer to whatever activity is occurring.

 

dance studio, thirft stores, and retail

 

Unless somebody else knows different, you will need to leave DS for these things...."Antique row" is pretty darn close though up on Lorain Rd.

 

We're going to be checking things out this weekend and I'll definitely share my thoughts after our visit.

 

If you wanted to pick a time to meet at say Stone Mad, you might get some locals here to buy you a guinness.

 

Does anyone from the neighborhood use the Zone Rec Center on Lorain/W 65th?  A friend's sister and brother-in-law just moved to W.44/Whitman from Virginia and were asking about the Rec Center.  I found this link to programs but was hoping someone had first-hand experience...

 

http://portal.cleveland-oh.gov/clnd_images/Parks/rec_sched/zone.pdf

Hitting RJ Boland's before the game tonight. Will check out a couple of more places in the same hood after the game.

 

Fwiw, I have 2 family friends who recently moved back to the Cleveland area..both early 30 something professionals. One lived in Los Angeles for years and the other was in Chicago and Indianapolis. The Chicago friend has been living in the Bingham for a year, but now, along with my other friend, wants to move to...Tremont.

 

They both have the financial resources to live anywhere in the city, grew up in Oberlin...lived out of state for over 10 years...returned to the Cleveland area and now want to live near the city. Gotta like that...

 

Definitely. It's a beautiful thing.

RJ Bohlands has a pretty decent Happy Hour from what I recall (only been there once).  BBQ pizza was pretty good.

Ok, quick recap of my weekend visit and genreal observations:

 

I went to the Cavs game Friday night, ate at RJ BOlands pre-game and hit that Irish place on the corner of East 4th postgame and then hit a bar in Tremont. Drank too much but was impressed with the downtown area. It was lively, clean and a lot of younger folks out and about. The weather was great. The food was good at Bolands and good value.  Pretty compact area with a lot going on. Did not get a chance to venture beyond that little square though. People were very friendly. Unfortunately, the only time I was in Tremont was that night. The bar was fine and it was a mixed crowd. I wish I could remember the name of the place. My GF remarked that, unlike Chicago, the bars or restaurants were spread out throughout the neighborhood. It made it feel more deserted to her...not as lively. I liked it though...nice views of downtown from Tremont.

 

Saturday: Due to family obligations I was only able to do a quick driveby through Ohio City and DS. We drove in on Lorain Ave from Great Northern Mall to Ohio City. Went to the West side Market and walked around 2 blocks of Ohio City. The Great Lakes Brewery and Flying Fig looked good and young people were out and about. The West Side Market was bustling. My GF liked the Ohio City area the best and thought it was more Chicago-like but still seemed deserted comparitively speaking. Some interesting architecture going on..I liked it alot and see why it is becoming more popular. Unfortunately, was not able to explore it fully.

 

We then drove west on Detroit Avenue to DS and visited Battery Parkand went theough The Gordon Arts District, saw Mad Pub...I liked it...nice balance of shore line living and urban. My GF, again, could not get past that pubs were mixed in with houses..she's used to brownstones. I saw the more modern neo-futurist townhomes that have sprung up in the area, that loked smaller than I envisioned. I liked the area. GF didnt.

 

Finally, drove through Lakewood on Edgewater

My GF loved the look of Lakewood and thught it was the most Chicago like. She compared i to Oak Park (where we live currently. She htought it was a great blend of neighborhood, while still being close to the city. She would move to lakewood and be happy. 

 

All in all, I was impressed with the neighborhoods, and would now consider downtown a real player...I probably liked Ohio City the best, but Tremont did not get a fair shake on this visit.

GF didnt like the more urban neighborhoods...they seemed too desolate to her. No sh!t babe. :)

I have nothing bad to say about any of the areas you have discussed so far

 

OC

Tremont

DS

 

and now

 

Downtown

Lakewood

 

I have visited friends in Chicago....Lincoln park and Wrigleyville......No matter where or when we went out and about (including some 4 am bars and late night burrito stands) there were ALWAYS people around and not just people but what I call "citizens"  you know somebody who looks like they might help or at least call 911 if a problem broke out.  Cleveland just isn't like that....people just aren't out and about on foot like you are used to.

 

Much less walking/public transport in C-town.....you just don't have foot traffic like you did in Chi-town anywhere in the Cleve.  The few places that might come close are small and situational.  There are tons of event down at the Q/Jacobs field but if you go down town on a Sat/Sun non game day it will most likely be a ghost town during the day...E 4th seems to have achieved some critical mass that weekend evenings should have a good bit of activity with or without Events.

 

Next time you come observe all the cars with bike racks/bikes....people here drive to where they ride their bikes (a generalization of course, but this is not a "bike friendly" city) or roller blade or even jog sometimes.

 

Ohio City by the market will be hopping on a sat morning/afternoon and be deserted on Sunday.

 

Lakewood is a decent community, like all others there are pluses and minuses.  A huge Minus for someone hoping to use public transit extensively...RTA just discontinued the 55 service down Clifton on the weekends as part of some wide ranging cuts. 

 

Lakewood  does have quite a bit of Density and is full of the "Cleveland brownstone"  Wood frame up and down doubles.  We needed to double up on the available land not triple or quadruple like chi-town when they were built.  We also didn't have THE FIRE and the resultant codes.

 

The nice thing about any and all of the areas you are discussing.....it isn't but a 20 (30 during rush hour maybe) minute drive between the furthest ones (lakewood - tremont/downtown).  Downtown to DS or Tremont is 3 miles, less to OC.

 

You can try to live car-free here but it will be a lot more challenging than Chicago.  On the other hand, 1/2 a house in lakewood shouldn't cost you much more than $600, so the difference in the rent can go towards a car(s).  And driving from lakewood to downtown shouldn't be more than 30 minutes during rush hour and you can shave this down by adjusting your start/leave time and/or how close you can find a place to an on ramp.

 

The key will be where you work in relation to where you live as to how hard it is to public transport it.

 

If you are trying to get by on 1 car and maximize public transit/walking downtown might be the best bet, but it will be more expensive than Lakewood.  The difference will probably equal out to a car payment on a Honda Civic or so.

 

One nice thing you have is flexibility......pick a place come and rent, visit the areas a little more, get a 1 year lease, after a year you will have much better idea of how the Cleve works :-).

Thanks for the recap, sounds like you got a lot done!

Yeah, thanks indeed for that- always interesting to read some neighborhood reviews.

 

If you're open to having a suburban address (like Lakewood), I'd also look at Cleveland Heights.  I'm not a Cleveland Heights homer (have never lived there), but Coventry has always struck me as one of the least deserted-feeling walkable, dense neighborhoods in the area, which has great appeal to me.  Good variety of housing stock too.  And while not very close to the lake, it' very close to University Circle.

I have nothing bad to say about any of the areas you have discussed so far

 

OC

Tremont

DS

 

and now

 

Downtown

Lakewood

 

I have visited friends in Chicago....Lincoln park and Wrigleyville......No matter where or when we went out and about (including some 4 am bars and late night burrito stands) there were ALWAYS people around and not just people but what I call "citizens" you know somebody who looks like they might help or at least call 911 if a problem broke out. Cleveland just isn't like that....people just aren't out and about on foot like you are used to.

 

Much less walking/public transport in C-town.....you just don't have foot traffic like you did in Chi-town anywhere in the Cleve.   The few places that might come close are small and situational. There are tons of event down at the Q/Jacobs field but if you go down town on a Sat/Sun non game day it will most likely be a ghost town during the day...E 4th seems to have achieved some critical mass that weekend evenings should have a good bit of activity with or without Events.

 

Next time you come observe all the cars with bike racks/bikes....people here drive to where they ride their bikes (a generalization of course, but this is not a "bike friendly" city) or roller blade or even jog sometimes.

 

Ohio City by the market will be hopping on a sat morning/afternoon and be deserted on Sunday.

 

Lakewood is a decent community, like all others there are pluses and minuses.   A huge Minus for someone hoping to use public transit extensively...RTA just discontinued the 55 service down Clifton on the weekends as part of some wide ranging cuts.  

 

Lakewood does have quite a bit of Density and is full of the "Cleveland brownstone" Wood frame up and down doubles. We needed to double up on the available land not triple or quadruple like chi-town when they were built. We also didn't have THE FIRE and the resultant codes.

 

The nice thing about any and all of the areas you are discussing.....it isn't but a 20 (30 during rush hour maybe) minute drive between the furthest ones (lakewood - tremont/downtown). Downtown to DS or Tremont is 3 miles, less to OC.

 

You can try to live car-free here but it will be a lot more challenging than Chicago. On the other hand, 1/2 a house in lakewood shouldn't cost you much more than $600, so the difference in the rent can go towards a car(s). And driving from lakewood to downtown shouldn't be more than 30 minutes during rush hour and you can shave this down by adjusting your start/leave time and/or how close you can find a place to an on ramp.

 

The key will be where you work in relation to where you live as to how hard it is to public transport it.

 

If you are trying to get by on 1 car and maximize public transit/walking downtown might be the best bet, but it will be more expensive than Lakewood. The difference will probably equal out to a car payment on a Honda Civic or so.

 

One nice thing you have is flexibility......pick a place come and rent, visit the areas a little more, get a 1 year lease, after a year you will have much better idea of how the Cleve works :-).

 

Thanks ksonic!

See, Wrigleyville and LP are the reference points for my GF. She works in Lincoln Park. The irony is she doesn't necessarily want to live in such a dense neighborhood. Hence, why she liked Lakewood so much. She likes the urban/suburban mix (ahem, she is thinking kids in the near future) Plus, I'm a straight Cleveland homer while she is not. My urban pioneering ways don't translate to her...she wants more safety and kid friendly.

 

Anyway, yes, renting a for awhile would probably be best, but oh the deals to be had buying! What they are charging at the Pointe of Gateway for example is criminally low. Why people aren't pouncing on those condos makes no sense to me.

 

Oh, and something else that jumped out at me...the people in Cleveland were better looking than you find in Chicago. There's something to hang your hat on. :)

 

 

Yeah, thanks indeed for that- always interesting to read some neighborhood reviews.

 

If you're open to having a suburban address (like Lakewood), I'd also look at Cleveland Heights. I'm not a Cleveland Heights homer (have never lived there), but Coventry has always struck me as one of the least deserted-feeling walkable, dense neighborhoods in the area, which has great appeal to me. Good variety of housing stock too. And while not very close to the lake, it' very close to University Circle.

 

Absolutely! I've always found the east side to be more New Englandly. Shaker Square, Cleveland Heights, etc...if my GF thought Lakewood looked good, she would positively weep at Shaker Square. If you want suburbs, CLeveland is the place. Much better on the whole than, say, Chicago's.

 

For those of you old timers, I'll never forget the quote by former Indian Pat Tabler who said Cleveland had the best suburbs in the American League. Ha ha. A wise man. :)

They aren't buying at the pointe at gateway because there is no parking...you have to rent a spot in an open garage across the street.  In chicago just being able to get a spot off the street might be a bonus...in C-town if you don't have covered secured parking it ain't selling.

 

Rent in Lakewood, then buy in Rocky river (Don't everybody get all over me or list 30 other burbs just as good or better than river....River is the best closest burb to lakewood/west side of cleveland)....if you are going to have kids.  Look up the school ratings where ever such things exist.  Next time you are in town check out the area around Detroit and Wooster  old down town rocky river.  The 55 bus serves the area.

 

 

The 55 bus serves the area.

 

Not anymore it doesn't.  See the RTA thread.

^I think the 55 still runs, just not on the weekend.  Which still stinks.

I meant it basically doesn't run when it might be useful outside of work hours.  Just like many of the other buses.

Thanks for the recap! It's nice to get fresh perspectives on these nabes! Based on your feedback, it sounds like Ohio City, downtown and Tremont might be good mixes for both of you. I would definitely also check out Shaker Square with her. It's in the city proper, so you're still fighting the good fight. You'd have midrises, retail, pedestrians, ample public transit, three distinct city neighborhoods (Buckeye, the square and Larchmere) within a 10-minute walk, but you're also flanked by the beautiful homes of Shaker Heights, the crazy-nice Shaker Parklands and a bit of a hike (but not too far) from Coventry and Cedar-Fairmount, two pedestrian-dense areas in Cleveland Heights.

 

I would also check out Little Italy. This is nice and dense, has a ton of pedestrian traffic and is just blocks from Lakeview Cemetery (beautiful, beautiful place) and from Case Western and the museums. The streets are narrow, which adds to the sense of density. It's just a really fun little nabe, and train service is being realigned to serve it a bit better (currently, it's on the backside of the neighborhood, with poor site lines ... in a couple years, it'll be right on the main drag). You're also a 10-minute walk from the HealthLine, our bus rapid transit line that runs really frequently. There's also Uptown, a planned retail corridor set to be the new home of Cleveland's fantastic Museum of Contemporary Art, in a couple of years. This definitely might be a nice fit for both of you. 

All that being said, I would recommend spending a bit of time checking out NEOCANDO (http://neocando.case.edu). It takes a few minutes to register, but it's well worth it. It's a clearinghouse of data about Cleveland neighborhoods (and in some cases, the surrounding suburbs). You can see data on crime rates, median household salary, educational attainment, average number of years residents have lived at their current address, students' average academic proficiency scores, percentage of residents who ride a bike to work, etc., etc. ... All at the neighborhood level. Some of this data dates back to 2000 (mostly Census stuff), but other stuff is as fresh as 2009. You can search for a particular indicator across multiple neighborhoods or get a profile for a particular neighborhood.

 

As an example of some basic research, if your gf is worried about a place feeling desolate, the underlying fear might be likelihood of crime. Here's a look at some sample violent crime rates per 100,000 residents, as of 2008:

 

Buckeye-Shaker (area around Shaker Square): 1,479.22 per 100,000 residents (189 crimes total)

Detroit-Shoreway: 2,017.92 (333)

Downtown: 3,043.67 (240)

Edgewater (the Cleveland neighborhood that borders Lakewood): 1,311.17 (110)

Ohio City: 3,089.83 (271)

Tremont: 891.31 (70)

University (includes Little Italy): 573.67 (66) 

 

Now, that's not to say that Tremont or Little Italy are wonderful and Ohio City and Downtown are horrible. Obviously, crime rates vary from year to year, non-violent crime rates may look different, some crimes aren't recorded, etc., etc. And obviously a TON of factors go into selecting a neighborhood. Just recommending mixing your gut reaction with a bit of data. Frankly, I would feel safe in any of these neighborhoods, day or night, but data like this might help you make an informed decision, particularly if you're not going to get a ton of time in each neighborhood.

The larger take away should be that you will be able to find something suitable.  I would figure out where you are both going to be working, that would be the most important to me in the decision making process.

 

You can find Lakewood on the east side in the various Heights communities....Shaker, University, Cleveland.

 

Tremont/OC on the west...shaker square little italy on the east.  As well as various burbs  Rocky River/Beachwood  Fairview/mayfield hts....etc etc etc.

 

if one of you works downtown and the other in Solon...then maybe Shaker square or Mayfield Hts.

 

if it is downtown and Westlake....then Lakewood.

 

Downtown and Independence...then Tremont.

 

or you can live down town :-)

 

Driving from Shaker square to Westlake or from Lakewood to Solon will be about as long a commute as you can come up with.

 

Especially when you are first here and renting find an area that works in the short term...then look for the best long term fit especially for having kids.

 

Cleveland Eastside-Westside is Chicago North-South.....the river divides us both physically and mentally.

 

Whichever side you pick...your neighbors certainly and you  probably will rarely cross the river. 

 

Downtown is Switzerland :-)

One thing to note about the crime rates 8shades posted is that while they're helpful for comparing residential neighborhoods, they break down for comparing places like Downtown and University that have relatively few residents, but large numbers of workers and visitors.  Even at best they only give you statistical odds of being a victim, but little crime is random- most revolves around the drug trade, or domestic disputes, or being drunk and belligerent with someone else, etc.

That's actually an excellent point. Both Downtown and University have larger residential populations than Ohio City and Tremont, but with the sheer number of visitors in these neighborhoods, the overall probability of being a victim of violent crime is actually significantly lower than what it looks like. You can find similar limitations to just about any of the data available there. My main point is that you should definitely go with your gut instinct at the end of the day, but if you find yourself equally split on three or four neighborhoods, a little data might help.