OK still taking in the design...but I count 38 floors.

I was prepared for it to be a lot worse, and I am pleasantly surprised. With a cursory glance, it compliments the normative height of buildings on the Mall. I hope they give the tall columns supporting the trellis a little more thought.

Steven Litt just posted these, and a lot more, on Cleveland.com

 

Don't suppose you have a link to the article?

 

I'm seeing some influence of the Ernst & Young tower (not necessarily a bad thing) but as convention hotels go, I'm pleasantly surprised. Not wowed but I've seen some absolute clunkers so here's hoping.

So this will be the second building downtown with a "cut-out". The design is better than I expected, just as others have mentioned.  I'm hoping there are some renderings revealed today showing how it will fit in with the rest of the mall.

The front kinda reminds me of the copenhagen opera house:

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ec/Copenhagen_Opera_House_-_front_view.jpg

 

I'm ok with it. I'd like a more polished rendering and some close-ups, but largely pretty good. Let's get the ground floor right Cleveland!

Hmm.  At first glance I'm not liking this as much as Denver (my favorite) or San Diego. But really, the most important aspect imho is how the building interacts on a human scale, with the surrounding mall and streets. It needs to be inviting, ie not Key Tower II.

i dont have an eye to judge architecture, so i like this.  My only fear is that nasty Justice Center blocking my view of it from the west.

Hmm.  At first glance I'm not liking this as much as Denver (my favorite) or San Diego. But really, the most important aspect imho is how the building interacts on a human scale, with the surrounding mall and streets. It needs to be inviting, ie not Key Tower II.

I agree with half of those hotels, I think Denver is BEAUTIFUL but I believe this looks better than San Diego. I need a 3D design to fully get an appreciation of the design, but so far I like it for the most part (Going back and forth on the podium design).

 

EDIT: Found the 3D design

 

http://photos.cleveland.com/plain-dealer/2013/11/hotelzip.html

Here are a couple 3D renderings:

 

http://photos.cleveland.com/plain-dealer/2013/11/hotelzip.html#incart_photo

The thing I dont like is that the tower will be along the mall side, giving a slim appearance from the lake

Ew! No! I change my mind. The entire wall of the hotel tower faces the park. That is going to feel really weird compared to all the 3 and 4 story buildings surrounding it (with the exception of Key--which I also which had done a podium on the park)

I *want* to like it, but I'm fairly underwhelmed. I feel like the whole podium portion is rather lost from the Mall. The podium concept could help it relate better to the Group Plan, and they totally lost that by having the tower right at the eastern edge of the site.

 

Plus, I really don't like how the angling out portion appears when viewed from the North. Extremely awkward looking to me.

I couldn't tell but will there be retail spaces on the side facing Mall B?

Maybe if you flipped the whole building 180 degrees it wouldn't be so bad (so that the podium portion fronts the Mall).  But having the tower side smack up against the Mall looks, well, awful.  Overall, I find the design pretty underwhelming.

Hmmm  I don't like it. I am disappointed

 

I don't mind the long side facing the mall but I do think the podium's (which looks like six stories, not four) prominent side should face the mall. Perhaps they didn't want more rooms closer to the Justice Center. But I would rather have the main entrance facing the mall, just as the Marriott at Key's main entrance faces the mall, even though its tower is right at the corner of the Ontario and St. Clair.

 

BTW, the tower design is fine. I suspect it will look nicer at night, especially if it is creatively lit. There's little nooks and crannies in there which could lend itself to some subtle decorative lighting features.

Wow, Tough Crowd!  It's not bad, however, I was not expecting an architectural gem.  "High Rise" hotels typically do not impress me as they tend to be long, balconyless, and very slim.  High Rise hotels with a residential component tend to be much more aesthetically pleasing in my opinion. 

 

I do think the brick podium will provide good contrast. 

Again we're not getting enough of a close-up look, but I'm fearing the side facing the mall is too sterile looking.

 

I though the purpose of the podium was the engage the mall and to pay respect to the Group Plan? Perhaps I'm mistaken on that last point, but I'm not seeing this at all.

You know what I'd like to see about this building?  having it filled up regularly.  I think the County is making a mistake by trying to retain ownership here & be involved with the development.  Sell the parcel to a qualified operator or do a land lease & be done with it.  There is no reason the county should be in the hotel business.

You know what I'd like to see about this building?  having it filled up regularly.  I think the County is making a mistake by trying to retain ownership here & be involved with the development.  Sell the parcel to a qualified operator or do a land lease & be done with it.  There is no reason the county should be in the hotel business.

 

The county is not in the hotel business any more than they are in the trucking business (by owning roads) or in the aviation business (by owning an airport). Like trucking and aviation, the hotel could not exist and sustain itself financially without a government sponsor to finance, assume the risk, and own the infrastructure in which a private sector partner could operator its hotel services.

roads & airport are hardly similar investment as hotels.  Plenty of hotels out there being done locally without government sponsorship. 

Man, I'm bummed about the reaction. I really think it's a cool building and something we don't have in Cleveland yet. And it's better than what's sitting on the site currently. I hope more of the 3D renderings come out. I've seen some that are more realistic and less CAD looking and it really is a cool building. Oh well, everyone's entitled to their opinion. Sorry if I hyped it up too much!

Since we're all jumping in - I really like it.  We got some reasonable height and it modernizes our skyline.  The Ontario side is strange the way it's only 4 stories but that is the price we have to pay for the height on the mall side.

I love the design and I can't wait to see this rise in the Cleveland skyline.

roads & airport are hardly similar investment as hotels.  Plenty of hotels out there being done locally without government sponsorship. 

 

And large-scale hotels whose primary function is to support convention centers are often done with government sponsorship, especially in a city like ours which has historically not been a large convention draw and thus is not worth the risk to a hotelier. Thus if the community wants the hotel more than a private company does, then the community has to pay for it and assume the risk. Road and aviation may not be the best comparison. Perhaps major league sports teams are.

 

Point is, the community (through its elected representatives) has decided to build this. That's done. Now how do we get the best hotel possible?

 

Man, I'm bummed about the reaction. I really think it's a cool building and something we don't have in Cleveland yet. And it's better than what's sitting on the site currently. I hope more of the 3D renderings come out. I've seen some that are more realistic and less CAD looking and it really is a cool building. Oh well, everyone's entitled to their opinion. Sorry if I hyped it up too much!

 

Don't be bummed. You know the old saying. Put 30 people and a piece of art in a room and you'll produce 30 opinions from that room.

I think the renderings don't do the finished product justice. With what looks to be a full glass facade I think it will look very modern (even more than Ernst & Youngs), and will be a great addition to the skyline.

 

To touch a bit on what people are saying about the tower facing the mall...I think it would be better to have the podium lakeside. Especially if there is to be a green roof up there.

Plus don't forget a skylift needs to be able to fly off the top down to the lake ;)

Since we're all jumping in - I really like it.  We got some reasonable height and it modernizes our skyline.  The Ontario side is strange the way it's only 4 stories but that is the price we have to pay for the height on the mall side.

 

I agree with an earlier poster--the 4 story setback should be on the mall side to fit with the surroundings.  Otherwise I don't mind this so much.

My 2 cents.... Don't mind the tower, it's contemporary and different than what Cleveland currently has.  I thing the tower should have been either set in the middle of the base or towards Ontario.  If in the middle people could still get a view onto the Mall (those views are probably why it set on a north-south axis).  They should have had more of the podium rooftop facing the mall.  Perfect for a rooftop bar/lounge with ability to mingle and take in great views of the Mall.  At first glance the base seems to have too much going on.  It would look better IMHO with a little less going on.  Overall not too bad at all but I have to wait to see more photo realistic renderings to form a final opinion.  Plus I don't know the full program and locations of different functions as the small rooftop facing the mall may serve as a rooftop lounge.

Since we're all jumping in - I really like it.  We got some reasonable height and it modernizes our skyline.  The Ontario side is strange the way it's only 4 stories but that is the price we have to pay for the height on the mall side.

 

I agree with an earlier poster--the 4 story setback should be on the mall side to fit with the surroundings.  Otherwise I don't mind this so much.

 

 

Agreed.

Otherwise, I like it.

Man, I'm bummed about the reaction. I really think it's a cool building and something we don't have in Cleveland yet. And it's better than what's sitting on the site currently. I hope more of the 3D renderings come out. I've seen some that are more realistic and less CAD looking and it really is a cool building. Oh well, everyone's entitled to their opinion. Sorry if I hyped it up too much!

 

I think you were right to be excited. The design is great! The only thing I'm unsure of is the orientation of the podium. I almost think it would be better if the tower was closer to the MedMart and the podium was facing Lakeside. However, I'm a software engineer and not an architect, so I'm sure they know what they are doing more than I do.

This remimds me of a building you would see in Vancouver or Seattle. Overall I am pleased, but also confused. And I have to echo what others are saying. When I first envisioned this the one thing I was sure about would be for the podium to be facing the mall with the tower backing up against Ontario. I want to hear a good explanation from the architect or Litt why this building seems backwards. It doesn't follow the group plan, at all. The only reason I can think of was to distance the tower from the inJustice Ctr. I hope when design review comes around that question is raised.  Other than that going to have to wait and see more detailed renderings. Because right now the mall view needs work.

I think you were right to be excited as well, Klingaling87. Really tough crowd, haha. I think it's quite good! And like KJP, I would speculate the Justice Center is at fault for having the tower on the mall.

 

Overall, I'm pleasantly surprised.

My 2 cents.... Don't mind the tower, it's contemporary and different than what Cleveland currently has.  I thing the tower should have been either set in the middle of the base or towards Ontario.  If in the middle people could still get a view onto the Mall (those views are probably why it set on a north-south axis). 

 

I always thought towers in Cleveland were oriented on the north-south axis to reduce the sail/sway effect from winds off of the lake.

Having the tower oriented N-S allows rooms on both sides of the building to have a lake view.

 

Could there be an engineering reason that the tower is on the mall side, instead of setback closer to Ontario?

inJustice Ctr.

 

Ha ha! That building sucks and agree the hotel needs to shield itself from the suckyness. Injustice Center should have gotten the Federal Building's stupid shell.

Yikes Cooper Carry.  Not sure where to start here...

It's fantastic.  A 21st century addition to a decidedly post-modern skyline.  In the 3-d rendering, you can easily appreciate the facade's nod to the Burham plan. 

Public Meeting:

See Preliminary Designs for New Convention Center Hotel

and Share Your Thoughts

 

Greater Clevelanders have an opportunity to share their vision for an exciting new project in Downtown Cleveland.

 

The architecture firm, Cooper Carry, will present preliminary hotel designs on Wednesday, November 20th at 5:30pm in the Cleveland Public Library Louis Stokes Auditorium.

 

 

Please register for the event by emailing [email protected] 

 

WHO:             Cooper Carry Architecture Firm

 

WHERE:       Cleveland Public Library

Louis Stokes Wing, Auditorium

325 Superior Avenue East

Cleveland, OH 44114

 

WHEN:         Wednesday, November 20, 2013 • 5:30 p.m. – 7:00 p.m.

 

QUESTIONS + REGISTRATION:[email protected]

 

 

ALL ARE WELCOME

 

Megan E. Jones

Marketing + Communications Director

Why would you build a hotel near the lake front and have no rooms facing the lake?  You could have built this so that half the room were lake view and half the rooms were city view.  This design is awful.

The whole thing needs turned 90 degrees.

^Really?!? Both sides will have lake views.

Why would you build a hotel near the lake front and have no rooms facing the lake?  You could have built this so that half the room were lake view and half the rooms were city view.  This design is awful.

The whole thing needs turned 90 degrees.

 

The whole thing needs turned 90 degrees so then half the building would have lake views?...With the way it was designed you'll have lake shore views from both sides...plus the podium roof will have a huge lake view as well...

 

With the way it was designed you'll have lake shore views from both sides...plus the podium roof will have a huge lake view as well...

:clap:

 

As it is designed, you have a lake view if you turn your head about 45 degrees from every room in the place. Otherwise you either have a view of the Justice Center and the Warehouse District or you have a view of the mall and the buildings on E 9th and E 12th. If the tower was on the west side of the lot, you'd only be able to see the Justice Center and lose most of the views in that direction of the Warehouse District and the lake. I'm not going to say I love the design, but the orientation of the tower makes sense IMO if the goal is to provide decent views to every room.

^Really?!? Both sides will have lake views.

 

Book a room at the DoubleTree which is also oriented north-south. Every room has a lake view.

The more I look at it the more I like it.  I really like the podium and it's nod to the Burnham plan.  If the eastern placement of the tower is due to Keith's reasoning then I understand but I would like to see just a little something added/removed/etc to that east side to maybe make it appear more as if the tower is coming out of the podium.

^^Plus damn near every high rise in Lakewood & Euclid are oriented that way for the same reason.

^^Plus damn near every high rise in Lakewood & Euclid are oriented that way for the same reason.

 

By gosh, you're right!

^^Excellent point

Here's the facade I'm imagining the hotel having.... Cleveland's skyline deserves a sleek tower like this. Obviously the hotel will be shorter than 7 world trade center, but judging from the renderings I like to think this is what the facade will look like.

The more I look at it the more I like it.  I really like the podium and it's nod to the Burnham plan.  If the eastern placement of the tower is due to Keith's reasoning then I understand but I would like to see just a little something added/removed/etc to that east side to maybe make it appear more as if the tower is coming out of the podium.

 

I think it's less a nod than a middle finger.  "Yeah, we see your coordinated building lines, and the architectural rhythm and sense of space it creates.  We're going to do the same, but on the other side of the building.  Ha-ha, f' your Group Plan!" 

 

That or somebody just accidentally rotated the building 180 in each rendering.  Also possible.

 

Other than that the tower is inoffensive boilerplate modernism.