In a way, I wish that the Final Four would be next year. By that time, E4 should be all filled up and Euclid should be all filled between E4 and PS (sans May Co.). 

^^ True story... I not a sports junky, but with precious little space available in the press for women's sports, I sort of feel like reporters aren't going to have the room available to them to diss Cleveland.

 

I could be wrong!

I thought the most blatant omission/falsehood in the article was its portrayal of Ohio being uniformly supportive of Republican candidates and conservative policy. I can forgive someone doing a political piece and failing to capture the full spirit of a city's vibrancy (or even lack thereof), but if you're doing a political piece with a focus on a particular city, then you should probably at least articulate that city's political environment accurately.

 

She might have mentioned that while Republicans have dominated rural elections in the last couple decades, Democrats are pretty fierce adversaries in many cities throughout the state; meanwhile, Cleveland is one of the most heavily Democratic communities in the Midwest. I remember a Tubbs-Jones staffer telling me that the 13th Congressional District has 8 registered Democrats for every 1 Republican. We have a strong history of "blue-collar liberalism" which is still pervasive today and have been a national leader in advancing progressive policy, including some progressive social policy (Cleveland Heights' domestic partner registry comes to mind). I think it's unfair to suggest that we were a bunch of conservatives who started voting for Democrats after we lost our jobs at the mills.

 

That being said, I don't know whether I advocate flooding the reporter with e-mails; our energy would probably be better spent trying to get the positive word out through other stories, rather than keeping a negative piece alive for longer than it should be.

 

 

I will comment first on specific things the reporter talked about that irked me. I'd like to see more pedestrians, more upscale hotels, more restaurants, more shops, etc. but the situation the reporter creates isn't exactly accurate.

 

"Few pedestrians on a Wednesday afternoon" Now I'd for one like to see more pedestrians at all hours of the day, but picking a Wednesday afternoon during winter is probably the worst time in any city to judge pedestrian activity. "Few upscale hotels" - yeah well Cleveland does have Ohio's only Ritz-Carlton. Now these aren't luxury hotels, but the Marriot, Renaissance, Hyatt, Wyndham, Interconntinental (all of which are fairly new) are usually considered upscale. "Few restaurants" - this statement is the one that most confuses me. Not that there as an abundance of restaurants, but I don't think they are in short supply.  "Store after store is shuttered" - a lot of those shuttered stores she saw are probably boarded up because they are doing work inside of them at the present moment to open in the near future. And finally she obviously knows nothing about Playhouse Square, because it is the second largest performing arts center in the country, the theaters were extensively restored a decade ago, and revenue is exceeding the foundation's expenses. Playhouse Square is doing well, and the actors have not left. She also doesn't mention E.4th Street, W.6th Street, the Euclid Corridor Project, anything about University Circle, or the fact that downtown Cleveland has one of the highest downtown population growth rates.  I honestly think her visit didn't go anything beyond a walk from the Hampton Inn to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame on a Winter Wednesday afternoon.

 

For whatever reason, Ohio is the country's huge scapegoat, and it drives me crazy. A lot of things people say are so contridictory its ridiculous. I've heard the same people knock Ohio with shifting statments like Ohio is too suburban, Ohio is an industrial wasteland, or Ohio is a bunch of cornfields. Ohio is very union and Ohio is very Republican. Ohio isn't diverse and the urban cores are filled with minorities. Which is it people? People are really this stupid and ignorant. This reccent article as others have pointed out is filled with contradictions and preconceived biases.

 

Now, I for one want leadership in the federal governent to take a stance on urban policy. The federal government leadership has really not had a stance on urban affairs and planning since the 1970s. As a Clevelander, I realize what our metropolitan region has been struggling with. In my opinion our local and regional leadership has been doing the best they can with what they have, but they need support from the federal government. I wish more discourse on Ohio would include what Ohio is doing right and what the state and federal government can do to make it better. For instance we have these great master plans, but little funding and support from the federal government. Whose fault is it that things aren't getting done?

 

I'm not some homebody who has never been anywhere else, and thinks Cleveland is the best place in the world. I'm also not one of those ex-pats who percieves there is nothing of value in the state, travels and affirms these generalizations without ever knowing what Ohio really is. The fact of the matter is Ohio is very diverse in terms of landscape and lifestyle, but most people in the country want to paint the state one color or another. This is why marketing is so important. We really need to "show" people that no matter what lifestyle you'd like to lead, you could make it work in Ohio (more so than most states).

Well said both 8shades and Vulpster!

Good Vulpster. I would share that exact statement with her.

Well said both 8shades and Vulpster!

 

I agree, well said, let her rip!

 

Vulpster leave out the hotel as luxury part, as none of the properties, except the intercontinental and R-C are "luxury".  The properties we have are not luxury.

 

For instance, we have a basic "marriott", not a JW Marriott or Marriott Marquis and the renaissnce is Marriott's Mid tier brand.

 

We have a Hyatt Regency, mid tier brand, not a Grand or Park Hyatt.

 

Wyndhams are mid tier brands.

The Hyatt downtown is a Regency.

Vulpster leave out the hotel as luxury part, as none of the properties, except the intercontinental and R-C are "luxury".  The properties we have are not luxury.

 

For instance, we have a basic "marriott", not a JW Marriott or Marriott Marquis and the renaissnce is Marriott's Mid tier brand.

 

We have a Hyatt Regency, mid tier brand, not a Grand or Park Hyatt.

 

Wyndhams are mid tier brands.

 

I say leave it in.  Even if we only have two "luxury" hotels, she said in the article that we have none, which is an outright lie, and she should know that she was wrong.

Vulpster leave out the hotel as luxury part, as none of the properties, except the intercontinental and R-C are "luxury".  The properties we have are not luxury.

 

For instance, we have a basic "marriott", not a JW Marriott or Marriott Marquis and the renaissnce is Marriott's Mid tier brand.

 

We have a Hyatt Regency, mid tier brand, not a Grand or Park Hyatt.

 

Wyndhams are mid tier brands.

 

I say leave it in.  Even if we only have two "luxury" hotels, she said in the article that we have none, which is an outright lie, and she should know that she was wrong.

 

I say leave the information about RC and Intercontinental.  If we are trying to "correct" and "enlightern" her, why would we say we have more of something we dont?  If we do that, we are just as wrong as she is.

That's what I was implying.  Sorry if it wasn't clear.

don't we have 2 intercontinental hotels?  the suites and the regular one?  they are at different locations and are different products, but both "luxury" offerings, no? 

don't we have 2 intercontinental hotels?  the suites and the regular one?  they are at different locations and are different products, but both "luxury" offerings, no? 

 

Yes.  We are one of a few cities that boast two intercontinental properties.  they are virtually right accross the street from each other.

Well said both 8shades and Vulpster!

 

I agree, well said, let her rip!

 

Vulpster leave out the hotel as luxury part, as none of the properties, except the intercontinental and R-C are "luxury".  The properties we have are not luxury.

 

For instance, we have a basic "marriott", not a JW Marriott or Marriott Marquis and the renaissnce is Marriott's Mid tier brand.

 

We have a Hyatt Regency, mid tier brand, not a Grand or Park Hyatt.

 

Wyndhams are mid tier brands.

 

I agree with you entirely. What I meant was I know Hyatt, Marriot, Wyndham, and Renaissance aren't "luxury" hotels like Ritz, Fairmont or Peninsula, but I think you could consider them "upscale". Its not like all we have downtown is Holiday Inn or Hampton Inn like the reporter made it seem. 

And the Clinic will be adding a third hotel soon. The developer would like to break ground sometime in the fall for an extended stay hotel that would be located on Chester around E.93rd. My feeling is that this fall is a bit too soon for the developer to get everything together.

Seems to me that most of you are more concerned about how Cleveland looks on paper, vis-a-vis what the experience of walking down E 9th on a weekday afternoon is like.  Which do you consider to be more important, and to leave the more lasting impression?

 

Yes, there are improvements happening downtown.  I understand that.  But I refuse to believe that the weather is the single biggest determining factor in the lack of people on the street.  I've been in New York and Chicago when it was 10 degrees and windy, and there were still plenty of people outside.

 

When you live somewhere where you are accustomed to seeing people walking on the street, downtown Cleveland does feel downright dead.  One weekday afternoon this past December, I was on Public Square, among other places.  I was almost convinced that it was a holiday, because there were so few people walking on the street.  That was my perception, but you can believe what you want.

Seems to me that most of you are more concerned about how Cleveland looks on paper, vis-a-vis what the experience of walking down E 9th on a weekday afternoon is like.  Which do you consider to be more important, and to leave the more lasting impression?

 

Yes, there are improvements happening downtown.  I understand that.  But I refuse to believe that the weather is the single biggest determining factor in the lack of people on the street.  I've been in New York and Chicago when it was 10 degrees and windy, and there were still plenty of people outside.

 

When you live somewhere where you are accustomed to seeing people walking on the street, downtown Cleveland does feel downright dead. 

 

I agree, however, my take on the last sentence is, "When you live somewhere where you are accustomed to seeing people walking on the street, at certain times, downtown Cleveland does feel downright dead.

Dan, I don't think anyone here is naïve enough to believe that cold weather is the biggest factor keeping people off of the streets downtown, but it certainly doesn't help.  In a city of less than 500,000 without a significant tourist base and where few people live downtown, the cold does make a difference, especially when you throw in the street construction. 

 

You and Ms. Hunter have a biased point of view because you can't help comparing Cleveland to much larger and more vibrant cities, and we Clevelanders are just as biased because we've seen downtown and the entire city in much worse shape, so to us, the improvements we see around us seem much bigger than they actually are. 

 

No one here is claiming that the city is buzzing with activity.  As the downtown population continues to grow and stores are cleaned up and re-opened, there will be a noticeable difference, but even today, I wouldn't call downtown dead.  There are places in this country that are much, much worse.

There are places that are worse.  It all depends where you want to set your standard.

 

You and Ms. Hunter have a biased point of view because you can't help comparing Cleveland to much larger and more vibrant cities, and we Clevelanders are just as biased because we've seen downtown and the entire city in much worse shape, so to us, the improvements we see around us seem much bigger than they actually are.

 

Would you be happier if I used Gary and Camden as the basis for comparison?  I don't think that's the direction we want Cleveland to go, is it?  To me, Cleveland doesn't seem nearly as lively as it used to.  Perhaps it's because I lived: 1) in a college town for 5 years and 2) in DC for six, but aside from rush hour, when most of the activity is automobiles, it's a stretch to call it "lively".

Would you be happier if I used Gary and Camden as the basis for comparison?  I don't think that's the direction we want Cleveland to go, is it?  To me, Cleveland doesn't seem nearly as lively as it used to.  Perhaps it's because I lived: 1) in a college town for 5 years and 2) in DC for six, but aside from rush hour, when most of the activity is automobiles, it's a stretch to call it "lively".

 

Have you lived in Gary or Camden?  If not, you have no way of making a comparison.  My point was that you do it unconsciously.  And you used the word "lively," not me.

I go to all parts of downtown frequently and at all times of the day for interviews, to pick up police reports and attend meetings. There is a noticeable diminishment of pedestrian activity when the weather is cold/snowy/raining/windy. When mother nature is spitting out three of those conditions (and sometimes all four!), the pedestrian activity is minimal, even during lunch hour. But visit the same locations of downtown during the same times of a sunny, mild day and the sidewalks are quite busy.

 

On a beautiful day last summer, I walked during lunch hour from the Windham Hotel, up 9th to Lakeside and then to the malls. The sidewalks were simply mobbed with people. There was a pedestrian traffic jam trying to get around some scaffolding along 9th near St. Clair. And when the "walk" signs came on at intersections, the floodgates of people opened.

 

So does this mean that Clevelanders aren't hardy people after all? The visual evidence seems to bear this out.

^^ I agree with KJP. During the winter, this town has really gone into hibernation and it is rather depressing. I don't blame people. Just a couple weeks ago, I had to go from the Theater District to the Warehouse District and I just ran from my building to the trolley and right out the trolley door to the building where I was going.

 

Now, in the summer, people are all over! Star Plaza is mobbed with people eating lunch; folks in offices are in their jogging outfits going on runs in packs of three or more!

 

I know Dan doesn't believe it, but the areas where I hang out, primarily Euclid between E. 12 and Public Square, have a lot of foot-traffic during the summer weekdays. Is it midtown NYC? No, but it definitely reflects the number of people downtown.

Seems to me that most of you are more concerned about how Cleveland looks on paper, vis-a-vis what the experience of walking down E 9th on a weekday afternoon is like.  Which do you consider to be more important, and to leave the more lasting impression?

 

I think we're all very concerned about the impression downtown Cleveland makes on visitors, and none of us are entirely content with the current level of pedestrian activity. For instance we all hate the surface parking lots, and really wish there was more infill development to increase vibrancy. However I think its unfair for someone to form an opinion without making an effort to enjoy and appreciate what's good about downtown. It's amazing what has happened on W.6th Street and E.4th Street, and the amount of interest people have in living downtown now, but the reporter didn't even mention these transformations taking place. I guess my point is, I know downtown still has a way to go, but it is going there. It isn't stagnant and it isn't continuing to deteriorate. She claimed the momentum in the 90s had leveled off, but I don't think thats the case. What we're seeing now is a shift from large scale civic type developments to medium scale neighborhood developments, which is a good thing. And it isn't just downtown that is seeing transformations. University Circle, Ohio City, Detroit-Shoreway, and Tremont are doing quite well. Little Italy, Shaker Square, neighborhoods in Cleveland Heights and Lakewood continue to remain stable urban neighborhoods.

 

Yes, there are improvements happening downtown.  I understand that.  But I refuse to believe that the weather is the single biggest determining factor in the lack of people on the street.  I've been in New York and Chicago when it was 10 degrees and windy, and there were still plenty of people outside.

 

When you live somewhere where you are accustomed to seeing people walking on the street, downtown Cleveland does feel downright dead.  One weekday afternoon this past December, I was on Public Square, among other places.  I was almost convinced that it was a holiday, because there were so few people walking on the street.  That was my perception, but you can believe what you want.

 

There are honestly VERY few cities that have a constant level of pedestrian activity throughout the day, week, and year. I have traveled extensively and spent extended periods of time in other cities. It would be unfair to make sweeping judgements about the worth of a city based on an experience during an extremely unfavorable time. I spent time in Boston last summer, and I distinctly remember being downtown in the morning and there being very little pedestrian and automobile traffic. In fact that was my first impression. But Boston is still an awesome city and that is more evident in the afternoon and evenings in particular parts of downtown.

 

I've spent a lot of time in different parts of Cleveland. I've worked downtown for two summers now. I got off of one office job I had in the Warehouse District at 10 PM, and everyday after work there were lots of people out. My last job was a typical 9-5 job and during rush hour, and particularly lunch there were a number of people on Public Square, the Library's reading garden, sidewalk tables, etc. There is also a TON of things going on during the summer; festivals, sporting events, and other events that bring in a lot of people. In the winter you have less events like these and you have a lot more workers staying in their buildings. Its fairly understandable. Just because you don't see people out on the streets downtown during the week in winter, doesn't mean that people aren't there - they're just inside.

I have some more thoughts too. I guess the part of the problem with claiming downtown is dead isn't going to in any way make the situation better. We have some great hotspots downtown that attract people but need more people. If we convince people these places are worth going, then we will increase their demand and see more development. I'm really not content with the status quo, but you can see how bad PR can only become self-fulfilling.

In the end, it just seems like a journalist coming to a city with a particular story assigned/in her mind, and then "discovering" the atmosphere, examples, illustrations that she "believed" ahead of time that she would find.  Does this make the image of Cleveland she portrays any better, no, but it provides perspective.  Not that this helps C-towns rep anyware.

The financial districts of Chicago are not exactly teaming with life when it is cold either.  LaSalle, where the Board of Trade is located is about as lively as E. 9th is most days

I spent time in Boston last summer, and I distinctly remember being downtown in the morning and there being very little pedestrian and automobile traffic. In fact that was my first impression. But Boston is still an awesome city and that is more evident in the afternoon and evenings in particular parts of downtown.

 

That's because everyone was in line at Dunkin Donuts.

Yes, the tours will continue for companies hiring and courting new employees. In two weeks, one of my co-workers at the DCA and I will be leading potential new-hires from Progressive Insurance around Downtown Cleveland. We're only given two hours to show off the city, but this is well needed considering 17/22 of their job offers from the last similar tour chose to go elsewhere. Our goal is to make Cleveland seem so great that they can't afford NOT to be here. We'll make it happen.

 

Diversity among tour guides was relatively non-existant. Any "visible" diversity was not present at all. That is something we'll have to consider as things evolve. We are a rather diverse city and it would be nice to represent that. Good suggestion!

 

The magazine is out in 2.5 weeks- www.clevelandcityliving.com -YPs requested certain content and YPs wrote the editorials. This should be one of the best pieces we'll have to sell Cleveland. We'll be looking for help pretty soon for the September Issue. We'll keep you posted!

 

 

Questions?

Will these tours continue, not only for APP, but other company's thinking of relocating? or people currently in NE Ohio who don't know much about the city/region they live in.

What is the representation of Black, Latin, Asian, Women & Gays/Lesbians on the tourguides?

 

 

 

I'm probably not reading this correctly - but I'm confused.

 

The following quote suggests that five people chose to move to Cleveland:

"We're only given two hours to show off the city, but this is well needed considering 17/22 of their job offers from the last similar tour chose to go elsewhere."

 

But this quote from earlier this months suggests that a lot more chose to move to Cleveland:

"I will say that of the 21 people who have decided to come to Cleveland permanently, 17 have made the move to DOWNTOWN Cleveland."

 

Either way, any gain is a good thing - but obviously the more the merrier. As for the September issue, you have a great resource with the members of this forum - all you have to do is ask :-)

17/21 is the PR Newswire figure, and the 5/22 is Progressive, right?  Or did I misinterpret that?

I'm also curious about showing Progressive's new hires around downtown.... Unless Progressive is opening an office downtown! When I lived in the Hillcrest area in the 1970s, not many of my neighbors ventured downtown.

 

I'm interested in learning more about City Living magazine. Is the editorial content contributed by freelancers or by staff writers? If the latter, I'm interested in learning more about that. As a staff writer at a Cleveland-area newspaper chain, I couldn't contribute freelance articles to a local magazine or I'd risk my employment status. But I love the concept of the magazine!

Maybe some of the potential Progressive hires didn't like the fact that it was located out in suburbia??          I know of one person (very anecdotal) who was being recruited by a Solon firm. She was living in San Francisco. She didn't take the job because the firm wasn't in downtown.

There's a modicum of justice in that. If you want quality, young employees, where the employer is located is obviously very important.

Maybe some of the potential Progressive hires didn't like the fact that it was located out in suburbia??          I know of one person (very anecdotal) who was being recruited by a Solon firm. She was living in San Francisco. She didn't take the job because the firm wasn't in downtown.

 

Even here in the DC area, which has no shortage of young people, I know a few folks who turned down job offers simply because the job was located in Tysons Corner or Reston, Virginia.  Most of them opted for a job in-town, accessible by Metro.

Maybe some of the potential Progressive hires didn't like the fact that it was located out in suburbia??          I know of one person (very anecdotal) who was being recruited by a Solon firm. She was living in San Francisco. She didn't take the job because the firm wasn't in downtown.

 

Even here in the DC area, which has no shortage of young people, I know a few folks who turned down job offers simply because the job was located in Tysons Corner or Reston, Virginia.  Most of them opted for a job in-town, accessible by Metro.

 

Good point, Dan. If I were moving to NYC, Boston or DC, I wouldn't take a job that isn't close to public transit!

 

edit: Also, on further thought, my request of those marketing Cleveland to youngins. Can we touch everyone rather than just "young professionals?" I just say this because it seems like when people in Cleveland think "young" they think of the networking groups across the region. I just don't think the average young person is in touch with that sort of thing, I know I'm not.

 

It talks all types of people to make a fun, vibrant community -- from hair stylists to lawyers to construction workers!

Our tours over the past three months were a nice blend of what you might think of for "young professionals" (read: Yuppies), as well as what "young hipster urbanites" might be into.  A little bit of what Emerging Cleveland focuses on (the behind-the-scenes stuff) and a little of what Lolly the Trolly might swing you by.  Nothing wrong with either one, as long as the other side isn't neglected!

 

As for diversity, there was a bit more diversity during the meet n' greets, but I can't speak for the whole three day period.

 

On the point of where a firm is located and how it can impact employee's choices to take a job... I may change my tune if I don't find a job right away, but I'm really only considering places that are convenient to public transit.  And by that, I mean that I can work until 7:00 and the bus route won't have shut down already.  So, a company in University Heights, which is certainly not Solon to me, is still too far out of the mix.  Location is a BIG factor for me.

 

I have a friend who lives in Ohio City, is from Chicago, and works in Westfield... don't ask me where that is.  Basically, he can't stand driving all that way anymore and is about to take a job Downtown for less money because of the convenience. 

I have a friend who lives in Ohio City, is from Chicago, and works in Westfield... don't ask me where that is.

 

I couldn't tell you where Westfield is, either. 

 

Basically, he can't stand driving all that way anymore and is about to take a job Downtown for less money because of the convenience.

 

The job downtown might pay less, but you can commute by transit, which saves a hell of a lot of money--especially if your employer gives you transit benefits.

 

 

If I ever took a job that actually kept me in the city, I would only consider downtown.

Westfield is in southern Medina County near Lodi and the interchange of I-71, I-76 and US224. That's a horrible drive.

Wow, did anyone else see this response from Michael McIntyre of the PD?

 

Some hot air from Windy City

Saturday, March 10, 2007

Michael K. McIntyre

Plain Dealer Columnist

 

A columnist for the Chicago Sun-Times used Barack Obama's visit to the North Coast as a vehicle for some Cleveland bashing.

 

"This is one sad city, as dingy as the gray lake it sits beside, Lake Erie. Cleveland makes Chicago, with its Magnificent Mile and vibrant night life, look like Paris," wrote Jennifer Hunter. "The downtown streets are soulless. . . .

 

...

 

WWW.CLEVELAND.COM

Absolutely frightening - I thought most '94 Cutlasses had fallen apart by now!

That second one is absolutely horrible news, and a good example of how perception can overwhelm reality.  Cars get stolen, and its bad when it happens, but a cop telling a person not to walk one block during daylight because he will get mugged and not to leave the hotel at night- yeesh.  And then making it an announcement to the entire damned reception!

I understand what the cop is saying. I work downtown. If I have to walk one block, I expect to get mugged once. If I have to walk three blocks to a meeting, I usually get mugged three times. Now, I may get mugged one time at block A, none at block B,  and twice at block C. You see, its not always one mugging per each block, but it always averages out.

 

 

Someone from a newspaper in Indianapolis is writing an article right now and will be citing the above post as proof of how dangerous Downtown Cleveland is. 

Well, tech employment was down this year, but it's good to see theivery is still booming.

Someone from a newspaper in Indianapolis is writing an article right now and will be citing the above post as proof of how dangerous Downtown Cleveland is. 

 

OK, then how's this:

 

I understand what the cop is saying. I work downtown. If I have to walk one block, I expect to get mugged once. If I have to walk three blocks to a meeting, I usually get mugged three times. Now, I may get mugged one time at block A, none at block B,  and twice at block C. You see, its not always one mugging per each block, but it always averages out. ;)

perfect

That second one is absolutely horrible news, and a good example of how perception can overwhelm reality.  Cars get stolen, and its bad when it happens, but a cop telling a person not to walk one block during daylight because he will get mugged and not to leave the hotel at night- yeesh.  And then making it an announcement to the entire damned reception!

 

Ms. Hunter, in her snotty email reply to me, said that she was also told that it was unsafe to walk around downtown at night.  I think the hotel employees and cops downtown need a reality check.

 

As for the PD article, it's like two anecdotes were fused together, and I think the point it makes is a little too subtle.  It is nice, however, to have someone write an article illustrating how overblown people's perceptions of downtown are.

That second one is absolutely horrible news, and a good example of how perception can overwhelm reality.  Cars get stolen, and its bad when it happens, but a cop telling a person not to walk one block during daylight because he will get mugged and not to leave the hotel at night- yeesh.  And then making it an announcement to the entire damned reception!

 

Ms. Hunter, in her snotty email reply to me, said that she was also told that it was unsafe to walk around downtown at night.  I think the hotel employees and cops downtown need a reality check.

 

As for the PD article, it's like two anecdotes were fused together, and I think the point it makes is a little too subtle.  It is nice, however, to have someone write an article illustrating how overblown people's perceptions of downtown are.

 

Did she indicate by who?

 

This is a perfect time to email the mayor, county ciperman and the police commish as well as the media on how these "stereotypes"  & "perceptions" are a black eye to the overall impression of the city AND metro areas.

 

Who's up for drafting an email?

^ I'm thinking about writing a letter. I'm not too happy by our police force right now. I respect cops, but come one, did they get CompStat and not pull it out of the packaging? We need aggressive, progressive policing. What's happening right now is not working.

 

edit: eerrrr. make that "citistat." ;)