These conversations about demanding 500'+ buildings to balance out the skyline is baffling.

I always thought it would be interesting to tax vacant (surface lot considered vacant) parcels in the central business district at the full height and square footage that zoning allows.

Who said anything about punitive?  There's already a tax.  Anyway, point is I'd bet that Stark met a lot less resistance to building this project on this lot, as compared to his earlier WHD plan.  A taller tower with a smaller footprint has less impact on surface parking.  We here aren't fans of that, but there is a fan base, and suburban commuters are only one portion of it.  All in all, this project is a huge victory so I'm not worrying about what could have been.

 

You said "undesirable."

There is not "resistance" to developing on West 6th.  My sources say this will happen long before Stark builds any new office or residential building for nucleus.

These conversations about demanding 500'+ buildings to balance out the skyline is baffling.

I always thought it would be interesting to tax vacant (surface lot considered vacant) parcels in the central business district at the full height and square footage that zoning allows.

If the city adopted form based code, it may be possible. 

I just want to say how annoying it is to type nuCLEus.

but the pun wouldn't be apparent without the caps

you could also tax land value higher than building value...therefore making it more expensive to own a parking lot than to build a building on it.

you could also tax land value higher than building value...therefore making it more expensive to own a parking lot than to build a building on it.

 

Responding here:

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,29155.msg778412.html#msg778412

In actual nucleus news, i think this is a new brochure with some new renderings. I hadn't seen the laneway rendering shown in here before:

http://www.starkenterprises.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/OH_Cleveland_nuCLEus_iPad.pdf

They do look new.  I like this project, a lot.  Only thing I am a bit skeptical on is closing this section of 4th to vehicular traffic.  It remove a bit of the urban fabric, and only keeps the option of 9th and Ontario as a cut through. From Euclid down to Huron, this would leave 9th and Ontario as the only north south route.  It also doesn't seem inviting to cyclists imho.  I an imagine during evening hours especially, bikes are not very welcome along 4th unless they're being walked.

^ I don't mind it not being friendly to cyclists if it's because that the road is overly friendly to pedestrians.

I think they're insane if they think that "Laneway" is going to be a pleasant place to be.  It will be like dining inside a parking garage.  If they were smart, they would do more "liner residential" along that laneway and along all of East 4th St., if not along Huron, too.

That's a really interesting point. That laneway would have honking, screeching, motors, etc noises not only happening but reverberating throughout the alley. I hope they have a plan for all that noise...

 

And then you have the exhaust. hmmm

My brother's company was selected to install all the appliances in Crocker Park's new residential buildings and was just selected to install all the appliances in nuCLEus as well. If they're at the point where they're selecting people to do installation of things like appliances then that's a good sign that this won't sit on the drawing boards forever then just wither away.

My brother's company was selected to install all the appliances in Crocker Park's new residential buildings and was just selected to install all the appliances in nuCLEus as well. If they're at the point where they're selecting people to do installation of things like appliances then that's a good sign that this won't sit on the drawing boards forever then just wither away.

Sounds like some inside pics too :D

These were Stark's inspiration for nuCLEus's laneways...

 

“If you can design a good street, you have a good city.” #Melbourne's lanes. https://t.co/NXQE0iIZv8 v/@UrbanistOrg https://t.co/tRFggwDj0o

Stark Enterprises apparently doesn't have enough on its plate...

 

Cleveland-based developer has new plan for Purple Hotel site

http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/lincolnwood/news/ct-lwr-purple-hotel-tl-1112-20151109-story.html

Is there growing concern that this project is not going to make it past concept art, or am I just impatient?

Be patient, these things take years.

You're being impatient, yes. Especially since they've already selected suppliers for various aspects of the residential tower which is not something a project that would only make it to the schematic phase would have happening.

 

skyscrapers are giant projects. We have no idea how far along they were when they released those renderings. It's likely it was early in the schematic phase so you still had the entire design process still to go through which, for a building that size, can take a team well over a year alone. Then permitting, financing (which we've heard on several occasions is coming along), contract signing with suppliers, contractors, sub contractors, etc. This isn't a fast process for any building let alone one this scale.

^agreed. I think it will go in some capacity, though I don't believe it will be built as originally designed. Just my thoughts.

Not from what I'm hearing. The tower and hotel bridge were the selling point and is absolutely the goal of the project.

 

I stated upthread that my brother's company was selected to install appliances in the apartments. The information they were given is for the tower as shown previously. They're definitely moving forward with that design.

I wish they put Nucleus on Public Square on that empty lot, then build outward from the location. I agree with earlier posters. We need taller buildings more like Erieview tower height to even out the skyline. We also need to fill in those parking lots/ gaps in the skyline...

 

welp -- at long last it looks like mission accomplished on the majority of the parking lots front. i am still kind of stunned to read about that this morning. and it didnt take moving nucleus to do it.

You're being impatient, yes. Especially since they've already selected suppliers for various aspects of the residential tower which is not something a project that would only make it to the schematic phase would have happening.

 

skyscrapers are giant projects. We have no idea how far along they were when they released those renderings. It's likely it was early in the schematic phase so you still had the entire design process still to go through which, for a building that size, can take a team well over a year alone. Then permitting, financing (which we've heard on several occasions is coming along), contract signing with suppliers, contractors, sub contractors, etc. This isn't a fast process for any building let alone one this scale.

 

It probably also helps them that they won't be breaking ground before the RNC, giving them a built in buffer time to work things out....

Not from what I'm hearing. The tower and hotel bridge were the selling point and is absolutely the goal of the project.

 

I stated upthread that my brother's company was selected to install appliances in the apartments. The information they were given is for the tower as shown previously. They're definitely moving forward with that design.

 

I have my doubts based on information that I can't really expose on here. But nonetheless, if they move forward with the way it's currently designed then great.

Stark has said Melbourne's lanes are his inspiration for nuCLEus. Just saw this on Twitter. Now Melbourne wants to have green lanes. via @MishoBaranovic: http://participate.melbourne.vic.gov.au/greenlaneways

 

This is the proposed green lanes in Melbourne:

 

This is Melbourne's existing lane ways. Think this (or a green lane, above) will work in nuCLEus?

 

BTW, while cruising the streets of Melbourne on Streetviews, I spotted a new building (built since 2009) that looks like it may have also inspired Stark. It's a jenga-style condo building: http://empiremelbourne.com.au/

nucleus melbourne inspiration by Ken Prendergast, on Flickr

 

nucleus melbourne inspiration2 by Ken Prendergast, on Flickr

nucleus melbourne inspiration3 by Ken Prendergast, on Flickr

Wow that does look like NuCLEus...

Nice find.

For what it's worth....was at party Thurs. evening talking with a construction guy from a large local company.  They had been  in some talks with Stark about Nucleus.  Although they will not be involved, this person told me that Stark really has this project set to go.  All the prep work is done, etc.  My friend told me he would bet his last dollar that Nucleus happens and  pretty much as currently scaled.

^That's great to hear. I hope its true and not scaled back in any way. we need the height, density, and variety of uses!

For what it's worth....was at party Thurs. evening talking with a construction guy from a large local company.  They had been  in some talks with Stark about Nucleus.  Although they will not be involved, this person told me that Stark really has this project set to go.  All the prep work is done, etc.  My friend told me he would bet his last dollar that Nucleus happens and  pretty much as currently scaled.

 

Great to hear. I am very much looking forward to seeing something so different, architecturally.

Also firmly in the FWIW category; I met someone at a xmas party who is involved in other developments downtown and they said that NuCLEus was a go as is. FEB phase 3 is also definite, but I'm not sure that's new news.

Also firmly in the FWIW category; I met someone at a xmas party who is involved in other developments downtown and they said that NuCLEus was a go as is. FEB phase 3 is also definite, but I'm not sure that's new news.

 

Someone I know does accounting work for a contractor who is under contract for concrete work for nuCLEus, and also does accounting work for an HVAC contractor who did a lot of work for FEB phase 2... the HVAC contractor is under contract for the Weston Citymark development, and was given some firm timetables.  It certainly appears that all 3 of these projects are going to be worked on to some degree in 2016.  My hopes are high!

 

On another note, there is a nice surge of Cleveland pride as I attend gatherings.  It's nice to see.

Thanks to all you with your insider/Xmas party knowledge. It's great stuff to hear!

Thanks to all you with your insider/Xmas party knowledge. It's great stuff to hear!

 

Ditto. I can't wait for the New Year's parties!!

Thanks to all you with your insider/Xmas party knowledge. It's great stuff to hear!

 

Ditto. I can't wait for the New Year's parties!!

 

I have to get all my information by Christmas... New Year's is pretty uneventful for us.  Dinner and a movie is our usual thing, unless I'm playing keyboards somewhere for $$$.

So when does everyone expect grounbreaking on this project? Will it be before or after RNC. They have to demo the parking garage first.

So when does everyone expect grounbreaking on this project? Will it be before or after RNC. They have to demo the parking garage first.

 

I'm expecting groundbreaking on this project in August - after the RNC.

Here's a blurb about nuCLEus from today's article on 515 Euclid:

 

 

"Ezra Stark said that plans for the 515 high-rise aren't an indication that Stark has lost interest in nuCLEus. "They're completely different flavors," he said, adding that apartments on Euclid Avenue will be less costly to rent than those near The Q. "So it's going to attract a very different person."

 

Stark still is assembling financing for nuCLEus and hopes to start construction on the property – now a parking lot, a dingy garage and a small retail building – after the GOP convention leaves town. Demolition of the existing structures isn't likely to happen before the convention. Construction would take at least two years.

 

"We have tens of millions invested in nuCLEus, and we are for sure doing it," Ezra Stark said, adding that the project team is negotiating with the city over public financing. "It's a much harder lift. It's a much more complex project."

 

http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2016/01/stark_enterprises_enters_joint.html

I know these bid sites aren't very reliable but I haven't seen 'it' on any one before.

I wish the lane ways were actually additional arcades, maybe retractable roof arcade? 

^no mention of hotel in that CMD list of uses. hopefully just an oversight by that source.

I am sure these numbers will continue to change but Stark has an ad in the January SCT that differ from the numbers on the projects website. Website has

150k / Retail - 200k / Office - 1500 / Parking.  SCT ad has 125k / Retail  -  230k / Office  -  2100 / Parking  -  120 room / Hotel.  500 apartments remain the same on both.

First timer here - not an architect, just a "fan" - always great stuff from the regulars here!

Question - Cleveland Planning/Design Commission said they wanted some changes to the look of

Nucleus - that the design was more suitable to a city with many skyscrapers like NY/Chi - it

seems they were concerned about the dramatic contrast between the big 3 and Nucleus.

I'm wondering if/when we'll see the revised design.  Also, I wonder if any of you has any ideas

for how to "tweak" the design, if that is actually happening. 

First I've heard of that.  Did the commission make any suggestions of its own? 

I hope that is not true...  I was downtown the other day and marveled at how sleek and modern the hilton looked....  we need more of that....!!!

Welcome CleveFan!

Thanks Punch - I agree with Lockdog that the Hilton looks amazing (and it looks like we have more of that coming with the Warehouse District Project) - reason for my question:

the January 16, 2015 article by Steven Litt (I believe) quoting Jennifer Coleman on Nucleus design:  "Coleman said in Thursday's and Friday's meetings that she was concerned about what she viewed as the abrupt termination of the tall apartment tower with a flat roof.

 

She said she wanted the designers to consider modifying the design to create more of a visual dialogue with the tops of the city's three existing skyscrapers – the 1931 Terminal Tower, the 1985 BP Tower and the 1991 Key Tower, the tallest U.S. building between Philadelphia and Chicago.

 

"It was one of the first things I thought" about the design, review committee member Thom Geist said at Thursday's meeting. "The top is flat and it just stops. Otherwise, I love it." 

 

So that's why I wondered if there was any word about possible "tweaks" to the design ...

She's not wrong, pointy looks better than flat and the theme is worth continuing.  Aside from that I like the design we've seen so far.

Just don't get it. A private developer is putting up a skyscraper, he should be able to design it as he and his money sees fit. Not to mention in a city that should be begging him to go forward with it. Not my favorite design either but im not building it.

 

---that is all assuming that someone at the planning commission really is having him take a look at changing the design.

Just don't get it. A private developer is putting up a skyscraper, he should be able to design it as he and his money sees fit. Not to mention in a city that should be begging him to go forward with it. Not my favorite design either but im not building it.

 

---that is all assuming that someone at the planning commission really is having him take a look at changing the design.

 

Almost any building built in any city in America is subject to review for the developer to receive it's permits.  Just imagine if Stark wanted to make a 55 story copy of Rhodes Tower or the Justice Center.    Would you let him do that without review?  :laugh: