So I took a left turn outside of a store and almost hit an oncoming car.  Either he was going faster than I was, or I was going too slow.  Either way, the car had to swerve out of the way and of course a police car was behind him.

 

So I received two citations for reckless endangerment and not having a seatbelt, but no ticket (I'll call tomorrow to see what the costs are).  My court date is in a few weeks, and I have no idea what to do, if this is going to screw up my insurance, what happens if I plead no contest, not guilty, etc. 

 

I've done some research and I think I'll get 4 points for the reckless driving and 0 points for the no seatbelt.  Am I right about this?  Will this raise my insurance substantially?  I've heard that I should go to court, plead not guilty, then try to talk to the prosecutor before the next court date and explain what happened, that I haven't had a ticket in 12 years (for going 37 in a 25).  Will I be then responsible for court costs if I go to court and lose?  What would that run?

 

I'm really not sure what to do here, and quite frankly I'm a little freaked out.  This happened in South Euclid a few days ago, but every time I called they have no news for me on the case (it hasn't been uploaded into the computer). 

 

Does anyone have any suggestions what I should do?  What I should expect?

According to what I have heard from other people, your insurance probably won't hear about it unless you tell them. As long as they don't have to shell out any money for car damage you might be ok. I received one of those 11 am all kids are in the classroom school zone speeding tickets once, and it did nothing to my insurance.

So if I went to court and lost, are you saying that the court wouldn't notify them that I would get 4 points?  Or that I was involved in this mess in the first place?

 

Man, 12 years of being an overly careful driver and then this happens!!!

Everytime I plead "no contest" for a traffic infraction....I was assumed guilty, got the points and paid the fines...even when I proved (in my eyes and a witness) that I was in the right. Good luck on this one.... 

You might want to challenge the reckless op citation.  Based on your description of the incident, it sounds more like failure to yield the right of way... or maybe improper lane changing.  The prosecutor won't let you go unscathed, but perhaps see if he/she would drop the seatbelt ticket if you pled guilty to a reduced charge on the other ticket (something with less points).

 

If you want to drive a hard bargain (but also risk pissing the prosecutor off), say that you want to challenge the ticket and ask if the cop is present.  If the cop is not in the courtroom, there is a slight chance the judge will dismiss the case.  More likely though is that the judge just sets the hearing for a future date.

 

That said, if you really are a safe driver then what are a few points anyways.

"So I received two citations for reckless endangerment and not having a seatbelt"

 

I agree with MayDay - I was just in traffic court yesterday and the people on both sides of me were being cited for seat belt in addition to their primary offense. What is the DEAL?  It's the easiest thing in the whole world to do and it can save your life, why would you NOT do it?  I seriously don't understand why so many people would drive around without one. It saved my life when I was 16, I have never driven a car without wearing one. Not once. 

 

Now that my chastising is over, Hts121's post is very good.  This sounds like it is not a waiverable offense (meaning you just pay and skip court), and I can tell you, your insurance WILL and DOES find out about these things - did the other party take down your insurance information?  Or the police? You can guarantee your insurance company will find out about it if the other party took down your insurance.  Anyway, if it's not waiverable, you go to court and you have 3 options: plead guilty, pay all associated fines and court costs, and go on your way.  You will have points on your license plus the costs.  Plead no contest, which is basically a guilty plea.  If you do not talk to the prosecutor first and just plead this on your own, the result is the same as if you pled guilty - fines and costs plus points.  If you are able to talk to the prosecutor before the case begins, or the officer, mention your clean driving record (don't bother with the 12 year old ticket, that won't come up on the report they run) and ask if there's any lesser points offense or, as hts said, at least get the seat belt dropped.  The third scenario (dismissal) is not very likely - in addition to the cop, the other party involved are both the "witnesses" to the event; unless both do not show up, you can't dismiss for "want of prosecution" (meaning no witnesses are present, so they can't prove you did it, and thus dismiss the case).  Given that this was in a suburb and that another person was involved, I think dismissal is pretty unlikely.  Research online what more minor (points-wise) offenses you might be able to plead to and go to the prosecutor first thing on your court date and try to work out a deal.

 

 

I don't know if anyone else was involved unless you mean the cop.  He just pulled me over; the first driver was well on the way.

 

Anyway, I called city hall today and asked about what the fees were.  It turns out the cop changed his mind as I was charged with something totally different than what's on the ticket, I think it was not yielding as opposed to reckless endangerment (the latter of which he had written on the ticket).  Not yielding is only 2 points, and $165 total ($135 for the traffic violation, $30 for the ticket).  So I'm wondering if he cut me a break. 

 

I'll probably just pay it off....unless you guys think that two points will increase my rates, in which case I'd want to plead not guilty and then find the prosecutor before the hearing.

 

Also, the cop did check the 'waiverable through violations bureau' box too.

I got 2 points for doing 51 in a 35 (Who the hell posts a 35mph limit in an agriculture zone) in some Mayberry, Lake County burb and I never received any change in my insurance rate.  However, I haven't received a letter from my insurance company thanking me for being a safe driver for some time now either :D

You can also take a driver's safety course and basically have it negated, both in terms of your points allotment and potential insurance hike.  The points aren't removed, you just get your total bumped up to 14 from 12 and your insurance will give you a credit for taking driver's safety.

 

Personally I wouldn't think it's going to dramatically increase your rates.  Depending on your insurance company they may not raise it at all.  You can probably even call and ask them for advice.

Your insurance will uncover it eventually whether you tell them or not and more than likely your rates will go up.

Your insurance will uncover it eventually whether you tell them or not and more than likely your rates will go up.

 

THIS.  However, it depends on your insurance. I'm with Liberty Mutual, and when I was in a minor fender bender in traffic one day (he said-she said, insurance ruled with him instead of me), they sent me a letter saying because of my good driving history, I was allotted this 1 mistake with no change in rates; and if I kept a clean record for something like the next 2-3 years, then the strike 1 would be removed.  This is but one of many reasons I have gone to court on tickets I have received since then, and also prior to the fender bender.  IMO, it is a gamble, and odds I'm willing to take; if you do nothing, you pay the fine and have the points, no question.  If you go to court, you've got at least a 50-50 chance of getting something changed - points removed (did this 2 months ago with a speeding ticket), where you'd just owe the fines, perhaps the ticket dismissed (I got a speeding ticket dismissed yesterday), with no fines owed.  If you lose, you have to pay the cost of the ticket AND court costs, so that's the downside to the gamble, but with a very good driving record, I personally would go to court and at least try to get it knocked down to a no points.  JMO.

... (did this 2 months ago with a speeding ticket), where you'd just owe the fines, perhaps the ticket dismissed (I got a speeding ticket dismissed yesterday) ...

 

Do you save more time by speeding than you spend in court dealing with the tickets? :-)

Everytime I plead "no contest" for a traffic infraction....I was assumed guilty, got the points and paid the fines...even when I proved (in my eyes and a witness) that I was in the right. Good luck on this one.... 

 

No Contest means you are not admitting guilt, but that you are accepting the consequences of the charge as if you were guilty.  You don't get a chance to prove anything when you plead No Contest.  If you feel you are not guilty, you put in a plea of "Not Guilty" on the date of your court appearance and then you get a trial date.  That is when you argue your case (or accept a plea bargain).

 

"Not Guilty" pleas are very hard to win against an officer.  That is why on a speeding ticket they will always check "Unreasonable For Conditions".  If they don't, they have to prove the speed you were going was dangerous (assuming it's under the state speed limit, usually 55 MPH in Ohio) as most speed limits are prima facie limits (simply evidence that you may have been driving too fast, not breaking a hard set law).  Then it becomes your word against the officer's.  Your best bet for taking the case to trial is to hope the officer doesn't show up, then if he does, see if you get a decent plea bargain.

 

TBideon, in your case it sounds like the officer already lowered the charge so it's up to you whether to take it to trial.  If you represent yourself (most people do in traffic court), your court costs are already paid for (you pay for them as part of the cost of your ticket regardless of whether you go to trial or not).  The only thing you stand to lose by going to trial is your own time and energy.

Be one of the few people in traffic court who dress with respect for the court and you might get your reckless driving lowered to 'excessive muffler gas' like I did!

I'm with Johio. Suck it up and move on, while wearing a seatbelt of course.

 

I get tickets every few years when the cops finally manage to catch up to me. Life is too short to worry about a silly ticket. Step on it, have some fun and wear those points with pride.

My cousin's life was saved by not wearing a seatbelt. A car ran into him from the driver's side and the force threw him into the next seat over. Almost the entire inner volume of the driver's side portion of the car was smashed in, meaning that if he had his seatbelt on he would have been crushed instantly. He never wears a seatbelt because of that. After being in an accident like that I can't say I blame him but I'm sure that overall it probably is safer to wear one. It's probably much more common to have impact from the front or back.

I got ticketed 2 years ago in Mentor for 78 in a 60 - paid the waiver and never saw any increase in my insurance rates.  In fact, my policy still has me listed with a "Safe Driver" discount.

 

From the relevant part of my Nationwide policy:

What's a traffic ticket going to do to my insurance?  Minor moving violations can cause your insurance rates to increase, because they often indicate that a driver engages in risky driving behavior. And if the speeding ticket adds points to your license, your insurance rates could be affected for three years or more, depending on where you live.

 

However, we understand that mistakes happen. That’s why if you’ve been a Nationwide customer for three years without a ticket, we’ll likely ignore a minor violation.

 

...  overall it probably is safer to wear one ...

 

Statiscally proven, in fact. A seat belt is much more likely to reduce injury or even save your life than it is to contribute to a worse outcome than if none had been worn.

 

A significant number of critical and fatal injuries result from an occupant being ejected from the vehicle, especially in rollovers where they end up being crushed beneath the vehicle.

 

Does Ohio's law require that a law enforcement officer must stop you from some other reason in order to ticket  you for not wearing a seat belt? Indiana's law used to work that way, but now they can pull you over if they notice that you're not belted in.  They don't need any other reason to pull you over.

 

Occasionally the hometown cops where I grew up just pick a spot and watch passing drivers for seat-belt violations. Sometimes they'll get twenty or thirty in an afternoon. I heard of one guy (not too bright, apparently) who got ticketed twice at the same spot in the space of an hour, once going to the store, and again on the return. I say turn that one loose and let Darwin take care of him.

My cousin's life was saved by not wearing a seatbelt. A car ran into him from the driver's side and the force threw him into the next seat over. Almost the entire inner volume of the driver's side portion of the car was smashed in, meaning that if he had his seatbelt on he would have been crushed instantly. He never wears a seatbelt because of that. After being in an accident like that I can't say I blame him but I'm sure that overall it probably is safer to wear one. It's probably much more common to have impact from the front or back.

 

My cousin was thrown out of the passenger side of her friend's car when they lost control and it rolled over. The car rolled over on top of her and killed her. She was 16 years old.

 

Just wear the seatbelt.

Yes, they have to pull you over for something else, and the seat belt is on top of it.

 

And I don't speed to save time, really.  I'm aware it doens't really save much time in the long run.  Generally, I just go with the flow of traffic and am not glued to the speedometer every minute.  The flow of traffic is usually speeding.  I just got unlucky a couple of times close in a row.  Or lucky, as the case may be, since I got no points and one ticket was dismissed.

My cousin's life was saved by not wearing a seatbelt. A car ran into him from the driver's side and the force threw him into the next seat over. Almost the entire inner volume of the driver's side portion of the car was smashed in, meaning that if he had his seatbelt on he would have been crushed instantly. He never wears a seatbelt because of that. After being in an accident like that I can't say I blame him but I'm sure that overall it probably is safer to wear one. It's probably much more common to have impact from the front or back.

 

My cousin was thrown out of the passenger side of her friend's car when they lost control and it rolled over. The car rolled over on top of her and killed her. She was 16 years old.

 

Just wear the seatbelt.

 

I ALWAYS wear a seat belt. But when something like that happens (what happened to my cousin) I can see why some people wouldn't. That's all I'm saying.

Yes, they have to pull you over for something else, and the seat belt is on top of it.

 

And I don't speed to save time, really.  I'm aware it doens't really save much time in the long run.  Generally, I just go with the flow of traffic and am not glued to the speedometer every minute.  The flow of traffic is usually speeding.  I just got unlucky a couple of times close in a row.  Or lucky, as the case may be, since I got no points and one ticket was dismissed.

 

That's what I do. It's safer to go with the flow of traffic than to go much slower and have people cut you off nonstop.

 

I got a speeding ticket for going 75 on the highway (speed limit was 65) but I was just going along with everyone else. The police officer didn't lecture me or anything, just said I was going 75 and handed me the ticket. I didn't argue about it - we both know he has a quota and probably has to make it look extra good on a holiday.

I've heard that I should go to court, plead not guilty, then try to talk to the prosecutor before the next court date and explain what happene

 

This is the correct method. I'm a law student with lots and lots of citations, so I feel that I can speak with a bit of authority on the subject. In a nutshell, if you plead guilty, you will receive the penalty prescribed by the statute no matter how convincing your sob story is. If you plead not guilty, your potential of winning rises above 0%, but you may run the risk of an extra $70 or so in court costs if the case goes to trial. Now the prosecutor's door is open to you for a plea bargain. You can change your plea to guilty at any time before trial and avoid incurring any additional costs. Thus, there is absolutely no downside to pleading not guilty.

 

I have never been to South Euclid's municipal court, but Lyndhurst, Mayfield, Shaker, and Geauga all cut plea bargains as a matter of course. In Geauga, they even direct plea-bargain seekers to sign up on a list outside the prosecutor's door and plead not guilty. More likely than not, you will not even need to provide an explanation. The prosecutor is busy. He will examine your record, examine the ticket, and offer you the "standard" plea bargain, which will likely be a no-points speed (40 in a 35) with a $30 fine (plus ~$100 in court costs, depending on where you are). If you convince him that you are serious about going to trial, they will lower the fine further. Generally, though, when the sole evidence supporting the citation is an officer's observation, it will be hard to impeach and you will probably lose.

 

Hope that helps.

 

ccars, everything you said sounds correct to me except the court costs.  I thought the court costs you paid along with your ticket covered a trial (whether you take the case to trial or not)?

That's not the way I understand it.  Court costs are separate, and are in addition to the cost of your ticket. 

That's not the way I understand it. Court costs are separate, and are in addition to the cost of your ticket.

 

Court costs are paid along with every ticket.  I know that for a fact (speeding tickets are usually in the range of $30-$50 and the rest is court costs).  The question is whether those court costs cover a trial or not.

ccars, everything you said sounds correct to me except the court costs. I thought the court costs you paid along with your ticket covered a trial (whether you take the case to trial or not)?

 

Actually, you're right. The waiver payment includes court costs. Here's a layout of court costs in Cleve. Hts., with waiver costs broken out to $95 in court costs and an additional fine.

 

http://clevelandheightscourt.com/fees&costinfo.html

 

So, really, there absolutely is no reason to plead guilty to a traffic citation, ever. You can't lose any more than you already have.

So, really, there absolutely is no reason to plead guilty to a traffic citation, ever. You can't lose any more than you already have.

 

Moneywise, correct.  Time is all you lose.