Sweet.  Would be a huge bummer to lose the balconies though.

I've always found that I'm, personally, just as happy with a large french balcony setup.  I hope they consider something like this as an alternative.

It sounds like the scale/design of the building is obviously still being developed, but isn't a huge change from what has been presented before. Which is great.

 

Still holding off full excitement, but this is sounding more and more like it will quickly become reality.

^Unfortunately, I feel like I've been conditioned by a couple decades of fizzled plans to hold off on excitement till I see shovels in the ground.

Which is always a good plan. Things can change in a heartbeat. Even having shovels in the ground isn't a sure bet. Just ask Chicago how they feel about major projects seeming like sure bets at the beginning of 2008.

April 6:

Based on a reliable source I heard from today' date=' the hotel is still part of the project (despite it not being in the Corenet description above).[/quote']

 

 

April 8:

Residential - said the top 5 (I think) floors are being underwritten as apartments' date=' but they'd like to sell as condos if market will bear....Hotel operator is Olympia out of Portland ME [/quote']

 

Good to hear! We need more for-sale housing Downtown. Thanks for the summary. And it looks like we got confirmation on the hotel aspect.

I'd say it really does seem like this will become a reality. 

Sweet.  Would be a huge bummer to lose the balconies though.

 

As to the residential finishes and balcony issue - he said the top floors if they are condos the buyers would essentially be given an allowance for their improvements and they could obviously go beyond that if they want to pay more.  He said if those condos didn't have balconies and a buyer wanted one, they would let them "move back" the exterior wall to create outdoor space - i.e. give up inside space for outside space. 

 

As to the apartments, they haven't designed the finishes on them yet.

April 6:

Based on a reliable source I heard from today' date=' the hotel is still part of the project (despite it not being in the Corenet description above).[/quote']

 

 

April 8:

Residential - said the top 5 (I think) floors are being underwritten as apartments' date=' but they'd like to sell as condos if market will bear....Hotel operator is Olympia out of Portland ME [/quote']

 

Good to hear! We need more for-sale housing Downtown. Thanks for the summary. And it looks like we got confirmation on the hotel aspect.

 

Wonder why no ''pre-construction'' sales for these condos.

^Unfortunately, I feel like I've been conditioned by a couple decades of fizzled plans to hold off on excitement till I see shovels in the ground.

 

Yep. While I enjoy seeing/reading plans, I withhold a greater excitement until I see shovels in the ground. But it's still fun debating the plans and I don't get too disappointed when they don't pan out. It's not my money! :)

Where there any updated pictures of the Nucleus project plans at the meeting?

^Unfortunately, I feel like I've been conditioned by a couple decades of fizzled plans to hold off on excitement till I see shovels in the ground.

 

Yep. While I enjoy seeing/reading plans, I withhold a greater excitement until I see shovels in the ground. But it's still fun debating the plans and I don't get too disappointed when they don't pan out. It's not my money! :)

 

They've certainly spent A LOT of money so far!

 

Where there any updated pictures of the Nucleus project plans at the meeting?

 

Not sure as I don't know that I've seen everything.  He had a PowerPoint that he went through pretty quickly - I think the stacking plan may have been dated late 2015.  They did have a nice rendering or two of the outdoor space, particularly for the residents who will have their own pool and dedicated green space, I think above the garage.  Not sure if that has been shown or not.

I've never heard of ABS Parking, could it be ABM?

 

Interesting about the hotel operator. Their website has the following brands:

• LVX Preferred Hotels
  
• Hyatt Place and Hyatt House
  
• Hilton Garden Inn
  
• Clarion Hotel
  
• Hampton Inn & Suites and Hampton Inn
  
• Holiday Inn and Holiday Inn Express
  
• America's Best Inn & Suites
  

 

LVX Hotels sounds awesome  :-D

A bit disappointed that the retail has been a tough sell, but not entirely surprised. Does national restaurant mean chain restaurant?

A bit disappointed that the retail has been a tough sell, but not entirely surprised. Does national restaurant mean chain restaurant?

 

Possibly, but I would put my money on something "different."  I heard that they are thinking of putting in a Pappadeaux's in there, which is a chain, but definitely not something around here (closest one is in Cincinnati). 

"Tough sell" could mean no demand, or it could mean wrong price point, the latter being less absolute and more likely.

I can understand how national restaurants are needed for national retailers to be interest. It just gives them more of an apples to apples comparison. "Well, we have a store next to National Restaurant in Pittsburgh and National Restaurant is opening in Cleveland, so perhaps we should open there as well." No one wants to be the guinea pig.

I can understand how national restaurants are needed for national retailers to be interest. It just gives them more of an apples to apples comparison. "Well, we have a store next to National Restaurant in Pittsburgh and National Restaurant is opening in Cleveland, so perhaps we should open there as well." No one wants to be the guinea pig.

 

Exactly - the guy from Stark talked about how a retailer can look at an national restaurant like Yardhouse (pretty sure he said Yardhouse isn't a tenant) and say "ok, we know that Yardhouse does $X million a year typically in sales, so that means we can look at this location" where they can't look to say E 4th and know what volume the local restaurants do.

Cleveland apartments rising at 'insane' rate

 

• nuCLEus, a mixed-use tower now planned for 48 stories instead of 51, proposed by Stark Enterprises of Cleveland and J-Dek Investments of Solon, will begin by year-end and is forecast for completion by 2018.

 

It includes 500 apartments and six floors of build-to-suit condos. Look for suites to hit the market in 2018.

 

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20160515/NEWS/160519863/cleveland-apartments-rising-at-insane-rate

 

 

 

I had heard that they are very close to completing all of their financing for this project, which shocked me.

That shocks me too.  I was expecting a massive scaling back and no groundbreaking for years.  Is your source credible?

The Crains article indicated breaking ground by end of year and the only scale back mentioned was 49 floors instead of whatever it had been. 52?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm very happy to see the article still confirming there are plans to have for sale units. I would expect those units to be some of the priciest in the city, if not the region.

Interesting that news of a possible design change for Nucleus comes out, sort of happenstance, in the Crains article - the original plan for Nucleus was actually 54 stories and 647 feet tall (not 52) and if its true that the new design is 48 stories, it could mean a change in height of about 72 feet, based on the number of floors and height originally proposed.  Great to read that there will be residential units for sale. 

I agree that the possible design change is an interesting revelation, CleveFan. But, because of the other possible errors in the article (previous height of 52 stories), I will withhold any reaction until Stark releases an official statement outlining the project in its current form. Taking the aforementioned errors into account, there is also the possibility that the reporter was told that there will be 48 floors containing apartments topped by an additional 6 floors of build-to-order condos, which would total 54 stories as originally presented.

 

Just something to consider.

No news. Just a pic I found of the nuCLEus display at @recon16

I was about to say that the "bridge building" is no longer in the plan, but you can see it if you look hard enough.

Yes, I missed the bridge. It's in the same spot, just not highlighted in blue light. The previous poster is right. It IS hard to see.

From that angle it seems the same height as 200 P.S

 

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

 

 

I was about to say that the "bridge building" is no longer in the plan, but you can see it if you look hard enough.

 

I thought the bridge part is where the hotel was going to be.

I was about to say that the "bridge building" is no longer in the plan, but you can see it if you look hard enough.

 

I thought the bridge part is where the hotel was going to be.

 

Probably. But in a redesign, it could be relocated anywhere.

Stark Enterprises explores auction of downtown Cleveland headquarters building (photos)

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio – Stark Enterprises, a downtown developer with high-rise projects in the hopper, is trying to sell its more modest headquarters office building through an online auction.

 

The Ten-X Commercial website is offering up the property, at 1350 W. Third St., with an undisclosed minimum dollar amount in mind. Bidding will start at $850,000 on July 11, and the auction is scheduled to end July 13.

 

Stark doesn't have to sell - and won't, necessarily, if the price isn't right. But the company, with 60 downtown workers and twice that number in other locations, has outgrown its Warehouse District digs and has decided to test the market.

 

 

http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2016/06/stark_enterprises_explores_auc.html

It seems odd that Weston wouldn't just buy this and tear it down so their project can go to the sidewalk.  Its such a small footprint...  We will see!  I think this is a good sign for NuCleus... with all the doubt surrounding that project hopefully we see something soon as well as on the Weston project.

 

Side note... I know this doesn't belong here but I was looking at the street view on this... does anyone know if there is ANY plan to fix up the hideous 55 Public Sq. garage right across from Stark's building?  That along with the fact that theres a surface lot wedged right into the corner AND the prison on the other corner makes this intersection pretty awful.

It seems odd that Weston wouldn't just buy this and tear it down so their project can go to the sidewalk.  Its such a small footprint...  We will see!

 

Aw, I think this little building has a lot of character! I'd like to see them build around it.

nuCLEus is perpetually 6 months away from groundbreaking.

I think it had a lot of character. I asked this on Cleveland.com but I'm wondering how much of the facade is intact from its original construction.

nuCLEus is perpetually 6 months away from groundbreaking.

 

Pesht II?

New branding?

 

 

New branding?

 

Would seem to indicate that whatever changes they've made to the building design they at least kept the bridge concept in there, which is awesome.

I'm feeling optimistic - we won the NBA Championship - anything is possible! - even that Nucleus becomes reality!  And whatever downsizing may be occurring, from the bits and pieces we're hearing,  it might be the best thing that could happen.  I'd love to see the essence of the Nucleus design maintained with a less bulk-like rectangular box dominating the skyline.  A thinner tower with the same basic design (and height) would solve the problem - with or without the flat roof aesthetic discussed some months earlier in this forum.

If only championships and real estate development were connected -- Cleveland would surely benefit. But the Cavs (or Monsters) winning won't translate into new construction for Stark. It won't even impact Gilbert who owns both championship teams. He's smart enough to know you keep emotions out of business decisions. You don't become a billionaire by reacting.

If only championships and real estate development were connected -- Cleveland would surely benefit. But the Cavs (or Monsters) winning won't translate into new construction for Stark. It won't even impact Gilbert who owns both championship teams. He's smart enough to know you keep emotions out of business decisions. You don't become a billionaire by reacting.

 

There's always one. Lol. Sheesh. Bah humbug I guess

Ground breaking is on track for November.

Ground breaking is on track for November.

 

Hope so.  This project needs to get going ASAP.

gottaplan[/member]  If I recall you have been one of the least confident this project would ever move forward.  So coming from you this is a good sign. Can you share what you learned?

There's always one. Lol. Sheesh. Bah humbug I guess

 

OK, I'm sorry. Gilbert will abandon his business sense and ignore market fundamentals and instead dance through the city throwing C-notes wildly into the air at any developer who utters "Cavs championship" to him.

gottaplan[/member]  If I recall you have been one of the least confident this project would ever move forward.  So coming from you this is a good sign. Can you share what you learned?

 

Speaking with the construction folks from Walsh that are building the tower.  They are moving full speed ahead.  I still think the Stark team will have a major uphill battle to find office tenants, deal with a softening hotel market and lease apartments at a rate even higher than FEB or the Nine...  Certainly not rooting against it though, it's very exciting

OK  thanks. The Nov start date seems to coincide with what smith[/member] reported in April.

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,29504.msg798347.html#msg798347

 

From that post it seems that they are prepared for a 2 year absorption rate, that certainly sounds doable.  As for the retail they probably will be competing with Bedrock/Tower City.  I believe the market is there for the residential, office component.  The hotel operator is the same operator as for Crocker Park,  I don't think we will see anything that upscale.

I actually think the office component is the weakest demand.  Consider that the existing "class A" office buildings downtown are doing leases at $16-$18 psf.  Penton/Aecom, North Pointe, 1111 Superior, One Cleveland Center, etc.  And look at the vacancies they all still have.  Then consider that these new construction buildings require rents of $30-32 psf.  There's not a lot of companies that can afford those rents.  Flats East Bank probably isn't doing any more office for this reason.  Also adding new office at Pinecrest which will compete with this development for tenants, and the North Coast Harbor development is looking for tenants...  where does everyone think these new tenants are coming from?  A few may make the move from the suburbs but not many.  It's a huge swing in a company's financials to double their rent and pay for parking....

I actually think the office component is the weakest demand.  Consider that the existing "class A" office buildings downtown are doing leases at $16-$18 psf.  Penton/Aecom, North Pointe, 1111 Superior, One Cleveland Center, etc.  And look at the vacancies they all still have.  Then consider that these new construction buildings require rents of $30-32 psf.  There's not a lot of companies that can afford those rents.  Flats East Bank probably isn't doing any more office for this reason.  Also adding new office at Pinecrest which will compete with this development for tenants, and the North Coast Harbor development is looking for tenants...  where does everyone think these new tenants are coming from?  A few may make the move from the suburbs but not many.  It's a huge swing in a company's financials to double their rent and pay for parking....

 

I'm not sure if this was mentioned in the lakefront thread, but Dick Pace said that he has one tenant relocating from another location Downtown, and is actively recruiting companies from out of state. He has one HQ that is close to being secured...but I can't remember if that is the company already in downtown or not.