I understand what you are saying about the stoops but put that in context of the issues we were having to confront just a few short years ago in and around that same block.  Hopefully with the park redevelopment that starts this fall and SCPA, even issues like this will become more and more rare.

I understand what you are saying about the stoops but put that in context of the issues we were having to confront just a few short years ago in and around that same block. Hopefully with the park redevelopment that starts this fall and SCPA, even issues like this will become more and more rare.

Oh I totally agree, I just try not to be confrontational.  If nothing else, I could do without the trash that usually gets left behind.

There are a group of homeless at the corner of 12th and Clay that have been causing trouble as of late. They started out as peaceful homeless individuals at the corner of a shuttered bar (closed last fall), but the building has since been vandalized several times over since then. The homeless also go through the trash and recyclables, and literally throw the trash onto Clay. I come home at night a lot, and the entire road can be littered with debris and trash and is really unslightly.

They've also been tearing all the plants out of planters on Vine St- there is absolutely no reason for this....just to vandalize.

I think these homeless people are pissed because the neighborhood is getting fixed up and they can't stand looking at pretty things;) 

They've also been tearing all the plants out of planters on Vine St- there is absolutely no reason for this....just to vandalize.

I am sure a big portion of it is vandalism but it may also be our friendly neighborhood plant thief. I was hit by him last weekend and he tends to strike Sunday mornings and sells the plants outside of Findlay Market.  If anyone wants a good pic of the guy, let me know.

I'd be more than happy to do that. I have a great super-telephoto lens with VR (150-500) that's fast.

Does anybody know the status of the Senate?  Are they still looking to open in September?  Also, the empty space next to it in the Q?  Just curious.

 

 

July 21, 2009

 

 

3CDC unveils Web site redesign

 

By Lisa Bernard-Kuhn

[email protected]

 

Cincinnati Center City Development Corp. has unveiled a redesigned Web site at www.3cdc.org.

 

Mount Washington-based Stanard Design Partners and Atlas Design & Technology of Green Township were tapped by the nonprofit development group to lead the effort.

 

The new site features recent residential and commercial projects by 3CDC, including the redeveloped Fountain Square, Over-the-Rhine’s Gateway Quarter and highlights from a proposal to renovate Washington Park.

 

The home page also features a project scrollbar, allowing visitors to browse a variety of 3CDC projects.

 

Stanard Design also recently redesigned the Cincinnati Visitors Bureau Web site at www.cincyusa.com. Other clients include Cincinnati-based KAO Brands.

 

 

First off, I'd like to say that I love OTR.  I walk the neighborhood frequently and it is beautiful in many ways.  I particularly enjoy the architecture and sense of history.  I can envision what life was like in 1880 when I walk her streets.

 

I'd like to play devil's advocate for a moment.

 

If OTR was revitalized, it would be a hip spot for people aged 20-35.  It would be a functioning neighborhood:  walkable, convenient, and upper-class. 

 

Let's assume that OTR rises again:  What would this do to Hyde Park, Oakley, the Gaslight District,and other parts of city that currently target the same demographic? 

 

Do we really believe that the pie will get larger and that these neighborhoods will retain their identities as OTR rises?

 

First off, I'd like to say that I love OTR. I walk the neighborhood frequently and it is beautiful in many ways. I particularly enjoy the architecture and sense of history. I can envision what life was like in 1880 when I walk her streets.

 

I'd like to play devil's advocate for a moment.

 

If OTR was revitalized, it would be a hip spot for people aged 20-35. It would be a functioning neighborhood: walkable, convenient, and upper-class.

 

Let's assume that OTR rises again: What would this do to Hyde Park, Oakley, the Gaslight District,and other parts of city that currently target the same demographic?

 

Do we really believe that the pie will get larger and that these neighborhoods will retain their identities as OTR rises?

 

 

Question 1: Help them through step migration.  There are tremendous numbers of 20-35s in the suburbs that likely not make the direct move to OTR, but would be more likely to move to Oakley/Hyde Park.  The people moving from the East Side to OTR would be replaced by people moving into the East Side from the suburbs. 

 

Question 2: Yes

Yes, absolutely. The pie will get larger for those neighborhoods.

 

Revitalization isn't a zero-sum-game. Like thomasbw said, there are plenty of suburbanites who also considered moving to Hyde Park/Oakley/Mt Lookout. It's an extremely desirable area, and anyone who leaves will be quickly replaced. Indeed, since the neighborhood is so heavily populated with corporate transplants, you can see this phenomenon every year. There's quite a bit of turnover in places like Hyde Park. But the new P&Gers replace the old ones ;)

 

Furthermore, a gentrified OTR would be a totally new market segment for Cincinnati. The only neighborhood that compares might be Mt Adams - and it's easy to see how much the demand outstrips the supply for those units. Young professionals live all over the suburbs, and I think many of them would be attracted to a revitalized OTR.

 

If anything, the neighborhoods that suffer from OTR's success would probably be on the Westside. That's where the negative elements from OTR will move, so places like Price Hill and Westwood will decline even further. But I really can't see any risk to the Eastside.

 

It's not like Cincy's neighborhoods are all competing for a finite resource of 350,000 people. There are over 2 million people in the metro area, and plenty of them are willing to live in a nice urban neighborhood if it becomes gentrified. (Although yeah, it will trend towards people without children).

 

Question 1: Help them through step migration.  There are tremendous numbers of 20-35s in the suburbs that likely not make the direct move to OTR, but would be more likely to move to Oakley/Hyde Park.  The people moving from the East Side to OTR would be replaced by people moving into the East Side from the suburbs.

 

Take me for example.  I graduated from UC in 2007 in computer engineering and I got a good job.  I was born and raised on the west side. 

 

I graduated during the housing boom.  I was pre-approved for a mortgage of $125,000 and I didn't have a steady job.  I decided not to buy a $110,000 condo in OTR even though it is my favorite neighborhood in the city.  Instead I rent in Oakley for $440 a month and I get better amenities and less crime (statistically).

 

What happens to Oakley and Hyde Park when people like myself choose to live in OTR instead?  Net property tax revenue may marginally increase, but what is the real benefit to the city?

 

In response to the second question, The Cincinnati Metro has grown at a very slow rate for a very long period of time.  Where are the additional people coming from in your model? 

HeHateMe - With all due respect, you are incorrectly viewing this as a zero-sum-game, when it is not.

 

In response to the second question, The Cincinnati Metro has grown at a very slow rate for a very long period of time.  Where are the additional people coming from in your model?

 

When looking at the entire metro - yes, then there will probably be neighborhoods that lose. Like I said before, it will almost certainly be the Westside. If the Section 8 folks clear out of OTR and move to Price Hill and Westwood, the remaining money in these neighborhoods (and it's still there) will eventually relocate elsewhere within the metro. Sure, some might move to the suburbs, but others will relocate within the city.

 

Also, don't underestimate the difficulty that the major corporations have in recruiting young people to come to Cincinnati. A gentrified OTR would make Cincy infinitely more attractive to young professionals, which then has a huge spillover effect in how these corporations allocate their office workers. (i.e. a gentrified OTR means more office space will be built in the CBD because the whole area has suddenly become more attractive.)

 

HeHateMe - With all due respect, you are incorrectly viewing this as a zero-sum-game, when it is not.

 

 

I understand this.  I use this forum as a source of news.  You guys are great.

 

I just want to know how you can populate OTR and the banks with affluent people without having a detrimental effect on Oakley, Hyde Park, and the Gaslight District.

Sorry, I guess I'm not really good at explaining it without repeating the phrase "zero sum game" a hundred times ;)

 

Let me put it this way - there are literally thousands of young professionals who thought about living in Hp/Ok/Mtl but (for whatever reason: price, availability, etc.) ended up living in Kenwood or Covington or wherever. So there is plenty of demand to fill up the units for people who might leave for the core.

 

At worst, it would be the lesser neighborhoods that would eventually feel negative effects from a shifting population. Or perhaps the exurban neighborhoods would suffer if gas prices rise again, and their depopulation would further buoy the city.

It is interesting because we seem to be repeating some mistakes from the past.

 

In Miller's 'Changing Plans for America's Inner Cities', the author describes Cincinnati's urban renewal programs of the forties and fifties.  The slums in the West End were cleared in favor of highways and industrial/business purposes imposed by strict city zoning.

 

Not only did the strategy not attract industry, but it resulted in the terrible living conditions for the poor brought on by newly established public housing initiatives.  The programs displaced far more than they housed, resulting in a new ghetto near avondale.

 

Given this historical presidence, it is important to ask ourselves:  What effects may occur that are not immediately seen by our actions?

It is interesting because we seem to be repeating some mistakes from the past.

In Miller's 'Changing Plans for America's Inner Cities', the author describes Cincinnati's urban renewal programs of the forties and fifties. The slums in the West End were cleared in favor of highways and industrial/business purposes imposed by strict city zoning.

I do not see where the progress being made by 3CDC is in any way repeating what you described above, if anything, it is a reversal. We just attracted Dunnhumby with over 500 employees. We just attracted an Iams move by P&G with over 650 employees. We are attracting people to the Quarter who may have chosen to either stay in rental or move out of the area entirely. The Quarter is in many ways creating markets that did not exist and that goes beyond residential. It is encouraging moves due to proximity and style as well as having a ripple effect to businesses that can now be supported by what is becoming a viable neighborhood once again.

Neighborhoods are dynamic, they are constantly changing, competing, and evolving into something better or worse. This goes for all neighborhood, all the time. Would the people in the Q have bought in one of the neighborhoods you mentioned, perhaps, perhaps not, but is the Q making OTR and the CBD by extension a more viable place for people to live and business to locate from both inside the City and abroad?...Absolutely.

So we are attracting jobs, we are attracting residents, we are reducing crime, we are affecting the entire cities image and these are the affects that are being seen by our actions. In more ways than one, the efforts being put into both OTR and the CBD have a net positive effect on Oakley, Hyde Park, MTL and every other community that is interdependent on the success of the core.

I would say that Covington might actually have the most to lose from a vibrant OTR since it has the other fantastic stock of century+ urban neighborhoods. The first ring eastside 'burbs problem is mostly one of housing cost - it becomes increasingly hard for young upwardly mobile families to move in. The NE neighborhoods are benefitting from this to some degree as they are more affordable still. There isn't enough folks in OTR to get to displaced to seriously harm another 'hood. The only question is where the drug markets might move. I could see St. Bernard/Avondale hit harder @ Mitchell or Camp Washington or similar places just off the expressway. It could also make the West End even harder to build back up.

In regards to Hyde Park and Oakley area, I know of someone who recently got a job in the burbs, but wanted to live in the city and reverse-commute because they don't believe in the burbs and would much rather give their taxes to Cincy.  But when looking at properties in Oakley, they were priced out because of their entry level salary and the taxes on those properties.  Instead, for the same prices they found a property around the same price in Norwood but it was leaps and bounds above those properties in Oakley.  So if you think the revitalization of OTR will decrease the value of Oakley, that won't take YPs out of there, but in fact maybe make it even more available. 

I believe Senate is still slated to open in mid to late september, last time i heard there was going to be another restaurant moving in next door to it.

I believe Senate is still slated to open in mid to late september, last time i heard there was going to be another restaurant moving in next door to it.

 

Senate is moving forward. Looking good..they will open up to a sidewalk cafe, which will be elevated a bit to be flush with the restaurant floor. The actual restaurant/bar will not be very large as far as seating goes, but comfortably cozy befitting the neighborhood vibe they're shooting for.  They will also keep better hours, i.e. open until 1 am on weekends.  I heard yesterday from a knowledgeable source that Melt is still moving forward for the location next door, no rush tho.  Sounds like they will have beer and wine as well.

Does anyone know that with the all the work going on to replace the sidewalks up vine street, are all the power lines along the west side of the street going to remain, or has all of that been, or going to be, put underground?

 

Also with all the renovations planned for the 1400 block of vine on the west side of the street, is it just the apartments being renovated or are the remaining businesses on the street level being thrown out and their areas being fixed up as well?

 

are all the power lines along the west side of the street going to remain, or has all of that been, or going to be, put underground?

They will be put underground.

 

is it just the apartments being renovated or are the remaining businesses on the street level being thrown out and their areas being fixed up as well?

For all 3CDC buildings, those are entire building renovations.  Are there buildings that 3CDC does not own in that block and will some businesses remain?, possibly. 

Went walking around this area on a Tuesday afternoon with my mom and sister a few weeks ago. We tried to hit as many of the businesses as we could find. We were one of only 2 small groups of shoppers in the entire stretch of Vine, but we did buy a few things and really enjoyed it. All the renovations were gorgeous. Honestly while inside the stores I felt like I was in Chicago. And the sense of service and ownership you get from independent retailers is of course enormous compared to going to the mall.

 

The only interaction we had with the (quite numerous) poor/homeless people milling about was when a few of them sitting under a stoop told us how to get to one of the stores we were looking for.

 

I think of this little experience often when I read the Enquirer.com article comments. It doesn't even make me angry anymore, just sad. The racism and hatred for urban/progressive issues is so thinly veiled.

hardly thinly veiled!

They know it's socially unacceptable to come right out and do a full-on Michael Richards in a public forum, so they'll perform all sorts of linguistic and mental gymnastics in order to dance right up to that line without actually crossing it.

Amen!  As much as I believe in freedom of speech the overwhelming about of racism and ignorance spewed about on the Enquirer's online comments section almost makes me wish they would shut that feature off.  It's embarassing to think that someone outside of the region reading a story on there must think the majority of Cincinnatians feel that way with how those idiots cheer each other on. 

^It's that way on tons of newspaper websites around the country. 

The actual question is - don't the majority of people in the tri-state think that way?

I don't think so. At least I really hope they don't.

^ I'm pretty sure 99% of comment sections in newspapers all over the internet are filled with trolls, some amusing and some not. 

The comments section is probably the only outlet they have when they're not at their monthly John Birch Society meetings.

Amen! As much as I believe in freedom of speech the overwhelming about of racism and ignorance spewed about on the Enquirer's online comments section almost makes me wish they would shut that feature off. It's embarassing to think that someone outside of the region reading a story on there must think the majority of Cincinnatians feel that way with how those idiots cheer each other on.

 

As much as the Enquirer would LOVE to disable the commenting site-wide, Gannett, their parent company, will not allow them to do that.

They recently hung a "SOLD OUT" sign on one of the 3CDC projects.  Whoever thought of that was brilliant. 

 

There is a dumpster out in front of one of the buildings near Smitty's, maybe work is getting started on it. 

They recently hung a "SOLD OUT" sign on one of the 3CDC projects.  Whoever thought of that was brilliant. 

That started out as a simple sandwich board sign outside of the office.

I think that stuff is really important. For example that clown Tracy Jones claims he's going to "take a look around" OTR this weekend in response to a female caller saying it's safe and she walks around at night by herself.  Also, if someone in their 20's is looking for a condo and needs a parent to cosign, that stuff inspires a lot of confidence.     

^It's that way on tons of newspaper websites around the country.

Of course you are correct about that.  It just gets to me when it's residents of my community being the buffoons. 

 

That being said - and getting back on the point of this thread - if you blindfolded any of those clowns that make all the ridiculous OTR comments and dropped them off in the middle of the Q, they would not even be able to tell you what city they were in spite of "knowing" everything about the area and the people that live there. 

^Your absolutely right.  But I've said it before and I'll say it again.  There are people in Cincinnati that can't stand the city.  They want to see it fail.  They love negative comments because they feed off of it with the mentality of "see I told you so" If they actually set foot in OTR, I'm pretty sure their perception of the place would completely change.

if you blindfolded any of those clowns that make all the ridiculous OTR comments and dropped them off in the middle of the Q, they would not even be able to tell you what city they were in

I am every bit as frustrated at the lack of goodwill coming from people in other parts of our city as it relates to the redevelopment efforts of both the CBD and OTR as anyone on this site. That being said, the sales team at the Q realizes that it is more beneficial to focus on a large percentage of a small group of people who actually get urban living vs striving to simply get a small percentage of the larger group of people who will never give places like OTR a chance. We as a community need to be proactive in countering false information, but do not get caught up in trying to win the hearts and minds of everyone as that will lead to frustration.

700 is anti OTR, always has been, always will be. 550 is much friendlier with Sweeney's show and Brian Tiffany's spot on Brian Thomas' show. Call into 550 and show them support rather than even bothering with 700. Those who tune into City Talk or listen to the Chambers "things to do" are looking for reinforcement in their thinking that Downtown has turned the corner so spend your time there instead on winning that group over entirely vs fighting to change 1 or 2 minds on 700.

Gateway Quarter Tour of Living

 

Start Time: Sunday, September 13 at 12:00pm

End Time: Sunday, September 13 at 5:00pm

 

Come join us for a day filled with fun. The Gateway Tour of Living will feature great new condos and homes and it's FREE! There will be food and drink vendors, street performers, shopping, arts, and ample parking.

 

There will be two registration booths at the corners of 12th and Vine and the other at the corner of 12th and Main.

gatewayquarter.com

UC Classmates’ award winning redesign of Drop Inn Center will compete nationally

http://www.soapboxmedia.com/innovationnews/0818award.aspx

 

A three-person team of UC classmates took the top prize at the 2009 Natural Talent Design Competition sponsored by the Cincinnati chapter of the U.S. Green Building Council  with a redesign of the city’s Drop Inn Center homeless shelter.

 

The trio received a $1,000 cash prize, and will compete with other designers in a national contest at USGBC’s Annual Green Building Conference and Expo in Phoenix Nov. 11-13.

 

Nearly a dozen teams of young professionals and students competed in the Cincinnati contest, which required them to design in accordance with the LEED Green Building Rating System. It was one of more than two-dozen contests that took place across the country from New York City to Los Angeles.

 

The Cincinnati team of Stephanie McBride, Donald Mouch and Corey DiRutigliano won with their creative design which incorporated solar panels and skylights, green space, rain water collection system, radiant floor heating, roof and hanging gardens and more. The design also incorporated the practical elements of the Over-the-Rhine shelter with separate woman’s and men’s dorm facilities, residential recovery units, employee offices and dining area.

 

There are no plans for the winning design to be used at the Center, but potentially it could serve as a starting point if the Drop Inn center is redeveloped.

 

“(The) Drop Inn Center's redesign is structured around assisting the growth of the homeless into employed, self-sufficient adults. The Drop Inn Center should not be constricted to simply being a homeless shelter, but rather should aspire to connect its users with the community and the environment in which they live,” the trio explained in its project submission.

 

The design took about two months to complete, McBride said. The team spent most of that time talking about what the design should include and what statement it should make.

 

“The social aspect of the design was important. We didn’t want to build a bigger center, we wanted to confront the problem (of homelessness) and provide a quality of life for the inhabitants,” said McBride, and Artechture grad working on her MBA at UC.

 

New in Gateway Quarter

http://cincinnati.com/blogs/dining/2009/08/26/new-in-gateway-quarter/

 

A new restaurant will join the small, growing collection of businesses on Vine Street in the Gateway Quarter. Senate will open at 1212 Vine across the street from Lavomatic in mid October. Daniel and Lana Wright are the owners; Daniel the chef and Lana in charge of the front of the house. Wright is a Johnson and Wales-trained chef who has worked in Chicago and Los Angeles. He was executive chef at  Souk in Chicago, where Lana was dining room manager,  before coming here. One of  Senate’s motto is “Eat. Drink. Discuss.”  “I liked the idea of being a forum for families eating, discussing their day. I also loved the idea of the back rooms where politics and business used to get done,” said Wright.  He describes the food as “modern street food,” including gourmet hot dogs. They’ll have unique renditions of the classic, including a Cincinnati, a Chicago, a Trailer Park, and a Korean. The hot dogs, as well as all the pickles, relishes and kim chee will be mae in-house. Also on the menu: bacon-wrapped oysters, lobster BLT sliders, falafel sandwiches. They’ll have craft beers, some to be  found nowhere else in the city, and craft cocktail.  The look will be minimal and modern, but with references to old-school Cincinnati. The oak floor is being made into walls, while the floor gets old-style hexagonal tiles; the sign will be old-fashioned neon. Senate will feature an open kitchen, a sidewalk patio, a communal table. The dining room will hold 50 seats, the patio another 15-20. They’ll serve lunch, be open through the afternoon, and then open with food until 1 a.m on the weekends.

This place sounds great. I honestly cant wait for it to open, Craft Beer and Hotdogs Mmmmmmmm! Wonder if there gonna be open on Sundays though?

This is a really off the wall question, but are they going to use any wood window framing and trim as opposed to the vinyl they seem to be using in every building? I know that there is a large price difference, but it makes it look so much better with wood.

Craft beers and hot dogs?  I can already say I will frequent this place, even if they use vinyl trim.

^This place sounds awesome.  Exactly the type of restaurant that this city needs more of.  Unique, high quality bar food.  I am very excited.

I'm definitely gonna check out the Tour of Living on the 13. I've been in downtown for the past couple days and decided to go check out some of the projects Gateway has going on. I have to say i'm very impressed. I wasnt aware of the magnitude of the entire plan until I saw everything in person. I plan on moving to Cincy within the next couple months and I think OTR will be my new home!

^Congrats!

^^Check out Lackman Lofts at 13th & Vine.  I'm telling you that those are under-priced and will see a tremendous uptick in value after this next phase is complete.  Great units and a solid investment.