I really really want this to happen:

 

Cleveland software exec launches campaign for lakefront cable-car system spanning downtown

By Michelle Jarboe McFee, The Plain Dealer

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- As public officials and private developers consider plans for Cleveland's lakefront, a local tech executive has a fanciful suggestion: Run a cable-car system along Lake Erie and the Cuyahoga River to bridge gaps between attractions and bring attention to the city.

 

Read more at: http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2013/08/cleveland_software_exec_launch.html#incart_river_default

 

This is their main website: http://www.clevelandskylift.com/

^ WOW! I'm not sure how feasible that is, but I really hope that happens!

Own thread??/

 

That would be unbelievably cool.

I really really want this to happen:

 

Cleveland software exec launches campaign for lakefront cable-car system spanning downtown

By Michelle Jarboe McFee, The Plain Dealer

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- As public officials and private developers consider plans for Cleveland's lakefront, a local tech executive has a fanciful suggestion: Run a cable-car system along Lake Erie and the Cuyahoga River to bridge gaps between attractions and bring attention to the city.

 

Read more at: http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2013/08/cleveland_software_exec_launch.html#incart_river_default

 

This is their main website: http://www.clevelandskylift.com/

 

I wasn't sold until :56 of the video. Tell me that vantage point wouldn't be such a cool site to see in Cleveland.

 

How about putting a station at the Zeppelin dock on top of the Huntington Building? Suddenly the renovation is TOD!

I'm E12 commenter on cleveland.bomb.  I just posted this...thoughts?

 

 

After thinking a little more about this, I wonder if having station specific corporate sponsorship would help buffer at least the operating costs...almost like an "adopt-a-highway"

 

For Example:

 

- Cleveland Browns sponsor their lakefront station

- Horseshoe Casino sponsors their station

- Cleveland Clinic or Philips Healthcare or HIMSS sponsors the Global Center for Health Innovation/Cleveland Convention Center station

 

Other possible sponsors:

- Parker Hannifin ("Global leader in motion and control technologies"...even though mostly hydraulics, electro-pneumatics, etc)

- NASA (presuming funding!)

- Eaton Corp (similar to Parker)

- Sherwin-Williams...a color tower!

 

Plus, having each station unique would make the whole system more interesting....for example, the one station that allows for different directions could be the symbolic center...viewing tower/restaurant/bar?

BTW, there are a number of videos:

 

Here's the proposed route from an aerial view:

 

 

Here's the promotional video:

 

 

Map of the routes:

 

Talk about a really cool idea!! Skylift definitely deserves its own thread.

This company seems to the the opposite of Rock-O-Meter, too.  They look prepared to go all in on this thing in a professional manner.

There's also a Facebook page, which I presume will have the best real time updates on things: https://www.facebook.com/clevelandskylift

There's a link at the bottom of that article to the proposed Cleveland Skylift tram system.

 

Is there a thread for that?

 

http://www.clevelandskylift.com

This company seems to the the opposite of Rock-O-Meter, too.  They look prepared to go all in on this thing in a professional manner.

If so why would they purpose build this in direct competition with the WFL?  I think this is a bad investment.

I'm cautiously intrigued

This company seems to the the opposite of Rock-O-Meter, too.  They look prepared to go all in on this thing in a professional manner.

If so why would they purpose build this in direct competition with the WFL?  I think this is a bad investment.

 

I look at this as a really cool entertainment venue/tourist attraction/novelty rather than competition to a public light rail system. Plus this would cross the Cuyahoga to Edgewater, which the WFL doesn't. The lift would probably offer some stunning views, which for the most part the WFL lacks except for that brief part before Brown's stadium where you can actually see the water.

 

I'm sure any admission price to this would be too high for daily commuters to use, but how fun would it be to park at Edgewater at 8 am on a Monday and ride one of these to work!

 

 

This company seems to the the opposite of Rock-O-Meter, too.  They look prepared to go all in on this thing in a professional manner.

If so why would they purpose build this in direct competition with the WFL?  I think this is a bad investment.

 

I see this complimenting the Waterfront line, since it would be connected in the the Flats East Bank stop.  Plus it actually connects the west bank to the east bank...and in an iconic way.

 

In Vancouver, BC the SeaBus is part of the all-day pass of the transportation system, which connects Vancouver to North Vancouver across the bay.  Not saying I'd want this to be part of RTA, but if government transportation funds end up being used, why not, for example, give a 50% discount for a SkyLift ticket for any RTA pass holding members?

 

I'm cautiously intrigued

 

This.

As for the SkyLift can you imagine riding this thing at night. Flying past the RHall up to the the mall, maybe docking at the new Hotel for dinner. I love this idea but there is no way in hell it could ever be financed. I am trying to think of a source but come up empty. And involving RTA would be a bad idea.

 

BTW I don't know if this warrants its own thread yet considering it is just an idea, maybe the mods can start one. In the meantime conversation should be continued in the thread where the subject was introduced.

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,2768.385.html

 

Own thread??/

 

 

Done.

In before Wiremobile.

 

I'm generally against this, but if you cut the stations in half I could probably lean towards being more ambivalent about the whole thing.

Not to be a nitpicker, but isn't this going to be gondolas?  An aerial tram is mainly a larger cabin. There are just 2 cabins on the cables going to and fro. I was under the impression with their gondola purchase they were going with that. Maybe they'll go with a mix of trams and gondolas?

This company seems to the the opposite of Rock-O-Meter, too.  They look prepared to go all in on this thing in a professional manner.

If so why would they purpose build this in direct competition with the WFL?  I think this is a bad investment.

 

This is intriguing.....BUT...isn't this just an enclosed walkway in a different guise? 

I don't have a problem if this is built to link the Waterfront Line at the as yet unbuilt station at Dock 20 west to Wendy Park, south to the West Bank, west to Lakeview/West 25th, west to a location between Detroit Avenue/Shoreway near Max Hayes. I think an aerial tram can link these access points better than any other mode of transportation can.

Not to be a nitpicker, but isn't this going to be gondolas?  An aerial tram is mainly a larger cabin. There are just 2 cabins on the cables going to and fro. I was under the impression with their gondola purchase they were going with that. Maybe they'll go with a mix of trams and gondolas?

 

Not possible to mix.  Generally a tram is two large cars on the same fixed wire, both dock at the same time just on opposite ends.  A Gondola system, which I am pretty sure this is as well, runs on a loop, usually with the cars detaching from the main wire when in a station.  This allows the cars to slow down for loading/unloading, but travel at higher speeds between the stations.

 

I think this could be doable, especially from the Flats to the west.  I would only want it to go as far east as Voinavich park and def not anywhere near Terminal Tower or the Convention Center. 

I think an aerial tram can link these access points better than any other mode of transportation can.

 

Right. And not only that, this type of transport brings the roofs of buildings into the equation. Which at the very least poses some very unique and interesting scenarios.

Does anyone else see the irony in clamouring for foot traffic and at the same time saying that a pie-in-the-sky idea that moves people around via a ridiculous gondola would be good for Cleveland? How about the city focuses on making the streets livable, walkable, and connected rather than looking up to the sky.

It's really more of a Shelbyville idea ....

 

Simpsons - Monorail

Not to be a nitpicker, but isn't this going to be gondolas?  An aerial tram is mainly a larger cabin. There are just 2 cabins on the cables going to and fro. I was under the impression with their gondola purchase they were going with that. Maybe they'll go with a mix of trams and gondolas?

 

Not possible to mix.  Generally a tram is two large cars on the same fixed wire, both dock at the same time just on opposite ends.  A Gondola system, which I am pretty sure this is as well, runs on a loop, usually with the cars detaching from the main wire when in a station.  This allows the cars to slow down for loading/unloading, but travel at higher speeds between the stations.

 

I think this could be doable, especially from the Flats to the west.  I would only want it to go as far east as Voinavich park and def not anywhere near Terminal Tower or the Convention Center. 

I didn't mean mix as in connect to each other. I just meant trams are point to point. They might feel a tram serves a purpose somewhere like coming across the river at a higher point due to the freighters.  That might work better for a tram. Trams in general are more expensive than gondolas and would need a longer route than a short hop across the river to make them worth it.

Benefit of gondolas is you can bring bikes on them or hung on the outside somehow.

I would see this as enhancing Cleveland's ability to get around by taking away the physical obstacles of the river, train tracks, hills, and highways.

not a bad idea to at least bridge the river and get to edgewater.

 

heck, run it across detroit-superior from the innerbelt to downtown lakewood. the cle transittram!

This may be an exciting pie in the sky idea, but this is a horrible non-sustainable idea. Not to mention an eyesore that would undoubtedly be shifted to the taxpayer..

 

The reason Cleveland is making a comeback is because of realistic endeavors.. Not skytrams. Envision a 10 degree January day with 25 mph winds coming off the lake. Are you climbing in a skytram to ride along an ice laden wire? Heck no! Sell crazy someplace else.

This may be an exciting pie in the sky idea, but this is a horrible non-sustainable idea. Not to mention an eyesore that would undoubtedly be shifted to the taxpayer..

 

The reason Cleveland is making a comeback is because of realistic endeavors.. Not skytrams. Envision a 10 degree January day with 25 mph winds coming off the lake. Are you climbing in a skytram to ride along an ice laden wire? Heck no! Sell crazy someplace else.

 

As far as eyesores on the lakefront go: Cargill Salt, the wastewater treatment plant, the silo thing at the mouth of the river, the Port of Cleveland, Burke, the East/West Shoreways, etc....not a pretty picture, so no sweat off my back if they throw up some wires and mast towers. As far the project being un-sustainable, how about we wait and see what the upcoming feasibility study says about Skylift's prospects. Oh, and 10degree days with 25mph winds probably happen all the time, high in the Alps, where this transportation technology was perfected.

^ yeah i was about to say, these things are used in ski resorts most of all. and as i understand it, are actually a very safe form of transportation. the roosevelt island skylift tram here in ny is very popular with commuters. i imagine the new portland tram is as well. i dont think they are an eyesore either, in fact they look quietly elegant going around.

As far as eyesores on the lakefront go: Cargill Salt, the wastewater treatment plant, the silo thing at the mouth of the river, the Port of Cleveland, Burke, the East/West Shoreways, etc....not a pretty picture, so no sweat off my back if they throw up some wires and mast towers. As far the project being un-sustainable, how about we wait and see what the upcoming feasibility study says about Skylift's prospects. Oh, and 10degree days with 25mph winds probably happen all the time, high in the Alps, where this transportation technology was perfected.

 

One person's eyesore is another's beauty. I think it would be fascinating to have aerial views of these activities which are not easily visible now. Plus it would link to buses on Detroit and the Shoreway (or future streetcars on Detroit) in the vicinity of the growing north end of the Ohio City neighborhood, linking it with Wendy Park, the West Bank (connections to the #81 on West 25th) and the East Bank (connections to the Waterfront Line). I would not want it traveling east of there as it would duplicate the Waterfront Line. I think the proposed route length is too long and it should be a single routing without having branches. Just my opinion based on what I know of mass transit systems, but I have no special knowledge of aerial tramways, gondolas, cable cars, etc. My proposed skylift routing. Keep it short, simple, fewer stations, and use the Shoreway's substructure, as was planned back in the 1990s for another aerial tram concept....

 

 

The lack of street, rail, bike or pedestrian routes in this area hurts its accessibility, yet we always claim we want to develop our riverfronts and lakefront. This would do it without having to build numerous lift bridges which could otherwise cost at least $50 million each. There are several river crossings likely, through active industrial areas, that could/would need to be made to link up these access points and traffic generators.

 

And I was about to say that Cleveland's weather has nothing on the 100+ mph winds that buffet the Alps. That is what the infrastructure can survive, but maximum winds for safe/comfortable operating conditions generally are 50-60 mph or less.

 

A backgrounder......

 

http://web.pdx.edu/~bertini/courses/558/Aerialropeways.pdf

 

 

A video of cable-based transportation in one of the most extreme environments on Earth......

 

People can call it "pie in the sky" if you want to, but I, for one, am glad to see someone in this town with the you-know-what's to go for the gusto. I get so tired of boring people who can't "see the possible", in the words of channel 3. Stop being so damn vanilla. Go big or go home!!

After reading this thread, I could only imagine what people on this board would say if someone proposed the Cuyahoga Valley Scenic Railroad today.

 

* "But it'll compete with the Akron METRO busses between Cleveland and Akron"

* "It'll keep people off the towpath trail where they should be"

* "What a waste of money, it'll only operate a few times a week"

* "What's so scenic about a river valley?"

* "People won't want to ride a train in Cleveland's weather"

 

I look at the skylift as a novel new attraction. Cleveland is lacking things that differentiate it from other comparable cities. Everyone has casinos now, everyone has museums, everyone has large sporting venues. What can Cleveland have that other cities don't? This is the kind of forward thinking we need in the city. Yet, already it's bashed.

A tram from the "rock hall" to downtown was proposed about a decade ago.

For visitors to Cleveland, those bluffs are a huff.

I pitched in $20

 

I had forgotten about this until just recently but there is a gondola system used as public transit.  It just happens to intersect with the Telluride Ski Resort.  It's interesting in that you do not need a lift ticket from the ski resort to ride, and it's free.  It is actually pretty innovative the way it is set up, if you are skiing they scan you as you exit the station house otherwise you can hang out at a restaurant they have at the top of the mountain.

 

Some info

 

I think something like this linking FEB->West Bank->Whiskey Island->Edgewater would be fantastic.

http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/cleveland-skylift

 

First, I am not terribly fond of them using Indiegogo to crowd-fund this. They are using indiegogo's flexible funding, which means they don't have to reach their goal amount to claim the money raised. If they only reach $30,000 dollars of their $500,000 goal, are they going to claim the money anyway? How can you flexibly fund a Skylift? All their rewards start with "If Skylift is built..." which seems like a pretty big if. If they had confidence in this, they should have set up a Kickstarter, which is more strict on actually reaching a feasible goal amount before you can claim the money. And it has a much larger local userbase; indiegogo is more multinational. I can see people investing money in this for a project that never really takes off the ground.

 

Regardless, it sounds cool, I suppose, but I'm skeptical. It would be a neat novelty for a while but, that's all it is really. It's rather redundant. It's not offering many wildly new routes that we can't get to with our current public transportation systems already. It's the same thing with a nicer view. Why give people a reason to use the rapid less? I don't believe this is going to be as "iconic" as they claim or draw people downtown, and I don't know if I want to look out at the lakefront and see tramlines running everywhere.

I think anything that connects Edgewater Park (one of few waterfront gems) with downtown so people can access the water and enjoy it is brilliant.  I think the only competition this gives the WF line is for people getting on the flats east bank.  Anyone riding the train from the burbs trying to get the north coast harbor (at least the majority wouldnt-i think) would get off of a train that is one stop away from detination, take an extra half hour to walk to a tower and get on a skylift.

Welcome, somecledude! Even though we disagree! :)

Welcome, somecledude! Even though we disagree! :)

 

Thanks! I've been lurking for a while, but I thought I'd finally start posting... :-P

^^^Kickstarter is great for raising money toward providing a product, but their rules tend to prevent ideas like this from using it to fund raise toward a big project. This has it's positives and negatives.

 

I'm skeptical of the project, but I can see the attraction.

Sorry, but I think this is ridiculous. No need, little benefit, and arguably an unattractive landmark regardless of how well designed and implemented it is. Can't we just have a water taxi between the new marina at Voinovich Park and Edgewater, and one in the river after the new Casino is built? Plus, we have the Waterfront Line...I mean, I would actually oppose this even if it was built with entirely private funds. It adds nothing and I think it's just a bizarre thing to put in a flat, lakeside city. I've seen escalators in Hong Kong and cable cars in the Rockies, and they made sense because of the terrain, and added a certain charm as well. This might be amusing, but it doesn't make sense.

Water taxis are slow and wont run in winter due to river ice. And to get you around railroad barriers (such as at Wendy Park) would take a long, roundabout trip. Planners have been looking at a pedestrian bridges to otherwise improve access from the West Bank and other areas to the south. This pedestrian bridge is a major issue to capitalize on Wendy Park. An aerial tram might actually be less expensive than the bridge. And there's still the issue of accessing riverside docks from neighborhoods areas like Ohio City where there are significant issues of terrain, highways, water treatment plants, and lack of publicly owned rights of way to the water's edge.

I don't see this as a form of transit per se. Although people surely could use it for their transportation needs.

 

I'm in.

 

 

And these are great points

 

After reading this thread, I could only imagine what people on this board would say if someone proposed the Cuyahoga Valley Scenic Railroad today.

 

* "But it'll compete with the Akron METRO busses between Cleveland and Akron"

* "It'll keep people off the towpath trail where they should be"

* "What a waste of money, it'll only operate a few times a week"

* "What's so scenic about a river valley?"

* "People won't want to ride a train in Cleveland's weather"

 

I look at the skylift as a novel new attraction. Cleveland is lacking things that differentiate it from other comparable cities. Everyone has casinos now, everyone has museums, everyone has large sporting venues. What can Cleveland have that other cities don't? This is the kind of forward thinking we need in the city. Yet, already it's bashed.

 

This is a pipe dream that cities with a lot of private money can accomplish....IT AINT HAPPENIN!

When someone mentioned Telluride, it occurred to me that I have also seen a system integrated with an existing metro.  It was in Barcelona.  I didn't ride it, but I remember it being there.    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transport_in_Barcelona  It mainly links to the recreational facilities at the top of Montjuic so It wouldn't be used by commuters much.  Anyway, they might be another example to look at. 

 

I think we need to explore creative ideas and things that make Cleveland stand out.  That said, I do worry about stealing riders from existing bus/rail lines and having unsightly towers and lines cluttering up the skyline.  If we can make the system so it is attractive an complements RTA perhaps there is something to this. 

 

I am intrigued but not fully supportive yet.   

I rode the Barcelona tramway over the port when I was a teenager. I remember seeing the Soviet ship with the hammer and sickle on the funnel. I was in the Navy and felt a particular sense of umbrage that was misplaced.

I don't see this as a form of transit per se. Although people surely could use it for their transportation needs.

 

I'm in.

 

 

Yeah. I think many on this board are taking this only for its transit value and not taking it for the attraction that it is. People will ride this just to ride it. By building this, you are actually adding value to the attractions that already exist. It's one more thing downtown to pull people in for an extended period. People will end up spending a whole day doing attractions downtown and along the lake. This would also be a great venue for watching the sunset.

 

I'd definitely ride this at least once a month for its entertainment value.

 

But with that said, I just don't see how this can be privately done cost wise without astronomical ticket prices. The full price tag for something like this has to be staggering. Let alone the legal aspects of rights of way, Burke Airport flight path, and purchasing property for the masts that would hold up the skylift at regular intervals..

I agree with those saying this can't really be viewed as public transit. While it certainly can function in part as a public transit system, its main value would be as a tourist attraction and as specialised transport for tourists between a handful of popular attractions. Take Hong Kong's Ngong Ping 360, for example: it's technically run by MTR Corporation as a transit system, and it is used by some local residents, but ~90% of ridership is tourists, as most locals drive or take cheaper public buses.

 

With that in mind, the Cleveland Skylift is going to need private funding to happen. I'd like to see stations at Edgewater, Wendy Park/Whiskey Island, Flats East Bank, Rock Hall/FirstEnergy Stadium, and then extending along the lakefront, terminating near Gordon Park and the Lakefront Nature Preserve, and providing easy access to the under-appreciated cultural gardens and Rockefeller Park from downtown, but this would probably need to happen in a second phase. A bus down MLK could then connect the Skylift to University Circle, providing a scenic alternative to the HealthLine for tourists.

 

Funding this is obviously going to be a challenge, and Indiegogo isn't the way to do it. But with corporate sponsors for each station, sale of extensive advertising for tourist attractions in stations/gondolas, and a recognition of the value of such an attraction by the local tourism industry, it can be possible to make something like this work with private money (at least in other cities). Imagine a resurrected "Cleveland Plus Pass," with unlimited use of the Skylift and RTA, admission to waterfront and UC attractions, discounts on restaurants, etc.