Sept 20, 2020:

On 9/21/2020 at 1:39 PM, ink said:

Gorilla Glue Gardens...

 

 

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2020/10/13/get-a-look-at-fc-cincinnati-s-experience-center.html

 

The FC experience center (whatever that means) has a map showing parking, in orange dots, around the stadium and fc headquarters, the blue dots. What is the orange dot next to Vine street halfway between McMicken and Liberty? I thought the parking garage up there was going between Elm and Central? 

I don't understand where you got that the orange dots were parking locations. I personally think the orange dots are points of interest, and the one up by Vine and Race should be one block west to indicate Findlay Market.

 

The thing they're talking about is just a floor of their headquarters downtown that's intended to sell people tickets. Give them an idea of amenities in the stadium and give them an in person experience where they can get questions answered while the stadium is under construction.

OK that makes sense, and as you said the Findlay dot is in the wrong spot anyway. The caption says, "a map shows where parking and restaurants are located". I guess I only read the word parking. 

On a side note, I love scale architectural models and miss making them. 

On 9/17/2020 at 11:38 AM, GCrites80s said:

So Quibi's not happening then.

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/quibi-weighs-shutting-down-as-problems-mount-11603301946

 

 

So the Quibi jokes can cease?

 

4 hours ago, jwulsin said:

So the Quibi jokes can cease?

 

Chipeleto field

The stadium is looking reallllly IMPRESSIVE. It’s shaping up to be the leagues best in my opinion and that includes the others that are currently under construction. I’m so interested to see the “Fins” installed (next to last picture below) that are wrapping around most of the stadium. When this lighting feature is turned on I think it may blow a lot of people away, I did some research and found it’s not the same fancy lighting used on many other new stadiums such as the new place in Minneapolis, Cincinnati’s will be much more unique and programmable using motion sequencing. If I’m not mistaken Jeff Berding the teams president mentioned early on that it was one of a kind and has only been used in the Middle East I think Dubai (don’t remember exactly). They are about to begin installation soon, I’m thinking we may see some lighting test’s in late December or January. Hopefully we can get a competitive team too lol.

 

Edited November 23, 20204 yr by 646empire

I drove by yesterday, I love how the Choremonster building helps hide the stadium a little, makes it fit in.  Hopefully once the entire build-out is complete, more of it is hidden behind garages with nice facades or buildings.  I haven't seen it from the west side yet, but judging on how it looks now, I feel bad for those residents.

^ I sorta noticed the same thing the last time I drove past the stadium when I was in Cincinnati, it kinda stays hidden on most approaches. I think because it sits back off of central a bit but when you finally see it at least for me it was much larger than I expected and it caught me off guard but not in a bad way. In regards to the west side I actually don’t mind it at all, I believe they are gonna put up some metal paneling then landscaping and signage so it should be fine. I could be wrong but I’m almost certain that side of the stadium will be the entrance for most premium seating, all VIP and expensive suites plus admin-team offices and such.

Edited November 24, 20204 yr by 646empire

I drove by the stadium yesterday after work (relocating back to Cincy). I love the look of the stadium from the south on Central Ave. I know the initial complaints were that it might not fit in with the overall aesthetic of the neighborhood but to be honest, I think the fact that it's so different is actually a benefit. It reminds me of some of the newer Euro stadiums like Tottenham's new stadium in that it contrasts so much with the local architecture. I think it's going to be a really nice stadium and I can't wait to see a game there.

 

The inside looks like an open-air Cintas Center.  

 

44 minutes ago, jmecklenborg said:

The inside looks like an open-air Cintas Center.  

 

Because they both have blue seats? Lol. Not at all. 

Edited November 24, 20204 yr by 646empire

1 hour ago, JaceTheAce41 said:

I drove by the stadium yesterday after work (relocating back to Cincy). I love the look of the stadium from the south on Central Ave. I know the initial complaints were that it might not fit in with the overall aesthetic of the neighborhood but to be honest, I think the fact that it's so different is actually a benefit. It reminds me of some of the newer Euro stadiums like Tottenham's new stadium in that it contrasts so much with the local architecture. I think it's going to be a really nice stadium and I can't wait to see a game there.

 

Definitely and Both Tottenham and Cincinnati’s new stadium are designed by Populous.

 

2 hours ago, 646empire said:

Because they both have blue seats? Lol. Not at all. 

The rake, bowl, and aisle designs are pretty similar.. The midcourt seats at Cintas look a lot like the figure of the Bailey in the WE shots. 

44 minutes ago, zsnyder said:

 

The rake, bowl, and aisle designs are pretty similar.. The midcourt seats at Cintas look a lot like the figure of the Bailey in the WE shots. 

Lol not sure if your joking but if not: Most sports venues “bowl & aisle designs” look similar. In their basic form they are all big circles with seats all around and stairs separating the sections. The things that really separate sporting venues for the most part are indoor v. outdoor or retractable roof, Premium Seating and Suites, the field or court and of course the shell/facades of these structures. All of those things are very different in Cintas v West End Stadium/ MLS Stadium v College basketball arena.

Edited November 25, 20204 yr by 646empire

On 11/24/2020 at 8:58 PM, 646empire said:

Lol not sure if your joking

I did make the comment in passing based on the images at hand, but to dismiss the relevance of even noting the similarities and differences in bowl designs because they're all just basically circles (?) with seats all around and aisles in between is a naively broad generalization and an oddly patronizing response in a forum filled with people that pay attention to building minutiae. 

 

Any image search of stadiums will yield bowl designs that vary wildly from one another.

 

2 hours ago, zsnyder said:

I did make the comment in passing based on the images at hand, but to dismiss the relevance of even noting the similarities and differences in bowl designs because they're all just basically circles (?) with seats all around and aisles in between is a naively broad generalization and an oddly patronizing response in a forum filled with people that pay attention to building minutiae. 

 

Any image search of stadiums will yield bowl designs that vary wildly from one another.

 

I’m sorry your offended by my response it wasn’t meant to be patronizing or dismissive. But I stand by everything I said. When you say “Any image search of stadiums will yield bowl designs that vary wildly from one another” I find that to be nonsense (no offense). Yes all seating bowls are not exactly the same (color of seats, slight variations in shape many times due to capacity or the kind sport the venue is hosting and such) but to say they “vary wildly” is just not true. In my opinion as I said seating bowls themselves and aisle designs are generally very similar in all sports venues across the world. Which is why I pushed back when you used those 2 points as reasons West End Stadium looks like Cintas Center.

 

Edited November 30, 20204 yr by 646empire

Meanwhile, Nippert Stadium is pretty unusual.  The soccer team is moving from a unique stadium to a generic one. 

In what universe is the West End Stadium generic? Or is this more of Jake bashes everything soccer?

25 minutes ago, JaceTheAce41 said:

In what universe is the West End Stadium generic? Or is this more of Jake bashes everything soccer?

 

You nailed it.

1 hour ago, jmecklenborg said:

Meanwhile, Nippert Stadium is pretty unusual.  The soccer team is moving from a unique stadium to a generic one. 

Nippert's one of the coolest stadiums in the country, but at the end of the day, it's UC's stadium, not FC Cincinnati's.

25 minutes ago, thomasbw said:

Nippert's one of the coolest stadiums in the country, but at the end of the day, it's UC's stadium, not FC Cincinnati's.

 

Nobody thought Nippert was cool in the 90s, just like how nobody thought Riverfront was bad.  

 

1 hour ago, thomasbw said:

Nippert's one of the coolest stadiums in the country, but at the end of the day, it's UC's stadium, not FC Cincinnati's.

i visited the Pitt at Univ of Pittsburgh years ago. I thought it was a unique stadium. Situated at the top of a hill as if they dug out a crater. 

1 hour ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

Nobody thought Nippert was cool in the 90s, just like how nobody thought Riverfront was bad.  

 

Nippert in the 90s was great. We would go to games with my uncle who has a guide dog. At halftime, my dad would go up to the guy at the gate and say the dog had to go out to use the bathroom (which was true) but then they would go to the Tangeman center where beers were  like $0.50, pound three or four of them and go back midway through the third quarter. I'd always play a quick game of the Bomberman arcade game. 

3 hours ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

Nobody thought Nippert was cool in the 90s, just like how nobody thought Riverfront was bad.  

 

 

I don't remember much about Nippert in the 90s, but I thought it was cool in the early 2000s. As for Riverfront, lots of people thought it was bad in the 90s. I don't know what you're talking about there.

1 hour ago, DEPACincy said:

 

I don't remember much about Nippert in the 90s, but I thought it was cool in the early 2000s. As for Riverfront, lots of people thought it was bad in the 90s. I don't know what you're talking about there.

I think some of the anti-Nippert sentiment came from the fact that the Bearcats football team was horrible and UC made you purchase football season tickets if you wanted basketball season tickets 

In the 80s and first half of the 90s, Cincinnati was a hub of Notre Dame super-fandom.  You'd go into people's houses and the entire place was a shrine to Notre Dame.  Nobody cared about Harvard or Yale - if your kid went to Notre Dame you were the Ultimate ParentTM.  At my Catholic grade school, we were made to watch Lou Holtz motivational speeches in religion class.  

 

The only reason people liked playing at Nippert back then was the novelty of playing on astroturf, which was still an object of intrigue.  It was before anyone heard of turf toe or the mass blaming of astroturf for the world's ills.  

 

 

 

17 hours ago, DEPACincy said:

 

I don't remember much about Nippert in the 90s, but I thought it was cool in the early 2000s. As for Riverfront, lots of people thought it was bad in the 90s. I don't know what you're talking about there.

Once they did this to Riverfront it was a great baseball stadium. They could have left it like that for a few years

 

^When KC & The Sunshine Band played after a Reds game in 1999, two 200-member conga lines formed on the red seats and after 5 minutes of steady progress toward a Casey Jones showdown met more or less directly above those pile drivers.  After a moment of confusion, one of the conga lines made an about face, and the combined 400-member conga line continued in a counter-clockwise direction for the remainder of the performance.  People were throwing paper cups, lids, napkins, and those things that hold 4 cups off the upper deck onto the blue seat people the whole time.  Like for 20+ minutes.  Security was helpless to stop it . It was one of the wildest out-of-control displays of mob behavior I've ever witnessed.  I mean, like 10,000+ people were either dancing in their seats, participating in one of history's largest spontaneous conga lines, or actively throwing every piece of garbage on the upper deck on to the helpless people below.   It was in danger of becoming that village in England that danced to death.  

 

Nothing like that can happen today because of phones.  It's not legendary either because seemingly zero documentation of it exists, unlike the Disco Sucks thing in Chicago.  

 

OK.

 

Let's keep this on topic

I'll throw a snowy (bad quality) FCC pic to bring it back on topic: 

Riverfront was a dump cookie cutter multi-fuction stadium from the 70s.  Great American is a huge upgrade.  Nippert is a cool old stadium with a great atmosphere, but it's awful to be there when sold out.  You can barely walk around the concourses because they're too small.  Then you get to be crammed on bleachers with no backs. FCC's new stadium will be a huge upgrade in every way since it's actually being built for soccer.  

FC Cincinnati kicks in for West End affordable housing

 

FC Cincinnati has donated hundreds of thousands of dollars to boost affordable housing in the West End where it is building its new stadium.

 

More below:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2020/12/03/fc-cincinnati-kicks-in-for-west-end-affordable-hou.html

 

Thousands!

What a joke FC.

I also think they should donate more money and do more for the community's at-risk populations. I also think the team was wholly irresponsible for what they did to secure the stadium site. I also bet the team lost millions of dollars this year with the lack of attendance at stadiums. But I understand mocking the team is cool

These contributions are good, but ultimately the team needs to make a major contribution towards finishing the construction of CityWest.

 

Due to all of the vacant lots and incomplete sidewalks in this area, it still feels like a Drees subdivision that built phase 1 and the clubhouse, but never got around to building phases 2 or 3.

1 hour ago, ryanlammi said:

I also think they should donate more money and do more for the community's at-risk populations. I also think the team was wholly irresponsible for what they did to secure the stadium site. I also bet the team lost millions of dollars this year with the lack of attendance at stadiums. But I understand mocking the team is cool

 

I wonder how many posts there are mocking and attacking the Reds Community Fund or when the Bengals make donations considering those stadium deals? 

4 minutes ago, cincydave8 said:

 

I wonder how many posts there are mocking and attacking the Reds Community Fund or when the Bengals make donations considering those stadium deals? 

It's not just about the money of stadium deals though, Paul Brown knocked down old warehouses, bars and historic building stock yes; but it didn't displace poor and minority residents in a neighborhood with a bad history of displacing poor and minority residents. With FCC, they chose their site to be close to the same historic vibrant neighborhood they proceeded to tear down (the church especially bothered me since it wasn't even on their footprint).

 

Also the stadium deals were such a long time ago all anyone remembers is that it cost a lot, the bars on 2nd street were demolished before many on this board were born at this point, I was 10 in 1998, but this time we're paying attention. Just because people are being critical doesn't mean they hate FCC either. I can wish FCC did more and still support the team just like I root for the Bengals but wish Mike Brown wasn't such an a-hole. 

^ I really do understand both sides. But my problem is with the exaggerated narrative individuals push. So many people talk as tho FC Cincinnati tore down half of a thriving neighborhood to build their new stadium and it’s just not true. Most of the stadium footprint was a former high school football stadium, right? Not homes. Also we all know the neighborhood has been struggling for decades with vacant buildings, crime and no activity. Also especially among people of color I keep hearing them say “why is the city paying for another stadium and not the things the public really needs” but when I inform them that unlike the reds and bengals the stadium it self is actually privately paid for those same people get become quiet and perplexed. That tells me that there is a ton of negative misinformation out there.

Edited December 4, 20204 yr by 646empire

There's also a strange dynamic where a lot of urbanists and liberals I know and am friends with think that sports teams are just play things for the rich and/or brainless entertainment for uneducated people in the rural outskirts of the city. Some think they have no inherent positive impacts on a community. And I think that's complete BS, honestly. Sports teams are cultural entities as much as a symphony, zoo, theater company, music festival, museum, etc. I'm not calling out any specific people here in that observation, for the record.

EDIT: To be clear, there are things sports teams/owners should be doing (and should not be doing) to be better community partners, and those criticisms are very valid. 

5 minutes ago, ryanlammi said:

There's also a strange dynamic where a lot of urbanists and liberals I know and am friends with think that sports teams are just play things for the rich and/or brainless entertainment for uneducated people in the rural outskirts of the city. Some think they have no inherent positive impacts on a community. And I think that's complete BS, honestly. Sports teams are cultural entities as much as a symphony, zoo, theater company, music festival, museum, etc. I'm not calling out any specific people here in that observation, for the record.

EDIT: To be clear, there are things sports teams/owners should be doing (and should not be doing) to be better community partners, and those criticisms are very valid. 

100% agree

12 minutes ago, 646empire said:

^ I really do understand both sides. But my problem is with the exaggerated narrative individuals push. So many people talk as tho FC Cincinnati tore down half of a thriving neighborhood to build their new stadium and it’s just not true. Most of the stadium footprint was a former high school soccer stadium, right? Not homes. Also we all know the neighborhood has been struggling for decades with vacant buildings, crime and no activity. Also especially among people of color I keep hearing them say “why is the city paying for another stadium and not the things the public really needs” but when I inform them that unlike the reds and bengals the stadium it self is actually privately paid for those same people get become quiet and perplexed. That tells me that there is a ton of negative misinformation out there.

You are ignoring the second and third order effects. Building a massive stadium, or any development, is going to change the local real estate market in that community. So the club is not directly kicking people out of their homes but the distortion in the market their stadium caused did kick people out of their homes.

 

The city also raided their emergency fund to give the team $33 million for utility and RoW improvements. So yes, the city isn't paying for the stadium directly but it is spending money to allow it to exist.

1 hour ago, Dev said:

You are ignoring the second and third order effects. Building a massive stadium, or any development, is going to change the local real estate market in that community. So the club is not directly kicking people out of their homes but the distortion in the market their stadium caused did kick people out of their homes.

 

The city also raided their emergency fund to give the team $33 million for utility and RoW improvements. So yes, the city isn't paying for the stadium directly but it is spending money to allow it to exist.

So we should have just left the West End to rot like it did for the previous 50 years?  I guess you also preferred the old OTR? 

 

The team has already given/swapped land it previously owned in the West End to the Port so they can develop it into affordable housing.  That land is likely worth tens of thousands of dollars if not over $100k.  They assisted the very few people who needed to move due to the stadium via financial assistance and help in finding a new home.  They've now donated over $650,000 for West End housing initiatives.  They've donated tend if not hundreds of thousands of other dollars to other West End ventures through their foundation.  That's more money then the West End has likely seen in decades.  All of this while they lost tens of millions of dollars this year by having zero fans at games.  

 

But of course to some of you it's never enough....

 

I'll also add that I think the team should continue to support the West End regularly.  They have done that in the last year and I think/hope they will continue to do that moving forward.  You cold always give more money to a charity/school/shelter/ect, but at some point you sound greedy continuing to ask for more.  

Edited December 4, 20204 yr by Cincy513

5 minutes ago, Cincy513 said:

So we should have just left the West End to rot like it did for the previous 50 years?  I guess you also preferred the old OTR?

Exactly and Thank you for this. I was just about to write the same thing! Lol.

Edited December 4, 20204 yr by 646empire

1 hour ago, ryanlammi said:

There's also a strange dynamic where a lot of urbanists and liberals I know and am friends with think that sports teams are just play things for the rich and/or brainless entertainment for uneducated people in the rural outskirts of the city. Some think they have no inherent positive impacts on a community. And I think that's complete BS, honestly. Sports teams are cultural entities as much as a symphony, zoo, theater company, music festival, museum, etc. I'm not calling out any specific people here in that observation, for the record.

EDIT: To be clear, there are things sports teams/owners should be doing (and should not be doing) to be better community partners, and those criticisms are very valid. 

 

 

38 minutes ago, Cincy513 said:

So we should have just left the West End to rot like it did for the previous 50 years?  I guess you also preferred the old OTR? 

 

The team has already given/swapped land it previously owned in the West End to the Port so they can develop it into affordable housing.  That land is likely worth tens of thousands of dollars if not over $100k.  They assisted the very few people who needed to move due to the stadium via financial assistance and help in finding a new home.  They've now donated over $650,000 for West End housing initiatives.  They've donated tend if not hundreds of thousands of other dollars to other West End ventures through their foundation.  That's more money then the West End has likely seen in decades.  All of this while they lost tens of millions of dollars this year by having zero fans at games.  

 

But of course to some of you it's never enough....

 

I'll also add that I think the team should continue to support the West End regularly.  They have done that in the last year and I think/hope they will continue to do that moving forward.  You cold always give more money to a charity/school/shelter/ect, but at some point you sound greedy continuing to ask for more.  

You are presenting a false dichotomy. Of course the City should not let the West End rot, and no one is asking for that to be the case. There are other options than giving carrots to developers to redevelop massive sections of communities.

1 hour ago, Dev said:

The city also raided their emergency fund to give the team $33 million for utility and RoW improvements. So yes, the city isn't paying for the stadium directly but it is spending money to allow it to exist.

 

15 minutes ago, Dev said:

There are other options than giving carrots to developers to redevelop massive sections of communities.

So you actually believe that the 33 mil the city put up for infrastructure vs. the 150 million dollar expansion fee and the 250 million for the stadium the team put up isn’t a decent deal? The revenue over the coming decades from a new MLS team and surrounding development plus the ticket and restaurant and bar receipts over the next 20 years+ isnt going to be worth it?

Edited December 4, 20204 yr by 646empire