I believe it wasn't adding the bus lane, but rather the station out front that required demo of the facade, the font bay and the entire building/annex that had been on the corner immediately to the west.  Which, IMHO, was absurd, given there are other stations a quarter of a mile away in either direction.

Does anyone have a picture pre Euclid Corridor?  Here's one During and After, but I'd love to see how it approached the Street beforehand.

 

 

 

 

 

^There are some older photos posted somewhere in the the Euclid Corridor or Cleveland demo thread.

Euclid084

Title 6603 Euclid Avenue, 1954

Subject Euclid Avenue (Cleveland, Ohio)

Description "E. R. Squibbs & Sons, Co.: First Floor of this building at 6603 Euclid Ave., formerly Lake City Dodge and Plymouth Agency, has been remodeled by Benson & Co., contractors, to serve as office and plant of E. R. Squibbs & Sons Co. Alterations, which included instalation of new offices and loading ramps, painting and lighting, cost $50,000. Squibbs, now located at 2603 Payne Ave., will move into the new quarters next week." -- photo verso

Cleveland Press Collection

 

 

 

You can see the building in the background in this 1932 view.....

 

6709 Euclid Avenue - Dunham Tavern

Subject Cleveland

Dunham Tavern Museum (Cleveland, Ohio)

Euclid Avenue (Cleveland, Ohio)

Description Dunham Tavern, 6709 Euclid Ave., is one of Cleveland's oldest buildings and a representative Colonial farmhouse of its pioneer days. Cleveland landscape architect, A. Donald Gray, encouraged the founding of Dunham Tavern Corp. which saved the building from threats of business development.

Date  1932

 

Oh good grief...future generations may speculate that our own military assaulted that building!!

Yes, it was a decent-enough looking building at one time. I'm almost never in favor of anything from before WWII disappearing from Euclid Avenue, but in its present situation this one should go, as fast as possible.  Unless, of course, someone comes along to make it totally respectible again. And they won't.

^If they haven't yet, they probably won't for a while.

 

This is very stale news, but at one point someone at RTA told me there was a very good chance it would be sold to the Dunham Tavern folks and torn down.

 

Total bummer it ever had to turn out this way. If it was in good enough condition to preserve the truncated shell, I imagine the intact whole could have made a very nice conversion to office or lab space or mixed use.

This is probably my own fault, but I don't even know what Dunhams Tavern's purpose is.

This is probably my own fault, but I don't even know what Dunhams Tavern's purpose is.

 

You mean its original purpose? It was a stagecoach inn on the Cleveland-Buffalo highway.

It looks like my wish for the fire-damaged Erie Square shell might be saved after all.... Can't say for sure but it looks like the equipment near it might be connected with actually trying to rebuild and repair it - such as along the western wall. I really do want about every pre-WWII building along Euclid to be saved, and we recently lost the other twin apartment houses.  They could have been spectacular as a home to the elderly.

 

I thought that this building was in the plans to be part of the 2nd Phase of the MidTown Tech park across the street on Euclid??

Heres a good compilation of buildings that have come down in recent years along Euclid (or in this case, severly damaged)... 

 

Euclid Avenue:  What we've lost and what we will probably lose.

http://www.clevelandareahistory.com/2010/09/euclid-avenue-what-weve-lost-and-what.html

 

*At the end, he makes an argument for why we need to keep the building next to Dunam Tavern

Even tho is sucks seeing buildings being domolished and what not but its what needs to happen if this city wants to succeed. Most not if all of the buldings had no use or future plans if you don't like being put down then I suggest you rent it out and do something with it if not its just going to stand there empty making us look more and more like Detroit. I will like to see Euclid filled in which I think is what's going to happen so this city can regain its reputation it once held.

From the aforementioned Cleveland Area History article on demolished buildings on Euclid Ave:

 

"6611 Euclid, the tall industrial building standing here next to the Dunham Tavern, provides real context for the museum. It illustrates how the city grew up around this tavern, and the level of development threats faced by it. It hints at how close the tavern might have come to being demolished itself.

 

This historic structure, 6611 Euclid Avenue, was condemned on May 7. Do we want another vacant lot, or do we want something that contributes significantly to the Dunham Tavern Museum?

 

It's the last of the taller structures of its type along Euclid Avenue, between East 55th and East 105th Streets. Once it is gone, this context will be lost forever. The building is owned by the RTA - in other words, us. We need to make the right decision here."

 

In tandem with what Mr. Busta-Peck mentions about the juxtaposition of 6611 Euclid and Dunham Tavern, wouldn't it be interesting if we could develop 6611 Euclid into a Museum of Industry, or related idea?  Allow this building to continue to represent what was Cleveland in the same manner Dunham Tavern represents an earlier era in Cleveland's history.  Two neighboring monuments of and to the city of Cleveland.

 

By the way, I'm not sure if I took too much of that article, or if this is the correct place for this post, if I blundered on either, please let me know so I don't do it again!  Thanks!

 

Totally agree.

This should not be demolished. Don't count on it surviving though.

The William Tecumseh Sherman bulldozer brigade is probably salivating over this one.

An article in Crains this week about the state of Euclid Avenue.  Euclid Avenue's renaissance

A couple notable things:

 

Doug Price, worries the city will lose its hard-won momentum as a downtown residential market. He said K&D's Residences at 668, a $60 million makeover to 232 apartments of the onetime Taylor department store and Atrium Office Plaza, has a waiting list of more than 300 people (we have heard varying numbers).

 

“We're in danger of stifling that because we don't have quality new product for young professionals,” Mr. Price said.

 

For its part, K&D has revised its plans for the Ameritrust complex, dropping a hotel component and streamlining it to apartments and service retail. The proposal is dependent on whether K&D gets to renew its quest for the skyscraper; Cuyahoga County, which owns the complex, is studying its own office needs before deciding whether to dispose of the skyscraper.

 

Great to hear that something may still be in the works for Ameritrust, but out of all the buildings being considered for hotels, the Ameritrust has one of the best set-ups with the grand rotunda, which is perfect for a hotel lobby/restaurant/lounge.  Where buildings like John Hartness that has a hotel in the works seems a better fit for residential since it lacks the grand lobby space component. 

 

Also, I do worry that we are not yet hearing about new residential conversion or builds downtown.  I know that we are in a stange period, so hopefully something else will be announced soon..

 

Ari Maron, a principal in MRN, sees plotting Euclid's future more simply. He said MRN is pursuing, and close to signing, tenants to fill the three empty storefronts it has left on Euclid. It also is on the hunt for more office tenants for Rosetta Tower, 629 Euclid, named after new anchor tenant Rosetta Marketing Group LLC.

 

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20110801/SUB1/308019999/0/FRONTPAGE   

An article in Crains this week about the state of Euclid Avenue. 

 

A couple notable things:

 

Doug Price, worries the city will lose its hard-won momentum as a downtown residential market. He said K&D's Residences at 668, a $60 million makeover to 232 apartments of the onetime Taylor department store and Atrium Office Plaza, has a waiting list of more than 300 people (we have heard varying numbers).

 

“We're in danger of stifling that because we don't have quality new product for young professionals,” Mr. Price said.

 

For its part, K&D has revised its plans for the Ameritrust complex, dropping a hotel component and streamlining it to apartments and service retail. The proposal is dependent on whether K&D gets to renew its quest for the skyscraper; Cuyahoga County, which owns the complex, is studying its own office needs before deciding whether to dispose of the skyscraper.

 

Great to hear that something may still be in the works for Ameritrust, but out of all the buildings being considered for hotels, the Ameritrust has one of the best set-ups with the grand rotunda, which is perfect for a hotel lobby/restaurant/lounge.  Where buildings like John Hartness that has a hotel in the works seems a better fit for residential since it lacks the grand lobby space component. 

 

Also, I do worry that we are not yet hearing about new residential conversion or builds downtown.  I know that we are in a stange period, so hopefully something else will be announced soon..

 

Ari Maron, a principal in MRN, sees plotting Euclid's future more simply. He said MRN is pursuing, and close to signing, tenants to fill the three empty storefronts it has left on Euclid. It also is on the hunt for more office tenants for Rosetta Tower, 629 Euclid, named after new anchor tenant Rosetta Marketing Group LLC.

 

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20110801/SUB1/308019999/0/FRONTPAGE   

 

I wonder the real reason behind the hotel fall out.  However, that would make a great condo or upscale/upmarket apartment building with the central bank/Ameritrust building as a restaurant.  Use the East Ninth side as retail and convert that parking garage!

 

This could be a HUGE win-win for those wanting a cool apartment with a birds eye view of the city.

I agree..  I liked the idea of a trendy hotel (w style)w/condos/apartments in there so that the rotunda could be appreciated by many. 

I also wish that somebody other than K&D was proposing something.  As has been discussed before, I'm not always confident in K&D's treatment of such spaces that have so much potential.  We really need another game in town.....     

Also, I do worry that we are not yet hearing about new residential conversion or builds downtown.  I know that we are in a stange period, so hopefully something else will be announced soon..   

 

Agreed.  I was thinking that exact same thing the other day. The demand is there.  I hear periodically on this board that the finances of building a new residential complex still aren't there in downtown Cleveland.  I dunno, I get about $1.25/month/sq. ft. for my place in the Warehouse District.  What kind of rental rates do there need to be for someone from out of town to come and build something too?  Is everyone too focused on hotels right now?

Also, I do worry that we are not yet hearing about new residential conversion or builds downtown.  I know that we are in a stange period, so hopefully something else will be announced soon..   

 

Agreed.  I was thinking that exact same thing the other day. The demand is there.  I hear periodically on this board that the finances of building a new residential complex still aren't there in downtown Cleveland.  I dunno, I get about $1.25/month/sq. ft. for my place in the Warehouse District.  What kind of rental rates do there need to be for someone from out of town to come and build something too?  Is everyone too focused on hotels right now?

 

It's the construction cost for a new building that are tight as the credit markets still haven't eased.  With building conversions, there situations where historical issues come into play, bigest one being is the ROI worth all the hoops you need to jump thru?  There are a lot of variables.

Also, I do worry that we are not yet hearing about new residential conversion or builds downtown.  I know that we are in a stange period, so hopefully something else will be announced soon..   

 

Agreed.  I was thinking that exact same thing the other day. The demand is there.  I hear periodically on this board that the finances of building a new residential complex still aren't there in downtown Cleveland.  I dunno, I get about $1.25/month/sq. ft. for my place in the Warehouse District.  What kind of rental rates do there need to be for someone from out of town to come and build something too?  Is everyone too focused on hotels right now?

For something new, you probably need to get $2.50-3/SF for a mid/high-rise building with good finishes, maybe a little less with stick.  At $1.25 you won't be building new product without grants/gov't funding. Its more likely things will be redeveloped, with the Historic Tax Credits and the absence of building costs, you could renovate and probably make something work for $1.60/SF.

In the large costal markets, many rents are in the $3-3.50 range for new product with height and good finishes, and the returns aren't as spectacular as you'd think.

It's the construction cost for a new building that are tight as the credit markets still haven't eased.  With building conversions, there situations where historical issues come into play, bigest one being is the ROI worth all the hoops you need to jump thru?  There are a lot of variables.

Exactly

I live in an underpriced, 850-square-foot, two-bedroom condo in Lakewood and pay about $800 per month to live here, not including utilities. I can certainly see paying twice as much as that in rent that to live in downtown Cleveland. Many people who move here from out of town are astonished to see that current downtown rents are less than that. So I don't think I'm alone in believing that there's a market for paying at least $2/SF for a downtown apartment. If that's the case, we may be close to a market for new-build housing in downtown Cleveland. At least I hope so!!

 

And think of all the places along Euclid Avenue in downtown Cleveland (to bring this thread back on topic!!!) where new construction could be had, such as atop the parking garage at 515 Euclid, on the "Hippodrome" parking lot east of 668 Euclid, or on the lot at the corner of Euclid and the newly extended East 17th Street. Then of course there's the Breuer Tower, assuming the county doesn't want it anymore (and I hope they don't). That would be a phenomenal housing tower. The county should have Weston build for it a new tower on one of Weston's parking lots in the Warehouse District.

 

BTW, while I realize these projects are all inter-related, in that the development of one project (ie: Breuer Tower) affects other downtown projects (county HQ, Board of Education HQ, etc), please focus the county HQ relocation discussion here:

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,1621.0.html

There's been a crane near the fire-damaged western bldg. of the Erie Square complex for over a week. I haven't been able to determine what they're doing there - starting a reconstruction/restoration effort or a demoliltion effort.... I think the boarded-up first-floor windows might be new, though. Would that imply demolition or reconstruction?  The basic brick exterior shell looks pretty good.

Rebuilding the bldg. with exterior as was, with the contemporary piece connecting the two buildings, would be far better than just demolishing it and doing without the housing units there. Can't picture a brand new, modern structure replacing it either.

I took a bit of a visual inventory last night of the available spaces between E 55 and the Clinic.  All I can say is there is years and years and years of lots prime for development there.  Several buildings are for lease and several acres of undeveloped land for sale/lease. 

 

What is the deal with the large lot on the south side of the street just west of the Clinic?  It has a sign that says "Build to Suite" (yeah, that really is what it says).  I'm surprised the Clinic has not swept in and turned that into a surface lot.

 

I was just thinking on the bus this a.m. it's suprising the private houses on the east side of E. 89th, between Euclid and Chester, haven't been "swooped up," too? The next two significant threats I'm aware of are the Church of the Transfiguration, by the Play House, and the Euclid Avenue Church of God at E. 86th. And the Play House complex itself, though the last I heard there were plans to retain it.

Word on the street was the Lerner College of Medicine would be moving over to the Playhouse complex in a few years. The existing Lerner building would become more research labs. On the surface it seems reasonable; if they chop up some of the larger theaters into several smaller amphitheater classrooms and keep some of the smaller, more experimental stages the same it conceivably would work fairly well. 

I wouldn't mind seeing the Playhouse torn down really.  The siting of that building is attrocious.  That said, the Clinic will prbably retain it.

Well, I STRONGLY, STRONGLY disagree with your first statement!!

What exactly is the Lerner College of Medecine?  Is this part of the Cleveland Clinic and located on Carnegie?

 

A simple Google search reveals the following....

http://portals.clevelandclinic.org/cclcm/Home/tabid/4257/Default.aspx

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Clinic_Lerner_College_of_Medicine

http://blog.cleveland.com/medical/2009/03/students_from_cleveland_clinic.html

 

So much information. So close. So easy. So there....

Cleveland Clinic's medical school taking up space in Playhouse Square?  Terrible fit!  It's bad enough the CC keeps swallowing up buildings. and square feet in the E. 79th-E. 107th area, now they might take over some of Cleveland's primary entertainment district?  What is needs is more restaurants and other amenities for those interested in performance pursuits, not a medical school.

^The speculation/assumption is that the the Clinic's med school will move into the PLAYHOUSE [Euclid and 86th], as originaljbw stated, NOT Playhouse Square.

Cleveland Clinic's medical school taking up space in Playhouse Square?  Terrible fit!  It's bad enough the CC keeps swallowing up buildings. and square feet in the E. 79th-E. 107th area, now they might take over some of Cleveland's primary entertainment district?  What is needs is more restaurants and other amenities for those interested in performance pursuits, not a medical school.

 

lafont,

 

Welcome to Cleveland.  The "Playhouse" is a theatre complex located between Carnegie and Euclid near E. 82nd, abutting the Cleveland Clinic's main campus.  It also currently houses the Cleveland Museum of Contemporary Art ("MOCA"). 

 

"Playhouse Square" is the nation's second largest theatre district located in downtown Cleveland on Euclid Ave.  between E. 18th and E.13th.  The Playhouse sold its building to the Cleveland Clinic about a year ago, and is moving to Playhouse Square downtown.  MOCA is leaving the Playhouse next year to move into its new building currently being constructed at the corner of Mayfield and Euclid at University Circle.  Once the complex is completely emptied, it is widely expected that the Clinic will move its medical school (the Lerner College of Medicine) to the Playhouse facility it now owns.  The Clinic owns nothing at Playhouse Square and has no intention of occupying any space in downtown's theatre district. 

 

The Lerner College of Medicine was formed a few years back as a joint venture between the Clinic and Case Western.  It is a niche medical school that focuses on educating physician researchers. 

 

 

^ha

Heightsfan - Yes, I read your post a bit too quickly, though if you had spelled the complex' name correctly - "Play House" - I might have read it more accurately. I can assure you I've been totally familiar with both the [Cleveland] Play House as well as Playhouse Square for the 38 years I've been here....

 

Seems a bit crazy to use such an excellent theater facility as a medical school but at least the theaters provide auditoriums/lecture halls and I really want it all saved.  If that's what it takes....

 

I'm just glad they moved so it's not an issue anymore. 

Heightsfan - Yes, I read your post a bit too quickly, though if you had spelled the complex' name correctly - "Play House" - I might have read it more accurately. I can assure you I've been totally familiar with both the [Cleveland] Play House as well as Playhouse Square for the 38 years I've been here....

 

Seems a bit crazy to use such an excellent theater facility as a medical school but at least the theaters provide auditoriums/lecture halls and I really want it all saved.  If that's what it takes....

 

 

The original post wasn't mine actually.

 

But in any event, it seems you're still upset even with knowledge that the Clinic isn't planning to utilize any space downtown, but rather, an empty theatre complex abutting its main campus.

 

While the Play House facility may well be an excellent theatre venue, I don't really think there is much need for yet more theatre space in this town.  We already have plenty between all the theatres downtown, Karamu, Beck, and Dobama.  And no other theatre company seems to be knocking on the door.  Indeed, the Play House is abandoning the complex because it is simply too big and too much of a drain on their budget sheet.

 

Frankly, the idea of having the Play House stuck in the dead zone between University Circle and downtown never made that much sense, and certainly led to a fair amount of confusion as to the difference between the Play House and Playhouse Square (as evidenced by your earlier post).  The Clinic's anticipated adaptive reuse really seems to the best of what are undoubtedly limited options for the venue.

^It really wasn't a "dead zone" when it was founded, just turned into one due to no fault of the Playhouse.

Actually, if this is to take place I'm quite happy with it! I thought the Play House's move had all sorts of controversy associated with it but the issue now is saving the Small & Rowley/Philip Johnson-designed complex.  So here, here!

Agreed. I believe wholeheartedly that concentrating things into "districts" is one of Clevelands distinct advantages over other cities across the world. The move is something I am happy with.

 

 

Saving the old Play House complex.. well that is just a no-brainer. Its not like the area is so dense that the building doesnt make sense economically, in fact, it seems to be the perfect density. I am positive that Sir Norman Foster would have elected to keep the structure, if it was still in their plans before he (foster) got to them. I will definitely be paying attention to this one.

Density?  The site is 80% surface parking and has no street presence on Euclid.

I think he's saying that given the surrounding level of density (lack of) that it fits in well. 

 

Density?  The site is 80% surface parking and has no street presence on Euclid.

 

So you'd like to tear it down so the site can be 100% parking?

^I don't see where W28th suggested in his post that the facility be demolished.

I wouldn't mind seeing the Playhouse torn down really.  The siting of that building is attrocious.  That said, the Clinic will prbably retain it.

I think he's saying that given the surrounding level of density (lack of) that it fits in well. 

 

 

exactly. I am simply saying that there is no obvious need for a completely different scale of building. there is no reason why someone couldn't use it, based upon what the surrounding area is like. :)

 

that is the Ace Fixtures and Supply Co. bldg

1975 E. 61st

It looks like they may be bringing back the windows -- those big warehouse kinda windows. Possibly applying some new facade too, most likely yuck (if they are)

 

Maybe something on one of the city websites

Noticed construction on the north side of Euclid Ave. between E. 12th and 13th. Anyone have any thoughts on what's going on? Looks like i twas a surface lot.

 

Why don't you just go up to the place and ask somebody there?

I do it all the time.

I doubt they're gonna bite you.

 

 

EDIT: if you live out of state (i.e. an expat), i retract my suggestion.

 

 

 

 

 

I'd say construction workers are often not good sources.

Noticed construction on the north side of Euclid Ave. between E. 12th and 13th. Anyone have any thoughts on what's going on? Looks like i twas a surface lot.

 

The Union Club bought the lot and somehow is deconstructing the surface lot to have better access to the below grade parking garage behind it