17 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

The billion dollar estimate from that blurb was for the local highway system, not the CTS expansion. 

My bad, read too quickly. 

Slower and less frequent today. And Cleveland had 500,000 more people back then, before they all fled to the suburbs with their shopping and jobs.

 

Interesting YouTube video: How Cleveland Rejected the Subway

 

This channel has a bunch of other videos on Cleveland area rail too.

Edited October 1, 2024Oct 1 by Rustbelter

Oh wow, check out this historical video of Cleveland Street cars. It includes the subway portals on West superior, West 25th, and Detroit. It features a street car running across the lower level of the Detroit superior Bridge.

 

 

I never knew they came out of the bridge and could make the turn onto W 25th

 

52 minutes ago, Cleburger said:

I never knew they came out of the bridge and could make the turn onto W 25th

 

Yes, portals on both Detroit and West 25th!

I finally found online the complete Northeast Ohio Commuter Rail Feasibility Study published late 2001 / early 2002 from Parsons Brinckerhoff. I downloaded everything (painstakingly, as each section was its own pdf buried in an archive). I believe this report was presented to NOACA in December of 2001.

 

Exec summary: http://www.multimodalways.org/docs/govts/counties/OHMPONOACA/NEORail/FINAL Report Chapters/Executive Summary/Exec Sum FINAL MBC 2-06-02.pdf

 

Archive: http://www.multimodalways.org/docs/govts/counties/OHMPONOACA/NEORail/

 

 

"Introduction
The Northeast Ohio Commuter Rail Feasibility Study (NEORail) was a two phase study conducted to assess the potential for regional commuter rail service in Northeast Ohio. The study focused on nine counties in the jurisdictions of three metropolitan planning organizations (NOACA, for the Cleveland-Lorain area; AMATS, for the Akron-Kent area, and SCATS, for the Canton-Massillon area). NOACA oversaw the study through its Commuter Rail Advisory Committee (CRAC). Parsons Brinckerhoff, a transportation consulting firm, performed the technical analysis, supported by Urban Conservation and Design, which conducted the public involvement portion of the study."

...

"Introducing commuter rail service onto existing mainline freight tracks would have significant impacts on rail freight operations, particularly at numerous bottleneck locations throughout the region. Thus, it is unlikely that the freight railroads that control key segments of each of the seven routes would permit commuter rail operation on their rights of way without significant capital investment to address bottlenecks in the rail system."

...

...

"Therefore, the NEORail Phase II Study has developed the following findings and recommendations:
1. The commuter rail network in Northeast Ohio that best achieves the region’s development and mobility goals in a cost-effective manner comprises four routes radiating outward from Cleveland:
- [1] Lake West corridor to Lorain
- [7] Lake East corridor to Painesville and Ashtabula County
- [6] East corridor to Aurora and Mantua
- [4] South corridor to Akron and Canton via Hudson

 

2. The CRAC recommends an early project to initiate commuter rail service in the Lake West and Southeast corridors. An MIS will be required to secure federal funding for commuter rail in this corridor. This project offers the best opportunity for early success:
- Commuter rail service would be provided westward to Lorain and eastward to Aurora and Mantua.
- It is the most cost-effective of all the combinations of routes and services examined in the study, in terms of riders attracted to the service for the dollars expended to create the service.
- It should be possible to implement this service in a reasonable amount of time, given that Norfolk Southern (NS) is the only freight railroad materially affected, the proposed plan offers significant capacity and cost-savings benefits to NS to compensate for the use of its right-of-way, and the proposed alignment results in minimal interference of commuter trains with freight operations.
- It provides early service to both the east and west sides of the region.

 

3. Extension of the commuter rail network into the South and Lake East corridors should proceed as soon as practicable, so that the benefits of a regional rail network can be realized as soon as  possible and have the greatest effect on regional development patterns.

"

 

 

The PD's quarter of a percent sales tax proposal for funding all future sports and airport projects reminded me of another quarter of a percent idea of what 40? 50? years ago.  For just a quarter of a percent increase in the sales tax the Cleveland Transit System was supposed to be FREE FOREVER.  The tax passed and I believe fares actually were free for a bit.  How long did that last?

15 minutes ago, Dougal said:

The PD's quarter of a percent sales tax proposal for funding all future sports and airport projects reminded me of another quarter of a percent idea of what 40? 50? years ago.  For just a quarter of a percent increase in the sales tax the Cleveland Transit System was supposed to be FREE FOREVER.  The tax passed and I believe fares actually were free for a bit.  How long did that last?

 

I'll reactivate my old tag line and say the quiet part out loud.

 

Free fares inevitably becomes rolling homeless shelters.

Edited January 5Jan 5 by E Rocc

And the turnpike was supposed to be free after it was paid off. 

Lots of additional historical background to add. They shouldn't have relied just on Mark Souther who incorrectly states that Detroit-Superior bridge wasn't a real subway because it wasn't heavy rail. Many subways around the world are light rail.

 

 

These Railroad Street videos are always great. 

 

I know that rail expansion in Cleveland is highly unliekly. But I am curious if anyone knows if there were any plans in the past to extend the redline down through Middleburg or Berea (Baldwin Wallace) to Strongsville or even Brunswick. The lower west side is completely unserved by rail. Were those areas ever considered for a red line expansion and if so how close did they ever get to getting build?

5 minutes ago, 8MPG said:

I know that rail expansion in Cleveland is highly unliekly. But I am curious if anyone knows if there were any plans in the past to extend the redline down through Middleburg or Berea (Baldwin Wallace) to Strongsville or even Brunswick. The lower west side is completely unserved by rail. Were those areas ever considered for a red line expansion and if so how close did they ever get to getting build?

Red Line expansion to Berea was studied. It was determined that it would not generate sufficient ridership to be worthwhile. Plus Berea leaders were understandably underwhelmed by existing RTA station areas. Barring a complete redo of zoning that increases density, there is no reason to consider expansion beyond Berea. We really need to improve service in the core of the metro area before considering expansion from the ends of the lines.

One recommendation that came out of GCRTA's SW Corridor Alternatives Analysis was a follow-on study that proposed taking the Red Line out of the airport tunnel and putting it on an elevated alignment on the north side of the current parking garage where a large retail-hotel-rail station complex would be built. For some reason, I recall this new structure was to be nine stories tall and built so the Red Line could be more easily extended to the south someday.

But wait, there’s more! The airport rail tunnel wouldn't be abandoned. Instead, it would be used by a new rail shuttle linking the airport to the car rental facility to rid the airport roadways of all the shuttle buses. The rail shuttle would share the Brookpark Rapid station with the Red Line and, after it went under I-480, it would make a sharp turn to the west, go over I-71 and head into the car rental facility that was built with a grassy strip for the rail shuttle route.