On 5/22/2022 at 6:11 PM, jim uber said:

I live nearly next door to the OTRCH Jimmy Heath house which seems to be a model for the Dunlap project (but about half the size). Folks who live there are constantly drinking and using drugs in public. This seems to be fine with OTRCH. I’ve had an adjacent property broken into by a resident; he was caught on camera and went to jail. 
 

My understanding is these are not addiction treatment facilities; they are housing for addicts who often have a variety of other problems. They wouldn’t be denied treatment options if they asked for them, but participating in them is not required for continued residency. 
 

i really couldn’t care less if someone thought me a Neanderthal Boomer for not wanting a facility like this as an immediate neighbor. Most people would agree with me if in my shoes. Once after talking about the problems with OTRCH, a senior staff member suggested that maybe I should move. So from their perspective I guess I am a type of blight on their vision. 

 

I’m very sorry to hear you’re having this bad experience with OTRCH and their answer is that you should move. 

On 5/27/2022 at 2:48 PM, Ucgrad2015 said:

So are we basically calling Liberty and Elm dead? If this was somewhere tucked back into OTR I wouldn’t be as upset but this is such a prime corner and will really activate that section of OTR. I’d hate for it to just sit empty as I’m assuming it will if Liberty and Elm doesn’t happen. 

Is Liberty and Elm dead? Did the NIMBYs win?

On 5/20/2022 at 11:57 AM, Chas Wiederhold said:

I have a feel like option A is the best option for a few reasons.

1) It's the densest option leaving more room for growth or more outdoor space. 

2) It reconnects Republic Street from what I can see, via a pedestrian path allowing for better connectivity

3) It completes the Vine Street street wall.

 

I think more outdoor space is fantastic for the folks who live around this part of the city. I go to a gym down the street and I am wondering if we would be able to access the outdoor space for outdoor workouts.

Agreed 

12 hours ago, 1400 Sycamore said:

No, I didn't say anything like that.

 

I think there is a chance, however remote, that the lawyers who represent the developer do not know that memoranda contra to objections must be filed within 10 days after the objections.

 

Sometimes, when the stakes are small and the outcome black and white an opposing party might be smug enough to ignore objections and let the Judge sort it out. Like when a person objects to a garnishment order. I would never have ignored objections. But, I suppose it could happen.

 

But, not with this much at stake.

 

Its either a stipulation extending time to respond or a mistake.

I tend to think if you miss a deadline like this and cause your case to get thrown out, heads will roll. 
I would assume some sort of extension was given by the judge and just not published on record

15 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I tend to think if you miss a deadline like this and cause your case to get thrown out, heads will roll. 
I would assume some sort of extension was given by the judge and just not published on record

I doubt that is a possibility. A request to extend time to the Court only happens if the other lawyer would not agree and they always agree if asked. In the rare situation where a lawyer refuses to extend, a request to the Court comes from a motion which is always filed. Between lawyers HCCP does not require a motion. The lawyers can stipulate an extension of not more than 28 days on their own. But, any sensible lawyer would then file a copy of the stipulation. It could be a stipulation that they didn't file. But that would be pretty negligent because the Judge might rule on the objections before the developer files its responses. That sort of casual practice occurs, but not usually with multiple parties and not usually when the stakes are high. If this was just a handshake deal among the lawyers to extend, what if one of them gets run over or fired by the client?

 

This is a puzzle all right. It will be interesting to see how it turns out.

Edited May 29, 20223 yr by 1400 Sycamore

 Considering who the developer’s attorney is, I would not be too worried. He is pretty seasoned around town. I would be more concerned if the developer was trying to rely on out of state counsel or out of the city counsel as some developers have in the past and have gotten their short handed to them. There are a number of out of town companies that will hire a Cleveland or Columbus attorney to represent them on a Cincinnati matter and their lack of experience in the local courthouse is quite detrimental to them 

Apartment building on Republic street that is part of Wilkommen. Used to be an empty lot. I think they killed it with the infill projects for Wilkommen and I’d love to see them continue these kinds of infills for affordable housing. 

Edited May 29, 20223 yr by Ucgrad2015

On 5/27/2022 at 11:36 PM, 1400 Sycamore said:

2. Mary Rivers OTRCH testified under oath that the lot netted $60,000 after expenses per year for the 24 spaces. That averages $200/mo per space.

Wow. We really need a parking tax in this city.

On 5/27/2022 at 11:36 PM, 1400 Sycamore said:

1. You are wrong. It was full today as it is at least some hours most days.

2. Mary Rivers OTRCH testified under oath that the lot netted $60,000 after expenses per year for the 24 spaces. That averages $200/mo per space. If that is not a full parking lot perhaps you can say what is.

3. I believe that an owner can do anything legal with his property. But, can I have an opinion about it? Apparently not according to you. Will you hold your opinion if the owner wants to put a single family residence on a corner lot in OTR with a nice two car detached garage? I'm guessing no.

 

1. Cool. It was full when you saw it and it is never full when I park there. Both can be true.

 

2. I don't know what the amount of money made on it has to do with whether it is at capacity? You realize that is silly right? I don't doubt that it makes tons of money. 

 

3. I was just genuinely curious what your opinion on this is. Of course you can dislike it. Just seems like a weird thing to get up in arms about.

 

 

cross posted from Beer News Thread

 

New Moerlein owner plans $30 million overhaul of historic OTR brewery buildings, may revive old brands

By Andy Brownfield  –  Senior staff reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier

May 31, 2022

 

The new owner of Cincinnati Beverage Co., home of beer brands like Christian Moerlein and Little Kings, plans a $30 million renovation of three historic brewery buildings in Over-the-Rhine.

 

John Richardson, chairman of the board of SugarCreek, one of the largest private companies in Cincinnati, acquired Cincinnati Beverage Co. in early May. The Cincinnati Beverage Co. is being operated as its own company separate from SugarCreek.

 

In addition to taking over the Cincinnati Beverage Co., which oversees brands like Christian Moerlein, Hudepohl, Shoenling, Little Kings and 30 other historic beer names, the group has begun renovating three historic brewery buildings in Over-the-Rhine – Clyffside Brewery, Felsenhaus and the Jackson Brewery – an undertaking what Richardson said would entail more than $30 million in investment.

 

MORE

 

10 minutes ago, The_Cincinnati_Kid said:

cross posted from Beer News Thread

 

New Moerlein owner plans $30 million overhaul of historic OTR brewery buildings, may revive old brands

By Andy Brownfield  –  Senior staff reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier

May 31, 2022

 

The new owner of Cincinnati Beverage Co., home of beer brands like Christian Moerlein and Little Kings, plans a $30 million renovation of three historic brewery buildings in Over-the-Rhine.

 

John Richardson, chairman of the board of SugarCreek, one of the largest private companies in Cincinnati, acquired Cincinnati Beverage Co. in early May. The Cincinnati Beverage Co. is being operated as its own company separate from SugarCreek.

 

In addition to taking over the Cincinnati Beverage Co., which oversees brands like Christian Moerlein, Hudepohl, Shoenling, Little Kings and 30 other historic beer names, the group has begun renovating three historic brewery buildings in Over-the-Rhine – Clyffside Brewery, Felsenhaus and the Jackson Brewery – an undertaking what Richardson said would entail more than $30 million in investment.

 

MORE

Hell yea, will be so cool to not only see these buildings revitalized, but also returned to something similar to their original uses. Money quote:

Quote

There's really no greater satisfaction than bringing something back from the edge and putting it back together and making it beautiful again," Richardson told me. "What others may see as, 'Christ, have you lost your mind?' I think this is a real opportunity to do something pretty neat."

 

Excited to see what the future holds not just for these buildings, but for CinBev and all it's holdings under SugarCreek's ownership.

Edited May 31, 20223 yr by dnymck

1 hour ago, The_Cincinnati_Kid said:

cross posted from Beer News Thread

 

New Moerlein owner plans $30 million overhaul of historic OTR brewery buildings, may revive old brands

By Andy Brownfield  –  Senior staff reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier

May 31, 2022

 

The new owner of Cincinnati Beverage Co., home of beer brands like Christian Moerlein and Little Kings, plans a $30 million renovation of three historic brewery buildings in Over-the-Rhine.

 

John Richardson, chairman of the board of SugarCreek, one of the largest private companies in Cincinnati, acquired Cincinnati Beverage Co. in early May. The Cincinnati Beverage Co. is being operated as its own company separate from SugarCreek.

 

In addition to taking over the Cincinnati Beverage Co., which oversees brands like Christian Moerlein, Hudepohl, Shoenling, Little Kings and 30 other historic beer names, the group has begun renovating three historic brewery buildings in Over-the-Rhine – Clyffside Brewery, Felsenhaus and the Jackson Brewery – an undertaking what Richardson said would entail more than $30 million in investment.

 

MORE

Just ran by all of these buildings over the weekend and saw some more activity. New portalets, updating fencing, cleared land, etc. Especially the Jackson Brewery. Very exciting to see!

3 new operating renovated breweries can be such a boost for north of Liberty. For it being a brewery District there’s maybe less than 5 actual breweries to actually go to.

On 5/28/2022 at 11:22 PM, Brutus_buckeye said:

 Considering who the developer’s attorney is, I would not be too worried. He is pretty seasoned around town. I would be more concerned if the developer was trying to rely on out of state counsel or out of the city counsel as some developers have in the past and have gotten their short handed to them. There are a number of out of town companies that will hire a Cleveland or Columbus attorney to represent them on a Cincinnati matter and their lack of experience in the local courthouse is quite detrimental to them 

Well, they did file a reply to the objections today. A week late, I think, with no explanation or stipulation of extension. So, probably no harm, no foul. Case goes on. Will the Judge (Lisa Allen) schedule this for oral argument or just overrule the objections? Matters not except for delay. Either way, then on to the Court of Appeals.

 

(I can provide the brief from the developer's attorney but it is not anything to write home about.)

19 minutes ago, 1400 Sycamore said:

Well, they did file a reply to the objections today. A week late, I think, with no explanation or stipulation of extension. So, probably no harm, no foul. Case goes on. Will the Judge (Lisa Allen) schedule this for oral argument or just overrule the objections? Matters not except for delay. Either way, then on to the Court of Appeals.

 

(I can provide the brief from the developer's attorney but it is not anything to write home about.)

Is there a legal end to this? How many times can someone appeal for something like this? When people commit every day crimes they can typically only appeal once after getting sentenced. 

Don’t understand how the legal loophole allows someone to constantly appeal endlessly without a end in sight.

 

6 hours ago, Troeros2 said:

Is there a legal end to this? How many times can someone appeal for something like this? When people commit every day crimes they can typically only appeal once after getting sentenced. 

Don’t understand how the legal loophole allows someone to constantly appeal endlessly without a end in sight.

 

Criminal cases are not necessarily over with one appeal. It depends on how much effort one puts into it.

 

Troeros2, have a look at this timeline for the history of a rather minor criminal act by Judge Tracie Hunter.

 

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/crime/crime-and-courts/2019/07/24/what-did-tracie-hunter-do-explained-and-timeline-jail/1814169001/

 

This is the world of the possible in a small criminal case.

On 5/31/2022 at 2:08 PM, The_Cincinnati_Kid said:

cross posted from Beer News Thread

 

New Moerlein owner plans $30 million overhaul of historic OTR brewery buildings, may revive old brands

By Andy Brownfield  –  Senior staff reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier

May 31, 2022

 

The new owner of Cincinnati Beverage Co., home of beer brands like Christian Moerlein and Little Kings, plans a $30 million renovation of three historic brewery buildings in Over-the-Rhine.

I'm late seeing this but this is incredible news. When it was leaked that they were buying CinBev I hoped that they would renovate the Clyffside brewery but I never thought they would renovate all three buildings at once. This will go incredibly far in making the Brewery District feel more like a district and along with the redesign of Grant Park and Findlay Playground the Northern Liberties are really going to improve in the next few years. Can't wait to see what they have in store for each building, especially Jackson Brewery which had so much potential before the fire and I'm curious what will become of it. 

Hamilton County will save millions on Findlay Market garage

By Chris Wetterich  –  Staff reporter and columnist, Cincinnati Business Courier

Jun 3, 2022

 

Hamilton County will get millions from the state for its Findlay Market garage project, money that will allow it to use local parking revenue for something else.

 

MORE

Good news, hopefully the port can use the money from the Banks down there to finish the undeveloped blocks or even start the FWW caps. Seems like the money from the Banks should stay at/near the Banks.

Edited June 3, 20223 yr by ucgrady

Sorry to double post. Walking around today I saw that the JB Schmitt door was open today to give a peak inside. It looks like whatever they are doing is pretty far along.

On 5/31/2022 at 11:03 PM, 1400 Sycamore said:

Well, they did file a reply to the objections today. A week late, I think, with no explanation or stipulation of extension. So, probably no harm, no foul. Case goes on. Will the Judge (Lisa Allen) schedule this for oral argument or just overrule the objections? Matters not except for delay. Either way, then on to the Court of Appeals.

 

(I can provide the brief from the developer's attorney but it is not anything to write home about.)

The City also filed a brief in opposition to the objections. So, the beat goes on.

I noticed on Saturday night there was a cop blockade that closed off main st in otr. Didn’t seem like it was crime related just traffic related. Don’t know if this was a common occurrence or just occurs on weekends when Main st gets busy.

9 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

I noticed on Saturday night there was a cop blockade that closed off main st in otr. Didn’t seem like it was crime related just traffic related. Don’t know if this was a common occurrence or just occurs on weekends when Main st gets busy.

 

Your answer could be in this real time twitter thread from that night:

 

 

 

Police presence on Main Street is common on weekends due to the college party-like atmosphere that continues to exist there.

 

49 minutes ago, JYP said:

 

Your answer could be in this real time twitter thread from that night:

 

 

 

 

That thread is pretty crazy. I still say we need to convert Main (and Walnut) to two-way.

1 hour ago, taestell said:

That thread is pretty crazy. I still say we need to convert Main (and Walnut) to two-way.

 

 

Well if you made both Main and Walnut two-way, it would be easy to close Main Street to auto traffic (say, from Central Parkway to 14th) on Friday and Saturday nights. I don't like the idea of making it permanently ped-only and don't think most businesses and residents on the street would support that idea.

I usually drive up Main on my way home from Reds games.  We went on Friday last week and in my 5 minute drive I could tell this is exactly how it always is.  I was worried I'd hit someone crossing at any minute.  But my takeaway isn't that the crowds are too rowdy, it was that visibility isn't great.  The parked cars before the bump-outs usually block my view into whether someone is trying to cross.  So I'm left waiting until I'm at the crosswalk to determine whether i need to stop or not.  It's just not a great setup with the parking.

 

Of course, businesses won't give that parking up though, so here we are.

Edited June 6, 20223 yr by 10albersa

Why don’t they make Main Street like the segment that is currently at the banks where it’s pedestrian only? Seems to be working well for the banks?

12 minutes ago, Troeros2 said:

Why don’t they make Main Street like the segment that is currently at the banks where it’s pedestrian only? Seems to be working well for the banks?

 

I think it would hurt businesses during the week when there isn't much going on on Main Street. Plus make life harder for all the people living there. And there are four bus routes that use Main that would need to be changed (could be fixed easily with making Walnut two-way). But making Main a ped-only street on weekend nights seems like a no-brainer. 

48 minutes ago, DEPACincy said:

But making Main a ped-only street on weekend nights seems like a no-brainer. 

 

Dayton has been doing that for years on 5th Street in the Oregon District.  It's a no-brainer to turn Main Street into ped-only for those nights.

11 minutes ago, ColDayMan said:

 

Dayton has been doing that for years on 5th Street in the Oregon District.  It's a no-brainer to turn Main Street into ped-only for those nights.

Agree, start it at Main and 12th and run it up to Liberty being pedestrian only on Friday and Saturday evenings. 

3 hours ago, taestell said:

Well if you made both Main and Walnut two-way, it would be easy to close Main Street to auto traffic (say, from Central Parkway to 14th) on Friday and Saturday nights. I don't like the idea of making it permanently ped-only and don't think most businesses and residents on the street would support that idea.

The short stretch of Walnut north of Liberty is supposed to go 2 way, Planning Commission approved on March 4. Not sure if it got sent to council yet.

4 hours ago, Troeros2 said:

Why don’t they make Main Street like the segment that is currently at the banks where it’s pedestrian only? Seems to be working well for the banks?

 

Freedom Way at The Banks is not a thru street and isn't used by any bus routes. I also don't think we want to turn Main Street into The Banks with a 24/7 party atmosphere. Many of the investments made on Main Street in recent years have been part of an effort to move away from that and make it more of a Vine Street-like mix of office, residential, and higher end bars/restaurants/shops. It only really gets crazy on Friday and Saturday nights and I would be fine with it becoming ped-only during those specific times.

On 6/3/2022 at 3:25 PM, ucgrady said:

Sorry to double post. Walking around today I saw that the JB Schmitt door was open today to give a peak inside. It looks like whatever they are doing is pretty far along.

 

There is a new IG account for this space: https://www.instagram.com/alice.otr_/

On 6/6/2022 at 12:40 PM, DEPACincy said:

I think it would hurt businesses during the week when there isn't much going on on Main Street. Plus make life harder for all the people living there. And there are four bus routes that use Main that would need to be changed (could be fixed easily with making Walnut two-way). But making Main a ped-only street on weekend nights seems like a no-brainer. 

I just want there to be an actual plan with all of the major changes coming soon to the core. It would theoretically be fine to close Main and reroute buses, but adding even more turns to some of our most frequent routes, after the effort it took to get an already-mostly not-enforced bus lane, seems like a waste of operating and travel efficiency and reduces clarity of the routes if it's weekend-only.

 

I'm not saying we should delay any pedestrian improvements until BRT is rolled out but it would be nice to know there was collaboration between DOTE and Metro to say hey, here's the streets we're actually changing to two-way, here's the ones we're not, here's some options we can close to create a plaza, here would be a great bus-priority route, and here's where we're putting bike infrastructure. IIRC that was sort of the purpose of the Downtown Pedestrian Task Force but it would be nice to have buses be at the forefront of the conversation, not an afterthought, for once. 

On 6/6/2022 at 12:40 PM, DEPACincy said:

 

I think it would hurt businesses during the week when there isn't much going on on Main Street. Plus make life harder for all the people living there. And there are four bus routes that use Main that would need to be changed (could be fixed easily with making Walnut two-way). But making Main a ped-only street on weekend nights seems like a no-brainer. 

Sorry for the long, probably unorganized post that's going to follow.

 

I strongly disagree, living in the area (two blocks away from The Hub and the crosswalk in question) I can count the number of times a day that I almost get hit by a car either on 12th or Main. I've also made eye contact with drivers as they speed up to avoid waiting 30 seconds. Two weeks ago a car hit a building two doors down from me as they drunkenly speed down 12th (a residential street) to get to I-71. Myself and many of my neighbors refuse to walk our dogs to the bathroom after a certain time because on any nice day you can stand and watch car after car blow through all stop signs and red lights headed to the highway.

 

I've also been in direct communication with the city about the issues, including being escalated to the mayor's office, between this and the attention The Hub has received it's hard to imagine change not coming. Something has to give because it's truly getting out of hand.

 

I would love to see the city invest in as many deterrents as possible to slow traffic and make it harder for people to drive. As far as the busses, I'd be supportive of moving bus routes to Sycamore, a block away since it is already a two-way road, and closing a section of Main permanently. 

 

To be completely honest, my life will be much easier knowing that I can walk through a cross walk to go to Kroger without having to worry about getting hit by a car.

47 minutes ago, CBustoCincy said:

Sorry for the long, probably unorganized post that's going to follow.

 

I strongly disagree, living in the area (two blocks away from The Hub and the crosswalk in question) I can count the number of times a day that I almost get hit by a car either on 12th or Main. I've also made eye contact with drivers as they speed up to avoid waiting 30 seconds. Two weeks ago a car hit a building two doors down from me as they drunkenly speed down 12th (a residential street) to get to I-71. Myself and many of my neighbors refuse to walk our dogs to the bathroom after a certain time because on any nice day you can stand and watch car after car blow through all stop signs and red lights headed to the highway.

 

I've also been in direct communication with the city about the issues, including being escalated to the mayor's office, between this and the attention The Hub has received it's hard to imagine change not coming. Something has to give because it's truly getting out of hand.

 

I would love to see the city invest in as many deterrents as possible to slow traffic and make it harder for people to drive. As far as the busses, I'd be supportive of moving bus routes to Sycamore, a block away since it is already a two-way road, and closing a section of Main permanently. 

 

To be completely honest, my life will be much easier knowing that I can walk through a cross walk to go to Kroger without having to worry about getting hit by a car.

Just moved from my condo at 14th and Main. Can confirm this was a daily occurrence at 14th. People run lights on main without even looking frequently. I witnessed this multiple times daily. Cars stopped and parked in crosswalks, and not yielding to pedestrians in the raised crosswalks as well. Police officers included.

Well come over to 14th and Sycamore if you want to see some speed. No speed humps and a straight shot down the hill. Serious reckless driving.

2 hours ago, 1400 Sycamore said:

Well come over to 14th and Sycamore if you want to see some speed. No speed humps and a straight shot down the hill. Serious reckless driving.

I walk the area daily, the entire area from  around Liberty, Central, Main, and Reading need to be improved dramatically. This by no means should be about what street is worse than each other, but should be focused on how the roads are increasingly less safe for pedestrians in the area.

Hey UO Cincinnati folks did the old Davis furniture building store at Main and 12th partially collapse? Hearing rumbling of building failure. Seeing if anyone is in the area.

 

Update: The Davis Building did have a partial collapse along the south wall

Edited June 12, 20223 yr by savadams13

44 minutes ago, savadams13 said:

Hey UO Cincinnati folks did the old Davis furniture building store at Main and 12th partially collapse? Hearing rumbling of building failure. Seeing if anyone is in the area.

 

Update: The Davis Building did have a partial collapse along the south wall

Have a feeling this is going to be the need of that building sadly. What’s the whole story behind the building? I’m sure there have been many people trying to buy and renovate that building but am assuming the owners just would not sell. Sad that the city lets these owners just sit on these buildings with no plan to renovate or at least keep them up to code. 

facebook link with photo

So does the owner have to knock it down? Shore it up? The streetcar will be blocked for weeks! Fortunately it was second Sunday and there weren't people underneath or parked there.

Wish I saw this earlier. I had the drone up this morning but went north and east. Maybe Monday.

Dilapidated historic building in Over-the-Rhine partially collapses

Jeanne Houck

Cincinnati Enquirer

 

A dilapidated historic building in Over-the-Rhine whose future has been a source of contention has partially collapsed.

 

That’s according to the Cincinnati Fire Department and a post on the Facebook page of Cincinnati Streetcar, which says the streetcar is shut down due to the collapse at the former Davis Furniture building on Main Street.

 

The long-vacant building is at a streetcar stop.

 

MORE

It’s gotta be coming down soon.

The city should sue them and take the property. They should not be rewarded for negligence

13 hours ago, ryanlammi said:

The city should sue them and take the property. They should not be rewarded for negligence

I hope this changes things with our new mayor. It really grinds my gears that the historic conservation board can give it all their night to get a new development killed because it doesn’t exactly meet their standards but on buildings like these that need rehabbed desperately they don’t seem to care. I’m assuming this will just become a parking lot.
 

I could see 3cdc buying this plot and possibly the one to the north and to the south and doing the same thing they did with the old kroger. 

3CDC offered to buy the building several years ago and rehab it. The owner refused to sell because he wants a parking lot at that location. After the city refused to grant permission to demolish the building, he made a bet that the demolition-by-neglect strategy would work, and it looks like it finally did.

 

15 hours ago, ryanlammi said:

The city should sue them and take the property. They should not be rewarded for negligence

 

The only thing I can see the city realistically doing is denying permission to build a parking lot there. Kinda like with the Dennison where the city ordered an emergency demolition, but did not let them build a parking lot there, so we ended up with the fake park.

He should be fined for blocking the streetcar tracks and causing the downtown loop to be shut down for several days, though.

Not to go off topic but why can’t we seem to get someone to built something like this in OTR. I know their would be a fight due to the height but even a shorter building would look nice and feel like it would mostly fit into the neighborhood. Imo columbus’ new builds are much more attractive than the ones going up in Cincinnati. 
https://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2022/06/13/long-street-project-follow-up.html

Edited June 13, 20223 yr by Ucgrad2015