1 hour ago, Cincy513 said:

Damn that blows, I love 16 bit.  Doesn't 3CDC own the current 16 bit space?  

They do yes. The thing I was wondering is if pins has the space for those machines and all the additional people that will come. 

1 hour ago, Ucgrad2015 said:

They do yes. The thing I was wondering is if pins has the space for those machines and all the additional people that will come. 

No they really don't.  16 bit is a pretty big bar so it's a big loss in terms of spreading people out in OTR.  Also as mentioned a big loss on Walnut St. 

I know 16-bit catered more to the "bro" crowd, but that and The Rook were my two go-to bars for a night out with friends.  There's plenty of date-night type of bars and resturants in OTR, but far too few that cater to just a fun social outing with a group of friends.  I'm sure at some point, someone will open a board game and/or arcade bar down there again, but this hurts for the time being.

Took a walk around yesterday afternoon, there is a ton of construction going on with streets/sidewalks, new buildings and renovations all across OTR. I feel like when people start coming back down they will be surprised at how much has changed. 

 

Somerset on McMicken 

Mural was being painted on the front of Somerset. This space is going to be amazing when it's done, I hope it's the start of more development on McMicken because that street has a ton of potential.

 

There appears to be a new bar/restaurant or something going in at 1434 Main Street behind these garage doors. The roof is removed so it ends up like a courtyard back behind there. They were working on it as i walked by so i couldn't get a great picture. All I could find was an old article from 2014 saying this is where Hen of the Woods was moving but nothing more recent, anyone know what's going on here?

 

The new building at the corner of Woodward and Yukon popped up quickly. 

 

Edited April 7, 20214 yr by ucgrady

I believe the J.B. Schmidt building is going to be a bar. I don't know much beyond that, but it's essentially an outdoor space behind those garage doors. I hope they keep the outside very unassuming and keep the old faded lettering on the front.

Don’t quote me, but I believe the road tripper people, the same people who are opening Somerset are also opening up the Main Street bar above. 

On May 17th, the Historic Conservation Board will review a proposal to demolish the old fast food / cell phone store at 1566 Elm. Unfortunately, it looks like it's slated to just be surface parking at least for the short term. I don't like any surface lots, but especially on a big street like Liberty, it's important to fill in the missing teeth with new construction. 

 

Is 3cdc running low on cash? 
 

I feel there have been so many surface lot construction projects by 3cdc lately...don’t get why the can’t just go for another major project instead of going the slow burn route with more surface parking. 
 

 

That parking lot does not need two entry/exit points to liberty. 

Two egress points and also a center median to prevent traffic crossing over. So weird.

Findlay park looks to be the next 3cdc focus area.

 

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/20-years-after-timothy-thomas-shooting-sparked-unrest-3cdc-plots-next-big-thing-in-otr?_amp=true&__twitter_impression=true

57 minutes ago, ucnum1 said:

Findlay park looks to be the next 3cdc focus area.

 

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/20-years-after-timothy-thomas-shooting-sparked-unrest-3cdc-plots-next-big-thing-in-otr?_amp=true&__twitter_impression=true

It sounds like from the article above they plan on completely renovating the park - 3cdc style - hopefully on the level of Washington park and redevelop the nearby rec center on republic.

 

Sounds also like maybe there might be some mixed use development near the park..but was kinda vague on details.

 

They mentioned about 3cdc wanting to make the rec center a state of the art facility with potential swimming pools..I’ve never been inside the rec center so I’m not sure if it would require a tear down or if there is additional land nearby and they can extend the rec center.

 

 

If nothing more I would hope 3cdc makes the facade more friendly.

 

It currently looks like a brown prison wall. Also please leave the church steeple.

Its a decent size inside, I suppose they could remove the skate rink and do something with that space.

If its on the scale of Washington park 48 million or Ziegler park 32 million it will be totally redone.Athletic fields aquatic center possibly new rec center makes sense at that price.

17 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

Sounds also like maybe there might be some mixed use development near the park..but was kinda vague on details.

 

 

I assume that is refering to the 3CDC/Model Group Findlay Parkside (BizCourier Story) that includes the following properties: 

6 W. Elder St. 1806 Republic St. 1808 Republic St. 1724 Vine St. 1732 Vine St. 1733 Vine St. 1804 Vine St. 1807 Vine St. 1810 Vine St. 1822 Vine St. 1816 Vine St. 1812 Vine St. 1814 Vine St. 29 E. McMicken Ave.

 

Edited April 8, 20214 yr by ucgrady

Makes sense with more investment planned to be tied in.It is how 3cdc rolls with thier past.Invest in a civic area and invest in the surrounding blocks.Other developers jump in once the blocks are established.

3CDC is working with CRC (Cincinnati Recreation Commission) to redesign 4 spaces that are City-owned and managed by CRC:

• Grant Park (1.1 acres)
• OTR Rec Center (1 acre)
• Findlay Playground (1.2 acres)
• Elm St playground (0.2 acres)

It's obviously a large, complicated project since it involves so much space scattered over 4 sites. 3CDC has identified Denver-based Barker Rinker Seacat (rec center portfolio) as lead architect, City Studios as local architect, Human Nature for landscape architecture, and Moody Nolan for community engagement. 

7 minutes ago, jwulsin said:

3CDC is working with CRC (Cincinnati Recreation Commission) to redesign 4 spaces that are City-owned and managed by CRC:

• Grant Park (1.1 acres)
• OTR Rec Center (1 acre)
• Findlay Playground (1.2 acres)
• Elm St playground (0.2 acres)

It's obviously a large, complicated project since it involves so much space scattered over 4 sites. 3CDC has identified Denver-based Barker Rinker Seacat (rec center portfolio) as lead architect, City Studios as local architect, Human Nature for landscape architecture, and Moody Nolan for community engagement. 

That would be quite the catalyst for north of liberty, wow.

Has 3CDC publicly released any of the renovation plans yet?

3 minutes ago, OliverHazardPerry said:

Has 3CDC publicly released any of the renovation plans yet?

3cdc posted some newish stuff on their development website but nothing in regards to these north of liberty projects.

There's been a lot of talk around Findlay Playground for years, but if Grant Park is included and can get the full renovation treatment that would be huge for McMicken and the surrounding Northern Liberties. I have always loved the 5 way intersection and McMicken Avenue and can't wait to see what they are planning for the area. 

18 minutes ago, ucgrady said:

There's been a lot of talk around Findlay Playground for years, but if Grant Park is included and can get the full renovation treatment that would be huge for McMicken and the surrounding Northern Liberties. I have always loved the 5 way intersection and McMicken Avenue and can't wait to see what they are planning for the area. 

I hope grant park is not going to be refurbished into another park...

 

With Washington and Ziegler park and Findlay Playground, not to mention other nearby parks it seems like a wasted opportunity for all of this supreme urban land.

 

Grant park would be the perfect location for a huge mixed use development and would do wonders for that stretch of otr.

Strongly disagree. There are not too many parks in the neighborhood

I disagree as well. We should be increasing tree cover in the neighborhood and renovating these existing parks is a good place to start. There are plenty of other open areas or surface parking lots that are not parkland that could be developed first.

Between Grant Park, Findlay Playground, and Hanna Playground - there are one or two too many parks on a short stretch of McMicken.  Grant Park is a 3 minute walk away from Findlay, and Hanna is a 6 minute walk. There's another small park between Elm and the Findlay Market parking lot.

 

The block where Findlay Playground is located used to have a ton of density - if any of the three sites were to be redeveloped, it probably should have been this one (or at least the half along Vine street) - but it sounds like it's too late:

 

 

Hanna and Grant Parks are older than the current Findlay Playground, but they still occupy sites that used to add density to the neighborhood.

16 minutes ago, Ram23 said:

Between Grant Park, Findlay Playground, and Hanna Playground - there are one or two too many parks on a short stretch of McMicken.  Grant Park is a 3 minute walk away from Findlay, and Hanna is a 6 minute walk. There's another small park between Elm and the Findlay Market parking lot.

 

The block where Findlay Playground is located used to have a ton of density - if any of the three sites were to be redeveloped, it probably should have been this one (or at least the half along Vine street) - but it sounds like it's too late:

 

 

Hanna and Grant Parks are older than the current Findlay Playground, but they still occupy sites that used to add density to the neighborhood.

Exactly. Not sure why OTR needs more than 5 parks...granted the actual total is probably closer to 10 if you throw Pendleton into the mix. 

I barely know of any urban neighborhood in Cincinnati that ha so many collection of parks so I don’t understand why we must immediately think of how to redevelop these park even though you can easily walk to Ziegler and Washington park in less than 5 minutes...

 

What other neighborhoods are as urban as Over-the-Rhine? It seems to me that because of Over-the-Rhine's unique density and its latest tourist attraction status, it absolutely should have more parks than a neighborhood where folks have yards.

If there were no other lots available for development, I'd agree with you that Grant Park would be the best candidate for development. But there are 4 surface parking lots along Liberty between Central and Sycamore. Dozens of abandoned buildings north of Liberty. Multiple open plots of land too. Why get rid of park space now when there are tons of better candidates for investment first? A park is an asset to build around and can spur residential development that will better utilize the green space. 

I think if by "park" you mean green space then yes i agree that Hanna playground, Elm Street playground, Findlay playground and Grant Playground don't all need to do the same thing. Hanna has a swimming pool, Elm can be a place to let kids play while people shop at the market, Findlay could be more of a plaza with programmed hardscapes and Grant could be a bigger green space similar to Washington park etc etc. 

 

They shouldn't all just be generic green space, but we shouldn't give them up to developers either. 

18 hours ago, Troeros2 said:

Exactly. Not sure why OTR needs more than 5 parks...granted the actual total is probably closer to 10 if you throw Pendleton into the mix. 

I barely know of any urban neighborhood in Cincinnati that ha so many collection of parks so I don’t understand why we must immediately think of how to redevelop these park even though you can easily walk to Ziegler and Washington park in less than 5 minutes...

 

 

Well if you want to raise a family in a dense neighborhood with minimal individual outdoor space you for sure need more than 5 parks.

I used to live in this area of Queens - it's extremely densely populated and has near zero parks:

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.7642585,-73.9183247,1425m/data=!3m1!1e3

 

It all works out just fine. If people want to go to a park, they go to the single large "Astoria Park" that serves the entire area.

 

We don't really have an Astoria Park here though. Eden maybe, but thats a hell of a walk for some people.

11 minutes ago, Ram23 said:

I used to live in this area of Queens - it's extremely densely populated and has near zero parks:

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.7642585,-73.9183247,1425m/data=!3m1!1e3

 

It all works out just fine. If people want to go to a park, they go to the single large "Astoria Park" that serves the entire area.

 

 

Just because New York does it doesn't mean that it's exceptional urban design policy. 

23 minutes ago, Ram23 said:

Queens - it's extremely densely populated and has near zero parks:

I see the point you're making comparing density of OTR to Queens, but there are a bunch of playgrounds and parks scattered throughout Queens. Families aren't gonna trek over to Astoria Park every time their kids need to run around. 

 

https://mommypoppins.com/new-york-city-kids/parks-playgrounds/the-best-playgrounds-in-queens

Yeah I live in Queens in a neighborhood with 116,000 people in it and it has one small park smaller than the size of Washington Park and it's most definitely not "fine." It's a huge issue. The second the weather gets nice, every space is swamped. My street is one that closed for the pandemic, and if I look outside right now, there are literally hundreds utilizing the street as extra outdoor space.

 

The other option is to take the 7 train to the riverfront, which is also swamped every time the weather is nice.

 

My issue with the greenspace in OTR is more that it was never designed as such, so it feels more like gap teeth in the urban fabric. That's something that needs to be addressed to turn these disparate spaces into assets that are actually nice and don't feel like remnant spaces nobody found a better use for.

I honestly don't think Grant Park needs a lot to change. They recently got a well-utilized playground, the basketball courts are usually busy, and it's a pretty active park most of the time.

 

The only real issue with it, which has been an issue for a while, is the drug dealing along McMicken and at Back/Hamer Streets behind the park.

Can you imagine the reaction we would see if the city gave a public park to 3CDC to turn into apartments? People would sh*t a brick.

21 minutes ago, DEPACincy said:

Can you imagine the reaction we would see if the city gave a public park to 3CDC to turn into apartments? People would sh*t a brick.

I would literally.

1 hour ago, jmicha said:

My issue with the greenspace in OTR is more that it was never designed as such, so it feels more like gap teeth in the urban fabric.

Another huge issue is that Cincinnati Rec Commission is woefully underfunded and can't afford to maintain urban spaces with the level of staff needed, even just to keep up with daily litter. I take my kids to Grant Park and Findlay Playground regularly, and I usually bring a plastic bag with me to pick up litter. Urban parks get litter. This isn't a problem unique to Cincinnati or OTR. It just requires ongoing staffing to keep up with the heavy traffic of urban use. Ziegler and Washington Park are now staffed 7 days a week throughout the year, with 3CDC managing the operations. 

2 hours ago, Yves Behar said:

We don't really have an Astoria Park here though. Eden maybe, but thats a hell of a walk for some people.

 

I think Washington Park serves OTR in the same capacity Astoria Park serves that neighborhood. It isn't as big of a park, but OTR isn't as big of a neighborhood (Astoria has nearly 100,000 people).

 

1 hour ago, jmicha said:

Yeah I live in Queens in a neighborhood with 116,000 people in it and it has one small park smaller than the size of Washington Park and it's most definitely not "fine." It's a huge issue. The second the weather gets nice, every space is swamped. My street is one that closed for the pandemic, and if I look outside right now, there are literally hundreds utilizing the street as extra outdoor space.

 

The other option is to take the 7 train to the riverfront, which is also swamped every time the weather is nice.

 

 

My main point is that you can have a dense, successful, vibrant neighborhood without a park on every block, as evidenced in many cities around the world. To an extent, I'd say too many parks is detrimental towards the goal of density and vibrancy. The fact that parks in NYC are packed adds to the vibrancy of the place. On the other end of the spectrum, if a neighborhood has so many parks that they are all poorly maintained and just busy enough to keep the drug dealers comfortable at all hours of the day, it has too many parks.

 

The city should turn Findlay Playground into a parking garage and market extension, and make Grant the neighborhood park for the northern have of OTR. There are some good opportunities to tie the park into the brewing heritage trail beyond what has already started with the signage. Hannah Playground could be reduced in size and kept as a neighborhood pool, if moving the pool to Grant is too costly.

 

21 minutes ago, Ram23 said:

On the other end of the spectrum, if a neighborhood has so many parks that they are all poorly maintained and just busy enough to keep the drug dealers comfortable at all hours of the day, it has too many parks.

I totally agree with you that parks that are perpetually empty and under-maintained are no good!

Not to be disagreeable, but under used green space is fantastic in an urban area. It is relaxing, quieting. When every park is filled with basketball players, crowds of people, events, concessions, it is not a plus. Although Ziegler Park is a tremendous asset, Cutter Playground (its predecessor) was loved by all of the residents for its untamed beauty and lack or disciplined landscaping. And, the lack of use of Ziegler Park is the best thing about it.

23 hours ago, Chas Wiederhold said:

I would literally.

We need to expand our vision of urban parks to include Fairview, Bellevue, and Jackson Hill Parks. Bring back the stairs and overlooks and gathering spaces. Connect them all with each other and with OTR. Each of those parks once had their own inclines and staircases.

 

Edited for typos. 

Edited April 10, 20214 yr by Miami-Erie

Bring back the inclines.

On 4/9/2021 at 11:04 PM, Miami-Erie said:

We need to expand our vision of urban parks to include Fairview, Bellevue, and Jackson Hill Parks. Bring back the stairs and overlooks and gathering spaces. Connect them all with each other and with OTR. Each of those parks once had their own inclines and staircases.

 

Edited for typos. 

Wasn’t there a rumor a few years ago that Rhinegeist was looking at building a chairlift up to a new beer garden at Bellevue? 

41 minutes ago, Guy23 said:

Wasn’t there a rumor a few years ago that Rhinegeist was looking at building a chairlift up to a new beer garden at Bellevue? 

 

I remember that rumor, and I don't think there was a shred of truth to it.

IIRC: people could pick up the Rhinegeist wifi from Bellevue one time, and somehow that led to the rumors.

I think that started because in late 2016 or early 2017 Rhinegeist bought a pretty big property due north of them on McMicken and rumors/conjecture spread but it ended up just being space for the employee parking lot. 

Northcrown Properties is applying for a COA for two buildings listed as 116 E McMicken. A front building will house a storefront and 7 units and a rear building that faces Hust Alley will house 3 additional units. The (large) PDF can be found here. Discussion about this property begins on Page 61. Drawings begin on Page 98. They plan on updating the storefront to conform with a historically appropriate design.

 

 

I don't see any drawings in the packet for the rear building.

I feel like the hype train is starting to die down with rhinegeist.

 

Not sure why they haven’t entered the seltzer market at this point.

 

I can’t drink ipa’s anymore or any beer for that matter. They make me gain weight like crazy and I feel so bloated and heavy.

 

 

1 hour ago, ryanlammi said:

I don't see any drawings in the packet for the rear building.

The owners also own the adjacent, empty parcel at 118 E McMicken. I'm curious to hear what their plans are for that empty parcel, as well as the rear building at 116 E McMicken.