So everyone spoke NY-style and then it stopped because Cincinnati was overrun with outsiders. It's interesting and certainly not like any other place I know of. NYers managed to keep their accent despite giant waves of immigration.

 

It's dying in NY as well though, at least according to the video I posted above discussing Bernie Sanders' Brooklyn accent. Accents, dialects, and even languages often change or die out. Ask those who spoke Latin or old English.

So everyone spoke NY-style and then it stopped because Cincinnati was overrun with outsiders. It's interesting and certainly not like any other place I know of. NYers managed to keep their accent despite giant waves of immigration.

 

It's dying in NY as well though, at least according to the video I posted above discussing Bernie Sanders' Brooklyn accent. No accent, dialect, or language lasts forever. Ask those who spoke Latin or old English.

 

That's a fair point although Brooklyn is getting so gentrified it's becoming Manhattan South. I have a fair amount of people I know who live in places the unwashed gentrified kids wont go to yet like Ozone Park and Howard Beach and their Queens accent is very strong, even with kids.  Same with my Kew Gardens example. Much of The Bronx is the same way.

 

So everyone spoke NY-style and then it stopped because Cincinnati was overrun with outsiders. It's interesting and certainly not like any other place I know of. NYers managed to keep their accent despite giant waves of immigration. Fine with me. I just never meet anyone from Cincy who spoke that way.

 

I don't pretend people from the Great Lakes cities are ECers it's just that they currently sound the closest than other places in the Midwest. I don't think many people would argue with that.

 

I wasn't pretending people from Cincinnati sound like NYer's, I just relayed a study I thought was interesting.  I don't know any Cincinnati people that speak like that either, really, and I wouldn't be the person to argue about any of that with.  The people who did the research would be the ones you would need to argue about it with.  You should read the study, it's actually pretty interesting.

I don't care about an academic study. I lived in Cincinnati for a long time and interacted with hundreds or thousands of people on the east, west and north side. I've been to NY several times. No one in Cincinnati sounds like a NYer. That just sounds totally ridiculous to me.

 

Yes well maybe if you read it and also the explanation I gave you would see that it stated it was dying out by 1995 and hardly existant in the younger generation of that time which was 1995, so only now people that are 70 years or older have it.  So you can dismiss a published academic research paper by the leading linguistic school and research team in America if you want, or just realize you are arguing with something imaginary because you aren't understanding what we were talking about?

 

And also it wasn't saying that Cincinnatians have the same accent that NY'ers have, it said they had the most similar annunciation of NY'ers out of any metro in the USA, and if you read the study you can see the results yourself, and also see that in 1995 only 2 of 16 subjects aged 18-30 had that, 50% of subjects 30-50 had it, and 100% of subjects had it that were 50 or older.  That makes them all 38-50 (only 2 of 16 have it), 50-70 (50% have it), and 70 and older (100% have it), that are living now.

 

If it was as prevalent as the study suggested: Why did it die.

 

For example: I have Taiwanese-American friend who was raised in Taipei then in Kew Gardens, Queens. If I blindfolded you and had her speak English you'd swear she was a fourth or fifth generation NYer. So why is there no more of this NY accent in Cincy?

 

Well, if you read the study, you can see what the researchers said the reason for it was, otherwise I am simply copying what was already in there for you to read freely.

 

But basically, overtime, immigration from the applachian south, black south, and immigration from business, etc. has crowded it out and it has followed what many other regions were seeing at that time which was a westernization of dialects.

 

How is this unique to Cincy? How does it explain that Chicago, Detroit an Cleveland all currently have an affected EC dialect despite larger levels immigration during this period (until about 1970 or so for Cleveland and Detroit). Sounds like the group of NY-style speakers was pretty small to begin with.

 

I honestly don't know.  Your last statement is incorrect as it said about 100% of the Cincinnatians in the older age group had the most similar announciation of "a" to New York City as any metro in the USA.  Like I said, you can read it yourself and the research was well done and answers questions as to why it is unique to Cincy, why it is different from other areas, etc.

 

Cleveland, Detroit and Chicago have the Northern City Vowel Shift which is not what NY has. 

 

I'm not the expert on this, I was just relaying a study I found, so I wouldn't be the one to answer any questions on it, the researchers and experts in the field would be the ones to do that.  But I would be inclined to believe them especially considering they are coming from a prestigious University that obviously has a very esteemed field of linguistics.

 

So everyone spoke NY-style and then it stopped because Cincinnati was overrun with outsiders. It's interesting and certainly not like any other place I know of.

 

It's quite common, historically.  For example, the famed Transatlantic accent is pretty much gone.  Numerous western states used to speak like Texas and now they speak like, totally, like Cah-li-for-nya.  It wouldn't be a surprise that an older Cincinnati accent shifted due to immigration from a linguistically different region.  You can look at New York as an example (Nuyorican and all).

Most people with a Cincinnati accent have been here 100+ years so they have more money and don't work at gas stations, Wal-Mart, and the places where newcomers to the city get the idea that everyone in Cincinnati is a hillbilly.

 

I thought Clevelanders were defensive! Wow.

 

About five years ago Mike Trivisonno called in a few times to Cincinnati radio and declared it a "hillbilly town". 

 

At my cousin's wedding in April I should take some recording equipment, capture some voice samples, and report back here.  These northeast accents are still going strong in Cincinnati, just not at McDonald's and Wal-Mart. 

 

 

 

I don't care about an academic study. I lived in Cincinnati for a long time and interacted with hundreds or thousands of people on the east, west and north side. I've been to NY several times. No one in Cincinnati sounds like a NYer. That just sounds totally ridiculous to me.

 

Yes well maybe if you read it and also the explanation I gave you would see that it stated it was dying out by 1995 and hardly existant in the younger generation of that time which was 1995, so only now people that are 70 years or older have it.  So you can dismiss a published academic research paper by the leading linguistic school and research team in America if you want, or just realize you are arguing with something imaginary because you aren't understanding what we were talking about?

 

And also it wasn't saying that Cincinnatians have the same accent that NY'ers have, it said they had the most similar annunciation of NY'ers out of any metro in the USA, and if you read the study you can see the results yourself, and also see that in 1995 only 2 of 16 subjects aged 18-30 had that, 50% of subjects 30-50 had it, and 100% of subjects had it that were 50 or older.  That makes them all 38-50 (only 2 of 16 have it), 50-70 (50% have it), and 70 and older (100% have it), that are living now.

 

If it was as prevalent as the study suggested: Why did it die.

 

For example: I have Taiwanese-American friend who was raised in Taipei then in Kew Gardens, Queens. If I blindfolded you and had her speak English you'd swear she was a fourth or fifth generation NYer. So why is there no more of this NY accent in Cincy?

 

Well, if you read the study, you can see what the researchers said the reason for it was, otherwise I am simply copying what was already in there for you to read freely.

 

But basically, overtime, immigration from the applachian south, black south, and immigration from business, etc. has crowded it out and it has followed what many other regions were seeing at that time which was a westernization of dialects.

 

How is this unique to Cincy? How does it explain that Chicago, Detroit an Cleveland all currently have an affected EC dialect despite larger levels immigration during this period (until about 1970 or so for Cleveland and Detroit). Sounds like the group of NY-style speakers was pretty small to begin with.

 

I honestly don't know.  Your last statement is incorrect as it said about 100% of the Cincinnatians in the older age group had the most similar announciation of "a" to New York City as any metro in the USA.  Like I said, you can read it yourself and the research was well done and answers questions as to why it is unique to Cincy, why it is different from other areas, etc.

 

Cleveland, Detroit and Chicago have the Northern City Vowel Shift which is not what NY has. 

 

I'm not the expert on this, I was just relaying a study I found, so I wouldn't be the one to answer any questions on it, the researchers and experts in the field would be the ones to do that.  But I would be inclined to believe them especially considering they are coming from a prestigious University that obviously has a very esteemed field of linguistics.

 

So everyone spoke NY-style and then it stopped because Cincinnati was overrun with outsiders. It's interesting and certainly not like any other place I know of.

 

It's quite common, historically.  For example, the famed Transatlantic accent is pretty much gone.  Numerous western states used to speak like Texas and now they speak like, totally, like Cah-li-for-nya.  It wouldn't be a surprise that an older Cincinnati accent shifted due to immigration from a linguistically different region.  You can look at New York as an example (Nuyorican and all).

 

Eh. Ok. I will say that Southern California had a massive growth rate compared to Cincinnati during the Cah-li-for-nya days. Cincy was growing but not at that level. Whatever, Cincy used to sound like Philly, OK.

 

I guess the Transatlantic/Mid-Atlantic accent really wasn't an organic thing. It looks like it was taught by prep schools in the early 20th century to dignify a certain class but wasn't really based on an ethnic group. It died out fast once it went out of style after WWII.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid-Atlantic_accent

 

Most people with a Cincinnati accent have been here 100+ years so they have more money and don't work at gas stations, Wal-Mart, and the places where newcomers to the city get the idea that everyone in Cincinnati is a hillbilly.

 

I thought Clevelanders were defensive! Wow.

 

About five years ago Mike Trivisonno called in a few times to Cincinnati radio and declared it a "hillbilly town". 

 

At my cousin's wedding in April I should take some recording equipment, capture some voice samples, and report back here.  These northeast accents are still going strong in Cincinnati, just not at McDonald's and Wal-Mart.

 

Jesus, if you're going to base Clevelanders on Mike Trivisonno..God help you! That guy has had mental issues for decades.

Oh, I never said it used to sound like Philly.  I'm just saying the idea that older accents give way to newer "immigrant" accents that take out the "old guard" is not uncommon in this country.

That's a fair point although Brooklyn is getting so gentrified it's becoming Manhattan South. I have a fair amount of people I know who live in places the unwashed gentrified kids wont go to yet like Ozone Park and Howard Beach and their Queens accent is very strong, even with kids.  Same with my Kew Gardens example. Much of The Bronx is the same way.

 

The video was saying that even the children/grandchildren of natives to the area do not say "cawwfee" anymore. I do not know enough natives to the area to be familiar with the true situation on the ground. The natives I do know around my age (30) speak with very faint accents, mostly noticeable in the "marry/merry/mary" situation, but don't sound like Bernie Sanders.

What about "corridor" being "cory dawr"?

This thread is getting crazy.

Whatever, Cincy used to sound like Philly, OK.

 

Did they say wooder instead of water? That would be hilarious.

 

It seems like I would have at least spoken to an old-timer in Cincy who spoke with this NY-style accent. Like I said, everyone there just sounded mid-land and on the west side, they had a bit of a drawal due to the Appalachian influence.

I grew up in the north central burbs of Cincinnati, and almost no one in that area has a 'Cincinnati accent'. Other than some low budget car commercials, I never realized there was such a thing as the Cincinnati accent until about high school, where I met several west siders and a few far east siders who had it. It's not wide spread throughout the region, but really concentrated in places where families have been for generations. The west side is kind of (in)famous for being the type of place where the grandparents, parents, and kids all live on the same street or the same neighborhood. They don't move around much, and it was/is an area that did not see much outside infiltration. It makes sense that these old accents would be most pronounced in these areas, and more dissipated in areas of the region that are more diverse. I would imagine the same is true just about anywhere.

Re: Cincinnati accent, I don’t know or care what East coast city it was most similiar to, but my grandparents (and even some of my parents) generation did have a very particular cadence and way of speaking. I’ll give some examples later.

 

Re: decline of accents, I think you guys are ignoring the effects of sprawl, which also coincided with the advent of radio and television. Look at that old black and white aerial photo of the density of downtown, OTR, and the West End. That was probably an accent furnace.

 

 

 

It seems like I would have at least spoken to an old-timer in Cincy who spoke with this NY-style accent. Like I said, everyone there just sounded mid-land and on the west side, they had a bit of a drawal due to the Appalachian influence.

 

You must either not be reading the responses in this thread, or you're purposefully trying to get some sort of a reaction by repeating the same line. No one is claiming that Cincinnatians, young or old, have a NY accent. There are some words and vowel sounds that share vocal similarities to accents in NY and Philly, but of course no one in Cincinnati talks like Ray Romano or something. Just subtle ticks that are definitely different than the plain, standard english you could find in Dayton or Indianapolis or somewhere.

 

I also find the Great Lakes accent interesting too, because there seems to be subtle differences between say, Cleveland and Detroit. Certainly different up in Minnesota. My friend from high school had a girlfriend from the absolute NE corner of Ohio who had an insufferable accent. I mean it was so awful, I could barely stand to hear her talk. She would literally pronounce the word cat like kee-yaaat. Oh my gaaaadddd, etc. People I knew in college from the Twin Cities, or even Chicago, tended to have a bit of the a sound like her, but much more muted. The O was where their accents really came through, though.

I grew up in the north central burbs of Cincinnati, and almost no one in that area has a 'Cincinnati accent'. Other than some low budget car commercials, I never realized there was such a thing as the Cincinnati accent until about high school, where I met several west siders and a few far east siders who had it. It's not wide spread throughout the region, but really concentrated in places where families have been for generations. The west side is kind of (in)famous for being the type of place where the grandparents, parents, and kids all live on the same street or the same neighborhood. They don't move around much, and it was/is an area that did not see much outside infiltration. It makes sense that these old accents would be most pronounced in these areas, and more dissipated in areas of the region that are more diverse. I would imagine the same is true just about anywhere.

 

Right, I don't think the Cincinnati accent has leftover similarities to New York/Philly accents because it has had outside influences over the years, I think it's precisely the opposite. Cincinnati's population growth began about two decades prior to most other inland cities, which likely means more of Cincinnati's later growth was due to local births rather than relocations from elsewhere.  This would explain why anyone who has the Cincinnati accent likely has family that's been around town for a few generations. Pittsburgh followed a similar growth pattern, though not as quick a rate early on, which is why it, too, has a somewhat strange local accent.

I see most of you enjoyed the presentation.

:D

 

I had a difficult time convincing my class that we had accents, but they don't get it because they've never really had it pointed out to them. You may be surprised but younger generations have heavy accents. My English teacher had a very thick accent, but one thing about Cleveland is that we're very verbal with our nose. So we're nasal.

 

Pronounce cot the normal way and then pinch your nose and say it again. Caught and Cot sound the exact same here. Its super weird.

 

As I was researching this project I was pointing out my own Vowel Shifted accent and I was astonished. I proved to myself, that I had an accent. I was genuinely happy and weirded out at the same time. Real trouble goes to convincing a class of 28 + 1 to know that they have an accent similar to the Northern Cities Vowel Shift. I got a C on the project; not too happy about that because I put my heart and soul into this. It's well put together and I thought I'd friggin ace it, but I guess it wasn't up for the chase.

I grew up in the north central burbs of Cincinnati, and almost no one in that area has a 'Cincinnati accent'. Other than some low budget car commercials, I never realized there was such a thing as the Cincinnati accent until about high school, where I met several west siders and a few far east siders who had it. It's not wide spread throughout the region, but really concentrated in places where families have been for generations. The west side is kind of (in)famous for being the type of place where the grandparents, parents, and kids all live on the same street or the same neighborhood. They don't move around much, and it was/is an area that did not see much outside infiltration. It makes sense that these old accents would be most pronounced in these areas, and more dissipated in areas of the region that are more diverse. I would imagine the same is true just about anywhere.

 

Yeah, the 'Dales, Wyoming, Forest Park, Woodlawn et. al. don't get to join in many Cincinnati Reindeer Games like White Oak and Terrace Park do.

 

The Middle Side

I don't know anyone who pronounces cot and caught the same.

I don't know anyone who pronounces cot and caught the same.

 

...I’m from Cleveland and I say them exactly the same

I don't know anyone who pronounces cot and caught the same.

 

You do now!  ME!!!!!!!!!!!!

Iron Maiden can't be fought; Iron Maiden can't be sought. Iron Maiden can be sots, though.

^^ I'm trying to understand this one.  So do you guys say you "cot the ball", or that you "lay down on a caught"?

They're pronounced the same. Such as the Caught/Cot merger, you could either say normally "He Caught the ball," but shift prone regions may say "He Cot the ball". Subtle difference here.

 

BUT if you're talking about a Cot, like "I'm lying out a Caught," it wouldn't make sense regardless... So Cot is just Cot, but Caught is now Cot, and its super weird, sometimes I look at myself like I'm a foreigner. We tend to use our nasal passages for language more often than most.

 

If you wish to replicate this yourself, try flaring out your nostrils and open your nasal passage when you speak. And i'm not saying exaggerate yourself to sound like Leonard from Big Bang Theory.

How would cot and caught be pronounced, if not the same? I’m genuinely stumped trying to think of another pronunciation, other than how Mike Meyers might say it on “Coffee Talk” lol.

We just say Cot instead of Caught. And being that this is American League Baseball Territory we tend to mix this sh*t up. We just cant help it it's just second nature. I sometimes catch myself before I say it, and I always want to say it right, but mind comes over matter in the circumstance and i just say Cot anyways.... I honestly cant explain it.

^^ I'm trying to understand this one.  So do you guys say you "cot the ball", or that you "lay down on a caught"?

 

I'm trying to understand how you would say them differently?  Would the Nasal-A-ccent make it "Cyyaaht" and "Caht?"  Like edale, I'm struggling on that one, man.

Caught rhymes with thought. Cot rhymes with bot.

Caught rhymes with thought. Cot rhymes with bot.

 

That doesn't help.  I say thought and bot with the same ending as well.  Is it (with the nasal A) "Thyyaaaout?" for "Thought?"

 

Or are you all just pranking me?!??! :D

It's the nasal 'O'* in 'cot' and an 'aw' sound in 'caught.' Go to 0:43 and listen for a few seconds.

 

*In the Northeast Ohio/Great Lakes accent there is a nasal 'O' which is just as significant as the nasal 'A' but seems lesser known. Shows up in words like 'job' or 'vodka tonic.' I gahhta go to work at my jaahhhb tomorrow so I can only have one vahhhdka tahhnic.

 

The vowel in (non-merged) 'caught' is like 'aw' as in "aww, poor baby". As opposed to the 'ah' in "aha!" which goes with 'cot'.

There are many German dialects within the modern borders of the country that cannot be understood by other native "German" speakers.  The dialect that came to Cincinnati was very different from the current stereotypical language (and mannerisms) parodied by Sprockets and others. 

 

I'm not sure how good this video is, but the southern German voice in this example is much more staccato and with a somewhat animated annunciation, which sounds exactly how I remember the old Germans speaking in Cincinnati.  If I recorded my two grandmothers who are still alive you would hear this. 

 

At 2:00 you hear a few sentences in a row by the Bavarian girl that have a vaguely Italian sound to them.  Southern Germany is obviously closer to Italy than is the rest of the country so perhaps some of the phrasing made its way over the mountains. 

 

There are many German dialects within the modern borders of the country that cannot be understood by other native "German" speakers.  The dialect that came to Cincinnati was very different from the current stereotypical language (and mannerisms) parodied by Sprockets and others. 

 

I'm not sure how good this video is, but the southern German voice in this example is much more staccato and with a somewhat animated annunciation, which sounds exactly how I remember the old Germans speaking in Cincinnati.  If I recorded my two grandmothers who are still alive you would hear this. 

 

At 2:00 you hear a few sentences in a row by the Bavarian girl that have a vaguely Italian sound to them.  Southern Germany is obviously closer to Italy than is the rest of the country so perhaps some of the phrasing made its way over the mountains. 

 

 

Interesting. Was at the store yesterday and a guy asked me if I was Germany. That was a first. I thought my English was without any noticeable accent. Maybe he was from somewhere else IDK.

Cot = Caht

Caught = Cawt

The vowel in (non-merged) 'caught' is like 'aw' as in "aww, poor baby". As opposed to the 'ah' in "aha!" which goes with 'cot'.

 

See, I use Cot and Caught as "Cawt."  I'm sleeping on a "Cawt" after I "Cawt" a fish at the lake.  The nasal-A-ccent may pronounce "Caht" more notably (which I don't have).  That YouTube video is definitely not how I say "Cot."

All people from the Amrap area say cot and caught the same way. When I moved to No. Va. I did notice that people here drag the au sound in caught more.

 

My wife grew up in DC and she says crayon like crown. Always tease her about that. Not sure where that comes from.

The vowel in (non-merged) 'caught' is like 'aw' as in "aww, poor baby". As opposed to the 'ah' in "aha!" which goes with 'cot'.

 

See, I use Cot and Caught as "Cawt."  I'm sleeping on a "Cawt" after I "Cawt" a fish at the lake.  The nasal-A-ccent may pronounce "Caht" more notably (which I don't have).  That YouTube video is definitely not how I say "Cot."

 

Do you pronounce 'got' like "gawt"? What about 'lot'?

 

These o sounds separate a lot of American dialects, like

horror = whore-er vs.

horror = harr-er

 

The patterns are difficult to nail down. e.g. Both NYCers and Bostonians will say "harr-er", but NYC will say "Bawstin" and Boston will say "Bahhstin"

Do you pronounce 'got' like "gawt"? What about 'lot'?

 

Correct.  Got, Lot, Cot, Caught, all the same for me.

 

Also, I say both whore-er or harr-er.  For example, I''ll say "It's a harr-er picture" but watching a "whore-er show."  I also use pop and soda weirdly...I'll request a soda but drink from a pop machine.  But that's a whole other discussion!

 

I've heard the most famous example of telling someone's accent is "Merry, Marry, and Mary."  I say them all the same but I guess some folks don't?

What about in Cincy the word bagel.  I notice people from the west side and I heard other people say this before, pronounce bagel as bah-gul, where as myself from Iowa and other east side people say bay-gel.

 

I also get crap on how I say milk, root, sack, and call parking garages as ramps.  I guess I call milk "melk" and root as "rut". And sack is what everyone asks at the gas station or grocery store (would you like a sack for that). It's funny because I looked into it and that is known as an Iowan way of saying those words, but I think Parking Ramp is more wide spread in the upper midwest

I had a friend from Finneytown who pronounced "museum" as "mew-say-um", but I'm 99% sure that was just him not knowing how to pronounce things.

What about in Cincy the word bagel.  I notice people from the west side and I heard other people say this before, pronounce bagel as bah-gul, where as myself from Iowa and other east side people say bay-gel.

 

 

 

 

Well see, it's sort of like a seagull but from a bay

What about in Cincy the word bagel.  I notice people from the west side and I heard other people say this before, pronounce bagel as bah-gul, where as myself from Iowa and other east side people say bay-gel.

 

 

 

 

Well see, it's sort of like a seagull but from a bay

 

Ha ha right, I wrote it out wrong.  That would be very strange to hear someone pronounce bagel as bay gel "you talking about the foam that washes up from the ocean, sick"

On Cincy's accent:

 

I've heard its a mix of Southern with some influences from Northern New Jersey due to shared German ancestry.

 

Also, I've never met anyone from Cincy who sounded like a New Yorker either. Some sounded more Southern to me like the Central Virginia/Richmond accent.

 

You had to have heard a few old men who say Cin-caah-nat-uh is interesting its like a mix of NYC and Appalachian.  I last heard it from an older TANK driver on the southbank shuttle a few years back - it is getting increasingly rare.

 

For a great example of modern Cincy accents which are the most pronounced on the West side, I'd recommend giving the Urbancincy podcast a listen, Jake and Randy have a west sider drawl, its hard to describe but its a slower way of saying things that has the cadence of a southerner without the twang - last ep has both Jake and Randy.

 

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-urbancincy-podcast/id524361802?mt=2

 

(I do wish you guys would update it :( ).

Do you pronounce 'got' like "gawt"? What about 'lot'?

 

Correct.  Got, Lot, Cot, Caught, all the same for me.

 

Also, I say both whore-er or harr-er.  For example, I''ll say "It's a harr-er picture" but watching a "whore-er show."  I also use pop and soda weirdly...I'll request a soda but drink from a pop machine.  But that's a whole other discussion!

 

I've heard the most famous example of telling someone's accent is "Merry, Marry, and Mary."  I say them all the same but I guess some folks don't?

 

I don't know an accent where all those words are pronounced with the "aw" sound. The caught-cot merger, AFAIK, refers to the "ah" sound.

 

The Merry/Marry/Mary triple-distinction is a signifier of northeastern accents, which have more vowel sounds overall than most regions.

 

I guess I call milk "melk"

 

Like the "caught-cot merger," this is the "pin-pen merger." I think people with the caught-cot merger can hear the difference in the way other people say it, but people with a full pin-pen merger literally can't hear the difference when others say them distinctly. Like how native speakers of some Asian languages can't learn the difference between L and R sounds. There are some funny videos on Youtube of people trying to figure out how 'pin' and 'pen' are pronounced differently by their friends.

 

Edit: I should add that I've become similarly confused when I've asked friends with NYC accents about the differences between Merry/Marry/Mary.

People tend to speak "politely" around strangers who have a different accent, which pulls the speech toward a "center" which can be easily understood by both speakers (that center of course revolves depending on the particular mix).  When you're on TV or the radio or a podcast, or doing public speaking, there is a tendency to do the same thing.  When I give a talk somewhere or just speak at a meeting at work I find myself speaking with some hesitation as to avoid pronouncing things and phrasing things how I naturally want to do it.  When I lived in Tennessee I was very self-conscious of my voice and I suspect just came across as lame to a bunch of people there since I had to keep thinking about how to say something in a polite way.  But when I lived in the Northeast and when I visit I just say whatever comes to mind so I'm a lot more comfortable!

 

The situation in which one's "true" voice comes back 100% is an argument with family members or to a lesser extent with coworkers or strangers.  My brother's mother-in-law has an old-fashioned Southern accent and I can tell is pretty taken aback by when he and I start arguing about music or politics. 

 

This is a very interesting subject. I've seen articles about black Americans turning their AAVE on and off depending on who they're around. Globally, accents tend to be thickest among working class people, so I think most educated people with working class roots have this phenomenon of turning their accent on and off.

 

I wouldn't say my family is working class per se, it's kind of a mix, but if you go back a couple generations then we definitely were working class, so that influence is still there in some ways. It's funny you mentioned Mike Trivisonno a few pages back, I went to the same high school as he did (decades later) and we probably a similar family history, and I always thought he was the quintessential example of whatever accent I might have. I definitely can sound a bit more like him in certain contexts.

This is a very interesting subject. I've seen articles about black Americans turning their AAVE on and off depending on who they're around.

 

I cannot confirm or deny this.  As Jeff Sessions says, I cannot recall.

I don't know an accent where all those words are pronounced with the "aw" sound. The caught-cot merger, AFAIK, refers to the "ah" sound.

 

It perhaps IS the "ah" sound you're speaking of when I say cot/got/caught/lot.  It's difficult to "get it" through text, I suppose.  Basically, they are all said the same to me, much like Merry/Berry/Marry/Terry/Larry/Mary.

^ Definitely hard to communicate sounds through text, especially since a direct consequence of what we're discussing here is that the same spellings can have different sounds to different people! This is why linguists have their own very complicated alphabet, but who's got time for that?

 

Since someone mentioned above to listen to the UrbanCincy podcast to hear Jake and Randy, I found one with you in it.

 

http://www.urbancincy.com/2015/07/episode-54-summer-update/

At 7:20 you say 'pond'. It sounds like the "ah" sound I am talking about. Relatedly, at 3:32 you say 'about', and I don't hear the U (w sound) that I perceive in my own pronunciation of the word.

Since people were talking about Appalachian accents, I'd argue that some areas of Ohio have actually gotten a thicker Appalachian accent with the younger generation. I grew up near Steubenville, and I've noticed that in my old small town, the high school and college aged people have much thicker accents than their parents. Granted, about 30% don't have an accent at all, but I feel like you can really notice the accent more than you could years ago. I'm not sure why this would be, considering most places in America are actually losing their accents. But somehow, a lot of my younger relatives sound like they are from the middle of West Virginia while most of the older people sound like they are from Cleveland or something. It's also always been in the part of Columbiana County around the river (East Liverpool) but I'm noticing that its spreading farther north into the county it seems. Then all of a sudden in Mahoning County, its gone. Strange.

It's the accent creeping further and further north of I-70. It used to stop at U.S. 22. Another thing going on is Elmo. Kids get stuck with the Elmo accent later and later in life as the ones that had Elmo in their face all throughout their childhood get older. When Elmo locks in with Appalachian accents it's really hard for the speech therapists at schools to get it out of them.