On 4/8/2021 at 3:30 PM, Chas Wiederhold said:

What other neighborhoods are as urban as Over-the-Rhine? It seems to me that because of Over-the-Rhine's unique density and its latest tourist attraction status, it absolutely should have more parks than a neighborhood where folks have yards.

Which is why the urbanity should be sold as an asset, Cincinnati already has plenty of excellent parks, but always sells itself short on its urban bones.

1 minute ago, neilworms said:

always sells itself short on its urban bones

What do you mean by "sells itself short"? (I'm not asking rhetorically... I genuinely am curious)

On 4/15/2021 at 1:53 PM, Cincy513 said:

They're like the 25th biggest craft brewery in the country, they're not having any issues making money or keeping up their "hype."  Like most breweries they probably just don't want to make seltzers and already have their well established cider line for non beer options.  The tap room also offers wine and cocktails.  They make a lot of other beers besides IPAs and still have the best tap room in arguably the best location the city.  So I don't really agree with anything in this post. 

 

This is correct, they also are the only craft brewery in Cincinnati that has a presence in Chicago.   I also could find non-IPA things from the up here, which wasn't the case a few years ago (Not an IPA fan myself, but they do good cider and have a few decent IPAs).

Edited May 10, 20214 yr by neilworms

1 minute ago, jwulsin said:

What do you mean by "sells itself short"? (I'm not asking rhetorically... I genuinely am curious)

Everyone rushing to build pocket parks in Walnut Hills, instead of stabilizing the buildings there is a good example.

Another example is destroying the business district in Fairmont, which while diminished could have been reworked and preserved, but instead you got a large park like area for the lick run environmental project.   It seems that Cincinnati always chooses the park over preserving or maintaining the urban fabric.

24 minutes ago, neilworms said:

Everyone rushing to build pocket parks in Walnut Hills, instead of stabilizing the buildings there is a good example.

Another example is destroying the business district in Fairmont, which while diminished could have been reworked and preserved, but instead you got a large park like area for the lick run environmental project.   It seems that Cincinnati always chooses the park over preserving or maintaining the urban fabric.

pocket parks aren’t unique to Cincy. Plenty of other major cities have these. 
 

I would argue that most communities don’t like pocket parks anyways since they tend to promote loitering and drug dealing. 
 

A pocket park in general is kind of nonsense..parks are meant for recreational activity for adults and children. I don’t understand what a pocket park the size of a McDonald’s parking is supposed to help promote other than allowing your dog to take a dump.

 

30 minutes ago, neilworms said:

Everyone rushing to build pocket parks in Walnut Hills, instead of stabilizing the buildings there is a good example.

 

Ahh... I see what you're saying (was a bit confused since this is the OTR thread - moderators feel free to move this to the Walnut Hill thread), though I'd disagree with the "everyone rushing" characterization, since most of the Walnut Hills residents I speak with talk about how they want to see the empty lots built on. When the Green Man Park was planned and built (on a shoestring budget of $46k), there wasn't enough market demand to support infill construction in Walnut Hills. Since then, the market seems to have turned a corner for Walnut Hills, and now there is much more new construction. Perhaps one day Green Man Park will get the budget to be a proper urban park, or perhaps a better use will present itself. Anyways... back to the thread's topic of OTR Development.

26 minutes ago, jwulsin said:

 

 

Ahh... I see what you're saying (was a bit confused since this is the OTR thread - moderators feel free to move this to the Walnut Hill thread), though I'd disagree with the "everyone rushing" characterization, since most of the Walnut Hills residents I speak with talk about how they want to see the empty lots built on. When the Green Man Park was planned and built (on a shoestring budget of $46k), there wasn't enough market demand to support infill construction in Walnut Hills. Since then, the market seems to have turned a corner for Walnut Hills, and now there is much more new construction. Perhaps one day Green Man Park will get the budget to be a proper urban park, or perhaps a better use will present itself. Anyways... back to the thread's topic of OTR Development.

I was saying a general thing about the city of Cincinnati as it applies to the specific case of Over the Rhine and parks.  Its still on topic, but the examples I had to give were citywide.

Great to see the Weilerts building finally being revitalized.  I just wish they were going to have a beer garden in the back like they had in the past.  I guess the side courtyard will have to do until 3CDC renovates that entire area where Kroger used to be. 

44 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

pocket parks aren’t unique to Cincy. Plenty of other major cities have these. 
 

I would argue that most communities don’t like pocket parks anyways since they tend to promote loitering and drug dealing. 
 

A pocket park in general is kind of nonsense..parks are meant for recreational activity for adults and children. I don’t understand what a pocket park the size of a McDonald’s parking is supposed to help promote other than allowing your dog to take a dump.

Pocket parks are everywhere, and IMO there is a parking lot in my current neighborhood in Chicago that I'd love to see turned into one because its a small triangle lot that would be very difficult to develop into anything.  (Sadly an auto repair shop went in next to it and use that lot as a parking lot for the backlog of cars they work on dashing any hopes of mine that it would be used in that way).   Nonetheless, if you can walk to 3 parks within 10 mins you have plenty of parks, there is no need for more.  (and that's the case in Over The Rhine right now).

 

1 hour ago, Cincy513 said:

Great to see the Weilerts building finally being revitalized.  I just wish they were going to have a beer garden in the back like they had in the past.  I guess the side courtyard will have to do until 3CDC renovates that entire area where Kroger used to be. 

strange they aren’t utilizing that space. You would think mad tree would love that kind of space to utilize their beer garden...

4 hours ago, ryanlammi said:

There's also an HCB hearing on June 21 about 228 E. Liberty Street (old Convenience store at the northwest corner of Liberty and Sycamore). The space used to be owned by OTR Holdings, which is 3CDC, but the current owner appears to be 

 

FOTOFOCUS CINCINNATI
212 EAST FOURTEENTH ST
CINCINNATI OH 45202

 

I'm really confused by this, and not sure what's going on. Is this still 3CDC related?

weird...just doing brief research on fotofocus it seems like they are a non profit art organization...not sure how they would have the kind of funds needed to flip that site.

48 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

strange they aren’t utilizing that space. You would think mad tree would love that kind of space to utilize their beer garden...

I think everything behind that building is a parking lot right now from when they tore down the old Kroger location.  

Imperial Theatre in Mohawk. Full presentation. Little more than renderings porn at this point (see page 16 for the financials,) but still cool 

 

 

Edited May 10, 20214 yr by Pdrome513

7 minutes ago, Pdrome513 said:

Imperial Theatre in Mohawk. Full presentation. 

The hyperlink isn't working for me. Can you try again?

3 minutes ago, jwulsin said:

The hyperlink isn't working for me. Can you try again?

Whoops, should be good now

There is a proposal for 228 East Liberty.A commercial building designed by Jose Garcia.Anyone have details?

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10165228556405343&id=185964090342

There are renderings of the new and improved imagination alley. 
 

looks like to be a much needed improvement and will hopefully kick out some of the shady characters that tend to linger their during late nights.

EXCLUSIVE: $23 million boutique hotel planned across from TQL Stadium

 

Developers are planning a boutique hotel across from FC Cincinnati’s TQL Stadium in Over-the-Rhine.

 

More below:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2021/05/11/23-million-boutique-hotel-planned-across-from.html

 

11 hours ago, ColDayMan said:

EXCLUSIVE: $23 million boutique hotel planned across from TQL Stadium

 

Developers are planning a boutique hotel across from FC Cincinnati’s TQL Stadium in Over-the-Rhine.

 

More below:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2021/05/11/23-million-boutique-hotel-planned-across-from.html

 

I’m already hearing murmurs from Waller and the OTRCC that they’re ready to oppose this one, which begs the question, has there been a single development in recent memory that they have actually supported? And if a CC exists solely to oppose development in a neighborhood why should their opinion have any weight?

 

In their defense, it looks like one of the ‘non contributing’ buildings that would be demoed is one of the only pre civil war buildings left in OTR, which does sound significant.

2 hours ago, Guy23 said:

I’m already hearing murmurs from Waller and the OTRCC that they’re ready to oppose this one, which begs the question, has there been a single development in recent memory that they have actually supported? And if a CC exists solely to oppose development in a neighborhood why should their opinion have any weight?

 

In their defense, it looks like one of the ‘non contributing’ buildings that would be demoed is one of the only pre civil war buildings left in OTR, which does sound significant.

 

It seems like that group will now just oppose anything for the sake of opposition. This proposal is only 3 stories tall (and should be taller considering it is on a very wide street). If you try hard enough to find reasons to oppose things you will always find something. 

OTRC. are idiots 

Lol they are against a three story building in a neighborhood with many taller buildings.... Because of height? Can't make this stuff up.

Maybe they want it taller?

2 hours ago, DEPACincy said:

Lol they are against a three story building in a neighborhood with many taller buildings.... Because of height? Can't make this stuff up.

 

I've heard people claim that the general rule of thumb for correct height ratio should be as tall as 1:1 with the width of the RoW and no shorter than 4:1. That would put buildings along this section of Central Parkway anywhere from 37.75' to 151'. Anything taller, as the saying goes, would be too cavernous and anything shorter would encourage reckless driving, lack of human presence, disinvestment, etc.

Anyone who lives in otr can talk about how things have been their lately as far as activity?

 

I know otr prepandemic was always crowded on a Friday/Saturday...just curious where it’s at now.

 

I used to follow various accounts on social media like Instagram and Snapchat and noticed that postings, even random photos of people eating out at an otr restaurant, are way down.

 

 

My social media used to be flooded with otr posts of people going out for dinner/drinks but it’s been almost a ghost town lately..which is odd because of how things are starting to lift restriction wise.

 

just curious what’s otr like nowadays?

14 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

Anyone who lives in otr can talk about how things have been their lately as far as activity?

 

I know otr prepandemic was always crowded on a Friday/Saturday...just curious where it’s at now.

 

I used to follow various accounts on social media like Instagram and Snapchat and noticed that postings, even random photos of people eating out at an otr restaurant, are way down.

 

 

My social media used to be flooded with otr posts of people going out for dinner/drinks but it’s been almost a ghost town lately..which is odd because of how things are starting to lift restriction wise.

 

just curious what’s otr like nowadays?

Can't speak for the residents, but my wife and I hung out during the day a couple of weekends ago before a 4pm Saturday Reds game.  The usual hot spots in OTR were packed to the brim, wait times were long at restaurants, but they also had capacity restrictions. Fountain Square seemed like it was hopping, OTR was maybe 50% as busy as a usual Saturday afternoon (before 3pm).  I left downtown hopeful about the vibrancy coming back quickly, it definitely was not a ghost town.  I'm definitely curious how things were this past weekend as it was beautiful.

7 minutes ago, 10albersa said:

Can't speak for the residents, but my wife and I hung out during the day a couple of weekends ago before a 4pm Saturday Reds game.  The usual hot spots in OTR were packed to the brim, wait times were long at restaurants, but they also had capacity restrictions. Fountain Square seemed like it was hopping, OTR was maybe 50% as busy as a usual Saturday afternoon (before 3pm).  I left downtown hopeful about the vibrancy coming back quickly, it definitely was not a ghost town.  I'm definitely curious how things were this past weekend as it was beautiful.

that’s good to hear. I haven’t been to otr for a while because having a new born will stop you from going out as much, but it’s good to hear that activity is picking up.

 

i was getting kinda worried because of the lack of activity on my social media stream but I guess maybe people aren’t using social media as much. 

It was packed this weekend. Went out to eat and to Findlay Market Saturday. Watched the FC Cincy game at a bar on Sunday. Everywhere was packed to the gills. Felt like pre-pandemic.

2 hours ago, Troeros2 said:

Anyone who lives in otr can talk about how things have been their lately as far as activity?

 

I know otr prepandemic was always crowded on a Friday/Saturday...just curious where it’s at now.

 

I used to follow various accounts on social media like Instagram and Snapchat and noticed that postings, even random photos of people eating out at an otr restaurant, are way down.

 

 

My social media used to be flooded with otr posts of people going out for dinner/drinks but it’s been almost a ghost town lately..which is odd because of how things are starting to lift restriction wise.

 

just curious what’s otr like nowadays?

I love on Main by the Woodward Theatre. Its been busy the last month. Much like a pre pandemic weekend. I'd say it's actually busier now (this past weekend) than it was before the pandemic. The weather was amazing. The streetcar was FULL. And bars were hoppin.

Live. Laugh. Love. Whatever. 

 

On Twitter, Matt Butler, President of the Devou Good Foundation, has stated that raised crosswalks are going to be installed on Main and Vine as an extension of the City's Streeteries project. He said construction should start within the next 3 weeks and that he would post more details later.

On 5/10/2021 at 5:27 PM, Cincy513 said:

I think everything behind that building is a parking lot right now from when they tore down the old Kroger location.  

Yeah. That's correct. 3CDC's new parking lot goes right up to the rear of the Kaze/Weilert's properties. Here's a photo showing the the old Kaze patio (on the left) and the rear of Weilert's. In the past, to access Kaze you had to enter through doors on 14th or Vine. I'm a bit afraid that MadTree is going to put an entrance here at the rear, which will mean some folks will park on the surface lot and then walk into MadTree without ever even stepping onto a sidewalk... which kinda sucks. But overall, I'm glad MadTree is coming to this space as I think it'll attract a lot of people to Vine Street (the majority of whom will hopefully walk around and enjoy the rest of the neighborhood). 

 

There is a mixture of 3CDC and non-3CDC properties in the block, but wanted to share this aerial photo (from CAGIS) as well as a few photos I took earlier today. WDC LLC (of the Wade family) owns most of the land on the Walnut side of the block. They're tearing it all up and appear to be making it all surface parking. I hope that 3CDC and the Wade family can figure out a coherent plan for this block. Would be a shame for it all to be surface parking longterm.

 

My photos from 18 May 2021:

 

 

CAGIS photo from April 2020:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

9 minutes ago, jwulsin said:

There is a mixture of 3CDC and non-3CDC properties in the block, but wanted to share this aerial photo (from CAGIS) as well as a few photos I took earlier today. WDC LLC (of the Wade family) owns most of the land on the Walnut side of the block. They're tearing it all up and appear to be making it all surface parking. I hope that 3CDC and the Wade family can figure out a coherent plan for this block. Would be a shame for it all to be surface parking longterm.

 

My photos from 18 May 2021:

 

 

CAGIS photo from April 2020:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

that’s an a insane amount of surface parking and has probably taken the spot for biggest eyesore in of downtown/otr.

 

hopefully that can be redeveloped soon because otr deserves better. 

45 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

that’s an a insane amount of surface parking and has probably taken the spot for biggest eyesore in of downtown/otr.

 

hopefully that can be redeveloped soon because otr deserves better. 

 

Urban Sites has a contract on the parking lot going in on the WDC LLC site. 3CDC looked to purchase that land from M. Scripps so they could build a garage but that didn't happen. Now Urban Sites has swooped in to build another surface lot. Unfortunately, this land isn't going to be infilled anytime soon.

All I hear is about how hot the Cincinnati real estate market is and how everything in inventory is flying off the market above asking price...I don’t get why something like this must remain a large parking lot instead of striking while the iron is hot and help fulfill that housing demand. 

Man all that parking is disgusting.  

9 hours ago, Dev said:

On Twitter, Matt Butler, President of the Devou Good Foundation, has stated that raised crosswalks are going to be installed on Main and Vine as an extension of the City's Streeteries project. He said construction should start within the next 3 weeks and that he would post more details later.

This was shared in 3CDC’s presentation to the neighborhoods committee a week or two ago. They have raised sidewalks at 12th and also at Woodward. They should add another at Orchard. 

22 hours ago, Dev said:

On Twitter, Matt Butler, President of the Devou Good Foundation, has stated that raised crosswalks are going to be installed on Main and Vine as an extension of the City's Streeteries project. He said construction should start within the next 3 weeks and that he would post more details later.

Vine Street plans: 3 raised crosswalks between 12th and 15th

 

 

Main Street plans: 2 raised crosswalks at 12th and Woodward

 

I saw on the OTR community council agenda about presentations regarding Wilkomen Phase 2 going ahead. 
 

Does anyone know the details regarding phase 2? I don’t believe they were ever announced. 

19 hours ago, Troeros2 said:

that’s an a insane amount of surface parking and has probably taken the spot for biggest eyesore in of downtown/otr.

Unsolicited rankings based on what used to be there and the potential of the area:

1. 8th & Sycamore

2. All four lots on Vine between 7th & 8th

3. This former OTR Kroger site

4. Court and Walnut south of new Kroger

5. All the lots plus the substation at the corner Central Parkway and down Plum

6. 4th and Plum/Soon to be vacant Millennium Site

7. All the lots around Eggleston

19 hours ago, Troeros2 said:

All I hear is about how hot the Cincinnati real estate market is and how everything in inventory is flying off the market above asking price...I don’t get why something like this must remain a large parking lot instead of striking while the iron is hot and help fulfill that housing demand. 

 

Why deal with the NoTR Community Council when you can make easy money with a parking lot with very little risk? 

45 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

I saw on the OTR community council agenda about presentations regarding Wilkomen Phase 2 going ahead. 
 

Does anyone know the details regarding phase 2? I don’t believe they were ever announced. 

The name of the project is likely to change, but the rough scope includes 48 residential units spread across three sites. Model Group is financing the project with LIHTC (Low income housing tax credits) and they are targeting 31-60% AMI. 

• 30 E 15th Street - renovation of vacant historic building
• 1617 Race - infill construction on empty lot (small ~1000 sq ft commercial storefront with apartments above)
• 1684 Central Parkway - infill construction on empty lot

From a visual perspective, the infill at 1684 Central Parkway will have the biggest impact. They're still working through the design, but it's proposed to be 6 stories, and a bit taller than the adjacent 5.5 story apartment building. 1684 Central Parkway will have 32 affordable units, 15-20 market rate units, and a commercial space (size TBD). The market rate apartments and the commercial space will be financed separately, not through the LIHTC. 

 

 

 

All infill is great but especially ones on main roads like Central Pkwy and Liberty.  Need those buildings to be at least 5-6 floors for more density.  

Devou Good has also asked that the parklet areas be named a "Pedestrian Priority Zone" and that the City adopt a no chase policy in them. Copy of letter shared here.

It still slightly blows my mind that almost 11 years into the gentrification process, with some homes in otr going for a million plus, that there are still quite a handful of vacant and crumbling historic buildings facing Washington park on race.

 

You would think most developers would love to flip that and with today’s housing market a single family home facing Washington park right in the heart of otr can fetch a hefty buyer.

 

just really confused on how and why in the heart of otr there are some buildings that are not being touched with a ten foot pole. 

50 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

It still slightly blows my mind that almost 11 years into the gentrification process, with some homes in otr going for a million plus, that there are still quite a handful of vacant and crumbling historic buildings facing Washington park on race.

 

You would think most developers would love to flip that and with today’s housing market a single family home facing Washington park right in the heart of otr can fetch a hefty buyer.

 

just really confused on how and why in the heart of otr there are some buildings that are not being touched with a ten foot pole. 

Look at CAGIS and you see that most of those properties are owned by churches, OTR community housing, CMHA or something that A. doesn't pay property taxes and B. is actively trying to avoid the gentrification that you are referring to. The building at the corner of 14th and Race for instance is inhabited with multiple affordable units, so that being purchased and turned into a swanky single family would not be a good thing at all. The building just south of it however is vacant but I'm sure OTRCH doesn't want to sell, because they know once it's gone it's gone forever whereas they may be able to raise enough money to renovate someday. 

21 hours ago, jwulsin said:

The name of the project is likely to change, but the rough scope includes 48 residential units spread across three sites. Model Group is financing the project with LIHTC (Low income housing tax credits) and they are targeting 31-60% AMI. 

• 30 E 15th Street - renovation of vacant historic building
• 1617 Race - infill construction on empty lot (small ~1000 sq ft commercial storefront with apartments above)
• 1684 Central Parkway - infill construction on empty lot

From a visual perspective, the infill at 1684 Central Parkway will have the biggest impact. They're still working through the design, but it's proposed to be 6 stories, and a bit taller than the adjacent 5.5 story apartment building. 1684 Central Parkway will have 32 affordable units, 15-20 market rate units, and a commercial space (size TBD). The market rate apartments and the commercial space will be financed separately, not through the LIHTC. 

 

 

 

I LOVE this. Finally, a project that will force the question "so do you actually care about affordable housing, or do you care about fostering a museum community based on height restrictions?" For a lot of the folks in the awkward coalition of OTRCC, OTR foundation, etc, I'm betting on the latter.

13 minutes ago, jim uber said:

I LOVE this. Finally, a project that will force the question "so do you actually care about affordable housing, or do you care about fostering a museum community based on height restrictions?" For a lot of the folks in the awkward coalition of OTRCC, OTR foundation, etc, I'm betting on the latter.

 

They will likely object to it because of some strawman argument like 'its not 100% affordable housing' (which they know is likely not financially realistic) to stall/oppose it. 

Well, they’d be going against their own past statements in that case. Any pressure that helps keep them honest will be good for OTR and good for affordable housing.