11 minutes ago, Dev said:

Yes, that's bad, which is my point.

And my point is its not necessarily the city planning staff fault. Some groups are better at working with them, others more combative/reactive vs. proactive.

4 minutes ago, jag said:

And my point is its not necessarily the city planning staff fault.

 

I never said it was their fault. 

On 4/1/2024 at 9:10 PM, Dev said:

Sold in late January last year to a LLC with ties to the Joseph Family. They also purchased the house behind it on Shaw. Looks like they tried to get a permit to build a 3-unit condo, in addition to a garage with a unit above it. If I'm reading it right, it got denied with a lot of questions from multiple departments asking for more information. That application started back in August but their demolition permit did get approved earlier in March. They also filed a permit to build a 3-story home on the Shaw property, with a detached garage that has a unit above. It is approved but it looks like no one has paid the permit fee yet or picked it up.

Update to the property facing Shaw: They sold the property to Michele Stanley Homes back in mid-April which led me to find a listing for the property.

 

In other Hyde Park news, a property on Victoria Avenue, a few doors down from Coffee Emporium is asking for local historic designation. They are applying for it under criteria B, "property is associated with the lives of persons significant contribution to the broad patters of our history." An early tenant at the home was Robert F. Schulkers, who came to national prominence by writing a set of children's novels which peaks during the late 1920's and early 30's. He also branched out into popularity in magazines, comic strips, radio scripts, and 3 movies. There is even a fan club that is still around that seems to be a mix of the Mickey Mouse Club and Boy Scouts.

Developers, residents wrestle with hotel on Hyde Park Square

By Chris Wetterich – Staff reporter and columnist, Cincinnati Business Courier

Sep 11, 2024

 

A group of developers planning a massive, multibuilding project on Hyde Park Square is considering including a high-end hotel in their plans, but residents who have taken a survey are divided on the question.

 

PLK Communities, NorthPointe Group and the Loring Group are planning a reenvisioning of one of Cincinnati’s best-known neighborhood business districts. They have control of most of the property fronting the south side of the square between Edwards Road and Michigan Avenue, plus a roughly 70-space parking lot to the south. In total, the site is more than 2 acres.

 

The developers released the initial results of their survey of residents and stakeholders at a Sept. 10 meeting of the Hyde Park neighborhood council. It showed that of the 490 people who answered whether they favored the developers building a boutique hotel, 247 said “yes,” while 243 said “no.”

 

MORE

Saying no to this is ridiculous. A hotel could only bring business to the area. I think it's a fantastic idea. What would be the downside? I'm sure it's not going to be a cheap place.

9 hours ago, anusthemenace said:

Saying no to this is ridiculous. A hotel could only bring business to the area. I think it's a fantastic idea. What would be the downside? I'm sure it's not going to be a cheap place.

Hyde Parker’s are still salty about the whole Wasson Way apartment project. 

Edited September 12, 2024Sep 12 by Ucgrad2015

1 hour ago, Ucgrad2015 said:

Hyde Parker’s are still salty about the whole Wasson Way apartment project. 

 

And they're happy with their luxury Hampton Inn behind Rookwood.

I support this project but the unfortunate reality is the construction period if it gets approved will be a nightmare due to the amount of traffic flowing through that area.

 

I wonder if stores like Peace Love and Little Donuts will even be able to survive the current road closure for the work occurring on Edwards.

Is there that much traffic in Hyde Park Square?  I've been there a billion times and I've done literal cartwheels crossing Erie Avenue going to that Graeter's.

26 minutes ago, ColDayMan said:

Is there that much traffic in Hyde Park Square?  I've been there a billion times and I've done literal cartwheels crossing Erie Avenue going to that Graeter's.

Agreed. And whatever traffic drives through there should, if anything, be further slowed down. Nobody should be flying through Hyde Park Square at excessive speeds. I'd be fine if construction creates a bit of congestions and slows cars down. 

Keep in mind that there are some residents who are trying to advocate for the Square to be redesigned with 2 of the lanes being closed down, and the remaining roadway converted into 2-way, allowing for a much larger space for businesses, visitors and residents. It will be interesting to see if the developers lean into that at all and/or it makes it into the neighborhood plan.

6 hours ago, ColDayMan said:

Is there that much traffic in Hyde Park Square?  I've been there a billion times and I've done literal cartwheels crossing Erie Avenue going to that Graeter's.

Fair point I should have clarified.  I am more referring to the general area especially observatory which is a major thoroufare from near east side neighborhoods to 71.  Anything that discourages traffic in this area is a good thing.   The square itself is no picnic though at certain times of the day especially school pickup.  Recall there was a pedestrian killed crossing Erie by a metro bus several years back as well.

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2024/10/09/hyde-park-square-preliminary-plans-boutique-hotel.html

 

sorry don’t know how to show a preview of the article

 

 

Edited October 9, 2024Oct 9 by cblhaus

PLK, Loring, NorthPointe release initial site concept for Hyde Park Square

 

The group of developers planning a massive, multibuilding project on Hyde Park Square has revealed an initial site concept based on feedback from their community survey.

 

PLK Communities, NorthPointe Group and the Loring Group are planning a reenvisioning of one of Cincinnati’s best-known neighborhood business districts. They have control of most of the property fronting the south side of the square between Edwards Road and Michigan Avenue, plus a roughly 70-space parking lot to the south.

 

More below:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2024/10/09/hyde-park-square-preliminary-plans-boutique-hotel.html

 

 

wow

I really like the pedestrian arcade. Hopefully it doesn't get VE'd out

$21M high-end apartment building opens on Hyde Park Square: PHOTOS

By Brian Planalp – Staff reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier

Oct 11, 2024

Updated Oct 11, 2024 7:32am EST

 

A new, high-end luxury apartment building has opened to residents on Cincinnati’s East Side.

 

The Skyler, a four-story, 65,000-square-foot apartment building at 2745 Erie Ave., welcomed its first residents Oct. 1. The building bookends the eastern side of Hyde Park Square.

 

The $21 million project is owned and operated by Falling Leaves LLC. Terrex Development & Construction, headquartered in Oakley, acted as the general contractor.

 

MORE

11 hours ago, The_Cincinnati_Kid said:

$21M high-end apartment building opens on Hyde Park Square: PHOTOS

By Brian Planalp – Staff reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier

Oct 11, 2024

Updated Oct 11, 2024 7:32am EST

 

A new, high-end luxury apartment building has opened to residents on Cincinnati’s East Side.

 

The Skyler, a four-story, 65,000-square-foot apartment building at 2745 Erie Ave., welcomed its first residents Oct. 1. The building bookends the eastern side of Hyde Park Square.

 

The $21 million project is owned and operated by Falling Leaves LLC. Terrex Development & Construction, headquartered in Oakley, acted as the general contractor.

 

MORE

Rent at $6,000/month! Yowzas

On 10/12/2024 at 2:00 AM, cblhaus said:

Rent at $6,000/month! Yowzas

Can't wait for the new residents to complain about the firehouse sirens... Just like people who move near Lunken complain.

Who's ready for a laugh!

 

Hyde Park reacts to square development proposal: ‘I’m worried (it) will become Manhattan’

 

Hyde Park residents turned out in force to give their opinions on a major development on that neighborhood’s square, with many having heartburn over the size and density of proposed new apartments and a boutique hotel. But others defended it as a needed refresh.

 

PLK Communities, NorthPointe Group and the Loring Group control most of the property fronting the south side of the square between Edwards Road and Michigan Avenue, plus a roughly 70-space parking lot to the south. They have proposed a 75-room boutique hotel, as well as new apartments.

 

The Hyde Park Neighborhood Council held a special meeting Oct. 29 for residents and stakeholders to weigh in. More than 200 people attended at Hyde Park School, which had to set up an overflow room. In November, the council could vote on whether to support, oppose or be neutral on the preliminary concept, a stance Cincinnati City Council and the Cincinnati Planning Commission are likely to weigh as they consider the project.

 

“I’m worried that Hyde Park Square will become Manhattan (because of the quantity of apartments),” said resident Kathleen Wilkins.

 

More below:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2024/10/31/hyde-park-square-development-proposal.html

 

Manhattan...Kansas?

Community council meetings are so frustrating. People are scared of everything.

20 minutes ago, ColDayMan said:

‘I’m worried (it) will become Manhattan’

lollllllllllllllllllllll

Back in 2006~ they flipped out over developing the long-dead Philips 66 station. 

Update on the PLK proposal from HPNC's Facebook page:

 

Quote

We wanted to provide the community with an update following last night's meeting. After several months of public presentations, surveys, and meetings with our Zoning Committee, the developers asked the HPNC trustees to vote on their proposed concept plan.

In response, the HPNC trustees unanimously passed the following motion:

"The Hyde Park Neighborhood Council (HPNC) supports redevelopment in Hyde Park Square. As discussed at our September monthly meeting, we are open to a development that is 50 feet tall at the perimeter/sidewalk, has upper floor setbacks similar to 3500 Michigan (“Michigan Terrace”; Lululemon), is no taller than 3500 Michigan, and improves the overall parking situation in Hyde Park Square. Unfortunately, the proposed Planned Development is 60 feet tall at the perimeter/sidewalk, has smaller setbacks than 3500 Michigan, is taller than 3500 Michigan, and appears to make the parking situation worse. As a result, HPNC opposes the proposed Planned Development. HPNC wishes for the existing CN-P zoning to remain in effect." 

HPNC is committed to continued dialog with both the developers and the community about this project. We will provide updates to you as they become available in our monthly meetings and email communications .

 

Opposition to the PLK proposal for Hyde Park Square is starting to coalesce behind a Facebook page and website. The website points people towards joining the HPNC and contacting city officials, with an email template to be sent to the planning department. There's also a slide deck dated October 29th, that was previously presented to HPNC. It includes a slide that represents a site concept alternative developed by the HPNC Zoning Committee.

This hotel proposal is so good. It raises the density along the square and so many hotel rooms will be a big boost for businesses. I really hope council can find the courage to support this development.

Can't help but chuckle at the "Save Hyde Park Square" title

One of the posts on the preliminary render of one of the buildings:

"If I didn’t know better I’d say it’s a communist building in Moscow circa 1960 - brutal, cold, out of place both spiritually and architecturally."

Well, the problem is, you don't know any better. It's a massing model.

Three neighborhood groups oppose major Hyde Park Square development

By Chris Wetterich – Staff reporter and columnist, Cincinnati Business Courier

Jan 23, 2025

 

The Hyde Park Neighborhood Council, Hyde Park Square Business Association and the Mount Lookout Community Council all oppose a major $150 million proposed development on the square that would bring new apartments, a hotel and renovate an existing multifamily building.

 

The developers, PLK Communities, NorthPointe Group and the Loring Group, plan a new mixed-use project on 1.78 acres on the south side of Hyde Park Square between Edwards Road and Michigan Avenue encompassing 3434-3448 Edwards Road, 2701-2725 Erie Ave. and 3439-3449 Michigan Ave.

 

MORE

Having the community council in predevelopment meetings telling you to match the height of an existing building at 61 feet tall, then when the development comes in at 65 feet tall as visible from the street only for them to now be against it is absurd and shows that none of these obstructionists are actually acting in good faith during community council and zoning meetings. I like PLK's quote “This inconsistency highlights a recurring pattern of resistance to progress and exclusionary practices by a handful of community members,”, which unfortunately could be applied across the whole city as everywhere from rich to poor neighborhoods resist any progress or new development at all. 

 

We need to update zoning across the city, not just as part of the BRT plans with Connected Communities, as well as make development easier throughout. I have personally been part of 3 projects in the past year that would have brought housing to neighborhoods that need more housing that have been either outright cancelled because of the city not allowing zoning variances like these, or worse because community members brought lawsuits to stall projects that are completely as-of-right with zoning but they simply oppose them.  It's incredibly frustrating and making me start to miss republicans on council like Keating who seemed to be the only one who wanted to increase housing and development in the city. I disagree with the current republican party on about 95% of issues but cutting red tape sure seems great on the local level. 

24 minutes ago, ucgrady said:

Having the community council in predevelopment meetings telling you to match the height of an existing building at 61 feet tall, then when the development comes in at 65 feet tall as visible from the street only for them to now be against it is absurd and shows that none of these obstructionists are actually acting in good faith during community council and zoning meetings. I like PLK's quote “This inconsistency highlights a recurring pattern of resistance to progress and exclusionary practices by a handful of community members,”, which unfortunately could be applied across the whole city as everywhere from rich to poor neighborhoods resist any progress or new development at all. 

 

We need to update zoning across the city, not just as part of the BRT plans with Connected Communities, as well as make development easier throughout. I have personally been part of 3 projects in the past year that would have brought housing to neighborhoods that need more housing that have been either outright cancelled because of the city not allowing zoning variances like these, or worse because community members brought lawsuits to stall projects that are completely as-of-right with zoning but they simply oppose them.  It's incredibly frustrating and making me start to miss republicans on council like Keating who seemed to be the only one who wanted to increase housing and development in the city. I disagree with the current republican party on about 95% of issues but cutting red tape sure seems great on the local level. 

They mention in the article that the Michigan terrace is around the same height but the council just ignored that fact (probably because some of them live in that)

I hope they take this type of project somewhere else.

19 minutes ago, tonyt3524 said:

I hope they take this type of project somewhere else.

 

as in, you don't want them to build this here, or you hope they build projects like this in other places?

 

I think it's a near-perfect development for Hyde Park Square. Fits nicely with the upper levels of density, will add a ton of activity to support businesses in the Square, properly fronts the Square, and staggers the height so it isn't imposing on the rest of the area.

 

Don't get me wrong, it'll be one of the tallest structures, but it's not 20 feet higher than any other building or something. It properly densifies the area. And it's replacing some really bland, ugly 1 story buildings.

I’m assuming a lot of these people are the same ones that tried to stop the ILA Hyde Park project. Let’s hope it’s the same outcome where they’re like we’ll listen to your feedback but it’s getting built as either way.

1 hour ago, ryanlammi said:

 

as in, you don't want them to build this here, or you hope they build projects like this in other places?

 

I think it's a near-perfect development for Hyde Park Square. Fits nicely with the upper levels of density, will add a ton of activity to support businesses in the Square, properly fronts the Square, and staggers the height so it isn't imposing on the rest of the area.

 

Don't get me wrong, it'll be one of the tallest structures, but it's not 20 feet higher than any other building or something. It properly densifies the area. And it's replacing some really bland, ugly 1 story buildings.

 

No, I'm definitely on board with it and do hope they build it here. But I'm saying if they keep getting this opposition and can't get this through, I hope they just go develop something somewhere else (I know they won't). 

Edited January 23Jan 23 by tonyt3524

10 minutes ago, tonyt3524 said:

 

No, I'm definitely on board with it and do hope they build it here. But I'm saying if they keep getting this opposition and can't get this through, I hope they just go develop something somewhere else (I know they won't). 

Well this grouping of developers is specific for Hyde Park, PLK on their own has been busy around the region and developing A LOT in Norwood, and I'm sure part of that has to do with the fact that Norwood is happy to see new development.

Yeah that's fair. I know they sniffed around some property in Deer Park as well last year I believe. 

There are westside neighborhoods BEGGING for developers to invest. They continue to ignore the untapped market that awaits them. Eventually someone will break in and reap the reward.

1 hour ago, TheCOV said:

There are westside neighborhoods BEGGING for developers to invest. They continue to ignore the untapped market that awaits them. Eventually someone will break in and reap the reward.

 

Well technically Northside is on the west side and PLK tried to develop there and were run off by the extremists. I don't see why the story would be any different in Westwood or Price Hill.

1 hour ago, DEPACincy said:

 

 I don't see why the story would be any different in Westwood or Price Hill.

 

Hyde Park and Northside are full of people with too much time on their hands. People on the west side have to work. 

32 minutes ago, Lazarus said:

 

Hyde Park and Northside are full of people with too much time on their hands. People on the west side have to work. 

 

That's a good story, except West Price Hill activists were some of the loudest opponents of connected communities. They showed up to every meeting and screamed about the degradation of their neighborhood.

2 hours ago, DEPACincy said:

 

That's a good story, except West Price Hill activists were some of the loudest opponents of connected communities. They showed up to every meeting and screamed about the degradation of their neighborhood.

To be fair, westsiders associate any apartment development with section 8. Those fears are not ufounded.

19 hours ago, ucgrady said:

Well this grouping of developers is specific for Hyde Park, PLK on their own has been busy around the region and developing A LOT in Norwood, and I'm sure part of that has to do with the fact that Norwood is happy to see new development.

PLK has developed in Oakley & Madisonville too...

15 hours ago, DEPACincy said:

 

That's a good story, except West Price Hill activists were some of the loudest opponents of connected communities. They showed up to every meeting and screamed about the degradation of their neighborhood.

 

Price Hill is nothing but "missing middle".  You know what really loves missing middle?  Section 8. 

 

So you've got the experts waddling over Price Hill waving their fingers at the townies who have been victimized by the Section 8 tidal wave that they need even more of it. 

 

Twenty years ago, Mariemont bought several apartment buildings within its borders and tore them down to prevent a Section 8 influx.  FFWD to 2025 and that place is doing great. 

 

 

45 minutes ago, Lazarus said:

 

Price Hill is nothing but "missing middle".  You know what really loves missing middle?  Section 8. 

 

So you've got the experts waddling over Price Hill waving their fingers at the townies who have been victimized by the Section 8 tidal wave that they need even more of it. 

 

Twenty years ago, Mariemont bought several apartment buildings within its borders and tore them down to prevent a Section 8 influx.  FFWD to 2025 and that place is doing great. 

 

 

 

Did you come back to the forum after throwing a fit because you got banned from all of the facebook groups you regularly troll?

to misquote a famous Galilean, section 8 will always be with you, why not help them get a leg up. there is an old saying that states, give away your possessions and get it back 10 fold. today's treasure is tomorrow's trash. the least of us can walk through the eye of a needle. the most of us are like a dog with a stick trying to get through a door.  

On 1/24/2025 at 1:42 PM, RJohnson said:

to misquote a famous Galilean, section 8 will always be with you, why not help them get a leg up. there is an old saying that states, give away your possessions and get it back 10 fold. today's treasure is tomorrow's trash. the least of us can walk through the eye of a needle. the most of us are like a dog with a stick trying to get through a door.  

Amen. 

Can anyone really present a compelling argument that HP square and its collection of current businesses is as good as it could be?  It's terrible frankly relative to what it could be and has so much potential to be better.  This project could be a real game changer.

A few community comments from tonight's virtual meeting were useful:

 

1. This plan is in conflict with the freshly-minted "Connected Communities"

2. This plan is in conflict from other adopted Hyde Park-specific community documents from recent years.

 

People missed that:

1. the small buildings on the side streets are important for having non-chain businesses now and in the future, but several will be lost (too much concern over the appearance of the development's street wall along Erie Ave.)

2. there is plenty of space in the middle of the block for some sort of large hotel/apartment project without touching most of the existing small buildings along Edwards and Michigan...such a project would not affect the appearance of the actual square