Detroit had a vision of bringing a 9.3 mile (one way) light rail system along Woodward Avenue from Downtown to Eight Mile Road (where the state fairgrounds are at the edge of Detroit City Limits). The line was to be called the Woodward Avenue Light Rail.

 

Here is a map of the original plan:

 

Here is a map of the current plan:

 

In December 2011, Secretary Ray Lahood (R-ODOT), Mayor Dave Bing (D), and Governor Rick Snyder ® agreed to change the plan to a BRT system. Local business leaders such as Dan Gilbert (Quicken Loans, Cleveland Cavaliers, Rock Gaming), Roger Penske (GE, Penske racing), and Matt Cullen (Rock Ventures, GM) decided to build a 3.3 mile (one way) streetcar line from Downtown to the intersection of Woodward and Grand just past the Detroit Amtrak Station.

 

A full description of the project can be found here [PDF].

 

Updates seem scarce for the time being, but the group seems confident that the project will continue. The total cost of the project would be ~$125 million and over $90 million has been secured through private financing. Annual operating cost would be $5.1 million and covered by private sources (fares, advertising, private investment, etc.) for the first 10 years of operation. This would be the first rail system in Detroit since the original streetcars were torn up (not counting the People Mover). Their target operating date is August 2015.

Detroit is such a disaster.  I have to imagine that banks and rich parents will be incredibly hesitant to loan money for homes and condos in this area. 

^ I agree.

 

I don't think that there will be much private investment along the line unless significant public investment is put in. One possible source of public investment is a new venue for the Pistons or Red Wings. This article from WXYZ suggests this as a possibility at the intersection of Woodward and Temple (two blocks north of the Sibley stop).

 

I would think either one would be valuable to the city. The Pistons currently play at The Palace in Auburn Hills to the West of Detroit. It is one of the oldest arenas in the NBA, however there has been significant improvements to the arena, so it may not be the future site of the Pistons. Bringing the Pistons in would bring a lot of visitors to the city who currently don't go to Detroit, though.

 

I think the better choice is for the Red Wings to relocate from Joe Louis Arena. The Joe is the fourth oldest arena in the NHL, and unlike MLB and select NFL stadiums, the really old arenas have little "nostalgia" in terms of an irreplaceable asset (think Wrigley Field, Lambeau Field, Fenway Park, etc). It is only a matter of time before The Joe is replaced, and I think this presents a great opportunity. It also could help spur development outside of the I-75 barrier at the edge of downtown. The Red Wings are a consistently good team that always draws a crowd for home games. I think this is the best opportunity to spur development along the line. This may not cause condos to open up next door, but with proper planning and a new adjacent development nearby for bars and restaurants, I think private investment could follow in the area around a new arena.

Detroit is such a disaster.  I have to imagine that banks and rich parents will be incredibly hesitant to loan money for homes and condos in this area. 

 

Cincinnati is a disaster.  Similar things could be said about the 'Nati.  You could argue that Cincinnati leadership has been every bit as incompetent as Detroit's in the last 20 years.

^The main difference between Detroit and Cincinnati is that the politicians have actually been stealing from the city of Detroit, not just making bad planning decision. Also, the outward migration from Detroit has been much more significant than Cincinnati. To put it in perspective, Detroit lost 25% of its population between 2000-2010. They went from the 10th largest city in the country to the 18th. Cincinnati lost 10% of its population and went from 54th to 64th. Cities this far down the list are typically closer together in population than those at the top of the list like Detroit. For examples, Detroit is now 260,000 people from regaining its #10 ranking (36% of its population). Cincinnati is 45,000 away from regaining its #54 spot (15% of its population).

 

I'm hopeful that Detroit will pull through and I believe the M-1 Rail could be the first step to revitalizing downtown. It's going to take so much more than just that to do it though. IMHO most of Woodward Avenue north of 75 needs to be demolished and some urban mixed-use needs to be built in its place. Aside from historic churches and schools along the road, most of the buildings have large setbacks or a huge parking lot facing the street that provide little benefit to pedestrians. Most of these need to be torn down and a truly urban environment needs to start from 75 and outward up Woodward. I think a new Joe Louis Arena would spark development on the south side and the M-1 Rail will push development outward. Then property values on neighboring streets will increase and people may actually want to live there.

 

If the rail line does get built though, I think Detroit City Council and the Planning Department need to be firm on their acceptance of almost exclusively mixed-use buildings with storefronts directly on Woodward. No strip malls, gas stations, or office towers that fail to interact with the street are going to help the redevelopment of that area. Unfortunately Detroit's problems reach far beyond Woodward Avenue.

^The main difference between Detroit and Cincinnati is that the politicians have actually been stealing from the city of Detroit, not just making bad planning decision. Also, the outward migration from Detroit has been much more significant than Cincinnati. To put it in perspective, Detroit lost 25% of its population between 2000-2010. They went from the 10th largest city in the country to the 18th. Cincinnati lost 10% of its population and went from 54th to 64th. Cities this far down the list are typically closer together in population than those at the top of the list like Detroit. For examples, Detroit is now 260,000 people from regaining its #10 ranking (36% of its population). Cincinnati is 45,000 away from regaining its #54 spot (15% of its population).

 

I'm hopeful that Detroit will pull through and I believe the M-1 Rail could be the first step to revitalizing downtown. It's going to take so much more than just that to do it though. IMHO most of Woodward Avenue north of 75 needs to be demolished and some urban mixed-use needs to be built in its place. Aside from historic churches and schools along the road, most of the buildings have large setbacks or a huge parking lot facing the street that provide little benefit to pedestrians. Most of these need to be torn down and a truly urban environment needs to start from 75 and outward up Woodward. I think a new Joe Louis Arena would spark development on the south side and the M-1 Rail will push development outward. Then property values on neighboring streets will increase and people may actually want to live there.

 

If the rail line does get built though, I think Detroit City Council and the Planning Department need to be firm on their acceptance of almost exclusively mixed-use buildings with storefronts directly on Woodward. No strip malls, gas stations, or office towers that fail to interact with the street are going to help the redevelopment of that area. Unfortunately Detroit's problems reach far beyond Woodward Avenue.

 

I agree that Detroit is corrupt to the core, but does Bob Bedinghaus ring a bell?  Other Cincinnati carpetbaggers who've cashed a state check or two: Mike Allen, Phil Heimlich, Joe Deters, Pat DeWine...

 

A streetcar is a bad idea for an area devoid of semi-contiguous development.  Subway is Detroit's future, Michigan legislators just have to skip a few kickback checks from their auto buddies and find the money for a radial rapid transit network.  In Cincinnati's Over the Rhine, Clifton, Walnut Hills, there are buildings in existence to capitalize.  On and off Woodward, there aren't enough ready-to-invest assets.  There needs to be something permanent in the ground with exits on major thoroughfares in areas like this one.  Dayton and Cleveland both have areas of comparison, but the biggest offender in the Detroitification category is St. Louis..

 

Fortunately, Cincinnati's political machine was county Republicans, who are a dying breed. Detroit's machine is comprised of city Democrats. Somehow, I don't see a band of progressive Republicans coming to save Detroit.

 

This is not to let Cincinnati city (Democratic) leaders off the hook for bad policies, but since Mallory took office (almost) everything has been on the up-and-up. Qualls will likely take over and continue in that tradition. Help from the county and state would be much appreciated, of course, but at least we have city leaders willing to fight for progress. Except when it comes to historic preservation. That oversight is inexcusable.

Snyder, Bing, Obama administration push for action on mass transit in metro Detroit by the end of the year

 

LaHood said the feds are prepared to put up millions to help build a rapid-transit bus system on major routes such as Woodward, Gratiot, Michigan Avenue and M-59 as well as $25 million crucial to support a light-rail line on Woodward, seen as a first leg of a wider rail network.

 

But that money will be available only "if this community can get its act together," LaHood said.

 

For those unfamiliar, there is a separate transportation authority in Detroit than there is in the suburbs. This would create a third authority for the region that would essentially force the two organizations to collaborate, but not merge. It seems impossible to actually merge the two because the suburbs vs. city environment is terrible in Metro Detroit.

 

They might as well build a moat and line snipers on either side of the Detroit city boundaries because they absolutely despise each other.

Regional Transit Authority For Metro Detroit: Bill Passes In Michigan House via Huffington Post

 

Southeast Michigan, home to the city of Detroit, is America's largest metropolitan area without a regional transportation authority (RTA) -- not that supporters of mass transit haven't tried. The Metro Times reports that RTA legislation has been introduced 23 times since the 1970s without any success.

 

SB 909, if signed by the Governor into law, will establish an authority, while SB 911, SB 912, SB 967 and SB 445 would resolve a number of issues related to zoning, funding and cooperation between different transportation agencies. The authority would be run by a board consisting of two representatives each from Oakland, Wayne and Macomb counties, as well as one member appointed by the Mayor of Detroit. It would also include an appointee of the governor who would not have a vote.

 

U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood has said that an RTA must be in place before developers of the M-1 Woodward Avenue light rail line can qualify for $25 million in federal funding.

 

Finally, Detroit will have a regional transportation authority. Governor Rick Snyder is expected to sign the bill.

Finally, Detroit will have a regional transportation authority. Governor Rick Snyder is expected to sign the bill.

 

It's great news, and so long in coming. I feel like raising my hands to the heavens like in your avatar.

Go Detroit!!

 

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20121213/POLITICS03/212130461/LaHood-Federal-funding-track-M-1-regional-transit?odyssey=tab%7Ctopnews%7Ctext%7CFRONTPAGE

Detroit seems like a natural place for surface transit because the streets are so mind-bogglingly wide to begin with.  Look at this photo of Woodward Avenue from 1942.  The streetcars look like little Micro Machines in that enormous street.  There's room left for three lanes of traffic each way plus parking.  With the city so depopulated as it is, there's no reason to bury subways or worry about losing car lanes.  You could do quite a nice New Orleans type transit boulevard with a tree-lined grassy median and still have plenty of space left over. 

 

Of course, that wide street is also a problem as it makes for pretty bad urbanism.  It's so difficult to cross as a pedestrian or a vehicle, and you lose the relationship between both sides of the street.  Also, being as wide as it is, plus the width of the sidewalks, means that you'd need pretty tall buildings on either side for it to feel "right" spatially.  Either way, the status quo obviously isn't working, so something has to be done. 

http://goo.gl/maps/BbrHK

 

Nine lanes. You can take away the center three lanes and install tracks with barriers, and widen Woodward where there are center station stops. Is there a plan out there for how the route would be laid out?

Secretary LaHood will be in Detroit January 18 likely to announce funding for the M-1 Rail line now that a regional transportation organization is in place (the main hold up on funds being allocated).

Hours after LaHood's visit is announced, two sources confirm that $25 Million is coming from the federal government to help fund the largely-privately funded M-1 Rail.

 

http://www.freep.com/article/20130110/NEWS01/130110064/ray-lahood-to-visit-detroit?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

Is there any vision for extending the rail line into Oakland county so that Ferndale and Royal Oak are better linked to downtown? Seems like that really help make this line relevant.

Is there any vision for extending the rail line into Oakland county so that Ferndale and Royal Oak are better linked to downtown? Seems like that really help make this line relevant.

 

Yes, that's been the subject of some planning.....

 

 

The Detroit Department of Transportation's $528 million plan is a nine-mile line from downtown Detroit to the city limits at Eight Mile Road. The Woodward task force has met with DDOT and its hired planners to discuss the status of the city's project.

 

....Some of Detroit's most prominent business leaders, companies and organizations have pledged $100 million toward the rail effort -- something the private sector hasn't done in Oakland County.

 

And politically, there is some skepticism from Oakland County's dominant political force, Executive L. Brooks Patterson. He's said he's supportive of regional mass transit, but noted that there is no consensus on funding.

 

"I'm going to be a hard sell," he said. "I'm not going to block it. I don't have the ability to block it. Some serious research has to be done on where it goes and who pays for it. Right now, none of that is happening."

 

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20110731/SUB01/307319981/next-stop-oakland-suburbs-study-expansion-of-woodward-rail

Big news for the Woodward Avenue Streetcar

 

M-1 plans to break ground on Woodward streetcar project by fall

 

The Detroit News

 

The group building Detroit’s planned 3.3-mile $137 million M-1 streetcar project up Woodward Avenue said Tuesday they plan to start construction later this summer or in early fall.

 

Construction for the streetcar line will occur in two segments with the first segment — Larned to Adams — set to break ground in the coming months.

 

The M-1 Rail Corp. also said it is still deciding whether transit system will be on-wire or off-wire. On-wire cars get their power from overhead wires while off-wire cars are powered by batteries.

 

For comparison, Cincinnati's Streetcar will cost approximately $148 million (I believe).

 

In the article is a very interesting couple of lines:

 

M-1 said once construction starts Woodward will be closed to traffic and pedestrians but detours will be available. Construction is expected to be limited from 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. Sunday through Saturday...

 

...The project is scheduled to begin operations in late 2015 and operate in mixed traffic in downtown Detroit. The group plans to build 11 stations and develop a 12th one in the future.

 

So the project will be closing down Woodward Avenue during the day on Saturdays and Sundays (pure hell for drivers taking that road to downtown). I see this as a huge advantage, though, because they are able to open the route by late 2015 (a full 9+ months sooner than Cincinnati if all goes according to schedule for both projects.

http://detroit.curbed.com/archives/2013/12/late-at-night-workers-begin-installing-m1-rails-utility-systems.php

 

 

And with that, Detroit has started construction on their modern streetcar/light rail line. No fanfare, but construction started last night.

So a bankrupt city can do it but Ohio can't.

to be fair, the entire thing is being funded by private companies (including operations) with some funding from the federal government. I don't believe the city, county, or state is contributing anything except approval. Sad Cincinnati can't get the same corporate support.

So a bankrupt city can do it but Ohio can't.

 

thats why they could do it. desperation forces innovation.

 

M-1 on track for groundbreaking in Detroit

 

The M-1 Rail project is inching closer to reality, organizers say, with a groundbreaking planned this summer that will rebuild a portion of Woodward Avenue and add sleek streetcars.

 

Officials won’t reveal when construction will begin — the road will be completely rebuilt from Adams past West Grand Boulevard. But they say they are down to a couple of vendors to build the streetcars and are close to securing the $140 million of mostly philanthropic money needed for the public-private project.

 

After six years of debate, delays and changes, M-1 Rail officials and others say the 3.3-mile route that once was considered to extend to Eight Mile and connect to other rail lines could be the catalyst to jump-start alternative modes of mass transit and convince a dubious public these types of projects can get done.

 

Piggybacking on Cincinnati's streetcar order is a possibility for Detroit (not mentioned in the article)

The M-1 Rail group just posted an interactive map of construction progress. This would be a great addition to the Cincinnati Streetcar construction.

Moved this from the "Streetcar news outside of ohio" thread.

 

My partner has accepted a position with Amazon in Detroit, which means I'll be moving away from Cleveland next week. While I'm sad to be leaving Cleveland after falling in love with it, I get a nice first hand look at the M1 rail project construction from the deck at our new place. So expect me to post plenty of progress pics in the near future, and if you followed my coverage of the "dazzle the district" project, you know I'll deliver!

 

 

 

You can still see the rails from the days when streetcars still traveled down Woodward. In 2016, they will return!

Thanks for all your Cleveland pics, Winterton!  Sad to hear those will be coming to an end, but I look forward to your Detroit updates. Good luck with the move!

And now....

 

Did they consider an extension of the people mover? I thought the original plan was to have a system feed into the downtown loop.

 

Did they consider an extension of the people mover? I thought the original plan was to have a system feed into the downtown loop.

 

The streetcar will have a connection with the people mover. The line starts at campus martius and terminates just north of the amtrak station.

Transit Riders (TRU) @DetroitTransit  ·  11m

RTA expects to decide "locally preferred alternative" for Woodward rapid transit at next month's board meeting. Hope they Go for the Gold!

Moved this from the "Streetcar news outside of ohio" thread.

 

My partner has accepted a position with Amazon in Detroit, which means I'll be moving away from Cleveland next week. While I'm sad to be leaving Cleveland after falling in love with it, I get a nice first hand look at the M1 rail project construction from the deck at our new place. So expect me to post plenty of progress pics in the near future, and if you followed my coverage of the "dazzle the district" project, you know I'll deliver!

 

 

 

You can still see the rails from the days when streetcars still traveled down Woodward. In 2016, they will return!

 

It's unbelievable how wide Detroit's major streets are. It looks like they could leave it striped for just two lanes and traffic would be fine.

^That was painful. Just...why?

I believe Detroit had a heavy rail subway proposal at one time, but Oakland County pretty much nixed it. Funds were dispersed to other cities in other states. Sound familiar Ohio?

 

To be honest, given the width of Detroit's arterial streets, street-running light rail makes sense. Traffic is not an issue on Woodward and there is space for it. They made the right decision on this project. Woodward Avenue is probably about the same width as San Francisco's Market Street (though the sidewalks aren't as wide), so it can easily support light rail lines on it.

 

Woodward was historically the Market Street of Detroit. With sidewalk widenings (I remember seeing projects like that downtown years ago) and light rail, it can be an active, dynamic street again for pedestrians.

Yes, failed by ONE vote: http://www.detroittransithistory.info/TheCityTakeover.html

^Wow, I didn't even know about that one. I was thinking more the 60's and 70's "modern metro" era that led to heavy rail systems in DC, San Francisco-Oakland, and Atlanta.

 

I remember reading about stuff like this:

 

Ford Rapid Transit Plan Map 1970

http://detroitography.com/2014/02/07/ford-rapid-transit-plan-map-1970/

Well, this isn't surprising...

 

 

Quicken Loans to name Detroit’s M-1 Rail

 

The official name of the M-1 Rail project under construction along Woodward Avenue will be decided by Quicken Loans Inc.

 

Project officials have confirmed the mortgage giant — founded by Detroit businessman Dan Gilbert — secured the naming rights to the 3.3-mile streetcar line “as part of its financial support during fundraising for the project.”

 

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/2015/05/26/quicken-loans-receives-naming-rights-detroit-light-rail/27951535/

Charge up the batteries for M-1 Rail

By Eric D. Lawrence, Detroit Free Press 2:26 p.m. EDT June 1, 2015

 

As construction on the M-1 Rail in Detroit builds momentum this spring, officials are touting the technology that will power the streetcars as highly advanced and the wave of the future for such transportation systems.

 

The line is projected to be operational by late next year, and most of the route is expected to feature streetcars operating on battery power provided by 750-volt rechargeable lithium-ion batteries.

 

"We're pushing the envelope on this really old industry," said Paul Childs, the system's chief operating officer.

 

Aesthetics, it turns out, was a key concern.

 

MORE:

http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2015/06/01/detroit-streetcar-use-batteries/28277789/

I'm missing something here...according to the map I saw the battery mileage is Canfield-Warren, which seems like a small segment compared to the total route. Anyway, if you're interested in lithium battery technology check out my posting on the Dayton RTA thread. We are testing rubber tired trolleybuses with a combination of overhead catenary and lithium batteries for off wire ops.  Or Google daytontrolleys.net  .

I think the battery technology makes sense for avoiding overhead wire clutter at junctions and for other unusual trackage.  But the appearance of overhead wire has improved so dramatically that it shouldn't be considered the issue that it once was. 

Right, wires aren't ugly when combined with certain landscape/street furnishings improvements-especially for a single wire system like M1 or modern Cincinnati streetcars. Batteries make future extensions less costly and more politically acceptable.

Report: Gilbert's Quicken pulls trademark on 'RocketRail', has M-1 Rail name rights

 

By Ian Thibodeau | [email protected]

on December 11, 2015 at 4:15 PM, updated December 11, 2015 at 4:16 PM

 

DETROIT - Crain's Detroit Business reports Dan Gilbert's Quicken Loans trademarked the name "RocketRail" not long after postponing a naming announcement for the M-1 Rail streetcar in Detroit.

 

Officials said in November "The streetcar's name will be announced at a later date as we have some additional steps to complete in the process ... construction continues on schedule as we build toward passenger operations in 2017."

 

http://www.mlive.com/business/detroit/index.ssf/2015/12/report_gilberts_quicken_pulls.html

Detroit's modern streetcar officially has a name

 

Since construction began in 2014, several names have been swirling about for Detroit’s modern streetcar, encompassing a 6.6 mile loop from downtown Detroit through West Grand Boulevard. Today, Quicken Loans pulled back the curtain, announcing QLINE (pronounced Q–LINE) as the name for the new project.

 

Construction on the project is proceeding as planned, and QLINE is expected to begin operation early next year connecting the city in a way not seen in more than a half century.

 

From the Congress Street station downtown to the last station in the North End, Detroiters and visitors from surrounding communities will be able to explore the city in a fast and convenient way.

Oh Danny Boy...

And least it's not "RocketRail"

Lame name, but good for Detroit for getting this built. With growth in millennials at Detroit's core, I expect Woodward Avenue to boom.

^It's already pretty expensive to live in a "good" area of Detroit. The other areas are dirt cheap. But living in Greater Downtown Cincinnati is cheaper than Greater Downtown Detroit.

^The growth in prices at Detroit's core is a sign of how deep the market is in good parts of Detroit. That's why it's more expensive than Cincinnati. Keep in mind there are still a lot of middle class people in Oakland County that can easily afford those rents. Detroit also has what is becoming the best start-up economy in the Midwest, and it is starting to land tech talent from New York City and the Bay. While Detroit has extreme poverty as bad as Toledo, Cleveland, and Buffalo, suburban Oakland County still has a huge population of middle class wealth (heavy on engineering, sales, and marketing talent too). There is no equivalent to that in Ohio. Oakland County is a difference maker considering the huge population. There are a lot of young people up there too...and a good number are moving downtown. I expect prices to continue to rise in Detroit's core, even during the next downturn.

 

The biggest price growth will be along this rail line. I just hope Detroit considers adding additional lines to the system...

Out of curiosity, did they leave any stubs for future extensions anywhere?

^I didn't hear about them doing that, but I could have missed it. I haven't followed it extremely close, and I could easily see casual observers of the Cincinnati streetcar not knowing we created stubs on the northern end.