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Might still be some stigmas from Coventry Street Fair riots, Brennan's murder, unbelievable taxes, and cops focusing on ticketing rather than providing security. A lack of lake and freeway access probably don't help either. Probably some ironic perception problems with crime and legitimate concerns with schools too.

 

Developers only have so much money to risk. I'm sure the Severance failure is well remembered.

 

I agree with you about the crime issues and the cops, but don't see how a lack of direct freeway access matters.  Why do people in Cleveland constantly see freeways as the lifeblood of everything?  I also don't buy CH's lack of lakefront access either.  Cleveland Heights, founded at the close of the 19th century, like Shaker Heights which was founded a decade or so later, was considered to be in the most desirable natural setting in Greater Cleveland: up on the eastern bluff overlooking the city ... the 'heights.'  The setting, especially along the Overlook, with views of downtown Cleveland and the lake, and lower CH along the Shaker Lakes, is still highly sought after with many older, $1M mansions... not sure where you're getting your information.

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  • Couple of dusk shots from the Cedar side tonight (west bound curb lane open again). Overhang lighting looks great and can be seen throughout the neighborhood with the leaves down. Rest of the exterior

  • New renderings from City Architecture for the Cedar-Lee-Meadowbrook project posted in preparation for the 2/9 Planning Commission meeting: https://www.clevelandheights.com/DocumentCenter/View/10394/PC

  • The promised photo dump. I thought the apartments were very nice. Good finishes, and layouts.                 

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^I'll take Cleveland Heights with its class and character, with its lack of direct freeway access (but with good public transit) over cookie-cutter, soulless Westlake, with it's I-90 freeway ramps, 10 out of 10 times.

I'm saying from a developer's viewpoint, freeway access may be a factor in where they risk investments. It's probably why more east siders hang out in Ohio City and Tremont than West Siders go to Coventry or Cedar Lee.

^On the flip side, CH has the advantage of NON-freeway access to the second largest (and probably fastest growing) employment center in the NEO region. 

 

Might still be some stigmas from Coventry Street Fair riots, Brennan's murder, unbelievable taxes, and cops focusing on ticketing rather than providing security. A lack of lake and freeway access probably don't help either. Probably some ironic perception problems with crime and legitimate concerns with schools too.

 

Developers only have so much money to risk. I'm sure the Severance failure is well remembered.

 

None of the above.  This lot was very close to being developed until the true abatement costs were discovered after more thorough testing.  This was the site of an old gas station.  When the developer sought further assistance of the City in fraying those costs, that's where the very vocal contingent of the community who want to maintain the green space AND who are anti-new construction found their footing and killed any prospects of a deal being worked out. 

 

I'm not sure what Severance has to do with this.  Severance has suffered because they tried to put a big box store roundabout in a community that prides itself on its street-front mom and pop shops.

I'm saying from a developer's viewpoint, freeway access may be a factor in where they risk investments. It's probably why more east siders hang out in Ohio City and Tremont than West Siders go to Coventry or Cedar Lee.

 

I frequent Ohio City quite a bit, but usually use the Rapid...buses from PS occasionally (to Hingetown infrequently)... I tend to drive to Tremont but did use the 81 and the old Community Circulator a couple times (I used to always get lost in Tremont when driving -- GPS is a Godsend)... But I never use the freeway to get there. Always use the Lorain-Carnegie bridge or hop over from Ohio City.

 

Btw, some of the biggest high-end apartment building in greater Cleveland has been in University Circle and yet there is no freeway access there (and no, I don't count the inbuilt Opportunity Corridor).

 

Anecdotal of course, but freeway access is the overwhelming complaint I hear from people who 1) move out of CH or 2) won't go to an event there.

^ not only lack of freeway access but limited transit access to CH as well.  IMHO

Anecdotal of course, but freeway access is the overwhelming complaint I hear from people who 1) move out of CH or 2) won't go to an event there.

 

Funny.  That is exactly what I find so appealing about Cleveland Hts.  (as well as Shaker and University Heights).  Too each his own.

Anecdotal of course, but freeway access is the overwhelming complaint I hear from people who 1) move out of CH or 2) won't go to an event there.

 

Funny.  That is exactly what I find so appealing about Cleveland Hts.  (as well as Shaker and University Heights).  Too each his own.

\

 

Doesn't it all depend on where you are going or coming from?  Otherwise for me, I totally agree with you on this as I love living in an area that isn't fragmented or otherwise desecrated by an overbuilt freeway system, as if it is difficult to get around otherwise...  Heck, I can easily walk to the rapid whenever I want to!   

None of the above.  This lot was very close to being developed until the true abatement costs were discovered after more thorough testing.  This was the site of an old gas station.  When the developer sought further assistance of the City in fraying those costs, that's where the very vocal contingent of the community who want to maintain the green space AND who are anti-new construction found their footing and killed any prospects of a deal being worked out. 

 

While that may be true, I also heard that a cable company has an easement that crosses diagonally across part of the property and they wouldn't allow construction over it.  The developer offered to put the cable into a culvert that would protect the cable and allow for future expansion but that was a non-starter.  The cable company (AT&T I think) wanted $100,000 to move the cable to where it followed the street grid. 

 

Enough little straws eventually break the camel's back.

^ not only lack of freeway access but limited transit access to CH as well.  IMHO

 

I find Cleveland Heights to be pretty well served by transit.  Even though the city doesn't have rail transit within its borders, it is flanked by rail to the west and south... I've known of many people in the southern part of CH who walk to Green Line rail stations just south of CH's southern border in Shaker.  Also some people in the Cedar-Fairmount and Coventry neighborhoods walk down the hill (and sometimes up it) to Red Line stations at Cedar Glen and, now, Little Italy, respectively... In addition, (relatively) frequent feeder bus lines also serve these stations.  And for those who'd rather drive, CH residents can, and do, drive and park along South Park Blvd in Shaker adjacent to the Green Line station there (where there are no, no-parking signs).  It's usually 5 (no more than 10) minute drive.

 

To those who choose to move out of Cleveland Heights due to a lack of freeways?  It's a free country.  These people, ultimately, are probably not the kind of folks who CH wants anyway as they are less likely to appreciate the unique charms that makes this old suburb attractive and special.

To those who choose to move out of Cleveland Heights due to a lack of freeways?  It's a free country.  These people, ultimately, are probably not the kind of folks who CH wants anyway as they are less likely to appreciate the unique charms that makes this old suburb attractive and special.

 

I don't get this argument.  In CH, you can get to I-271 in <15 min from most parts, I-90 east or west in <15 min via MLK, and downtown in <15 via Carnegie, where you can pick up I-90, I-71, or I-77.  So even when you do need a freeway (which isn't often because many places are nearby), it isn't that awfully hard to get to one.  I know people who complain about the lack of freeway access and then move to an exurb 40 miles from the city in a development 10-15 minutes from the freeway (the ONLY freeway, which they then need to take for many miles to get anywhere of interest).  It's a nonsensical argument.

To those who choose to move out of Cleveland Heights due to a lack of freeways?  It's a free country.  These people, ultimately, are probably not the kind of folks who CH wants anyway as they are less likely to appreciate the unique charms that makes this old suburb attractive and special.

 

I don't get this argument.  In CH, you can get to I-271 in <15 min from most parts, I-90 east or west in <15 min via MLK, and downtown in <15 via Carnegie, where you can pick up I-90, I-71, or I-77.  So even when you do need a freeway (which isn't often because many places are nearby), it isn't that awfully hard to get to one.  I know people who complain about the lack of freeway access and then move to an exurb 40 miles from the city in a development 10-15 minutes from the freeway (the ONLY freeway, which they then need to take for many miles to get anywhere of interest).  It's a nonsensical argument.

 

What about Lakewood?  Not exactly an exurb.  My brother works in Solon and still made that move.  To this day he comments on how much easier it is to get around. 

 

A friend of mine in Cleveland Heights just visited another friend in West Park and it took him 40 minutes each way.  The uber bill was quite large.  FWIW the Opportunity Corridor is going to bring these two friends closer together.  Both of them live in urban neighborhoods and both of their neighborhoods benefit from additional connectivity with each other.  I daresay the OC might even help get something built at Lee and Silsby.  Speculation, obviously.  But increased access and connectivity are not likely to hurt that parcel or any other in Cleveland Heights.

^^The E152 and E185 entrances to the Shoreway are about 10 mins from where I grew up in CH

 

 

What about Lakewood?  Not exactly an exurb.  My brother works in Solon and still made that move.  To this day he comments on how much easier it is to get around. 

 

A friend of mine in Cleveland Heights just visited another friend in West Park and it took him 40 minutes each way.  The uber bill was quite large.  FWIW the Opportunity Corridor is going to bring these two friends closer together.  Both of them live in urban neighborhoods and both of their neighborhoods benefit from additional connectivity with each other.  I daresay the OC might even help get something built at Lee and Silsby.  Speculation, obviously.  But increased access and connectivity are not likely to hurt that parcel or any other in Cleveland Heights.

 

I seriously doubt the OC will have any positive influence on the development of any multi-unit residential project in a walkable community like Cedar-Lee (Lee and Silsby).

To those who choose to move out of Cleveland Heights due to a lack of freeways?  It's a free country.  These people, ultimately, are probably not the kind of folks who CH wants anyway as they are less likely to appreciate the unique charms that makes this old suburb attractive and special.

 

I don't get this argument.  In CH, you can get to I-271 in <15 min from most parts, I-90 east or west in <15 min via MLK, and downtown in <15 via Carnegie, where you can pick up I-90, I-71, or I-77.  So even when you do need a freeway (which isn't often because many places are nearby), it isn't that awfully hard to get to one.  I know people who complain about the lack of freeway access and then move to an exurb 40 miles from the city in a development 10-15 minutes from the freeway (the ONLY freeway, which they then need to take for many miles to get anywhere of interest).  It's a nonsensical argument.

 

What about Lakewood?  Not exactly an exurb.  My brother works in Solon and still made that move.  To this day he comments on how much easier it is to get around. 

 

A friend of mine in Cleveland Heights just visited another friend in West Park and it took him 40 minutes each way.  The uber bill was quite large.  FWIW the Opportunity Corridor is going to bring these two friends closer together.  Both of them live in urban neighborhoods and both of their neighborhoods benefit from additional connectivity with each other.  I daresay the OC might even help get something built at Lee and Silsby.  Speculation, obviously.  But increased access and connectivity are not likely to hurt that parcel or any other in Cleveland Heights.

 

I don't think the OC is going to have the impact to his travel time that you may think.  It may take his drive from 40 minutes to 38.  I regularly drive down Woodland to get to E 55th and it takes almost no time as it is.  I think the OC is going to have absolutely zero impact on the Cedar Lee district.   

 

OK, folks, let's get back to actual development news.

^^The E152 and E185 entrances to the Shoreway are about 10 mins from where I grew up in CH

 

Get real.

  • 2 months later...

^Well this is a real bummer

Meadowbrook and Top of the Hill are still great development sites, despite the setbacks.

Meadowbrook and Top of the Hill are still great development sites, despite the setbacks.

 

Of course, but they are city owned and you have to work with Cleveland Heights. This is a huge red flag to developers who have to spend a bunch of time and money up front before a project even breaks ground.

Surprisingly, I've never noticed this thread until now and I have 9 pages to catch up on. So far, I don't see anything mentioned about it but I was wondering what's up with the giant empty lot between Meadowbrook and Tullamore.  What was there? What are the plans for it? I've lived in the area for a year and a half and they've barely done anything with it... It really does seem feasible to build an apartment building with first floor retail. The only reason businesses die on this section of Lee is due to bad management. This area is insanely popular for folks in Heights, Shaker and University Hts. They don't like to go downtown or anywhere far away and they like supporting the community. I think a lot of people here would be excited about the idea of new residential construction in this area. What's the scoop on this giant plot on Lee Rd?

^really have to read the thread.  Way too much history.

^really have to read the thread.  Way too much history.

 

I feel a headache coming on...

^I'll take Cleveland Heights with its class and character, with its lack of direct freeway access (but with good public transit) over cookie-cutter, soulless Westlake, with it's I-90 freeway ramps, 10 out of 10 times.

 

Where did you get this idea that CH has good public transit? There's no way you could say that if you've actually taken public transit over here, recently. Public transit in Cleveland Heights sucks. It takes forever to get around on a bus. For starters, you can't even get downtown without transferring. If I take a bus downtown to meet up with my girlfriend and drive back with her, I have to pay twice when transferring just to go in the same direction because there's no direct route to that area. RTA is such a scam. It's either a bus and a train or taking two buses to achieve that goal. It's obnoxious; I don't feel I live that far away from downtown. From what I was told, a lot of bus routes no longer exist, like one that went down Fairmount. There's others that I've heard legends of but can't remember where they were. I think S. Taylor had a bus as well. The one that goes along Cedar Rd. only runs once an hour, even during peak hours. It literally doesn't matter what time of day or which day it's running - it just comes once an hour. Same with the one that goes down Lee and Mayfield. The Mayfield Rd. bus might actually be worse. Is that considered frequent service in Cleveland? No one seems to have a problem with that sort of frequency even though I can imagine people spending half of their day waiting for busses, to run certain errands.  Maybe even catching hypothermia at the bus stop, in the winter. A similar street to Cedar Rd. in Columbus would have buses running every 20 minutes. Highway accessibility is also bad but imo that's a big problem for a lot of Cleveland.

Meadowbrook and Top of the Hill are still great development sites, despite the setbacks.

 

Of course, but they are city owned and you have to work with Cleveland Heights. This is a huge red flag to developers who have to spend a bunch of time and money up front before a project even breaks ground.

 

Disappointed about Top of the Hill to be sure.  I'm interested to hear what exactly the issue was. 

 

Lee/Meadowbrook is a different animal.  With that location, I can see that it would be difficult to get the rents that would justify the cost of construction, but I would have thought Cedar/Fairmount could justify it. 

 

(oh and I know it's a topic for RTA thread, but CH is served well by rail ("well" being relative to Cleveland))

Good to hear this. I was about to complain about so much parking but it's about right. The Flaherty & Collins plan has:

 

250+ apartments (250 parking spaces)

30,000 square feet of retail/restaurants (300 spaces)

20,000 square feet of offices (100 spaces)

110-room Element hotel (100 spaces)

-------

750 garage-parking spaces

 

 

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

  • 4 weeks later...

I like this one better than the Fairmount proposal. From mjarboe[/member] Twitter.

Love the density!

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

Like it especially:

 

Good job hiding the parking;

 

The mid block pedestrian way;

 

That they have plans for the east side of Nighttown which I did not know was part of the deal.  More density with the four story building and getting rid of some non descript buildings.  I wonder if this is just aspirational?  Do not know if the city owns this land where Zoos the Baker and a bank (I think 5th/3r but not sure) are.

 

Like the townhomes on the south side of Cedar but I am sure that the neighbors are going to go ballistic and put up a fight.  Might not happen.  Again, Aspirational?  Actually, I guess at this point the whole plan is in the wish phase.

Like it especially:

 

Good job hiding the parking;

 

The mid block pedestrian way;

 

That they have plans for the east side of Nighttown which I did not know was part of the deal.  More density with the four story building and getting rid of some non descript buildings.  I wonder if this is just aspirational?  Do not know if the city owns this land where Zoos the Baker and a bank (I think 5th/3r but not sure) are.

 

Like the townhomes on the south side of Cedar but I am sure that the neighborhoods are going to go ballistic and put up a fight.  Might not happen.  Again, Aspirational?  Actually, I guess at this point the whole plan is in the wish phase.

 

Nighttown owns the Zoss building and 5/3 owns their site.  Can't say about 5/3, but I would think Nighttown would want to partner with the developer - maybe take an ownership in the overall development for giving up their buildings.

That looks fantastic. Development at this location is a long-time coming as the neighborhood is really the gateway to Cleveland Heights. I just didn't realize how expansive they planned on making it; I really thought it would only be the old Doctors' Hospital corner and not stretch so much further, but I'm okay with that.

A document posted on the city's website also mentions a 110-room Element hotel, a Westin-affiliated, extended-stay brand that's billed as eco-friendly.

 

The extended-stay hotel inclusion is spot on for what needed in the area.  I can't tell you how many times I've run into people looking for short term housing for a couple weeks or couple months tied to Case Western Reserve, Cleveland Clinic, University Hospitals, etc.

 

Fantastic proposal.  It perfectly addresses the pent up demand for more housing and desire for walkability.

  • 2 months later...

Spirit Corner brings neighborhood together after vacant eyesore is finally razed (photos)

https://articles.cleveland.com/tipoff/index.ssf/2017/09/when_a_vacant_house_in_clevela.amp

 

As a teenager, my friends and I would drive over to that house every once in a while to take a look and maybe dare each other to knock on the door. As I recall, the house was almost certainly abandoned, but my memory tells me that there was always a light on in the attic. The rumor was that if you looked into that room from the correct angle, you could see the shadow of a noose on the wall. The tale was that a lady that had lived there had committed suicide and that it was haunted.

 

I'd like to know more about the real story behind the "Ghost House" and perhaps how some of these rumors began.

 

Anyhow, I have driven by that area since the house has been torn down and the pocket park has been built. It's a nice asset for a really unique area.

The man who owned that property before it was demoed owns countless vacant and abandoned properties. Great to see that something good came from one of them.

  • 3 weeks later...

There is a community meeting on the Top of the Hill Project tonight at 7pm at the Cleveland Heights Community Center. I am planning to go and happy to post updates and notes from the meeting afterwards.

 

Any updates mam?

Noticed some changes in my neighborhood (I live by Cedar and Cottage Grove Av. and walk around and shop somewhere on Cedar - Lee District every day.) They're remodeling the building where Lemongrass was. What is going in there?

 

Also, these "Fix" restaurants seem to be taking over the entire neighborhood. There's the Fix Bistro, Sweet Fix (bakery - where Black Box Fix used to be,) Soul Fix, just north of Cedar and Lee (which I'm assuming is the same owners?) and also "Fawaky Fix" which seems like a juicing and health-conscious vegetarian concept, moving into the location Subway used to occupy. Isn't that a little weird? More power to them, I guess. I just don't want them to end up taking over the entire business district. I've lived in urban neighborhoods all over Ohio's great cities and I've never seen an owner or company take over four different locations in one small strip.

 

I've been pretty loyal to the Rib Cage lately for take-out since they've gotten better service. I order the half chicken teriyaki dinner with two sides of mac and cheese, and hush puppies instead of the cornbread, probably 2x a week. I order there so much, they see my number on the caller ID and say, "What's up Dave? Your usual? LOL!

 

Whatever they're doing with the Lemongrass location, they're putting a lot of work into rehabbing it. I haven't  seen any sign indicating what is going in, though. Maybe a developer is just getting it ready with no tenant lined up, yet.

 

I'm surprised that there's not much talk about the Cedar - Lee NBD. The area is extremely vibrant for how gritty it looks but I can't help but think that there should be a lot of improvements. It has top notch restaurants and an Indie movie theater. The problem with the theater though is that they seem to play movies that cater to mostly just elderly people. I never see young people frequenting it. Maybe they could choose different indie movies to cater to that crowd. I'd like to see streetscape improvements; more outdoor benches, trees awnings, better-looking facades and things that just make it look more vibrant and inviting. Also, missing teeth that need filled in. I hate that Lopez owns that parking lot between Lopez and Hts Grill. That was clearly at one time, another building. If Hts Grill owned it, it could be an extension of their patio, making the strip look cohesive.

 

That vacant lot has a lot of potential by Meadowbrook.

 

It's ridiculous that there's so much valet parking service going on during weekends. Parking is not that hard to find around there. There's an extremely under-utilized giant parking garage nearby. There's free municipal parking next to AT&T. Often times, people think that parking is such a chore, when it's not, and the real issue is lack of signing directing people to parking lots/garages.

 

 

^ Boss Dog Brewery is moving into the Lemongrass space.

 

http://www.cleveland.com/cleveland-heights/index.ssf/2017/02/cleveland_heights_approves_200.html

 

Cleveland Heights approves $200,000 revolving loan for Boss Dog Brewing Co. on Cedar-Lee

 

CLEVELAND HEIGHTS, Ohio -- A $200,000 commercial revolving loan is on tap for Boss Dog Brewing Co. to move into the former Lemon Grass restaurant on Cedar-Lee.

 

Brothers Josh and Jason Sweet, who are originally from Cleveland Heights, are working toward a late spring opening for the full-service brewpub at 2179 Lee Road.

Any updates mam?

 

Sorry for the delay, but I am a bit sad to say the wait was probably not worth it. Flaherty Collins presented a new conceptual site plan that is the same flavor we have all seen before, similar to this: http://realestate.cleveland.com/realestate-news/2017/05/cleveland_heights_will_pursue.html except with a parking garage wrapped in apartments and retail where it says "terrace" in the linked plan. They were very quick to say that this will likely change over time.

 

Then they took comments from the community. About 50% were positive/cautious comments, as the developers asked to hear our concerns, suggestions for architecture, etc. 50% of the comments were generally unhelpful and negative ("I've seen development proposals here for 30 years..."), but I was a bit glad to get some historical perspective from the older residents. Some comments even bordered on scary ("I don't want any strangers moving into our community..."). Flaherty Collins said they will likely develop no more than 6 stories, and several residents liked that and several wanted 10-20 stories. It was nice to see some advocating for a bold statement to be made with this development (and I happen to agree with that sentiment).

 

The City is exploring a TIF plan for assistance on the site, and will likely ground lease the whole property to Flaherty Collins. No details on mixed use breakdown such as ratio of apartments, for-sale, etc. More to come I hope...

 

EDIT: Oh, I should probably mention parking. This was probably the most used word at the meeting. Parking, traffic, traffic study. Residents are nuts about parking, which I don't quite get because I have always seen CH as a leader in mixed-use district parking schemes. Cedar Fairmount, Cedar Lee, and Coventry all have public parking decks. In the comments I gave to the development team I implored them to examine the implication of self driving cars, as they plan to construct a massive parking deck for this project.

 

 

^ Boss Dog Brewery is moving into the Lemongrass space.

 

http://www.cleveland.com/cleveland-heights/index.ssf/2017/02/cleveland_heights_approves_200.html

 

Cleveland Heights approves $200,000 revolving loan for Boss Dog Brewing Co. on Cedar-Lee

 

CLEVELAND HEIGHTS, Ohio -- A $200,000 commercial revolving loan is on tap for Boss Dog Brewing Co. to move into the former Lemon Grass restaurant on Cedar-Lee.

 

Brothers Josh and Jason Sweet, who are originally from Cleveland Heights, are working toward a late spring opening for the full-service brewpub at 2179 Lee Road.

 

I live right behind this part of Cedar Lee and it is probably the slowest brewery project I have ever seen. They're well into a year on this.

David.  I feel like your post if from last year as I thought you were more tied into things in the area. 

 

There has been many stories about the Brewery going in for quite some time.  In fact it was supposed to open in July, August, September...... Now next Spring. 

 

So the district just wrapped up a street scape project that has been happenings since last year.  I must say that it seems to be one of the worst streetscape projects I have ever seen.  Many people think thinks actually look worse. 

The surfaces are mismatched, old and new, lighting doesn't line up, tree placement is random etc. etc...  I guess they are done, although it shouldn't be. 

 

Agree about Rib Cage.. What a treasure.  But the Fix places, well what started as an overpriced/overrated sandwich shop that took over the beloved Sweety-fry space has grown into all of these businesses.  He must be doing something right, and he does seem to be a quality operator.  I guess with all of the demographic changes in this area its unrealistic to not expect the business's to follow suit.  But yeah its odd to me to see one person control so many spots as well.  I must say that Rudy's Bar is another example and frankly a gem.  And a former Solid Gold dancer is the owner/bartender!

*Other gems on the street; Marrota's (pricey but great Italian and wonderful takeout pizza) and Taste (great happy hour, vibe and great food).  Dobama Theatre as well. 

 

I thought mam178 was responding about the Meadowbrook/Lee lot, but is instead talking about Top of the Hill.  They are now so behind the 8-ball with the Meadowbrook lot, it was really a vital project in order to stabilize the area.   

 

 

     

 

^Buildings no taller than 3 or 4 stories  max would be a huge disappointment, and a mistake in my mind.  The old "cost"  versus "return" bugaboo raises its ugly head again.

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