16 minutes ago, jwulsin said:

They are looking at completely rebuilding that stretch of Central Parkway, either maximizing the width of the sidewalks (my preference) or creating a large median.

 

Hopefully an increase in sidewalk and green space will help get more pedestrian traffic in that area. It's so desolate in that aspect.

Just now, RealAdamP said:

It's so desolate in that aspect.

That's what the project is trying to address. 

I love the concept and definitely think a major street calming should be done but I’m a little confused about the price tag. Also, I’d think you’d want a city financed project this expensive to generate a lot of development, but the section is already filled out pretty well by FCC, Music Hall and Sam Adams, with additional projects already in the pipeline.
 

If this can be done with private donors, like FCC, it makes a ton of sense, and if not I’d say it’s maybe worth cutting out the European fountains (whatever that is), just do a sizable street calming and spend the remainder on other road diets like Linn and Ludlow.

I wish this project went from 12th up to Mohawk/Linn. That intersection is a mess. Central Avenue should be reconnected and so should Bank/Whiteman across Linn.

58 minutes ago, RealAdamP said:

 

$20 million dollars? Are they planning on airlifting marble fountains from Italy or something? 

 

Unless there's traffic calming included in that, I don't think any plaza or fountain on central parkway would be a tourist destination outside of sharing images of it. Any gathering area near a road eventually becomes a hotspot for attention seeking loud vehicles and reckless drivers sadly.

I would like 3cdc to maybe use that stretch to maybe throw some art festivals, live music, etc. This has the potential to be a really neat area if done right and help it’s current ghost town and desolate status outside of fcc game days. 
 

it would be cool if they could put up some small European cafes with take out windows. 

Edited October 19, 20213 yr by Troeros2

For $20 million, they should open up the Liberty Street subway station and a stretch of the subway tunnels. Build a couple new stairs and an elevator for access.  Cut the top off the tunnels and build a sunken plaza/feature stair that leads down into it. That would make it an actual tourist destination year-round, as opposed to turning a mostly empty giant street into a mostly empty giant plaza.

 

And I've heard the water main/fiber optic cable excuses 1000 times. There are creative solutions. Here's a cheap one: only provide access to one tunnel, and seal the other side off with plexi-glass in the openings.

 

If this project actually happens and doesn't incorporate the subway, it will be a giant missed opportunity, IMO.

On 10/15/2021 at 4:07 PM, jwulsin said:

I like it! Better than asphalt!

 

From what I hear, they will permanently close that stretch of 14th street and make it a "Streatery."  The coating over existing asphalt is high-end and supposed to last a long time.  

4 minutes ago, nicker66 said:

The coating over existing asphalt is high-end and supposed to last a long time

I'm curious what the specific product/material is. I checked it out over the weekend and it has has a "rough" texture, almost like a very coarse sand embedded in epoxy. It feels like it would "rub off" with a lot of foot traffic or a snow plow... but perhaps it is deceptively durable. 

43 minutes ago, jwulsin said:

I'm curious what the specific product/material is. I checked it out over the weekend and it has has a "rough" texture, almost like a very coarse sand embedded in epoxy. It feels like it would "rub off" with a lot of foot traffic or a snow plow... but perhaps it is deceptively durable. 

They use it here in NYC when converting streets into pedestrian space. Seems to hold up well enough. Not perfect, but also a good solution when you can't fully rebuild from scratch. Not entirely sure what exactly the material is though, so would be interested to learn.

Something like Commonwealth Avenue in Boston is what is needed. Large greenspace with pedestrian path and park down the middle. $20 million actually seems like a very reasonable price tag considering they are redesigning the stretch completely.

14 minutes ago, DEPACincy said:

Something like Commonwealth Avenue in Boston

That was one of the best-in-class examples presented by Human Nature for the "maximum median" approach, if they decide to go that route. Whatever design they settle on, the challenge (as everybody is well aware) is how to activate such a large space, since it's not as though the street is lined on both sides with uninterrupted 4-7 story buildings like Commonwealth Ave.

Edited October 19, 20213 yr by jwulsin

Do we know who is financing the 20 million? Is 3cdc helming this project? Or someone else? Just curious where they plan on finding the 20 mill?  

18 hours ago, jwulsin said:

I'm curious what the specific product/material is. I checked it out over the weekend and it has has a "rough" texture, almost like a very coarse sand embedded in epoxy. It feels like it would "rub off" with a lot of foot traffic or a snow plow... but perhaps it is deceptively durable. 

 

I'm not sure they're done yet.  I know that everyone involved is trying to "do it right" instead of just throw down some cheap paint.  

19 hours ago, jwulsin said:

That was one of the best-in-class examples presented by Human Nature for the "maximum median" approach, if they decide to go that route. Whatever design they settle on, the challenge (as everybody is well aware) is how to activate such a large space, since it's not as though the street is lined on both sides with uninterrupted 4-7 story buildings like Commonwealth Ave.

 

Yep. I think it'll be tough to activate it in the short term but I expect that 10 years from now Central Parkway will have a lot more devleopment.

21 hours ago, jwulsin said:

I'm curious what the specific product/material is. I checked it out over the weekend and it has has a "rough" texture, almost like a very coarse sand embedded in epoxy. It feels like it would "rub off" with a lot of foot traffic or a snow plow... but perhaps it is deceptively durable. 

Look similar to a product called stonhard, used in lots of commercial and manufacturing buildings.

21 hours ago, DEPACincy said:

Something like Commonwealth Avenue in Boston is what is needed. Large greenspace with pedestrian path and park down the middle. $20 million actually seems like a very reasonable price tag considering they are redesigning the stretch completely.

So something like this?

1 hour ago, Dev said:

So something like this?

 

Yep... Or even like this...

 

Maybe Central Parkway becomes a little more European with new apartment/business buildings set back from the street for outdoor dining, etc. Plus, Hammarabi Traffic Circle cleans up that horrible intersection. And, Cincinnatians from all species are celebrated like this Hammarabi Fountain.

The gorilla's name was Harambe, show some darn respect! Lol

9 minutes ago, DEPACincy said:

 

Yep... Or even like this...

 

 

This is certainly much better. I was just copying Commonwealth Avenue from Street View literally which does not have separated or even protected bike facilities.

16 minutes ago, Dev said:

This is certainly much better. I was just copying Commonwealth Avenue from Street View literally which does not have separated or even protected bike facilities.

 

Oh yes. I should've clarified "inspired" by Commonwealth while avoiding some of its mistakes.

1 hour ago, RJohnson said:

Maybe Central Parkway becomes a little more European with new apartment/business buildings set back from the street for outdoor dining, etc. Plus, Hammarabi Traffic Circle cleans up that horrible intersection. And, Cincinnatians from all species are celebrated like this Hammarabi Fountain.

 

The city has been looking to redevelop the lot at the curve of Central Parkway (west of the YMCA) for a long time. There was some talk about putting a garage there a year or two before the stadium was proposed.

maybe some of you will get your own fountain... what species again?

 

Edited October 20, 20213 yr by RJohnson

On 10/20/2021 at 4:01 PM, RJohnson said:

Maybe Central Parkway becomes a little more European with new apartment/business buildings set back from the street for outdoor dining, etc. Plus, Hammarabi Traffic Circle cleans up that horrible intersection. And, Cincinnatians from all species are celebrated like this Hammarabi Fountain.

This idea is just silly enough to work... would this be the world's first ironic monument? and would the reddit bros be more likely to visit Cincinnati to take a picture with the fountain? 

Over the past ~6 months or so, 3CDC and the Cincinnati Rec Commission have been conducting a series of community engagement sessions, as well as working with a team of architects (Moody Nolan, Human Nature, and Barker Rinker Seacat) to explore options for upgrading/replacing the OTR Rec Center as well as surrounding parks (Grant, Findlay, and Elm St). On October 6th, a representative from Barker Rinker Seacat presented their findings and initial recommendation regarding the programming for the sites. The presentation is available at: https://www.3cdc.org/findlay-recreation-project/

 

The main takeaways:

• The recommended location for a new rec/community center is on the eastern half of Findlay Playground facing Vine Street, roughly east of the historic Republic Street right-of-way.
• The design would be multi-story and similar in height to the surrounding buildings that vary in height from 3-5 stories. 
• An indoor aquatics center was identified as one of the key programming features. 
• The remaining portion of Findlay Playground would be designed as greenspace
• The existing rec center would be renovated to be used by another organization, or it will get torn down for some other use.
• Grant Park and Elm St Park should be improved and remain as parks

This is a long, ongoing project and the total budget hasn't been determined yet, so there are lots of questions still to be answered. The next phase of design will start to get more specific about the design of the rec center and green space. 

 

 

Well then, maybe a goat fountain would bring in some tourists. I think people like change and if you can't afford a new tower, or an arch like in St. Louis, or a giant ferris wheel get them a goat. 

I...uhh...

Regarding the Central Parkway options... I I knew I had seen some options but couldn't recall where. Found this over on the Complete Streets thread:

 

Is the recent news story an extenuation of the previous survey or is this a separate/new thing?

1 hour ago, Dev said:

Is the recent news story an extenuation of the previous survey or is this a separate/new thing?

 

I believe it is a continuation of the previous survey plan.

So their maximum median, gussied up with trees and a path down the middle, would look something like this...

1 hour ago, Dev said:

Is the recent news story an extenuation of the previous survey or is this a separate/new thing?

I don't think anything significant has changed recently. WCPO covered it last week, which prompted this latest conversation in the thread. I suspect the City and the local organizers are working to figure out what kind of budget is available.

 

 

On 7/13/2021 at 2:44 PM, Largue said:

Yesterday, the Historic Conservation Board voted to deny the demolition of the 2-story building at Magnolia & Central. The demo would have made way for a new 4-story hotel adaptive re-use project that spans the block. Images below of the building that was planned for demolition and then the new design proposed for the site. 

 

 

On October 21st, the Zoning Board of Appeals (ZBA) heard the case regarding the proposed demolition of 1416 Central Parkway, and the ZBA overturned the Historic Conservation Board's (HCB) decision. On July 12th, the HCB had voted to deny the request to demolish 1416 Central Parkway. But with the latest ruling from the ZBA, unless there is some other step/process I'm unaware of, I believe the owners now have permission to proceed with demolition. 

 

Case document: https://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/buildings/hearings-appeals/zoning-board-of-appeals/z-4062-2021-concerning-1416-1430-central-parkway/

Video of hearing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfGACB3OmsE

 

Good, though they should have only given approval if they made the hotel bigger.  3 stories in central pkwy is such a waste.  

21 minutes ago, jwulsin said:

 

On October 21st, the Zoning Board of Appeals (ZBA) heard the case regarding the proposed demolition of 1416 Central Parkway, and the ZBA overturned the Historic Conservation Board's (HCB) decision. On July 12th, the HCB had voted to deny the request to demolish 1416 Central Parkway. But with the latest ruling from the ZBA, unless there is some other step/process I'm unaware of, I believe the owners now have permission to proceed with demolition. 

 

Case document: https://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/buildings/hearings-appeals/zoning-board-of-appeals/z-4062-2021-concerning-1416-1430-central-parkway/

Video of hearing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfGACB3OmsE

 

So does this give them permission to start demolition right away or do they still need further approval? 

Going through the HCB packet, there's an update on the findlay market garage. It's on page 99. Looks pretty like it was better than what we saw previously, in my opinion.

 

Edited October 28, 20213 yr by RealAdamP
Confused this for a different project.

Better, but the fake Italianate still needs to go.

I like it! I don’t mind the fake Italianette as long as the materials are not cheap.

 

Better than an alien spaceship landing in otr  with no respect for its surroundings.

 

 

I'm surprised there isn't more pushback on closing off Logan.

1 minute ago, JohnClevesSymmes said:

I'm surprised there isn't more pushback on closing off Logan.

There was (and continues to be) a lot of opposition due to losing that portion of the right of way and streetgrid. 

I've been thinking more about the potential redesign of Central Parkway. Initially, my sense was that Central Parkway was already "mostly built out" and would be nice but not have much potential to spur new development. But I took a look at development opportunities between City Hall and Elder St... and there's a lot of opportunity. I'm including the northern portion of Plum Street here just since it follows a straight line with Central Parkway, and there are a lot of surface lots in that area. 

 

Further south, there are a LOT of surface parking lots. 

 

Blue: surface parking

Green: projects underway or announced

Yellow: sites that could be repurposed/redeveloped

Orange: FCC owned

 

 

Apologies for the small font size... hopefully it's legible at 100% zoom. 

im glad you guys started thinking about developing central parkway. parking garage gets my ok. the proposed hotel looks good even though the old building between the hotels is silly. Unless it was turned into an 19th century breakfast area for the hotel. Way to many surface parking lots. Seems that multi storey parking would attract more interest. I never thought about getting rid of the mid street garden areas (the median). But wide sidewalks next to the buildings, then garden, then five traffic lanes in the center would make a great european blvd (option d see above)  Add a few sculptures: sacred cows, an ape, and a few old goats should do the trick.

4 hours ago, RJohnson said:

Add a few sculptures: sacred cows, an ape, and a few old goats should do the trick.

 

I...

7 hours ago, Troeros2 said:

I like it! I don’t mind the fake Italianette as long as the materials are not cheap.

 

Better than an alien spaceship landing in otr  with no respect for its surroundings.

 

 

why is everything so binary with you when it comes to building in OTR? There are options in between fake Italianate and Alien Spaceship.

A lot of options.

3cdc updated their upcoming project website and added the Findlay rec center project. 
 

Seems like we are getting close to having something commence..hopefully early next year? 

The Boys and Girls club is now completely gone (though the old swimming pool still needs to be filled in/removed). I  hope we see some foundation equipment showing up soon as this project has been sitting idle for way too long.

The 

Just a reminder that this $85m+ fully permitted mixed use project is on hold due to OTR Adopt / Klingler lawsuit challenging the Historic Conservation approval.

 

7 hours ago, lumpy said:

Just a reminder that this $85m+ fully permitted mixed use project is on hold due to OTR Adopt / Klingler lawsuit challenging the Historic Conservation approval.

 

How can an average citizen push back against NIMBYs like this?

My guess would be some sunlight in the media, inclusive of organized input from the affected parties (Findlay Market business community, area residents, etc.), an understanding of the motives of OTR Adapt and Sean Suder as lawyer, and maybe even a stated position from OTRCC disavowing the stall tactics.

It would probably set bad precedent, and I'm not a lawyer so it might not even work; but could a developer countersue for damages caused by delaying a project? Like if the case gets thrown out down the road, could they countersue saying "we would've collected x number of months rent that you now owe us"? 

Edited November 12, 20213 yr by ucgrady