Since we somewhat unfairly knocked the CH potential home buyer thread off topic, I thought it would be nice if there were a thread dedicated to the issues of the eastern suburban Heights area of Cleveland, including of course Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, University Heights, and also at times South Euclid and Beachwood.

 

So I'll start us off. 

 

Good news:  Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news:  Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens.  It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt.  Parking will be an issue, too.  What can CH do to alleviate that?  Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process.  However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts?  Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

Another police shooting in the Fernway area of Shaker Heights:

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/05/shaker_heights_police_fatally.html

 

Shaker Heights levy passes:

 

http://www.cleveland.com/sun/all/index.ssf/2010/05/shaker_heights_voters_approve.html

 

I believe the Beachwood levy passed, too.

Another police shooting in the Fernway area of Shaker Heights:

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/05/shaker_heights_police_fatally.html

 

Shaker Heights levy passes:

 

http://www.cleveland.com/sun/all/index.ssf/2010/05/shaker_heights_voters_approve.html

 

I believe the Beachwood levy passed, too.

 

 

Another?  When was the last one(s)?

Since we somewhat unfairly knocked the CH potential home buyer thread off topic, I thought it would be nice if there were a thread dedicated to the issues of the eastern suburban Heights area of Cleveland, including of course Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, University Heights, and also at times South Euclid and Beachwood.

 

So I'll start us off.

 

Good news: Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news: Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens. It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt. Parking will be an issue, too. What can CH do to alleviate that? Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process. However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts? Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

I don't think CH needs to make any street improvements.  Yes, things will be a bit slower, but I can't imagine it will turn into a gridlock.  As far as parking, I agree it seems like it would be an issue, but I think Melt will utilize the parking lot behind them as well as maybe the lot catty-corner (sp?) to them.

CH DEFINITELY has to fix up Taylor Rd.- it's a nightmare trying to keep your alignment intact in that street from Mayfield north to E.C..

Since there was some debate about this in another thread, let's clear some things up -

 

OHSAA offers possible rule change on forfeits: High school newswatch

 

Cleveland Heights prides itself upon being a progressive community.

 

Heights High is the poster child this month for a proposed change in an Ohio High School Athletic Association bylaw that caused plenty of heartache in the school last fall.

 

Principals at OHSAA member schools have until May 17 to vote on 17 referendum issues, including a limited change to eligibility Bylaw 4-1-1 that forced Cleveland Heights to forfeit three of its seven football victories. If adopted, the bylaw change would give OHSAA commissioners an option other than forfeits for administrative errors.

 

 

MORE - http://highschoolsports.cleveland.com/news/article/-4337222666245885925/ohsaa-offers-possible-rule-change-on-forfeits-high-school-newswatch/

Another police shooting in the Fernway area of Shaker Heights:

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/05/shaker_heights_police_fatally.html

 

Shaker Heights levy passes:

 

http://www.cleveland.com/sun/all/index.ssf/2010/05/shaker_heights_voters_approve.html

 

I believe the Beachwood levy passed, too.

 

 

Another?  When was the last one(s)?

 

A little less than a year ago:

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/07/shaker_heights_police_officer.html

Since we somewhat unfairly knocked the CH potential home buyer thread off topic, I thought it would be nice if there were a thread dedicated to the issues of the eastern suburban Heights area of Cleveland, including of course Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, University Heights, and also at times South Euclid and Beachwood.

 

So I'll start us off. 

 

Good news:  Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news:  Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens.  It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt.  Parking will be an issue, too.  What can CH do to alleviate that?  Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process.  However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts?  Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

I don't think CH needs to make any street improvements.  Yes, things will be a bit slower, but I can't imagine it will turn into a gridlock.  As far as parking, I agree it seems like it would be an issue, but I think Melt will utilize the parking lot behind them as well as maybe the lot catty-corner (sp?) to them.

 

Parking is going to be a nightmare over there, if my understanding of how busy Melt can get is correct.  The parking lot behind them is already used by several other businesses and the one caddy-corner to them is not really theirs to use.

 

CH DEFINITELY has to fix up Taylor Rd.- it's a nightmare trying to keep your alignment intact in that street from Mayfield north to E.C..

 

Taylor is probably the worst, but there are a lot of streets in CH that need some serious help.

Since there was some debate about this in another thread, let's clear some things up -

 

OHSAA offers possible rule change on forfeits: High school newswatch

 

Cleveland Heights prides itself upon being a progressive community.

 

Heights High is the poster child this month for a proposed change in an Ohio High School Athletic Association bylaw that caused plenty of heartache in the school last fall.

 

Principals at OHSAA member schools have until May 17 to vote on 17 referendum issues, including a limited change to eligibility Bylaw 4-1-1 that forced Cleveland Heights to forfeit three of its seven football victories. If adopted, the bylaw change would give OHSAA commissioners an option other than forfeits for administrative errors.

 

 

MORE - http://highschoolsports.cleveland.com/news/article/-4337222666245885925/ohsaa-offers-possible-rule-change-on-forfeits-high-school-newswatch/

 

In fairness to reality, Jeff Rotsky isn't held in high regard in the Cleveland area as a coach that plays by the rules as far as recruiting/transferring goes.  If I recall, this debate was in regards to private schools recruiting kids?  To be clear, I do believe that the punishment Heights received for the rule that was broken was a bit too harsh.  That said, I would not be the least bit shocked if there were other violations committed by the program that the OHSAA was unaware of.  We'll never know for sure, but such allegations are no less legitimate than claims made by some that private schools are out putting together all-star teams.

Since we somewhat unfairly knocked the CH potential home buyer thread off topic, I thought it would be nice if there were a thread dedicated to the issues of the eastern suburban Heights area of Cleveland, including of course Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, University Heights, and also at times South Euclid and Beachwood.

 

So I'll start us off.

 

Good news: Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news: Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens. It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt. Parking will be an issue, too. What can CH do to alleviate that? Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process. However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts? Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

I don't think CH needs to make any street improvements. Yes, things will be a bit slower, but I can't imagine it will turn into a gridlock. As far as parking, I agree it seems like it would be an issue, but I think Melt will utilize the parking lot behind them as well as maybe the lot catty-corner (sp?) to them.

 

Parking is going to be a nightmare over there, if my understanding of how busy Melt can get is correct. The parking lot behind them is already used by several other businesses and the one caddy-corner to them is not really theirs to use.

 

CH DEFINITELY has to fix up Taylor Rd.- it's a nightmare trying to keep your alignment intact in that street from Mayfield north to E.C..

 

Taylor is probably the worst, but there are a lot of streets in CH that need some serious help.

 

Agreed on A LOT of streets on CH that need help.  That's probably why I just had to buy 4 new tires yesterday and fix my seriously messed up alignment!

 

I think I heard that Melt will have an agreement with that parking lot owner to use some of their spaces (or it might have been another nearby parking lot).  I imagine they will have valet.  I think we are too spoiled in the Cleveland area.  Park on a side street and walk a block or two!  It won't kill us to walk off that grilled cheese sandwich!

 

As to the Shaker shooting, I never want any shooting to happen, but at least it wasn't an innocent person shot by a criminal (assuming the shooting was on the up and up).  And an average of 1 police shooting incident per year doesn't really qualify as an epidemic.

As far as parking goes...parking on a side street and walking a few blocks is already how it has been in Cleveland Hts forever around most commercial strips.  Cannot see why Melt will be any different.

Since we somewhat unfairly knocked the CH potential home buyer thread off topic, I thought it would be nice if there were a thread dedicated to the issues of the eastern suburban Heights area of Cleveland, including of course Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, University Heights, and also at times South Euclid and Beachwood.

 

So I'll start us off.

 

Good news: Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news: Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens. It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt. Parking will be an issue, too. What can CH do to alleviate that? Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process. However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts? Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

I don't think CH needs to make any street improvements. Yes, things will be a bit slower, but I can't imagine it will turn into a gridlock. As far as parking, I agree it seems like it would be an issue, but I think Melt will utilize the parking lot behind them as well as maybe the lot catty-corner (sp?) to them.

 

Do you ever drive on Cedar Rd. through the Taylor Rd. intersection?!?!?  It's an absolute nightmare since there is no left turn lane, and cars are allowed to park in the right hand lane.  Either you get stuck in the left lane behind someone waiting to turn, or you get stuck in the right lane behind parked cars.  This is just going to make things even more awful.

"I think we are too spoiled in the Cleveland area.  Park on a side street and walk a block or two!  It won't kill us to walk off that grilled cheese sandwich!

 

As to the Shaker shooting, I never want any shooting to happen, but at least it wasn't an innocent person shot by a criminal (assuming the shooting was on the up and up).  And an average of 1 police shooting incident per year doesn't really qualify as an epidemic."

 

I agree.  People in Cleveland are so spoiled about such things... It makes me laugh (what a bunch of babies)

 

Yeah and at least that shooting was of a suspect, which we wont have to worry about again.  Ive grown so intolerant of these stupid criminals that have seemingly infiltrated everyplace.  I was talking about how many crimes have been happening in the "nice" Edgewater area of Cleveland just this morning.  And here in DC, you can live in an $800,000 condo, but you just cant go outside at night because you will likely be the victim of an armed robbery. 

 

I'd say Shaker isnt doing too bad considering the areas of Cleveland its near. 

Since we somewhat unfairly knocked the CH potential home buyer thread off topic, I thought it would be nice if there were a thread dedicated to the issues of the eastern suburban Heights area of Cleveland, including of course Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, University Heights, and also at times South Euclid and Beachwood.

 

So I'll start us off.

 

Good news: Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news: Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens. It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt. Parking will be an issue, too. What can CH do to alleviate that? Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process. However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts? Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

I don't think CH needs to make any street improvements. Yes, things will be a bit slower, but I can't imagine it will turn into a gridlock. As far as parking, I agree it seems like it would be an issue, but I think Melt will utilize the parking lot behind them as well as maybe the lot catty-corner (sp?) to them.

 

Do you ever drive on Cedar Rd. through the Taylor Rd. intersection?!?!? It's an absolute nightmare since there is no left turn lane, and cars are allowed to park in the right hand lane. Either you get stuck in the left lane behind someone waiting to turn, or you get stuck in the right lane behind parked cars. This is just going to make things even more awful.

 

I used to do it every day after work when I worked on Lander.  I guess you are right it can be a mess, however, I am one of those agressive drivers that fly up on the right and go around the drivers turning left before I hit a parked car.  It wouldn't hurt to add turning lanes, but is there enough room?

 

 

Since we somewhat unfairly knocked the CH potential home buyer thread off topic, I thought it would be nice if there were a thread dedicated to the issues of the eastern suburban Heights area of Cleveland, including of course Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, University Heights, and also at times South Euclid and Beachwood.

 

So I'll start us off.

 

Good news: Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news: Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens. It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt. Parking will be an issue, too. What can CH do to alleviate that? Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process. However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts? Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

I don't think CH needs to make any street improvements. Yes, things will be a bit slower, but I can't imagine it will turn into a gridlock. As far as parking, I agree it seems like it would be an issue, but I think Melt will utilize the parking lot behind them as well as maybe the lot catty-corner (sp?) to them.

 

Do you ever drive on Cedar Rd. through the Taylor Rd. intersection?!?!? It's an absolute nightmare since there is no left turn lane, and cars are allowed to park in the right hand lane. Either you get stuck in the left lane behind someone waiting to turn, or you get stuck in the right lane behind parked cars. This is just going to make things even more awful.

 

I used to do it every day after work when I worked on Lander. I guess you are right it can be a mess, however, I am one of those agressive drivers that fly up on the right and go around the drivers turning left before I hit a parked car. It wouldn't hurt to add turning lanes, but is there enough room?

 

 

 

No, there's definitely no room for a turn lane.  You're thinking of driving WB on Cedar.....  EB is worse because the cars are parked before the intersection, thus resulting in getting stuck behind parked or turning cars.  The solution to that intersection is to get rid of the parking, or ban left turns permanently, no matter the time of day.

 

As for the parking lot currently there - it's too small for even for its current use most of the time.  Terrible planning by Melt, IMO.

Since we somewhat unfairly knocked the CH potential home buyer thread off topic, I thought it would be nice if there were a thread dedicated to the issues of the eastern suburban Heights area of Cleveland, including of course Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, University Heights, and also at times South Euclid and Beachwood.

 

So I'll start us off. 

 

Good news:  Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news:  Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens.  It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt.  Parking will be an issue, too.  What can CH do to alleviate that?  Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process.  However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts?  Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

I don't think CH needs to make any street improvements.  Yes, things will be a bit slower, but I can't imagine it will turn into a gridlock.  As far as parking, I agree it seems like it would be an issue, but I think Melt will utilize the parking lot behind them as well as maybe the lot catty-corner (sp?) to them.

 

Do you ever drive on Cedar Rd. through the Taylor Rd. intersection?!?!?  It's an absolute nightmare since there is no left turn lane, and cars are allowed to park in the right hand lane.  Either you get stuck in the left lane behind someone waiting to turn, or you get stuck in the right lane behind parked cars.  This is just going to make things even more awful.

 

I used to do it every day after work when I worked on Lander.  I guess you are right it can be a mess, however, I am one of those agressive drivers that fly up on the right and go around the drivers turning left before I hit a parked car.  It wouldn't hurt to add turning lanes, but is there enough room?

 

 

 

I think the traffic would be better if they made it one lane each way through the intersection with a turning lane.

 

Also, I think the problem is overblown.  I go through there often at busy times when left turns are allowed and have never had to sit through more than 2 traffic light cycles, even when I'm not driving aggressively.  The biggest problem with those intersections along Cedar is when two people facing each other are turning left; it's impossible to see around the other left-turner to see if cars are coming through the right lane.  This is even more of a problem at the Lee Rd. intersection.

Another police shooting in the Fernway area of Shaker Heights:

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/05/shaker_heights_police_fatally.html

 

Shaker Heights levy passes:

 

http://www.cleveland.com/sun/all/index.ssf/2010/05/shaker_heights_voters_approve.html

 

I believe the Beachwood levy passed, too.

 

 

Another? When was the last one(s)?

 

A little less than a year ago:

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/07/shaker_heights_police_officer.html

 

I don't know how you define police "shooting" but I always assumed someone had to get the bullet on the other end for it to qualify as a "shooting" in common parlance.  This article states that an officer discharged a firearm during a traffic stop, which is somewhat different in my book, though maybe not in yours if it helps to smear the heights, huh?

Another police shooting in the Fernway area of Shaker Heights:

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/05/shaker_heights_police_fatally.html

 

Shaker Heights levy passes:

 

http://www.cleveland.com/sun/all/index.ssf/2010/05/shaker_heights_voters_approve.html

 

I believe the Beachwood levy passed, too.

 

 

Another? When was the last one(s)?

 

A little less than a year ago:

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/07/shaker_heights_police_officer.html

 

I don't know how you define police "shooting" but I always assumed someone had to get the bullet on the other end for it to qualify as a "shooting" in common parlance. This article states that an officer discharged a firearm during a traffic stop, which is somewhat different in my book, though maybe not in yours if it helps to smear the heights, huh?

 

I live in the Heights, why would I want to smear it?  The officer discharged his weapon during a traffic stop, that's not normal procedure, and certainly something you don't hear about very often in places like Mayfield or Solon.  When discussing this area, which I would love to do (and I haven't found a better place to do it than here), I think it's only right to present an objective view.  Sugarcoating or ignoring realities isn't constructive.  We have problems, there's no denying that.  I want things to get better because 10 years from now I'd love to still be living here and raising my family in this area as opposed to feeling the need to move to a place with half the character!

^I just think that you have to come to the reality that, normally, more urban communities such as the Heights have "problems" that places like Solon and Mayfield do not and vice-versa.  They are different and always have been.  That said, it is a relatively safe area.  If you have statistics to prove otherwise (not just isolated incidents) please do share.

 

And while I will not exclude all of University Heights... if you live east of Belvoir and south of Mayfield, you WILL take back that claim that you live in the Heights ;)

Well they shoot dogs in Westlake...is that normal.

And they shoot deer in Solon (or at least they used to)... sniper walks right onto your property and perches up in one of your trees.

I live in the Heights, why would I want to smear it? The officer discharged his weapon during a traffic stop, that's not normal procedure, and certainly something you don't hear about very often in places like Mayfield or Solon. When discussing this area, which I would love to do (and I haven't found a better place to do it than here), I think it's only right to present an objective view. Sugarcoating or ignoring realities isn't constructive. We have problems, there's no denying that. I want things to get better because 10 years from now I'd love to still be living here and raising my family in this area as opposed to feeling the need to move to a place with half the character!

 

The "objective view" as you've presented it is that officers in Shaker Heights feel the need to discharge their weapons about once a year.  Forgive me if you don't have me quaking in my sneakers when I'm there.

 

And if you don't hear about incidents in Solon or Mayfield, it's not because they never ever happen.  Here's last week's Solon police blotter, for instance...  http://www.cleveland.com/chagrinsolonsun/index.ssf/2010/04/quick-thinking_man_avoids_arme.html

 

This is not a Solon smear- of course Solon is a very safe place. Safer than Shaker, I'm sure.  And I'd guess that Bainbridge is even safer than Solon.  And bumblef$&ck township is even safer than Bainbridge. 

^Agreed.  Saying simply that "Another police shooting" occured is not objective, it's completely subjective.  When I first read that line, my interpretation was that there was another one in the last week or month, or four or five in the last year.  I wonder how many other people on here thought the same thing.  Maybe you view two police shootings in one year a lot, but then it's a subjective statement, not objective.  It might sound like splitting hairs, but little words can make a big difference.  If you had given your data about the last shooting right after, it would have provided a much more objective perspective.

Good news:  Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news:  Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens.  It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt.  Parking will be an issue, too.  What can CH do to alleviate that?  Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process.  However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts?  Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

Widening the road would not be a good idea, even if it could be done.  CH can't afford to maintain the lane-miles it already has.  They can't afford more lanes (well, unless they raise taxes. Ha!).  What they could do, however, would be to eliminate the on-street parking near the intersection, which might make enough room for a turn lane.  The buildings on both sides are pretty close to Cedar already, so you probably couldn't add a lane anyway unless you knocked down the building across from Melt.

 

The parking lot diagonally across from Melt serves a Rite-Aid and a closed Hollywood Video at one end of a not-very-busy strip mall (seems totally out of place for the Heights).  Overall there probably is plenty of parking in the area.  Hopefully Melt is so busy that it really reenergizes the whole neighborhood, leading to more new businesses and eventually perhaps a city parking garage in that neighborhood.  That's a long way off, if ever.

 

It will be hard to choose between Melt and Mr. Brisket... nice to have such tough choices though.

 

^I just think that you have to come to the reality that, normally, more urban communities such as the Heights have "problems" that places like Solon and Mayfield do not and vice-versa.  They are different and always have been.  That said, it is a relatively safe area.  If you have statistics to prove otherwise (not just isolated incidents) please do share.

 

I'm not going to bother posting the self-reported CH crime statistics because we all know what they say (CH safer than Solon?).  I don't believe for a second that they're accurate, but it doesn't matter.

 

In regards to the police shooting today, maybe it's not news around here, though it should be.  And I think we lower our expectations when we say that because this is an urban area that we should put up with more crime. 

Good news:  Melt is slated to open up in late May.

 

Bad news:  Traffic in that area is going to become an even bigger hazard when that happens.  It's already troublesome with Pizza Bogo's success, however it's going to get much worse with Melt.  Parking will be an issue, too.  What can CH do to alleviate that?  Widening the street and adding a left-turning lane would help tremendously, but it would be long and costly process.  However I think if they put the no left turn light on for extended periods of the day/night, it may help a bit.

 

Thoughts?  Any other things of note/concern going on in the area?

 

Widening the road would not be a good idea, even if it could be done.  CH can't afford to maintain the lane-miles it already has.  They can't afford more lanes (well, unless they raise taxes. Ha!).  What they could do, however, would be to eliminate the on-street parking near the intersection, which might make enough room for a turn lane.  The buildings on both sides are pretty close to Cedar already, so you probably couldn't add a lane anyway unless you knocked down the building across from Melt.

 

The parking lot diagonally across from Melt serves a Rite-Aid and a closed Hollywood Video at one end of a not-very-busy strip mall (seems totally out of place for the Heights).  Overall there probably is plenty of parking in the area.  Hopefully Melt is so busy that it really reenergizes the whole neighborhood, leading to more new businesses and eventually perhaps a city parking garage in that neighborhood.  That's a long way off, if ever.

 

It will be hard to choose between Melt and Mr. Brisket... nice to have such tough choices though.

 

 

We'll see.  That neighborhood was bad news a few years back.  Platinum Dreams, the previous corner tenant, caused a lot of problems.  There are still issues that need to be resolved, I know that Cafe Tandoor recently had a window broken and other trouble with mischievous juveniles.

 

The Rite Aid parking lot is in University Heights, fyi.  Not sure if that makes a difference.

^Agreed.  Saying simply that "Another police shooting" occured is not objective, it's completely subjective.  When I first read that line, my interpretation was that there was another one in the last week or month, or four or five in the last year.  I wonder how many other people on here thought the same thing.  Maybe you view two police shootings in one year a lot, but then it's a subjective statement, not objective.  It might sound like splitting hairs, but little words can make a big difference.  If you had given your data about the last shooting right after, it would have provided a much more objective perspective.

 

Of course it's subjective.  But no matter how you look at it, whenever an officer discharges his firearm, it should be cause for concern (not that he took such action, but that it would even be necessary).  Like I said to 121, we seem to have lowered our expectations.  That's a really nice neighborhood, in fact one of the more attractive middle class areas of Shaker Heights. 

I live in the Heights, why would I want to smear it? The officer discharged his weapon during a traffic stop, that's not normal procedure, and certainly something you don't hear about very often in places like Mayfield or Solon. When discussing this area, which I would love to do (and I haven't found a better place to do it than here), I think it's only right to present an objective view. Sugarcoating or ignoring realities isn't constructive. We have problems, there's no denying that. I want things to get better because 10 years from now I'd love to still be living here and raising my family in this area as opposed to feeling the need to move to a place with half the character!

 

The "objective view" as you've presented it is that officers in Shaker Heights feel the need to discharge their weapons about once a year. Forgive me if you don't have me quaking in my sneakers when I'm there.

 

And if you don't hear about incidents in Solon or Mayfield, it's not because they never ever happen. Here's last week's Solon police blotter, for instance... http://www.cleveland.com/chagrinsolonsun/index.ssf/2010/04/quick-thinking_man_avoids_arme.html

 

This is not a Solon smear- of course Solon is a very safe place. Safer than Shaker, I'm sure.   And I'd guess that Bainbridge is even safer than Solon. And bumblef$&ck township is even safer than Bainbridge.

 

I'm not trying to scare anyone.  Additionally, we don't know that they've only had to do this twice.

 

No need to turn this personal.  Let's stay on discussion here, please!

^Agreed. Saying simply that "Another police shooting" occured is not objective, it's completely subjective. When I first read that line, my interpretation was that there was another one in the last week or month, or four or five in the last year. I wonder how many other people on here thought the same thing. Maybe you view two police shootings in one year a lot, but then it's a subjective statement, not objective. It might sound like splitting hairs, but little words can make a big difference. If you had given your data about the last shooting right after, it would have provided a much more objective perspective.

 

Of course it's subjective. But no matter how you look at it, whenever an officer discharges his firearm, it should be cause for concern (not that he took such action, but that it would even be necessary). Like I said to 121, we seem to have lowered our expectations. That's a really nice neighborhood, in fact one of the more attractive middle class areas of Shaker Heights.

 

My issue has nothing to do with the viewpoints or interpretations of you or anyone else and more to do with what you had upthread called "an objective view" and now correctly deemed subjective.  Like StrapHanger said, the objective view was simply that the police had to draw their firearms (at least according to the presented articles) once or twice in the past year.  How you then interpret that information is up to you and anyone else to decide.

Does anyone have any evidence - hell, I'll even settle for an accusation from a reputable journalist - that CH fudges its crime statistics?  Since that accusation is getting tossed about with such purported certainty maybe we should provide some... any... little shred of evidence.  Or, perhaps, it should be clarified that it is nothing but the unsubstantiated speculation from someone who does not, never has, and never will live in CH.

My issue has nothing to do with the viewpoints or interpretations of you or anyone else and more to do with what you had upthread called "an objective view" and now correctly deemed subjective.  Like StrapHanger said, the objective view was simply that the police had to draw their firearms (at least according to the presented articles) once or twice in the past year.  How you then interpret that information is up to you and anyone else to decide.

 

Now you're playing games with semantics.  You and another poster took issue with my use of the word "another" in reference to the officer discharging his weapon.  There is nothing subjective about my use of that word.  Unless it had never, ever happened before, which it obviously has, then my using it was absolutely appropriate.  It's how you view my use of the word in question that is subjective.  For people living in that neighborhood, I doubt it even seems like 10 months since it happened last.

 

This debate is so silly it's almost not even worth having.

Does anyone have any evidence - hell, I'll even settle for an accusation from a reputable journalist - that CH fudges its crime statistics?  Since that accusation is getting tossed about with such purported certainty maybe we should provide some... any... little shred of evidence.  Or, perhaps, it should be clarified that it is nothing but the unsubstantiated speculation from someone who does not, never has, and never will live in CH.

 

I suppose it's easier to just accept the statistics as being accurate than ask questions.  I think I was that way for a while until someone pointed out the inconsistencies between the "officially" reported statistics and what appears in the local police blotter.  Something doesn't jive.  If I had nothing better to do perhaps I'd do what the people on City-Data do for the City of Cleveland and keep a year-long record and then compare to see just how accurate the city's report was.

 

You're right, I don't live in Cleveland Heights.  But as a citizen of University Heights, for better or worse (and in recent decades I'd lean towards worse), my city is tied to the fate of Cleveland Heights.  And for that reason alone, I take interest in what's going across the border.

you know that you can respond to multiple users with one post right?

FYI, this recent incident in Shaker wasn't in Fernway, it was west of Lee, in the Onaway neighborhood, so if literal word meaning is our new standard, your intro to the crime link was objectively incorrect, '17 ;).  Don't get me wrong, I agree with you that incidents like that are very serious (sadly, they make me laugh less at those ridiculous burglar alarm commercials) and residents shouldn't just have to put up with it because they're near the City of Cleveland.  I just haven't seen any evidence that there is a pattern of gun crimes or discharges in Shaker Heights, which your use of "another" suggests.  And at least according to one of the Cleveland.com articles, residents on the street where this happen don't see a pattern either:

 

William Perry, 85, who has lived on Braemar Road for 42 years, said there hasn't been a major problem in the neighborhood until Wednesday. He also said there has been no previous problems of break-ins.

Another resident, Katie Hannon, 36, said the area has been so safe that people there normally leave their car doors unlocked.

"The only problem I've seen here happened when someone left their bike out overnight and it was stolen," Hannon said, "and that can happen anywhere. What happened here this morning is hard to believe. It's not at all typical for here."

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/05/shaker_heights_police_fatally_1.html

Same story in Lakewood too.  Once you get past c17's needless claims and implications, one cannot deny the basic point he's making.  Things are going downhill. 

 

It's a result of the region's increasing poverty and historical segregation.  Doubling down on the "my side - your side" attitude will only make it worse.  You can't build a wall big enough.  You can't possibly hire enough cops justforyourblock.  Well, maybe you can, but that doesn't really solve anything.  The entire metro area rises and falls together.  If you want CH, SH, UH to improve... you have to improve Woodhill and Mt. Pleasant.  There is no other way.  It's gone on long enough like this. 

 

Appears Micky-Dees wants to break ground in University Heights.

http://blog.cleveland.com/sunpress/2010/05/mcdonalds_hopes_to_come_to_war.html

 

To me this is an unhappy meal.  Even though it will bring jobs to the area, I'm not thrilled at having more unhealthy options for dining for this community.  I'm surprised that feedback to the UH mayor so far has "all been positive".  Any thoughts on businesses that could go in this location (Cedar/Warrensville) that the community really needs?

Looking back at last year's incident- it was west of Lee too.  So, objectively speaking, there have been zero police firearm discharges (as far as anyone can tell) in the Fernway neighborhood in the last two years.

It's unfortunate that anytime someone brings up the Heights it turns into an argument with some of us saying how much we love the Heights and others saying how it's a terrible place.  Agree to disagree I guess.  Let's discuss some other things.

 

I wanted to throw this out there to my fellow CH residents (and rest of County district 10) - A friend of mine is running for county council for our district.  His name is Julian Rogers and he is young, bright, and energetic, something I will admit we need in CH.  We have had the same old politicans in this city for too long.  We can use some new leaders for our community.  Here is his facebook page if you are interested.

 

http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Julian-Rogers-for-Cuyahoga-County-Council-District-10/111332302227849?v=wall

 

 

EDIT - I can't figure out how to get the facebook link to work.

Same story in Lakewood too. Once you get past c17's needless claims and implications, one cannot deny the basic point he's making. Things are going downhill.

 

It's a result of the region's increasing poverty and historical segregation. Doubling down on the "my side - your side" attitude will only make it worse. You can't build a wall big enough. You can't possibly hire enough cops justforyourblock. Well, maybe you can, but that doesn't really solve anything. The entire metro area rises and falls together. If you want CH, SH, UH to improve... you have to improve Woodhill and Mt. Pleasant. There is no other way. It's gone on long enough like this.

 

We tend to think of cities and neighborhoods going down hill in terms of blockbusting and the mass suburban exodus during the 50-70s. Right now I think what is happening is due to our regions stagnant population we are smearing thin layer of poverty and crime over a larger and larger area (ie the inner ring suburbs). Yes the poverty level is growing but the area it is being spread out over is growing faster. I am not sure if the bottom is as low for the historically stable burbs such as LW and CH as it was for the neighborhoods in the city proper. It seem to me that Cleveland kept writing off neighborhoods and then focusing on the remaining stable neighborhoods. I don't see the cities writing themselves off. The seperate school districts should also help slow the slide also (17, your points on the schools are noted) 

^I think that's right.  For one thing, the homeownership rate in CH and SH is much, much higher than it was in East Cleveland or city of Cleveland neighborhoods that fell apart.  In Lakewood it's a little lower, but still a lot higher than it was in East Cleveland in the 1960s.  The inner ring burbs are going to continue to change and evolve and become more economically diverse, with some negative effects, for sure, but I don't think it's a nuts exaggeration to think they're at a tipping point right now with an inevitable, imminent, East Cleveland-esque rapid decline to follow.  Though some people have been claiming as much about SH and CH for decades now.

 

Appears Micky-Dees wants to break ground in University Heights.

http://blog.cleveland.com/sunpress/2010/05/mcdonalds_hopes_to_come_to_war.html

 

To me this is an unhappy meal. Even though it will bring jobs to the area, I'm not thrilled at having more unhealthy options for dining for this community. I'm surprised that feedback to the UH mayor so far has "all been positive". Any thoughts on businesses that could go in this location (Cedar/Warrensville) that the community really needs?

 

I was just going to post about that.  That's where the gas station/car wash was going to be located.  I don't understand (or don't believe) that residents would fight Waterway, but be receptive to a McDonald's.

^Perhaps it was the "modern drive-through" that won over the neighbors.  I agree though, I don't see what this would be any better than a car wash.  I'm I wrong to think that this looks like a really large lot for a single McD's? 

Yeah, that's a big lot for a McDonald's.  Also, I could be wrong, but I don't believe there are any other fast food joints in UH.  I don't know for certain, but I don't believe that's by accident...

Yeah, that's a big lot for a McDonald's.  Also, I could be wrong, but I don't believe there are any other fast food joints in UH.  I don't know for certain, but I don't believe that's by accident...

 

So this is what is in store for us with the newly elected mayor?

 

I wasn't impressed with her suggestions for the city while she was running and I'm surely not impressed with this move.  Can't wait for the whirly-ball to go in where Tops used to be!

 

Yes, this is a very wide lot for a McDonald's.  Also, I don't see it being deep enough.  I don't see it fitting right unless they are going to site it facing Bushnell or Lansdale, which I highly doubt would be allowed (who knows with this new "leadership", though).

 

Also, I consider Boston Market to be fast food.

shhhh, it's coffee shop. See the Mccafe signs...not a fastfood joint (wink, wink)...

Yeah, that's a big lot for a McDonald's. Also, I could be wrong, but I don't believe there are any other fast food joints in UH. I don't know for certain, but I don't believe that's by accident...

 

So this is what is in store for us with the newly elected mayor?

 

I wasn't impressed with her suggestions for the city while she was running and I'm surely not impressed with this move. Can't wait for the whirly-ball to go in where Tops used to be!

 

Yes, this is a very wide lot for a McDonald's. Also, I don't see it being deep enough. I don't see it fitting right unless they are going to site it facing Bushnell or Lansdale, which I highly doubt would be allowed (who knows with this new "leadership", though).

 

Also, I consider Boston Market to be fast food.

 

You're probably right about Boston Market, I was thinking of your typical burger fast food places.

 

I'm not a big fan of Infeld, either, but I don't really think it matters that much.  If enough people don't want a McDonald's there, then it won't be built.

I'd like to hear some ideas about how Cleveland Heights (and University Heights) can encourage more middle-class families to relocate to the city, and how the perception of the local schools can be improved so that these families, current or future, will feel comfortable in utilizing them.

I'd like to hear some ideas about how Cleveland Heights (and University Heights) can encourage more middle-class families to relocate to the city, and how the perception of the local schools can be improved so that these families, current or future, will feel comfortable in utilizing them.

 

Draw them in prior to that stage of life, while they're young and single, so that they're already in love with the area by the time they become "middle class families."  Start a program to promote long-term settement to all the college students who populate CH and UH.  It makes little sense to develop a place called "University Heights" in a way that doesn't centrally involve said university.  Above all, promote economic development across the east side, from downtown to 271 and beyond, so that there is income available on which to raise a middle class family.

People will come to an area just for the schools if they're good enough.  I don't purport to be an expert on what makes a school great or how to make a mediocre (or bad) school a great one, but if you want to draw families in, the school has to start winning a lot of promotable awards and get national recognition.  Maybe several students go to the national spelling bee every year.  Maybe the HS graduates are so smart they start getting a lot of attention from big, national university's recruiting departments, etc.  How you actually get to that point, I don't know.  i'm not a teacher or school administrator, thank God, but if you get the schools fixed, the families will follow.

327 you are underestimating the paranoia that parents have about school. I have know several families that lived for years and professed to love Lakewood but moved further out because their kids were going to be starting school....Regardless of the school ratings.

 

But I think playing off of the economic development going on the eastside is a good start.